Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked
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How is this allowed, is this not completely heretical?
No one is going to change his mind, it will take an act of God at this point to remove the blinders @Runningman has put in place.
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KJV has this:
[2Pe 3:10, 12 KJV]
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. ...
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
Those who believe, do so because they have been given true faith by God as a fruit of the Spirit upon becoming
born again. True faith is only of God's work, it is not of men - only those to whom it has been given can truly believe.
A faith manufactured by a man is his work, not God's work and no one can be saved by their works.
- individually
- each, every, any, all, the whole, everyone, all things, everything
- collectively
- some of all types
[2Pe 3:10, 12 KJV]
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. ...
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
Those who believe, do so because they have been given true faith by God as a fruit of the Spirit upon becoming
born again. True faith is only of God's work, it is not of men - only those to whom it has been given can truly believe.
A faith manufactured by a man is his work, not God's work and no one can be saved by their works.
Correct, it is, imho, bad works to keep trying to "bash them them over the head"
with The Bible, thus, after the "good works" of "planting and watering," then God Commands:
Rom 16:17 "Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them."
Would the Unfruitful discussion then "be ended"? But still "pray for them"?
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Grace, Peace, And JOY In Christ, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided (+ I and II)!
with The Bible, thus, after the "good works" of "planting and watering," then God Commands:
Rom 16:17 "Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them."
Would the Unfruitful discussion then "be ended"? But still "pray for them"?
=====================
Grace, Peace, And JOY In Christ, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided (+ I and II)!
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In the second example of the parable of the sower, some believed for a while, but in the times of testing and trials walked away, due to making a shallow commitment. No OSAS for them we can say. In the third example, people kept getting side tracked from the path they should have been on by worldly things. Jesus did not say they walked away, only they did not mature. You mature by evermore practising right from wrong. So we could say, in the third example they did have OSAS, though they kept getting side tracked from the path they should have been on.
Did you not read the "he thought it not robbery to be equal to God"? Only God is equal to God. Do you think man is equal to God?
No, we are not in the form of God. In which verse did you find that?
Only God is in the form of God, that's why it is said of Jesus that He thought it not robbery to be equal to God.
You should read it more closely. The Lord Jesus Christ is part of the "one God". We can know this because
God created the Kosmos and the verse says it was created by Christ - "by whom all are all things".
So, Christ is God.
[1Co 8:6 KJV] 6 But to us [there is but] one God, the Father, of whom [are] all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom [are] all things, and we by him.
No, it does not say that - not even close - and you taking liberties with that verse that it doesn't allow. God the Father Himself is declaring that Christ is God. The next verse is speaking about Christ in His role as a man and a servant - a role that He willingly took upon Himself in mercy and grace to bring-forth salvation. Christ was fully man, fully God. Notice that God MADE HIMSELF of no reputation in becoming a man. So, what do you think His form was before He took upon Himself the form of a servant?
Observe:
[Phl 2:7-10 KJV]
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of [things] in heaven, and [things] in earth, and [things] under the earth;
Observe:
God is the Saviour:
[Luk 1:47 KJV] 47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.
and Christ is the Saviour:
[2Pe 3:18 KJV] 18 But grow in grace, and [in] the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him [be] glory both now and for
ever. Amen.
Ergo, Christ is Saviour and God.
God the Father is speaking to Christ in His role as a man - Christ is both God AND man. To save men, God the Son had to come to
this world as a kinsman redeemer and so He had to take upon Himself the form of a man.
God the Father did not give glory to God the Son - being God, the Son, He HAS the glory of God, it did not/could not be given to Him. God the Father gave glory to Christ in His role as a man. Because Christ willingly gave up His glory as God to become a servant, the glory the Father gave to Christ was in His role as a man - that is the same glory it is given to all of those who become saved.
[Isa 42:8 KJV] 8 I [am] the LORD: that [is] my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.
[Rom 9:23 KJV] 23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
[2Co 3:7-8 KJV]
7 But if the ministration of death, written [and] engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which [glory] was to be done away:
8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
[Jhn 14:8-9 KJV]
8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou [then], Shew us the Father?
No, we are not in the form of God. In which verse did you find that?
Only God is in the form of God, that's why it is said of Jesus that He thought it not robbery to be equal to God.
You should read it more closely. The Lord Jesus Christ is part of the "one God". We can know this because
God created the Kosmos and the verse says it was created by Christ - "by whom all are all things".
So, Christ is God.
[1Co 8:6 KJV] 6 But to us [there is but] one God, the Father, of whom [are] all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom [are] all things, and we by him.
No, it does not say that - not even close - and you taking liberties with that verse that it doesn't allow. God the Father Himself is declaring that Christ is God. The next verse is speaking about Christ in His role as a man and a servant - a role that He willingly took upon Himself in mercy and grace to bring-forth salvation. Christ was fully man, fully God. Notice that God MADE HIMSELF of no reputation in becoming a man. So, what do you think His form was before He took upon Himself the form of a servant?
Observe:
[Phl 2:7-10 KJV]
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of [things] in heaven, and [things] in earth, and [things] under the earth;
Observe:
God is the Saviour:
[Luk 1:47 KJV] 47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.
and Christ is the Saviour:
[2Pe 3:18 KJV] 18 But grow in grace, and [in] the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him [be] glory both now and for
ever. Amen.
Ergo, Christ is Saviour and God.
God the Father is speaking to Christ in His role as a man - Christ is both God AND man. To save men, God the Son had to come to
this world as a kinsman redeemer and so He had to take upon Himself the form of a man.
God the Father did not give glory to God the Son - being God, the Son, He HAS the glory of God, it did not/could not be given to Him. God the Father gave glory to Christ in His role as a man. Because Christ willingly gave up His glory as God to become a servant, the glory the Father gave to Christ was in His role as a man - that is the same glory it is given to all of those who become saved.
[Isa 42:8 KJV] 8 I [am] the LORD: that [is] my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.
[Rom 9:23 KJV] 23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
[2Co 3:7-8 KJV]
7 But if the ministration of death, written [and] engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which [glory] was to be done away:
8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
[Jhn 14:8-9 KJV]
8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou [then], Shew us the Father?
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No way! Because they have no root, their belief was of their own making, not God's. When it is from man it won't
last because it being from man, his faith is actually in himself, not God.
Regarding a death blow to OSAS, have you considered these verses? They clearly state otherwise - that once saved always saved.
[1Pe 1:3-5 KJV]
3 Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
[Phl 1:6 KJV]
6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform [it] until the day of Jesus Christ:
last because it being from man, his faith is actually in himself, not God.
Regarding a death blow to OSAS, have you considered these verses? They clearly state otherwise - that once saved always saved.
[1Pe 1:3-5 KJV]
3 Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
[Phl 1:6 KJV]
6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform [it] until the day of Jesus Christ:
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