Sabbath
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If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God;
if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth:
that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ,
to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. 1 Peter 4:11
What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
Much every way:chiefly, because that unto them
were committed the oracles of God. Romans 3:2
For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need
that one teach you again which be the first principles of
the oracles of God; and are become such as have
need of milk, and not of strong meat. Hebrews 5:12
This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel
which spake to him in [the mount Sina], and with (our fathers):
who received [the lively oracles] to give unto 7:38
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge:
because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee,
that thou shalt be no priest to me:
seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.
As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them.
O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err,
and destroy the way of thy paths.
if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth:
that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ,
to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. 1 Peter 4:11
What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
Much every way:chiefly, because that unto them
were committed the oracles of God. Romans 3:2
For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need
that one teach you again which be the first principles of
the oracles of God; and are become such as have
need of milk, and not of strong meat. Hebrews 5:12
This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel
which spake to him in [the mount Sina], and with (our fathers):
who received [the lively oracles] to give unto 7:38
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge:
because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee,
that thou shalt be no priest to me:
seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.
As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them.
O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err,
and destroy the way of thy paths.
As yet no one has been able to explain why there is not one single requirement in the NT to observe the Sabbath, whilst there are two examples of Paul saying that it is not binding.
All the other commandments are dealt with in one way or another, but not this one. In my view this is incomprehensible if the early church did see it as necessary to observe the Sabbath. Indeed it would be a gross dereliction of duty.
All the other commandments are dealt with in one way or another, but not this one. In my view this is incomprehensible if the early church did see it as necessary to observe the Sabbath. Indeed it would be a gross dereliction of duty.
now Paul as custom,he observed and taught jews and gentials, not only to the gentials,
but both on same day, on Gods day Sabbath. He taught 3 years on the Sabbath,
working the 6 other days to make a living, when did he preach to gentials?
as Jesus was [his custom] to, teaching jews and gentiles both at the same time,
the new church congragated on the sabbath to hear apostles preach,
disciples talked and learned daily among themselfs,
but preached to public on the sabbath, in a place of worship to be had.
a city had to wait the whole week to here him preach more, preached 3 sabbath days.
why did he not just teach on sunday instead ? or any other day but the 7th.?
the word who made it, preached his word on this day also.
and threw people out of the temple, because they robbed God of his Time.
Paul , talking to new gentile and jew converts, why does he mention Sabbaths, holy days ,
16Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday,
or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
if they had been done away with them sabbaths,why but which he did himself
for over 3 years [keeping] the sabbath like his custom was.
[He]was teaching them [to keep] the sabbath, and not let others tell you other wise.
There is no mention of the abolition of God’s law or His holy days. Nothing is done away
in these verses. In fact, it is just the opposite. The very criticism the Colossians were
receiving about their observance of these days proves they were keeping them.
How could they be criticized “with regard to” days they were not keeping?
Paul is warning them not to return to or be influenced by their old pagan ways—
the ways of those who hated God’s laws and His festivals.
; but the body [is] of Christ.
the word [is] was added and was not inspired by paul, and should [not] be in there.
this verse should read proper,
do not let [anyone] tell you about sabbath holy days, [but] the body of Christ.
now we know it was not peter that little stone, but Christ the rock.
but Christs own words and as [His] customs where taught.
Have I labored in vein he says?
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always [obeyed], not as in my presence only,
but now much more in [my absence], [work out] your own salvation with fear and trembling.
17Which are [a shadow] of things to come,
at this point, Christ is risen, what shadow do they talk about or mean?
of things to come [not] past, these feasts show the rest of the story, from the begining
but both on same day, on Gods day Sabbath. He taught 3 years on the Sabbath,
working the 6 other days to make a living, when did he preach to gentials?
as Jesus was [his custom] to, teaching jews and gentiles both at the same time,
the new church congragated on the sabbath to hear apostles preach,
disciples talked and learned daily among themselfs,
but preached to public on the sabbath, in a place of worship to be had.
a city had to wait the whole week to here him preach more, preached 3 sabbath days.
why did he not just teach on sunday instead ? or any other day but the 7th.?
the word who made it, preached his word on this day also.
and threw people out of the temple, because they robbed God of his Time.
Paul , talking to new gentile and jew converts, why does he mention Sabbaths, holy days ,
16Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday,
or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
if they had been done away with them sabbaths,why but which he did himself
for over 3 years [keeping] the sabbath like his custom was.
[He]was teaching them [to keep] the sabbath, and not let others tell you other wise.
There is no mention of the abolition of God’s law or His holy days. Nothing is done away
in these verses. In fact, it is just the opposite. The very criticism the Colossians were
receiving about their observance of these days proves they were keeping them.
How could they be criticized “with regard to” days they were not keeping?
Paul is warning them not to return to or be influenced by their old pagan ways—
the ways of those who hated God’s laws and His festivals.
; but the body [is] of Christ.
the word [is] was added and was not inspired by paul, and should [not] be in there.
this verse should read proper,
do not let [anyone] tell you about sabbath holy days, [but] the body of Christ.
now we know it was not peter that little stone, but Christ the rock.
but Christs own words and as [His] customs where taught.
Have I labored in vein he says?
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always [obeyed], not as in my presence only,
but now much more in [my absence], [work out] your own salvation with fear and trembling.
17Which are [a shadow] of things to come,
at this point, Christ is risen, what shadow do they talk about or mean?
of things to come [not] past, these feasts show the rest of the story, from the begining
The problem is in the details in the wording and understanding of the final point based on those small differences. You say you don't analyze the Law everyday to know what to do...ok
Then you go on to say....you keep the law because it is what God has lead YOU to do...and I ask, stopping there how has that been going for you so far?
He gave us the Holy law for two reasons, one of the reasons is this point right here...
You cannot keep the law on your own. Period! He gave us the laws so that first we see that in our failure in trying. Otherwise why would He have given us the Law when He did before the death and resurrection of Jesus? Where the power to honor and complete the law exists?!!
It is not God giving you a ta-do-list. For that will not work, Even with it being God who says the ta-do-list is Holy.
We must understand this point...or the whole conclusion becomes in error. The bible says we were found dead in our transgressions and sins. How does something dead be revived on it's own? It can't the only answer is to replace it fully with a new version. That is the New Man in Christ. The sealing of the Spirit of God to our own will our soul that makes us hear God thru the Holy Spirit and directs us in His word this new soul of ours now is the born-again me different totally than the old me revamped, version.
If you insist to think you are succeeding with God in a 60/40 split of doing rights vs. wrongs He cannot except you into the heavens, because He is such a Holy God not even one spec of sin can survive there. Jesus has washed you clean 100% in the New Man, which is our adhesion to the History and purity of Christ, So as we enter the test before God we are seen with the blood covered purity and not our performance overall.
Jesus does walk and give as you described in your life but it comes from a heart in you that is sold out to the fact , you are unworthy of Gods merit in what you can do. And that Jesus is the only way, You must put all your eggs in His basket.
not an avatar pun
Then you go on to say....you keep the law because it is what God has lead YOU to do...and I ask, stopping there how has that been going for you so far?
He gave us the Holy law for two reasons, one of the reasons is this point right here...
You cannot keep the law on your own. Period! He gave us the laws so that first we see that in our failure in trying. Otherwise why would He have given us the Law when He did before the death and resurrection of Jesus? Where the power to honor and complete the law exists?!!
It is not God giving you a ta-do-list. For that will not work, Even with it being God who says the ta-do-list is Holy.
We must understand this point...or the whole conclusion becomes in error. The bible says we were found dead in our transgressions and sins. How does something dead be revived on it's own? It can't the only answer is to replace it fully with a new version. That is the New Man in Christ. The sealing of the Spirit of God to our own will our soul that makes us hear God thru the Holy Spirit and directs us in His word this new soul of ours now is the born-again me different totally than the old me revamped, version.
If you insist to think you are succeeding with God in a 60/40 split of doing rights vs. wrongs He cannot except you into the heavens, because He is such a Holy God not even one spec of sin can survive there. Jesus has washed you clean 100% in the New Man, which is our adhesion to the History and purity of Christ, So as we enter the test before God we are seen with the blood covered purity and not our performance overall.
Jesus does walk and give as you described in your life but it comes from a heart in you that is sold out to the fact , you are unworthy of Gods merit in what you can do. And that Jesus is the only way, You must put all your eggs in His basket.
not an avatar pun
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When Christ died for me His death was full payment for my sins (my transgression of the law, Breaking the sabbath etc.) i can't save myself i already have a debt i can't pay and if i could pay it by obedience then i wouldn't need Christ any more and Christ died in vain. But just because Christ has paid my price and continues to cover my debt, should i continue to sin?
TMS maaaaate,
Not keeping the Sabbath is not a sin. Nine of the ten commandments have parallels in the Law of Christ (or the Law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus). The fourth is completely absent. Jesus fulfilled it, and he and the rest we find in him are the sabbath of which the seventh day under the old covenant was a shadow. I've said this before but no one has replied to it. Now's your chance. Show me from the New Testament, where keeping the Sabbath was reinstated under the New Covenant.
At the same time you can perhaps let us know how you're going with the other 603 commandments.
Not keeping the Sabbath is not a sin. Nine of the ten commandments have parallels in the Law of Christ (or the Law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus). The fourth is completely absent. Jesus fulfilled it, and he and the rest we find in him are the sabbath of which the seventh day under the old covenant was a shadow. I've said this before but no one has replied to it. Now's your chance. Show me from the New Testament, where keeping the Sabbath was reinstated under the New Covenant.
At the same time you can perhaps let us know how you're going with the other 603 commandments.
show us where it was ever stoped in the new testament,
not one verse fron gen to rev authorized the sabbath change,
to the first day worship.
the cathloc church claims it was all there doing and athority,
and worship by old roman rite ways,and made law in there land, there mark.
and people still do as romans do, who again have roman sunday law in there land now.
and you can not buy or sell any goods on first day of week, comming to youre continent soon.
and following Gods Sabbath he will give you knowledge, understanding and a mark on you.
a lot better then the law of the beast kingdom the roman empire, and nero cesaers name.
the sabbath are a seperate covenent made before the ten,
also sabbath day promise is a seperate covenent after ten, again not affected by law covent
the other 603 commandments added later for transgressions againest the sabbaths,
you could not do any work for money on a high holy day, big deal take day off
not one verse fron gen to rev authorized the sabbath change,
to the first day worship.
the cathloc church claims it was all there doing and athority,
and worship by old roman rite ways,and made law in there land, there mark.
and people still do as romans do, who again have roman sunday law in there land now.
and you can not buy or sell any goods on first day of week, comming to youre continent soon.
and following Gods Sabbath he will give you knowledge, understanding and a mark on you.
a lot better then the law of the beast kingdom the roman empire, and nero cesaers name.
the sabbath are a seperate covenent made before the ten,
also sabbath day promise is a seperate covenent after ten, again not affected by law covent
the other 603 commandments added later for transgressions againest the sabbaths,
you could not do any work for money on a high holy day, big deal take day off
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The Papal church was brought to its knees by the preaching of the reformers (Marten Luther etc.). In an effort to restore the catholic church to it's former power, Pope Paul III called the Council of Trent (1542-1565). The purpose of this gathering was to put the church back on solid ground. One of the big issues that was debated by the priests, bishops, cardinals and theologians was whether or not they based their faith on Scripture alone, or on scripture and tradition (The reformer taught Sola Scripture). This debate lasted for years. They had to change the theology and doctrines if they wanted to be sola scripture based, or they could keep their traditions and base it on tradition and scripture. The Archbishop of Reggio finally settled the question and he said we have 2 options. We can base our beliefs on Scripture but that would mean we should keep the Sabbath on the seventh day, or the church could build their belief on tradition and scripture and we can worship on the first day (Sunday). They could only come to one conclusion.
You know what they chose.
The Catholic Church claims to have the divine authority of God to make these changes but anyone or any church can claim that.
Mat 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
You know what they chose.
The Catholic Church claims to have the divine authority of God to make these changes but anyone or any church can claim that.
Mat 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
3 items
A jar of manna, Aaron's rod that budded, and the Ten Commandments written on 2 tables of stone by Gods finger.
Manna from heaven fell every day (except the Sabbath) before the sun rose, and people needed to gather it before the sun rose or it melted. I am the bread of life Jesus said in John 6:48, this manna is a symbol of the word of God that we need to gather every morning before we do anything else (before we get too busy). just like we can't live without physical food we can't live without spiritual food. If more was gathered then was needed for that day it went off and worms where found in it, except for Friday they needed to gather enough for two days and it didn't go off. If we gather the bread of life and don't make it part of us (internalize it) it is an external experience (out ward) and it breads worms. We should meet the Lord each day and gather enough food for each day, except on Friday, we should gather extra to prepare for the holy Sabbath.
Aaron's Rod that budded.
In Num 16 it is similar to what Satan did in heaven. Lucifer gathered a third of the angels to rebel against God and thought he was good enough to be in charge. Korah, Dathan, and Abiram are the main one here, verse 3. And they gathered themselves together against Moses and against Aaron, and said unto them, Ye take too much upon you, seeing all the congregation are holy, every one of them, and the LORD is among them: wherefore then lift ye up yourselves above the congregation of the LORD?
It didn't end well for this group they were consumed by fire and swallowed by the earth. The people still didn't learn in verse 41 they blamed Moses for the deaths of the 250. So God allowed a plague to kill 14700 more people that where still rebelling (Slow learners).
What has this got to do with the Rod of Aaron?
Num 17:6 And Moses spake unto the children of Israel, and every one of their princes gave him a rod apiece, for each prince one, according to their fathers' houses, even twelve rods: and the rod of Aaron was among their rods.
Num 17:7 And Moses laid up the rods before the LORD in the tabernacle of witness.
Num 17:8 And it came to pass, that on the morrow Moses went into the tabernacle of witness; and, behold, the rod of Aaron for the house of Levi was budded, and brought forth buds, and bloomed blossoms, and yielded almonds.
Num 17:10 And the LORD said unto Moses, Bring Aaron's rod again before the testimony, to be kept for a token against the rebels; and thou shalt quite take away their murmurings from me, that they die not.
This was a perpetual sign, we don't have a right to make up our own rules or change gods rules. It was out of jealousy that all the trouble started, it began in the mind and it all comes back to faith and trust. By being restless against Gods laws we give Satan access to our minds like the example above and God gave us Aaron's rod to remember that He chooses and we should trust in His directing's. It's a reminder that God is in control and we can trust Him. (Also Christ was dead and is alive. Rev_1:18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.)
The last Item is the Ten Commandments
This law was so important that God had to write them in stone Himself. Like Jesus our rock, this law was written on Stone to signify that it does not change and that it lasts forever. The law of God is called the law of Love, If you love me keep my commandments, law of liberty It is love that motivates us to keep the law. Sure it points out our sins but that is good because i can repent and give that sin away.
Rom_13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
Rom_13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.
Gal_5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Jas_2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
Luke 10:27
Mark 12:30
Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
A jar of manna, Aaron's rod that budded, and the Ten Commandments written on 2 tables of stone by Gods finger.
Manna from heaven fell every day (except the Sabbath) before the sun rose, and people needed to gather it before the sun rose or it melted. I am the bread of life Jesus said in John 6:48, this manna is a symbol of the word of God that we need to gather every morning before we do anything else (before we get too busy). just like we can't live without physical food we can't live without spiritual food. If more was gathered then was needed for that day it went off and worms where found in it, except for Friday they needed to gather enough for two days and it didn't go off. If we gather the bread of life and don't make it part of us (internalize it) it is an external experience (out ward) and it breads worms. We should meet the Lord each day and gather enough food for each day, except on Friday, we should gather extra to prepare for the holy Sabbath.
Aaron's Rod that budded.
In Num 16 it is similar to what Satan did in heaven. Lucifer gathered a third of the angels to rebel against God and thought he was good enough to be in charge. Korah, Dathan, and Abiram are the main one here, verse 3. And they gathered themselves together against Moses and against Aaron, and said unto them, Ye take too much upon you, seeing all the congregation are holy, every one of them, and the LORD is among them: wherefore then lift ye up yourselves above the congregation of the LORD?
It didn't end well for this group they were consumed by fire and swallowed by the earth. The people still didn't learn in verse 41 they blamed Moses for the deaths of the 250. So God allowed a plague to kill 14700 more people that where still rebelling (Slow learners).
What has this got to do with the Rod of Aaron?
Num 17:6 And Moses spake unto the children of Israel, and every one of their princes gave him a rod apiece, for each prince one, according to their fathers' houses, even twelve rods: and the rod of Aaron was among their rods.
Num 17:7 And Moses laid up the rods before the LORD in the tabernacle of witness.
Num 17:8 And it came to pass, that on the morrow Moses went into the tabernacle of witness; and, behold, the rod of Aaron for the house of Levi was budded, and brought forth buds, and bloomed blossoms, and yielded almonds.
Num 17:10 And the LORD said unto Moses, Bring Aaron's rod again before the testimony, to be kept for a token against the rebels; and thou shalt quite take away their murmurings from me, that they die not.
This was a perpetual sign, we don't have a right to make up our own rules or change gods rules. It was out of jealousy that all the trouble started, it began in the mind and it all comes back to faith and trust. By being restless against Gods laws we give Satan access to our minds like the example above and God gave us Aaron's rod to remember that He chooses and we should trust in His directing's. It's a reminder that God is in control and we can trust Him. (Also Christ was dead and is alive. Rev_1:18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.)
The last Item is the Ten Commandments
This law was so important that God had to write them in stone Himself. Like Jesus our rock, this law was written on Stone to signify that it does not change and that it lasts forever. The law of God is called the law of Love, If you love me keep my commandments, law of liberty It is love that motivates us to keep the law. Sure it points out our sins but that is good because i can repent and give that sin away.
Rom_13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
Rom_13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.
Gal_5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Jas_2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
Luke 10:27
Mark 12:30
Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
That, TMS, and your other posts are all very well but they don't change the fact that the fourth commandment is not found in the NT. The old covenant law, is now defunct. It is an ex-law. It remains no longer (I'm beginning to feel like John Cleese with the dead parrot). It is no more. It has ceased to be. Whereas nine of the ten are also part and parcel of the new covenant, the fourth commandment, as the writer to the Hebrews can hardly have made more clear, was fulfilled in Jesus, who is our true sabbath rest. Why would the shadow be necessary when the reality has come? None of anything else you said alters this fact.
You're welcome to your view, of course, but it is a mistaken one.
You're welcome to your view, of course, but it is a mistaken one.
Oh man it can't be this bad! Under the old covenant, no one had been born again if you like. There needed to be a command to worship God on a specific day of the week. The people needed a day to reflect on God and be encouraged to worship him. A specific day was set aside for this purpose. But under the new covenant you have been born again, and that transcends(or should transcend) the need to be told you must set aside a specific day of the week to worship/reflect on God. or specifically rest. The more you yield to the prescence of the Holy Spirit in your life, the closer you come to God in your heart. You want to reflect on God all 7 days the same. You want to worship him from your heart the same.
Anyway. I ain't so daft to think anyone with opposing views would believe me. This discussion has become tiresome, to each there own. I just praise God for the wisdom and knowledge given to Paul. He termed subjects like these ''disputable matters'' but for those hung up on the literal letter, not the spirit filled reality, they will never see it
Anyway. I ain't so daft to think anyone with opposing views would believe me. This discussion has become tiresome, to each there own. I just praise God for the wisdom and knowledge given to Paul. He termed subjects like these ''disputable matters'' but for those hung up on the literal letter, not the spirit filled reality, they will never see it
Joh 5:46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
Michael, to say people under the Old Covenant was not born again is flawed. They knew Yeshua my friend and they had a relationship with Him just like we are suppose to have one today
remember, He is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow.
Michael, to say people under the Old Covenant was not born again is flawed. They knew Yeshua my friend and they had a relationship with Him just like we are suppose to have one today
remember, He is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow.