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John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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You don't think Christian need their souls saved?

(1 Th 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ)
Lol, Christians already have their souls saved.
 

John146

Senior Member
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I'm not using a commentary or a "commentary point of view" - I'm taking James letter as written.
Where would you ever get that the term twelve tribes refers to none other than the whole nation of Israel as it is used in every other usage in Scripture? That’s not allowing scripture to interpret itself.
 
Apr 3, 2019
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Where would you ever get that the term twelve tribes refers to none other than the whole nation of Israel as it is used in every other usage in Scripture? That’s not allowing scripture to interpret itself.
Where did I say the 12 tribes does not apply to those in the nation - this is somewhat of a straw man.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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Where did I say the 12 tribes does not apply to those in the nation - this is somewhat of a straw man.
Again, all throughout scripture it is a reference to the entire nation. You want to change this interpretation to mean Christians called out from the nation of Israel. That’s not being honest with Scripture itself.
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
James is a Jew, addressing his Jewish brethren. Paul does the same thing sometimes when referring to his brethren according to the flesh.
He does not peach the Gospel to them as does Paul.. so this means he is addressing them as brethren in Christ.
 

John146

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Jan 13, 2016
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He does not peach the Gospel to them as does Paul.. so this means he is addressing them as brethren in Christ.
Lol, to my brethren in Christ, you need to receive the word and your souls need saving...🤦‍♂️
 
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Again, all throughout scripture it is a reference to the entire nation. You want to change this interpretation to mean Christians called out from the nation of Israel. That’s not being honest with Scripture itself.
It is being written to the called out of the tribes - that why he said:

(James 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting)

Now who is not being honest?
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
Lol, to my brethren in Christ, you need to receive the word and your souls need saving...🤦‍♂️
Salvation of the soul ... important to know when "soul" is not a reference to spiritual salvation.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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It is being written to the called out of the tribes - that why he said:

(James 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting)

Now who is not being honest?
When were the twelve tribes, the entire nation of Israel, Ever scattered abroad?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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It is being written to the called out of the tribes - that why he said:

(James 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting)

Now who is not being honest?
You are claiming the following is who James is addressing? The Church, not the twelve tribes...

Acts 8
1 And Saul was consenting unto his death. And at that time there was a great persecution against the church which was at Jerusalem; and they were all scattered abroad throughout the regions of Judaea and Samaria, except the apostles.
2 And devout men carried Stephen to his burial, and made great lamentation over him.
3 As for Saul, he made havock of the church, entering into every house, and haling men and women committed them to prison.
4 Therefore they that were scattered abroad went every where preaching the word.

These that we’re scattered abroad went everywhere preaching the word and yet, Paul tells them they need to receive the word and have their souls saved? Wow!

Also, James describes this faithful group who were scattered preaching the word as follows?

James 4
1 From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members?
2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.
5 Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?
6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.
7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

This doesn’t sound like those faithful Christians who were scattered abroad preaching the word...🤦‍♂️
 
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When were the twelve tribes, the entire nation of Israel, Ever scattered abroad?
The Northern kingdom was scattered when they were taken captive by the Assyrians.

If John states he's writing to the scattered tribes then you have to accept that - it's a very simple statement he made. There is nothing to debate about it.
 
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You are claiming the following is who James is addressing? The Church, not the twelve tribes...

Acts 8
1 And Saul was consenting unto his death. And at that time there was a great persecution against the church which was at Jerusalem; and they were all scattered abroad throughout the regions of Judaea and Samaria, except the apostles.
2 And devout men carried Stephen to his burial, and made great lamentation over him.
3 As for Saul, he made havock of the church, entering into every house, and haling men and women committed them to prison.
4 Therefore they that were scattered abroad went every where preaching the word.

These that we’re scattered abroad went everywhere preaching the word and yet, Paul tells them they need to receive the word and have their souls saved? Wow!
No I'm claiming that James is writing to the scattered tribes in particular the first fruits, but not limited to them only.

Also, James describes this faithful group who were scattered preaching the word as follows?

James 4
1 From whence come wars and fightings among you? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members?
2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.
5 Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?
6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.
7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
No he's not addressing them in particular, he orating to the those of the tribes not adhering to the gospel.

This doesn’t sound like those faithful Christians who were scattered abroad preaching the word...🤦‍♂️
See above response.

(James 2:1 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons)

(James 2:2 For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment)

Now this would pertain to conduct for any Christian including those of the 12 scattered tribes following Christ,.

You need to discern what is written and why and the issues. Do you really think he's calling his brethren adulterers and war mongers?

Paul writes in similar fashion to Gentiles.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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A question for you. Was James the brother of John? Where did he get his authority?

Two James' are mentioned as apostles James; the first was the son of Zebedee, the other the son of Alphaeus .

(Mat 10:2 Now the names of the twelve apostles are these; The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother)

(Mat 10:3 Philip, and Bartholomew; Thomas, and Matthew the publican; James the son of Alphaeus, and Lebbaeus, whose surname was Thaddaeus)

James the brother of Jesus is not mentioned in the gospels as an apostle.

It appears that James his brother was skeptical of Jesus:

(John 7:5 For neither did his brethren believe in him)
James the Just is the brother of Jesus from Mary, he is not in any of the original 12. He only believed in Jesus as the Messiah after the latter resurrected.

You didn't realized that?
 
Apr 3, 2019
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James the Just is the brother of Jesus from Mary, he is not in any of the original 12. He only believed in Jesus as the Messiah after the latter resurrected.

You didn't realized that?
Why do you think I pointed it out. This means his has no apostolic authority.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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Ecclesiastes 3:14
I know that whatever God does, it shall be forever. Nothing can be added to it, and nothing taken from it. God does [it,] that men should fear before Him.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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Why do you think I pointed it out. This means his has no apostolic authority.
I have my own explanation on why Peter faded into the background when Jesus designated him to the rock of the early church, and the subsequent rise of James the brother of Jesus as the head of that same church.

But scripturally speaking, those among the 12 and Paul himself, granted him that authority, so you have to respect that.

Acts 12: 17 But motioning to them with his hand to be silent, he described to them how the Lord had brought him out of the prison. And he said, “Tell these things to James and to the brothers.”[a] Then he departed and went to another place.

Acts 15:13 And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:

Acts 21:18 And the day following Paul went in with us unto James; and all the elders were present.

1 Cor 15:7 7 After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.

Galatians 1: 19 But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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Do you think this is the gospel message?
Nope, no mention of the d,b,r for sins. Saints enduring the tribulation must keep the commandments of God and the faith of Christ.

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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No he's not addressing them in particular, he orating to the those of the tribes not adhering to the gospel.
Sooo, James is not addressing those Jews scattered abroad in Acts 8? Who exactly is he addressing? Using scripture please...