Revelation

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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#141
#141
dcontroversal said:
And the AC MAKES war against the saints, over comes them and wears them out for 1260 days, or 3.5 years or 42 months according to DANIEL and REVELATION....kind of hard to do that if the SAINTS are GONE....there is NO split rapture of the saints
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not very hard if there is a massive evangelical and revival of the world.

which is prophesied.
 
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popeye

Guest
#142
#142
eternally-gratefull said:

Yeah, but this would support either a pretrib or post trib.

is the man of sin revealed pre trib (7 year covenant)

or mid trib (abomination of desolation)

and if (as I believe) the thing which restrains is the HS indwelt believers (the church) then it must be removed BEFORE the man of sin is revealed.

so I am not sure if it is after, that makes no sense.
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"Revealed" Can mean many things,such as who is he revealed to?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#143
#143
popeye said:
I am not being ugly,but I can assure you postrib is doa. It really gets eliminated by the pretrib verses.

Postrib rpture has no merit,no verses. It is 100% conjecture.
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thats being rude and not discussing the word.

we should not be that way, it is not a gospel issue.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#144
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,396
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#144
popeye said:
Well,right away the 2 witnesses defeat this assumtion.

But the answer is that ,yes,indeed the ac does kill ALL THE SAINTS left behind after the rapture. (mat 25 about vs 9 or so)

The pertinant question would be "since all saints die(as the word declares),who is left for a SUPPOSED postrib rapture"?
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So you believe some will be left behind.....now I see...well Paul the THE dead in Christ shall rise and then we which ARE ALIVE AND REMAIN shall be called up to meet the LORD in the AIR.....The definite article (THE) and we which are alive and remain is indicative of ALL of the saved...there is NO split rapture.....and THE two WITNESSES prophecy OVER LAP the exact time that the AC is given to WEAR out and MAKE war AGAINST the saints.....

NOT all SAINTS die SOME are left and REMAIN unto the COMING of JESUS
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#146
#146
dcontroversal said:
So you believe some will be left behind.....now I see...well Paul the THE dead in Christ shall rise and then we which ARE ALIVE AND REMAIN shall be called up to meet the LORD in the AIR.....The definite article (THE) and we which are alive and remain is indicative of ALL of the saved...there is NO split rapture.....and THE two WITNESSES prophecy OVER LAP the exact time that the AC is given to WEAR out and MAKE war AGAINST the saints.....

NOT all SAINTS die SOME are left and REMAIN unto the COMING of JESUS
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no one would be left behind,

God choses the two witnesses and 144000 to re populate the earth with the gospel.

if anything, why even bother with these people if the church is still around, the church could do this.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#147
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,396
113
#147
eternally-gratefull said:
not very hard if there is a massive evangelical and revival of the world.

which is prophesied.
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Except there seems to be no split GENERAL rapture(so called) of the saints.....Paul makes it clear...the dead in Christ and we which are alive and remain.....
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#148
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,396
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#148
eternally-gratefull said:

no one would be left behind,

God choses the two witnesses and 144000 to re populate the earth with the gospel.

if anything, why even bother with these people if the church is still around, the church could do this.
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Unless the church has been almost murdered out and persecuted and the power of the holy people scattered by the war being made by the AC
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#149
#149
dcontroversal said:
Except there seems to be no split GENERAL rapture(so called) of the saints.....Paul makes it clear...the dead in Christ and we which are alive and remain.....
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yeah, and that would support all theories,,

so we have to go elswhere.

as for the massive evangelical movement, it would be needed if the rapture takes place. no one would be left behind..
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#150
#150
dcontroversal said:
Unless the church has been almost murdered out and persecuted and the power of the holy people scattered by the war being made by the AC
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Your getting to picky now.

He does not go after the children of the woman until after the abomination, which takes place in the middle of the seven weeks. Yet the two witnesses appear about that same time.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#151
Dec 12, 2013
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#151
eternally-gratefull said:
yeah, and that would support all theories,,

so we have to go elswhere.

as for the massive evangelical movement, it would be needed if the rapture takes place. no one would be left behind..
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Where does it teach a massive evangelical movement during the trib.....?

Paul said the MAN of sin revealed and the APOSTASY takes place
The witness of the Lord's churches falters...having a form of godliness but no power
Evil men and seducers will wax worse and worse
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#152
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#152
eternally-gratefull said:
Your getting to picky now.

He does not go after the children of the woman until after the abomination, which takes place in the middle of the seven weeks. Yet the two witnesses appear about that same time.
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Not being picky...just thinking of verses that state these things
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#153
#153
dcontroversal said:
Except there seems to be no split GENERAL rapture(so called) of the saints.....Paul makes it clear...the dead in Christ and we which are alive and remain.....
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You also have to remember, Jesus tells us in matt 24 and other places. Whoever endures to the end will be saved (physically) and enter the kingdom as his children. every person who is not saved at his return are killed.

you have no one left alive to enter the 1000 year reign.

You have Jesus killing everyone who rejected him,

And rapturing those who are saved, and giving them new bodies.

no one is left on earth for jesus to reign over

(ps. thanks, I never thought of this before. Thats why discussion is vital for us to have open minds, for it is the only way we can learn)
 
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popeye

Guest
#155
#155
So you believe some will be left behind.....now I see...
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No,I believe mat 25 declares it.

The definite article (THE) and we which are alive and remain is indicative of ALL of the saved...there is NO split rapture.....and THE two WITNESSES prophecy OVER LAP the exact time that the AC is given to WEAR out and MAKE war AGAINST the saints.....
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No,there is no evidence,zero,that the 2 witnesses are anything but a separate resserection and rapture. You are reaching far,far,far.

NOT all SAINTS die SOME are left and REMAIN unto the COMING of JESUS
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Doctrine? or word of God?
Revelation states ALL DIE. What part of that do you refuse to believe?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#156
#156
dcontroversal said:
Where does it teach a massive evangelical movement during the trib.....?

Paul said the MAN of sin revealed and the APOSTASY takes place
The witness of the Lord's churches falters...having a form of godliness but no power
Evil men and seducers will wax worse and worse
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2 witnesses (seen all over the world on TV, when they rise from the dead, I believe many will get saved. )
144000 from the tribe of isreal going out to the world and teaching about Christ.
All the people killed for christ (martyres)

God will use all these things to bring people to him.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#157
#157
popeye said:
Revelation states ALL DIE. What part of that do you refuse to believe?
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Not all will die, even in the end at the end of the 1000 years. Jesus kills satans new army, then destroys the world. People will be alive then, I am sure unless jesus kills them when he destroys the world. there will be people who never die, not to mention, two men in the OT did not die.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#159
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,396
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#159
eternally-gratefull said:
You also have to remember, Jesus tells us in matt 24 and other places. Whoever endures to the end will be saved (physically) and enter the kingdom as his children. every person who is not saved at his return are killed.

you have no one left alive to enter the 1000 year reign.

You have Jesus killing everyone who rejected him,

And rapturing those who are saved, and giving them new bodies.

no one is left on earth for jesus to reign over

(ps. thanks, I never thought of this before. Thats why discussion is vital for us to have open minds, for it is the only way we can learn)
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A couple of things to ponder.....

At the end of the 1000 year reign where do all of the lost come from who are gathered by Satan for one final assault....the saved are like the angels in heaven...neither marrying and or given in marriage.....who repopulates the waste cities of the planet....I know the remnant of Israel is brought all the way through and repopulates the waste cities of ISRAEL, it seems Egypt takes a massive blow and is uninhabitable for 40 years and is not one third of GOG left....?
 
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