Retire the Ten Commandments?

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safswan

Active member
Jan 19, 2019
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sure, thanks.

but what about, how it says "the Law is not of faith"

what does this mean?

in another place, it is also written "whatever is not of faith is sin"

what does this mean?
You are welcome.The following scriptures best summarize what is meant by the statements you quote above:

Romans 3:
21But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
22Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
23For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
26To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.


Titus 3:
4But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
5Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
6Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
7That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.



Galatians 2:
16Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.


Hebrews 10:
1For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
2For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
3But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
4For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.


The problem,which Paul identifies in Romans 7,is sin and its everlasting effect on mankind.Neither our good works(works of righteousness)nor the works of the law(sacrifices,blood of bulls and goats)can remove our sins.This can only be achieved by faith in the Lord Jesus and His sacrifice for all mankind.In the system of the old covenant you did right and if you erred you did the sacrifices etc.No faith involved here.But God had declared His way of righteousness through faith in the Lord Jesus.

Now,after being reconciled to God by His grace through faith,do we continue in sin that grace may abound?
 

Wall

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2013
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Well, if you understand the mystery that God revealed to Paul in Ephesians 2-3, both Jews and Gentiles are one in the body of Christ, which is the Church.
And what does Eph.2 say about the church? What will that church be doing?

EPHES. 2 [11] Wherefore remember, that ye being IN TIME PAST GENTILES in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; [12] That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRANGERS FROM THE COVENANTS OF PROMISE, having no hope, and without God in the world: [13] BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. [14] For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

We {gentiles}were once STRANGERS from Gods covenants of promise, having no hope. BUT NOW in Christ, should we take hold of those covenants, we have hope

ISAIAH 56 [6] Also the sons of THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and TAKETH HOLD OF MY COVENANT; [7] EVEN THEM WILL I BRING TO MY HOLY MOUNTAIN, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for ALL PEOPLE.

Even them (us gentile STRANGERS mentioned in Ephes.2) will He bring to His holy mountain, if we should take hold of His sabbath covenant. Jesus will bring us to the 1000yr period of rest

EXODUS 31 [16] Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the SABBATH, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a PERPETUAL COVENANT.

The above scripture points to one of those covenants spoken of in Ephes.2

ROMANS 1 [30] Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, [31] without understanding, COVENANTBREAKERS, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: [32] Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

And you can see who Paul lumps in with the covenantbreakers. Not good company
 

newton3003

Senior Member
Feb 4, 2017
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Matthew 5:17-19 17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."
 

Wall

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2013
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Matthew 5:17-19 17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."
MATT.5 [17] Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I AM NOT COME TO DESTROY, BUT TO FULFIL. [18] For verily I say unto you, till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

What does Jesus say? First he says he has not come to destroy the law. Then he goes on to say the law is intact until heaven and earth pass. Has the earth passed? I know for a fact im still standing on this earth. So...Lets use some common sense. Jesus did fulfil the law and the law is still to be followed. It was not nailed to the cross as the "many" claim. So what did Jesus mean when he said he came to fulfill the law?

LUKE 24 [44] And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that ALL THINGS MUST BE FULFILLED, WHICH WERE WRITTEN IN THE LAW of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, CONCERNING ME.

Yeah, He came and fulfilled the prophecies of His coming which were written in the law of Moses concerning Him. The new covenant in His blood. The meat and drink offerings OF the new moons, feast days and the sabbaths which were but a shadow of Christ

HEBREWS 9 [1] Then verily THE FIRST COVENANT HAD ALSO ORDINANCES of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary..... [9] Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;[10] WHICH STOOD ONLY IN MEATS AND DRINKS, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation....[12] NEITHER BY THE BLOOD OF GOATS AND CALVES, BUT BY HIS OWN BLOOD he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

Verse 1- The 1st covenant had ordinances
Verse 9- Which were a figure {a shadow}
Verse 9- Which were the meat and drink offerings for sin. Jesus fulfilled that part of the law of Moses
Verse 12- These offerings are now fulfilled in Christ

HEBREWS 10 [1] For THE LAW HAVING A SHADOW of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with THOSE SACRIFICES WHICH THEY OFFERED YEAR BY YEAR continually make the comers thereunto perfect.[2] For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.[3] But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.[4] For IT IS NOT POSSIBLE THAT THE BLOOD OF BULLS AND OF GOATS SHOULD TAKE AWAY SINS.

Verse 1- The law concerning those animal sacrifices and offerings were a SHADOW of Christ
Verse 4- That law was fulfilled in Christ because the blood of those animals did not take away sin.

HEBREWS 10 [8] Above when he said, SACRIFICE AND OFFERING and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law; [9] Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. HE TAKETH AWAY THE FIRST, THAT HE MAY ESTABLISH THE SECOND. [10] By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Hebrews 9 and 10 explain how Jesus fulfilled which was written of Him in the law of Moses. Its not the blood of bulls and goats anymore. They were the shadow of Christ which was written in the law... which He fulfilled.
 

Wall

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Mar 13, 2013
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MATT.5 [17] Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I AM NOT COME TO DESTROY, BUT TO FULFIL. [18] For verily I say unto you, till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

MATTHEW 3 [13] Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him. [14] But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? [15] And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for THUS IT BECOMETH US TO FULFIL ALL RIGHTEOUSNESS. Then he suffered him.

Well, if you claim we need not keep the law because Jesus fulfilled the law, i guess you believe that we must not seek righteousness because Jesus fulfilled all righteousness. Good luck with that kinda thinkin
 

Wall

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Mar 13, 2013
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Jesus not only fulfilled the law but He filled full the law. According to the scriptures Jesus did not do away with the law but made the law greater. He magnified the law to a spiritual level. He made the 10 commandments even harder to keep.

2 COR. 3 [6] WHO ALSO HATH MADE US ABLE MINISTERS OF THE NEW TESTAMENT; NOT OF THE LETTER, BUT OF THE SPIRIT: FOR THE LETTER KILLETH, BUT THE SPIRIT GIVETH LIFE. [7] But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away: [8] How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

ROMANS 7 [4] Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God. [5] For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death. [6] But now we are DELIVERED FROM THE LAW, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should SERVE IN NEWNESS OF SPIRIT, AND NOT IN THE OLDNESS OF THE LETTER.

As we can see in above scriptures we are now to walk in the spirit of the law. If we walk only in the letter of the law this will lead to death, but if we walk in the spirit of the law this leads to life.

MATTHEW 5 [20] For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. [21] Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, THOU SHALT NOT KILL; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: [22] BUT I SAY UNTO YOU, THAT WHOSOEVER IS ANGRY WITH HIS BROTHER WITHOUT A CAUSE SHALL BE IN DANGER OF THE JUDGMENT: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

OLD LETTER- Thou shalt not kill
NEW SPIRIT- Don’t even get angry. Call no man a fool. Love one another in thought, word and deed.

MATTHEW 5 [27] Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, thou shalt not commit adultery: [28] But i say unto you, that WHOSOEVER LOOKETH ON A WOMAN TO LUST AFTER HER HATH COMMITTED ADULTERY with her already in his heart.

OLD LETTER- Thou shalt not commit adultery
NEW SPIRIT- Do not look on a woman to lust. Keep the law in our mind and spirit. Even in our eyes.

So you can see that Jesus did not do away with the letter of the law. Common sense will tell ya in order to walk in the spirit of the law you must also be walking in the letter. Jesus made the commandments even harder to keep and more honorable.

ISAIAH 42 [20] Seeing many things, but thou observest not; opening the ears, but he heareth not.[21] The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; HE WILL MAGNIFY THE LAW, and make it honourable.

Yes, Jesus magnified the law. He took the letter of the law (which leads to death) and magnified the law to a spiritual level (which leads to life).
 

posthuman

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Jul 31, 2013
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In the system of the old covenant you did right and if you erred you did the sacrifices etc.No faith involved here.But God had declared His way of righteousness through faith in the Lord Jesus.
as opposed to working at keeping a law?

and how are we made free from the law and the curse that falls on any ((all)) who fail to keep it?
isn't this in Romans 6-7 ?
that by dying with Him, the law - including the decalogue - has no more authority over us?


Now,after being reconciled to God by His grace through faith,do we continue in sin that grace may abound?
of course not

"as some slanderously accuse us of saying" ;)
 
Dec 9, 2017
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WASHINGTON – A mega-pastor of one of the largest “evangelical” churches in the U.S. is attacking the Old Testament again, this time insisting Jesus rendered the Ten Commandments null and void, issuing one new law “as a replacement for everything.” Andy Stanley, pastor of the 34,000-member North Point Community Church in suburban Atlanta, who famously advised his flock to “unhitch” from the Old Testament in a sermon last spring, has now penned an article promoting his new book saying laws such as “Thou shalt have no other gods before me” and “Thou shalt not kill” are no longer relevant to Christians living in the New Covenant era……Read More


He must have been talking with the pope.

A new, new age religion concept........."great deceptions in the end times".

The Bible does not change. People try to change the Bible....by reinterpretation or a new bible edition.

This is not even believable. To the dung heap.
The Law is relevant in that it shows us our sin in that we may repent and turn to God/Christ, it always has and always will,
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
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And what does Eph.2 say about the church? What will that church be doing?

EPHES. 2 [11] Wherefore remember, that ye being IN TIME PAST GENTILES in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; [12] That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRANGERS FROM THE COVENANTS OF PROMISE, having no hope, and without God in the world: [13] BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. [14] For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

We {gentiles}were once STRANGERS from Gods covenants of promise, having no hope. BUT NOW in Christ, should we take hold of those covenants, we have hope

ISAIAH 56 [6] Also the sons of THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and TAKETH HOLD OF MY COVENANT; [7] EVEN THEM WILL I BRING TO MY HOLY MOUNTAIN, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for ALL PEOPLE.

Even them (us gentile STRANGERS mentioned in Ephes.2) will He bring to His holy mountain, if we should take hold of His sabbath covenant. Jesus will bring us to the 1000yr period of rest

EXODUS 31 [16] Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the SABBATH, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a PERPETUAL COVENANT.

The above scripture points to one of those covenants spoken of in Ephes.2

ROMANS 1 [30] Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, [31] without understanding, COVENANTBREAKERS, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: [32] Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

And you can see who Paul lumps in with the covenantbreakers. Not good company
Are you now saying Gentiles need to keep the Law, to be saved?
 

Wall

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Mar 13, 2013
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Are you now saying Gentiles need to keep the Law, to be saved?
What do the scriptures say?

MATT.7 [22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?[23] And then will I profess unto them, I NEVER KNEW YOU: DEPART FROM ME, YE THAT WORK INIQUITY.

So who are these people God does not know? Its they who practice lawlessness. Those who made Gods law void.

JEREMIAH 16 [19] O Lord, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, THE GENTILES SHALL COME UNTO THEE FROM THE ENDS OF THE EARTH, AND SHALL SAY, SURELY OUR FATHERS HAVE INHERITED LIES, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit.

Jer.16 is a “Day of the Lord” scripture as is Matt.7. The “many” Gentiles have inherited lies. No profit! Why no profit?

ISAIAH 48 [17] Thus saith THE LORD, THY REDEEMER, the Holy One of Israel; I AM THE LORD THY GOD WHICH TEACHETH THEE TO PROFIT, which leadeth thee by the way that thou shouldest go.[18] O THAT THOU HADST HEARKENED TO MY COMMANDMENTS! then had thy peace been as a river, and thy righteousness as the waves of the sea:

Whose your Redeemer? Profit! The 10 commandments. Most gentiles ignore Gods 4th commandment.

1JOHN2 [3] AND HEREBY WE DO KNOW THAT WE KNOW HIM, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS.[4] He that saith, i know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.[5] But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
 

Guojing

Well-known member
Jan 12, 2019
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What do the scriptures say?

MATT.7 [22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?[23] And then will I profess unto them, I NEVER KNEW YOU: DEPART FROM ME, YE THAT WORK INIQUITY.

So who are these people God does not know? Its they who practice lawlessness. Those who made Gods law void.

JEREMIAH 16 [19] O Lord, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, THE GENTILES SHALL COME UNTO THEE FROM THE ENDS OF THE EARTH, AND SHALL SAY, SURELY OUR FATHERS HAVE INHERITED LIES, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit.

Jer.16 is a “Day of the Lord” scripture as is Matt.7. The “many” Gentiles have inherited lies. No profit! Why no profit?

ISAIAH 48 [17] Thus saith THE LORD, THY REDEEMER, the Holy One of Israel; I AM THE LORD THY GOD WHICH TEACHETH THEE TO PROFIT, which leadeth thee by the way that thou shouldest go.[18] O THAT THOU HADST HEARKENED TO MY COMMANDMENTS! then had thy peace been as a river, and thy righteousness as the waves of the sea:

Whose your Redeemer? Profit! The 10 commandments. Most gentiles ignore Gods 4th commandment.

1JOHN2 [3] AND HEREBY WE DO KNOW THAT WE KNOW HIM, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS.[4] He that saith, i know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.[5] But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
Thanks for clarifying. Now I understand better your perspective.
 
Dec 9, 2017
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What do the scriptures say?

MATT.7 [22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?[23] And then will I profess unto them, I NEVER KNEW YOU: DEPART FROM ME, YE THAT WORK INIQUITY.

So who are these people God does not know? Its they who practice lawlessness. Those who made Gods law void.

JEREMIAH 16 [19] O Lord, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, THE GENTILES SHALL COME UNTO THEE FROM THE ENDS OF THE EARTH, AND SHALL SAY, SURELY OUR FATHERS HAVE INHERITED LIES, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit.

Jer.16 is a “Day of the Lord” scripture as is Matt.7. The “many” Gentiles have inherited lies. No profit! Why no profit?

ISAIAH 48 [17] Thus saith THE LORD, THY REDEEMER, the Holy One of Israel; I AM THE LORD THY GOD WHICH TEACHETH THEE TO PROFIT, which leadeth thee by the way that thou shouldest go.[18] O THAT THOU HADST HEARKENED TO MY COMMANDMENTS! then had thy peace been as a river, and thy righteousness as the waves of the sea:

Whose your Redeemer? Profit! The 10 commandments. Most gentiles ignore Gods 4th commandment.

1JOHN2 [3] AND HEREBY WE DO KNOW THAT WE KNOW HIM, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS.[4] He that saith, i know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.[5] But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
These are not stand alone scriptures. They must be taken in context with Gods mercy, grace and the gospel. Cherry picking scripture to win a debate actually shows the debaters ignorance.
 

Wall

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Mar 13, 2013
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These are not stand alone scriptures. They must be taken in context with Gods mercy, grace and the gospel. Cherry picking scripture to win a debate actually shows the debaters ignorance.
"Day of the Lord" scriptures will stand alone. No matter what storys man comes up with you can be assured Day of the Lord scriptures will come to pass as written.
 

Wall

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2013
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"Day of the Lord" scriptures will stand alone. No matter what storys man comes up with you can be assured Day of the Lord scriptures will come to pass as written.
These scriptures for instance

LUKE 3 [16] John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:[17] Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and will gather the wheat into his garner; but THE CHAFF HE WILL BURN WITH FIRE UNQUENCHABLE.

MATTHEW 3 [11] I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: HE SHALL BAPTIZE YOU WITH THE HOLY GHOST, and with fire:[12] Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; BUT HE WILL BURN UP THE CHAFF WITH UNQUENCHABLE FIRE.

So who are the chaff? The people that Jesus will burn up

LUKE 4 [34] Saying, Let us alone; what have we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art; THE HOLY ONE of God.

ACTS 2 [25] For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved:[26] Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope:[27] Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer THINE HOLY ONE to see corruption.

Jesus surely is the Holy One

ISAIAH 5 [24] Therefore as the fire devoureth the stubble, and THE FLAME CONSUMETH THE CHAFF, so their root shall be as rottenness, and their blossom shall go up as dust: BECAUSE THEY HAVE CAST AWAY THE LAW OF THE LORD OF HOSTS, and despised the word of THE HOLY ONE of Israel.

Theres the people Jesus {the Holy One} will burn. Those who believe they can cast away His law.

MALACHI [7] For the priest's lips should keep knowledge, and they should seek the law at his mouth: for he is the messenger of the LORD of hosts.[8] But ye are departed out of the way; ye have caused many to stumble at the law; ye have corrupted the covenant of Levi, saith the LORD of hosts.[9] Therefore have I also made you contemptible and base before all the people, according as YE HAVE NOT KEPT MY WAYS, BUT HAVE BEEN PARTIAL IN THE LAW.[10] Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us?

There are the "many" people who claim they keep 8 or 9 of the commandments but the sabbath they will not keep. They are partial in the law. This is also covered in the book of James

JAMES 2 [10] For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.[11] For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
 

preston39

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Dec 18, 2017
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These scriptures for instance

LUKE 3 [16] John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:[17] Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and will gather the wheat into his garner; but THE CHAFF HE WILL BURN WITH FIRE UNQUENCHABLE.

MATTHEW 3 [11] I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: HE SHALL BAPTIZE YOU WITH THE HOLY GHOST, and with fire:[12] Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; BUT HE WILL BURN UP THE CHAFF WITH UNQUENCHABLE FIRE.

So who are the chaff? The people that Jesus will burn up

LUKE 4 [34] Saying, Let us alone; what have we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art; THE HOLY ONE of God.

ACTS 2 [25] For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved:[26] Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope:[27] Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer THINE HOLY ONE to see corruption.

Jesus surely is the Holy One

ISAIAH 5 [24] Therefore as the fire devoureth the stubble, and THE FLAME CONSUMETH THE CHAFF, so their root shall be as rottenness, and their blossom shall go up as dust: BECAUSE THEY HAVE CAST AWAY THE LAW OF THE LORD OF HOSTS, and despised the word of THE HOLY ONE of Israel.

Theres the people Jesus {the Holy One} will burn. Those who believe they can cast away His law.

MALACHI [7] For the priest's lips should keep knowledge, and they should seek the law at his mouth: for he is the messenger of the LORD of hosts.[8] But ye are departed out of the way; ye have caused many to stumble at the law; ye have corrupted the covenant of Levi, saith the LORD of hosts.[9] Therefore have I also made you contemptible and base before all the people, according as YE HAVE NOT KEPT MY WAYS, BUT HAVE BEEN PARTIAL IN THE LAW.[10] Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us?

There are the "many" people who claim they keep 8 or 9 of the commandments but the sabbath they will not keep. They are partial in the law. This is also covered in the book of James

JAMES 2 [10] For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.[11] For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
There are no exceptions to scriptures which will come to past...as stated in G-d's commandments....and not just the ten...I stress.
 

safswan

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Jan 19, 2019
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as opposed to working at keeping a law?

and how are we made free from the law and the curse that falls on any ((all)) who fail to keep it?
isn't this in Romans 6-7 ?
that by dying with Him, the law - including the decalogue - has no more authority over us?
If you carefully read Romans 6-7,you will see what it is that Paul identifies as the problem.Not the ten commandments.As I said:

"The problem,which Paul identifies in Romans 7,is sin and its everlasting effect on mankind."

Here are the scriptures which say this:

Romans 7:
7What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.

So since the ten commandments were not the problem than why would we have to die to it so that it has no more authority over us?What we actually die to is the entire system of "The Law" i.e the entire old covenant with the curse and the various sacrificial practices which could not remove sin.It is Jesus who causes the curse to be removed and so our continued obedience to the commandments would not now be in vain.It is still the standard which defines God's standard and hence what is sin.As Paul says:

Romans 7:
7What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

And:

Romans 8:
7Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound?Are we still carnal and not subject to this law which identifies sin?



of course not

"as some slanderously accuse us of saying" ;)
I believe the real problem may be to identify what is it that defines sin.Based on what the scriptures teach,the ten commandments is relevant in this endeavour.
 

Wall

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2013
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The problem,which Paul identifies in Romans 7,is sin and its everlasting effect on mankind.Neither our good works(works of righteousness)nor the works of the law(sacrifices,blood of bulls and goats)can remove our sins.This can only be achieved by faith in the Lord Jesus ......
ROMANS 3 [30] Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith. [31] DO WE THEN MAKE VOID THE LAW THROUGH FAITH? GOD FORBID: yea, we establish the law.

We are not to make void the law (10 commandments) because we have faith
 
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WASHINGTON – A mega-pastor of one of the largest “evangelical” churches in the U.S. is attacking the Old Testament again, this time insisting Jesus rendered the Ten Commandments null and void, issuing one new law “as a replacement for everything.” Andy Stanley, pastor of the 34,000-member North Point Community Church in suburban Atlanta, who famously advised his flock to “unhitch” from the Old Testament in a sermon last spring, has now penned an article promoting his new book saying laws such as “Thou shalt have no other gods before me” and “Thou shalt not kill” are no longer relevant to Christians living in the New Covenant era……Read More


He must have been talking with the pope.

A new, new age religion concept........."great deceptions in the end times".

The Bible does not change. People try to change the Bible....by reinterpretation or a new bible edition.

This is not even believable. To the dung heap.
I think I can accept some of that view. I’m convinced however that The Commandments reveal our sinfulness. That’s New Testament thru and thru. Perhaps he was quoted out of context 😏
 
May 30, 2019
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I think I can accept some of that view. I’m convinced however that The Commandments reveal our sinfulness. That’s New Testament thru and thru. Perhaps he was quoted out of context 😏
Others saying that Christ doesn’t recognize this as one of His churches is a poor choice of words and judgmental. Just saying
 

preston39

Senior Member
Dec 18, 2017
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I think I can accept some of that view. I’m convinced however that The Commandments reveal our sinfulness. That’s New Testament thru and thru. Perhaps he was quoted out of context 😏

.....nope...search it....listen for yourself.

The Bible cannot be changed......how can you accept any of the concept...if you are a Christian?

....123 note.....there is no PC in scriptures.