The Law Debacle Resolved

[just-me]

I am not under law. Every time I turn back to the law I desecrate what Jesus did on the cross.

Luke 9-26... But Jesus said to him, "No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for the kingdom of God."

Are we saying that the law is better that following the Spirit?

Kefa

Under what precedence will the "iron rod" of Christ be exorcised during the millennium you think? The words of Jesus are the same words of the unchanging Almighty God, His own Father, and ours if we believe in Christ.

For I am the Lord, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed. Malachi 3:6

For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words, of him shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he shall come in his own glory, and in his Father's, and of the holy angels.
Luke 9:26

For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him. John 3:34

Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. John 14:10

 

[Kefa54]

When we focus on the law and not the Holly spirit. Are we
[h=1]Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit?[/h]

 

[phil112]

Grace, Law? What about it? How do we resolve it.

KennethC gave me and all a reminder in Just-Me's wonderful thread on PHARISEES.

Here is the solution.

Do what Jesus teaches and did.

If you feel a need to argue this, you need His help right away.

Thank you Just-Me and KennethC..........

Argue? No. I feel, as I do frequently when I read your posts, the need to correct tho.
Debacle? Seriously?

Full Definition of Debacle
1: a tumultuous breakup of ice in a river


2: a violent disruption (as of an army) : rout


3a : a great disaster
b : a complete failure : fiasco

The only people that have a problem with law are the ones that don't have God's spirit guiding them into truth and those that refuse to study his word the way HE instructs us.
You know, those like you that think the law applies to the gentile somehow.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Galatians 3. Explain how the law is a guardian what does that mean exactly?

It does not let us get off track, it (if we follow it correctly) takes us right to Christ. (faith)

It is those who do not follow it that never find Christ. (faith)

I tried to show it earlier, i am not sure if it is in this thread or not. But just-me asked how the law was a schoolmaster. it should explain it biblically by what paul said.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It wasn't a faulty God given law that caused that problem of not entering into the promised land. It was the people who rejected our Almighty's instructions. What happened afterwards? Compromising with the world via the "doctrine of Balaam."

The problem isn't the law of God. The problem is with people rejecting its truth. Finding fault with the law of God is finding fault with God Himself.

Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain. Exodus 20:7

Your right, the problem was not the law. The problem was the interpretation of the law.

Paul said it is the schoolmaster. You call him a liar. thats all we need to see.

They rejected the law outright, and did not enter in, you misinterpret the law. and do not see its purpose.. Your just as bad as they were.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Its not so much about keeping the law but rather having Christ. But you can't have Christ and not keep the law. That's like saying Jesus will not do what Jesus does. It makes no sense at all.

this is the good news. Jesus died and raised again that we through His blood and life may escape the sin that did hold us in bondage.

Jesus did not die to get rid of the law. that makes no sense, He gave it in the first place. besides getting rid of it does not fix the problem. Sin is the problem not the law.

The point people do not get, is the law demands you obey every word. You can not do that, I can not do that. No person but Christ EVER did that.

If you do not, you are under a curse. That curse is death.

So how can we do what the law states is impossible to do?

You people who claim we must follow law reject its own condition. You claim you follow it, when you are not. thus you claim to be better than you actually are.

How can you come to the cross. and grow in his grace if you think you are better than yuo really are? You have not yet humbled yourself and allowed the law to do its job.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Originally Posted by gotime

Galatians 3. Explain how the law is a guardian what does that mean exactly?

1..........

2..........

3.........

Post 56"

Schoomaster - tutor - guardian A slave who was placed over the children of the rich and influential to supervise their daily lives, and keep them in line, These children were not even aloud to step out of the house without these "tutors" or "guides" until they reach adulthood.

Context. A schoolmaster kept their kids in line with whatever was the parent instructed them to do. His purpose was to get the child graduation (adulthood) with every thing needed for the child to have a successful life.

In the context of paul. The end result is Christ. The law was given as a gilde to give us every tool we need to graduate (find Christ) which would result in salvation.

How did paul say the law did this?

1. added because of transgressions.

[SUP]19 [/SUP]Why then the law? It was added because of transgressions,

2. In place until the offspring of the promise given abraham would come (christ)
until the offspring should come to whom the promise had been made, and it was put in place through angels by an intermediary

3. Holds us captive (like the child, we can not go anywhere without the "tutor" being with then, thus they were basically held captive by the schoolmaster until the reach the destination point which was adulthood) until faith is revealed.

[SUP]23 [/SUP]Now before faith came, we were held captive under the law, imprisoned until the coming faith would be revealed.

4. It proved to us we are under a curse, for no one has fulfilled the law as required by God through moses.

[SUP]10 [/SUP]For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.”

5. Paul explains the whole purpose in one sentence.. The schoolmaster is our guardian, until Christ came that we may be justified by faith.


[SUP]24 [/SUP]So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith.
6. Once the end result is achieved the "gardian" is no longer needed, it has done its purpose. The child is no longer a slave to the gaurdian, he is free to go out on his own, make his own mistakes. and grow in obedience to his master, the ceasar. .

Once we come to Christ, the gardian (law) is no longer needed, we are not longer held slaves to it any more. we are free to go out on our own, and grow in the love of our master (God himself)

Paul said it led us to Christ. And once we have found christ, we no longer need it.

So you tell us why paul lied

And next time you think your going to be tricky, Think again.. It just backfired on you!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Why does the law lead us to Christ?

Because it shows us our need of saving. saving from what?

Saving from sin which is breaking the law. who saves us?

Jesus saves us. saves us from what?

Sin which is breaking the law.

You can not be saved from sin if you are still living in sin.

Then you can not be saved by the law. because the law declares all are under sin..

So if your living in sin, the law condemns you.. because you have not been born of God..

One who sins has never known God or seen God.. That what John says..

so why do people claim we must (if we are born of god) go back to law??

Why??

the schoolmaster did its job

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So why do we not need the law after we have come to Christ?

Simple because the law was given to show us our sin that we needed saving from. once we are saved from it we are no longer breaking that law and thus no longer need it to point out our sin because we are no longer walking in sin. The law now written on our hearts.

So your perfect?

 

[Josefnospam]

for as many as are under the works of the law are under a curse...........Galatians 3:10


I thank God for his Grace and can rest in HIS finished work. He's done it all.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It appears you have overlooked a detail that makes all the difference. You said, "I have the same spirit that rose Jesus from the dead living in me. I don't need the law +Jesus. The spirit guides me every day" So many times I have seen this doctrinal point of view expressed and have to wonder why people think such a thing. That doctrine says that professing Christians don't need the law because the Holy Spirit writes the Torah/law on their hearts.

First of all, there are at least three places in the Bible (1 in the OT and 2 in the NT) where we are told that man does not live by bread alone but by EVERY WORD of God. Deuteronomy 8:3, Matthew 4:4, Luke 4:4
Second Jesus is the Word. John 1:1
Third, the Holy Spirit is going to write the same things on a believer's heart as God stated in the Torah because God does NOT change. Malachi 3:6

This argument gets old. And so stagnant, it is not even worthy of being called a strawman anymore.

We Have lived by every word. The law we ate and chewed and got every bit out of. This led us to Christ, and brought us to salvation.

Saying this does not mean we reject his word..

 

[DP]

Re: last sentence
They're not? You don't think we hit perfection after Judgement? Or did I misread something? If I didn't, can you fill your thought out further? Obviously, I'm confused.

I said "at", not "after" the Judgment; that's what those who reject Christ Jesus will be judged by. God's laws are eternal. They won't go away after the Judgment either.

 

[JaumeJ]

I leave for a ery short time for my local responsibilities, and I come back to another uproar about the law.

If possible, let us think in terms of those first qho believed Jesus Christ, men wondered at, the Twelve Aposstles, and if you like, Paul.

Look at how they worshipped our Lord, Jesus. They heard Him, and followed after Him, picking up their crosses and imitated our Lord. So did most of the assemblies.

How mankind has drifted away from these examples of following our Example, Jesus Christ.

I cannot imagine most congregations today transported to the time of our Lord on earth.. They do not even begin to resemble the Body of Christ at that time.

The Twelve were learned of Jesus Christ, men of Israel, descended of Abraham. They would not dream of disobedience for any reasonn unto their own deaths. (John apparantly died of natural causes.)

We have segments of what is called Christians today more concerned with war and politics than what we do not see, things eternal which our faith makes us to treasure. There are segments preaching the love of wealth with the gospel of wealth. There are segments eaching disobedience. And there is a segment labeling good brethren in Christ who choose to be children of obedience as under the law, and even having rejected the saving Blood of Jesus Christ. Praye especially for thse latter, for they walk in darkness, calling it light, condemning those who follow the Lamb of God.

Blessed be all who see, hear and understand, for they cherish the eternal, amen. Try to remain on topic and get out of this law/grace chaos you are creating. Grace and obedience are married by faith, established by faith.

 

[just-me]

Your right, the problem was not the law. The problem was the interpretation of the law.

Paul said it is the schoolmaster. You call him a liar. thats all we need to see.

They rejected the law outright, and did not enter in, you misinterpret the law. and do not see its purpose.. Your just as bad as they were.

Over the line. I am reporting this slanderous liable that you have mentioned twice now just because I quoted Acts 24:14.

 

[VioletReigns]

The law is for those walking according to the flesh, walking by sight and not by the faith of Jesus Christ. Those who are walking in the law of the spirit of Jesus Christ are literally being led by the Holy Spirit. So they don't need to try to focus on keeping any law, for the Lord is that law within them who is keeping them. They are free to live in the liberty and fellowship of Jesus Christ Himself.

You can only understand that truth in the spirit, that is not worldly or intellectual wisdom.

 

[VioletReigns]

Over the line. I am reporting this slanderous liable that you have mentioned twice now just because I quoted Acts 24:14.

Yikes! Really? I'm gonna hafta get out the shirt again, I see.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Over the line. I am reporting this slanderous liable that you have mentioned twice now just because I quoted Acts 24:14.

Yea Yeah,

You do not have to answer questions, But you can report when you think you have been slandered.

If I reported every time you and your clan has slandered and those like me, The mods would be so busy they would not have time to do anything.

Originally Posted by just-me

It wasn't a faulty God given law that caused that problem of not entering into the promised land. It was the people who rejected our Almighty's instructions. What happened afterwards? Compromising with the world via the "doctrine of Balaam."

The problem isn't the law of God. The problem is with people rejecting its truth. Finding fault with the law of God is finding fault with God Himself.

Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain. Exodus 20:7

acts 24; 14 -[SUP]14 [/SUP]But this I confess to you, that according to the Way, which they call a sect, I worship the God of our fathers, believing everything laid down by the Law and written in the Prophets,

Well now you just proved yourself a liar. Because the post I responsed to did not have acts 24: 14 in the post. So your not only a liar.

So I hope you did report me, Because the mods can see how you work..

ps. You slander me with acts 24: 14 by saying I reject it, So you better report yourself you hyocrite!

 

[JaumeJ]

Please meditate on what you have posted here.....thank you.

Well of course it is. Everything in the bible is true.... but not everything that is true is in the bible.

 

[ember]

I am not under law. Every time I turn back to the law I desecrate what Jesus did on the cross.

Luke 9-26... But Jesus said to him, "No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for the kingdom of God."

Kefa

Amen!

A child can understand this and many do

 

[Sirk]

Please meditate on what you have posted here.....thank you.

Do you disagree with that statement? "That everything in the bible is true, but not everything that is true is in the bible".