TONGUES is a precious gift from God
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Perhaps I could say that I was asked by letter when I first became a believer to consider the baptism and the gifts of the Holy Spirit - but the gift of tongues was raised expressly. I recall being very opposed to what I was reading in that letter. Just a day later I was reading the Corinthian passage you were given and became very distressed because there right in front of my eyes was the very thing that the brother wrote me about. I was only a babe in Christ and saved for less than a week. I had only been reading my bible for six days so I knew almost nothing of what was in the Scriptures.
I was so distressed that I literally cried out in a sort of grief because I realised that I had no way to know how to refuse what I could see in the Scripture. In fact I was so grieved in my spirit that I was compelled to cry out to the Father in a loud voice asking for help. After a few moments I received peace - but the peace was the ability to confess that I had no way to judge the word of God myself and needed the Father to make it have a true meaning. I asked the Father to give me an understanding of His word - and on that basis I would believe what I could understand and rest about what I could not understand.
Several years later and just over a year after I had been released from prison I was in a very poor condition spiritually chiefly due to falling into some fleshy habits and again I cried out to God. I was led in my spirit to travel to the city where the brother lived who wrote me the letter in which he spoke about the gift of tongues. I didn't have that thought in my mind - I was simply seeking advise from him because he had also visited me in solitary confinement where I was saved and where I received his letter and his was the only visit I ever had when I was in prison. But when I got to his house his neighbour told me that he was on his honeymoon and wouldn't be back for a week. So there I was in a poor spiritual condition having followed a belief that the Spirit had lead me there to get help and the brother was not even there.
I decided to book into a small hotel and await his arrival back to the city he lived in. It was during that time in a small bedroom whilst kneeling in prayer and longing to be able to overcome my fleshy attitude that I began to speak in tongues as I was praying out loud to the Father. I could hear myself speaking in a language I had no recognition of. I knew that whatever I was saying it had no connection with my mind - even though it was coming out of my mouth. That simple act of speaking in tongues changed my walk completely. The next day which happened to be Good Friday 1986 I went to the street that the brother who was on his honeymoon lived and as I was passing a rather shabby and somewhat poor building the Spirit spoke to me and said, "I will give you the key to this church." So I stood still wondering whilst I realised that I was standing outside a church building and within a few minuets a number of believers began to gather outside of this church. Among them was my future wife. I found myself going into the city and for the first time in my calling I preached the Gospel to a city centre and did so with such boldness and power that even I was surprised.
My point being brother - the evidence of my own speaking in tongues was proven to be of God because it took me out of my fleshiness and into a liberty of walking in the power of the Holy Spirit. I found out later that same Good Friday that the brother I had been led to seek out in a city several hundred miles from my own home - was also a member of that church. So the Father did do what I had asked of Him when I was in my prison cell and in distress at suddenly realising that the thing I had refused in a letter so forcefully - was received in experience of being strengthened in my spirit to begin walking in obedience to the calling of God.
And I should say brother that I was radically saved in my cell - it was only when I walked passed a pub and smelled the beer and knew the Spirit telling me not to go in - that I disobeyed God and fell back into a fleshy life. I cannot tell you how grieved I was that I had disobeyed God and fallen into fleshy lusts arising from drink. I guess it all comes down to asking the Father to teach you what His word means and to establish its meaning in a way that you can know that God is in it. God Bless.
I was so distressed that I literally cried out in a sort of grief because I realised that I had no way to know how to refuse what I could see in the Scripture. In fact I was so grieved in my spirit that I was compelled to cry out to the Father in a loud voice asking for help. After a few moments I received peace - but the peace was the ability to confess that I had no way to judge the word of God myself and needed the Father to make it have a true meaning. I asked the Father to give me an understanding of His word - and on that basis I would believe what I could understand and rest about what I could not understand.
Several years later and just over a year after I had been released from prison I was in a very poor condition spiritually chiefly due to falling into some fleshy habits and again I cried out to God. I was led in my spirit to travel to the city where the brother lived who wrote me the letter in which he spoke about the gift of tongues. I didn't have that thought in my mind - I was simply seeking advise from him because he had also visited me in solitary confinement where I was saved and where I received his letter and his was the only visit I ever had when I was in prison. But when I got to his house his neighbour told me that he was on his honeymoon and wouldn't be back for a week. So there I was in a poor spiritual condition having followed a belief that the Spirit had lead me there to get help and the brother was not even there.
I decided to book into a small hotel and await his arrival back to the city he lived in. It was during that time in a small bedroom whilst kneeling in prayer and longing to be able to overcome my fleshy attitude that I began to speak in tongues as I was praying out loud to the Father. I could hear myself speaking in a language I had no recognition of. I knew that whatever I was saying it had no connection with my mind - even though it was coming out of my mouth. That simple act of speaking in tongues changed my walk completely. The next day which happened to be Good Friday 1986 I went to the street that the brother who was on his honeymoon lived and as I was passing a rather shabby and somewhat poor building the Spirit spoke to me and said, "I will give you the key to this church." So I stood still wondering whilst I realised that I was standing outside a church building and within a few minuets a number of believers began to gather outside of this church. Among them was my future wife. I found myself going into the city and for the first time in my calling I preached the Gospel to a city centre and did so with such boldness and power that even I was surprised.
My point being brother - the evidence of my own speaking in tongues was proven to be of God because it took me out of my fleshiness and into a liberty of walking in the power of the Holy Spirit. I found out later that same Good Friday that the brother I had been led to seek out in a city several hundred miles from my own home - was also a member of that church. So the Father did do what I had asked of Him when I was in my prison cell and in distress at suddenly realising that the thing I had refused in a letter so forcefully - was received in experience of being strengthened in my spirit to begin walking in obedience to the calling of God.
And I should say brother that I was radically saved in my cell - it was only when I walked passed a pub and smelled the beer and knew the Spirit telling me not to go in - that I disobeyed God and fell back into a fleshy life. I cannot tell you how grieved I was that I had disobeyed God and fallen into fleshy lusts arising from drink. I guess it all comes down to asking the Father to teach you what His word means and to establish its meaning in a way that you can know that God is in it. God Bless.
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If you believe what Paul wrote is inspired scripture:
1 Cor 14:5 Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be built up.
It edifies you:
1 Cor 14:4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.
Jude 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost, [praying in the Holy Ghost is praying in the spirit: speaking in tongues. cp. 1 Cor 14:15].
It is giving thanks well to God:
1 Cor 14:17 For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified.
You are speaking divine secrets to God:
1 Cor 14:2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries. [musterion, transliterated as mystery, but it means secret].
When spoken in public and interpreted, it edifies the church:
1 Cor 14:5 Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless he interprets, so that the church may be built up.
Stop being a doubter, learn what it is, and step out on faith. Find people who know what it is and how to do it, they can help. Know this: God doesn't possess people, He will not make you do it.
CS1 answered that above.
Be a Christian.
1 Cor 14:5 Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be built up.
It edifies you:
1 Cor 14:4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.
Jude 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost, [praying in the Holy Ghost is praying in the spirit: speaking in tongues. cp. 1 Cor 14:15].
It is giving thanks well to God:
1 Cor 14:17 For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified.
You are speaking divine secrets to God:
1 Cor 14:2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries. [musterion, transliterated as mystery, but it means secret].
When spoken in public and interpreted, it edifies the church:
1 Cor 14:5 Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless he interprets, so that the church may be built up.
Stop being a doubter, learn what it is, and step out on faith. Find people who know what it is and how to do it, they can help. Know this: God doesn't possess people, He will not make you do it.
CS1 answered that above.
Be a Christian.
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Ive only started reading some of the posts in this thread but I want to give credit to one thing you said that I respect. It's the concept of not backing down but following a doctrine all the way to it's conclusion(s). (As a process of thought... not necessarily of practice... Because there is nothing glorious in following a false doctrine all the way to hell before discovering the mistake).
I'm not sure which questions of Aidan's you meant but I'm not ashamed to state miracles, etc that I've seen or done, or to state how far along the path towards doing more than Paul that I happen to be... But there does come a point where it's not the willingness or ability of the speaker that is in question... but rather "Will the speaker simply be giving that which is Holy unto dogs, and casting pearls before swine for them to turn again and rend?"
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
I'm not sure which questions of Aidan's you meant but I'm not ashamed to state miracles, etc that I've seen or done, or to state how far along the path towards doing more than Paul that I happen to be... But there does come a point where it's not the willingness or ability of the speaker that is in question... but rather "Will the speaker simply be giving that which is Holy unto dogs, and casting pearls before swine for them to turn again and rend?"
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
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I meant not all posts. I meant the one i quotet in my last post. Thank you!
Yes the Holy Spirit leads to the truth!
According millions of oneness pentecostals Christians which do not speaking in tongues are not saved. Millions of RCC believers claimes to be baptised with the Holy Spirit and speakingbin tongues, but believing all the RCC doctrines.
Would you say that the Holy Spirit supports false teachings?
We are talking here about speaking in tongues. Right!
But the teaching about it supports not what the bible teaches.
According 1.Cor. 12-14 is speaking a tongues a gift like any other mentioned gift, too.
A gift which not all receive, according 1. Cor. 12,30.
And it is in the church not depend from a second baptism or an special Level of spiritual life.
It was given, like the other gifts when someone was bornagain and received the Holy Spirit.
The events which mentioned in Acts 2,8,10 and 19 have nothing to do with the speaking in tongues which we find in 1. COR .
Those events were made for to show that Jesus came for all mankind and not only for an special nation or group of people.
According what we learn in 1. COR. the gift of speaking in tongues should be normal in every Christian group/church. ( not for all believers) through the whole churchhistory.
But the fact is, that however, it seems to end in the first centurys after the apostolic time. Except out of in cults, or in combination with gospel messages speaking in tongues occur not in the churches.
For example in australia speaking in tongues began after an woman ( i have not the name now) came in contact with the azusastreet movement and spread it then in australia
In germany the azusa movement came in 1906. Before this tongues where not practised according 1. COR. in the churches.
At for shure not, as it was taught in azusa.
If speaking in tongues would be normal given as gift today for the worldwide church. Then we would have this without azusa movement or all this charismatic movements
normaly in the church and would not discuss about this issue.
And again, I am believing that the Holy Spirit works today in many ways to open the hearts of people. And without Him we could not live
as believers.
And I believe also that he can do this throuh giving the gift of speaking in tongues.
For that he is God and can do everything!
But i dont believing the teachings from pentecostals/ charismatics regarding this issue, because I cant find taught this in the bible to other believers.
I know that they base their believing on the scripture. But for that they have to create an own doctrine and must interprete the scripture out of the context and must ignore scripture.
And now you can stone me!
Yes the Holy Spirit leads to the truth!
According millions of oneness pentecostals Christians which do not speaking in tongues are not saved. Millions of RCC believers claimes to be baptised with the Holy Spirit and speakingbin tongues, but believing all the RCC doctrines.
Would you say that the Holy Spirit supports false teachings?
We are talking here about speaking in tongues. Right!
But the teaching about it supports not what the bible teaches.
According 1.Cor. 12-14 is speaking a tongues a gift like any other mentioned gift, too.
A gift which not all receive, according 1. Cor. 12,30.
And it is in the church not depend from a second baptism or an special Level of spiritual life.
It was given, like the other gifts when someone was bornagain and received the Holy Spirit.
The events which mentioned in Acts 2,8,10 and 19 have nothing to do with the speaking in tongues which we find in 1. COR .
Those events were made for to show that Jesus came for all mankind and not only for an special nation or group of people.
According what we learn in 1. COR. the gift of speaking in tongues should be normal in every Christian group/church. ( not for all believers) through the whole churchhistory.
But the fact is, that however, it seems to end in the first centurys after the apostolic time. Except out of in cults, or in combination with gospel messages speaking in tongues occur not in the churches.
For example in australia speaking in tongues began after an woman ( i have not the name now) came in contact with the azusastreet movement and spread it then in australia
In germany the azusa movement came in 1906. Before this tongues where not practised according 1. COR. in the churches.
At for shure not, as it was taught in azusa.
If speaking in tongues would be normal given as gift today for the worldwide church. Then we would have this without azusa movement or all this charismatic movements
normaly in the church and would not discuss about this issue.
And again, I am believing that the Holy Spirit works today in many ways to open the hearts of people. And without Him we could not live
as believers.
And I believe also that he can do this throuh giving the gift of speaking in tongues.
For that he is God and can do everything!
But i dont believing the teachings from pentecostals/ charismatics regarding this issue, because I cant find taught this in the bible to other believers.
I know that they base their believing on the scripture. But for that they have to create an own doctrine and must interprete the scripture out of the context and must ignore scripture.
And now you can stone me!
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If you read @#277 and my response @#279 and then the connected response that the sister made @#280 it isn't difficult to see that brethren often refuse simple cogency in favour of another meaning. And it is almost always the case that that other meaning is implicit in fleshy ambitions and a poor spirit because were it not - then plain speech would suffice even when saying difficult things that will cause stumbling if they cannot be received in a spirit of humility.
It no longer surprises me after over 35 years of speaking into the lives of believers over extended periods of time and almost always with great resource of means to settle debt and to address harm in their lives to find that they cannot after all receive the things of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Thanks for taking the trouble to read what is written and to resist throwing atones when you give an better explanation to the problem of why the Spirit resists the flesh as the flesh resists the Spirit - because the flesh is not able to submit to the things of God. Only the new man in Christ.. That is gracious and commendable.
It no longer surprises me after over 35 years of speaking into the lives of believers over extended periods of time and almost always with great resource of means to settle debt and to address harm in their lives to find that they cannot after all receive the things of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Thanks for taking the trouble to read what is written and to resist throwing atones when you give an better explanation to the problem of why the Spirit resists the flesh as the flesh resists the Spirit - because the flesh is not able to submit to the things of God. Only the new man in Christ.. That is gracious and commendable.
O
One may think, "I'm saved by what I believe." When they were taught about salvation, some were taught that the gifts had ceased. So perhaps, in their mind, they have to deny tongues or else it might shake what they believe.
To some, tongues may be, in a round about way, a salvation issue.
Of course, it is not acceptance of spiritual gifts that saves one, but acceptance of Christ being punished for our sin. The Divine exchange.
I just wish that those who do not believe in the gifts would be more graceful to those who do. And stop saying that we're speaking by the devil. Are there counterfeits? Yes.
I could easily turn that around and say that this is something the devil would say, thus anyone who says that a tongue-talker is not of God and is speaking by the devil, and for the devil. But I don't really believe this.
Jesus is the son of God, God the son. He has always existed. He has always, and will always be, holy, sinless, and perfect. He came to this earth when He was conceived by the Holy Spirit and given birth by His mother, Mary.
He lived a sinless life. After 3 years of miraculous ministry, He was unjustly charged, convicted, and executed on a cross.
On the third day, God the Father raised Him from the dead. He is now seated at the right hand of the Father. One day He will return to judge the living and the dead. Those who have faith in Him will spend eternity with Him and those who don't will perish, I believe by being thrown into the lake of fire prepared by God for the fallen angels and demons.
Belief in what I've just laid out is the foundation of our unity in the congregation of God.
"Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit." - 1 Corinthians 12:3 NIV
Jesus is blessed and Jesus is Lord. Jesus gave me the gift of tongues.
"…2with all humility and gentleness, with patience, bearing with one another in love, 3and with diligence to preserve the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace. 4There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called;…" - Ephesians 4:3 NIV
We all need to get better at agreeing to disagree without being disagreeable on non-salvation issues. To bless and not curse.
Don't we?
To some, tongues may be, in a round about way, a salvation issue.
Of course, it is not acceptance of spiritual gifts that saves one, but acceptance of Christ being punished for our sin. The Divine exchange.
I just wish that those who do not believe in the gifts would be more graceful to those who do. And stop saying that we're speaking by the devil. Are there counterfeits? Yes.
I could easily turn that around and say that this is something the devil would say, thus anyone who says that a tongue-talker is not of God and is speaking by the devil, and for the devil. But I don't really believe this.
Jesus is the son of God, God the son. He has always existed. He has always, and will always be, holy, sinless, and perfect. He came to this earth when He was conceived by the Holy Spirit and given birth by His mother, Mary.
He lived a sinless life. After 3 years of miraculous ministry, He was unjustly charged, convicted, and executed on a cross.
On the third day, God the Father raised Him from the dead. He is now seated at the right hand of the Father. One day He will return to judge the living and the dead. Those who have faith in Him will spend eternity with Him and those who don't will perish, I believe by being thrown into the lake of fire prepared by God for the fallen angels and demons.
Belief in what I've just laid out is the foundation of our unity in the congregation of God.
"Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit." - 1 Corinthians 12:3 NIV
Jesus is blessed and Jesus is Lord. Jesus gave me the gift of tongues.
"…2with all humility and gentleness, with patience, bearing with one another in love, 3and with diligence to preserve the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace. 4There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called;…" - Ephesians 4:3 NIV
We all need to get better at agreeing to disagree without being disagreeable on non-salvation issues. To bless and not curse.
Don't we?
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Just caught up from a few pages ago. Wow... Kind of a hostile thread considering how positively Lafftur started it.
Anyway, I praise God for the Holy Ghost and speaking in tongues that comes with it. It was beautiful then and is beautiful now... Regardless if people do it at potentially inappropriate times, or attach stuff that God didn't attach, or even if they preach falseness around it.
I pray everyone who reads these posts seeks God until he pours out His Spirit on them. Remember, even the 11 apostles had to tarry until they received it. Some in Acts had to be prayed over by others before they could receive it. Don't give up before you recieve. Then let God teach you on the usage.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
Anyway, I praise God for the Holy Ghost and speaking in tongues that comes with it. It was beautiful then and is beautiful now... Regardless if people do it at potentially inappropriate times, or attach stuff that God didn't attach, or even if they preach falseness around it.
I pray everyone who reads these posts seeks God until he pours out His Spirit on them. Remember, even the 11 apostles had to tarry until they received it. Some in Acts had to be prayed over by others before they could receive it. Don't give up before you recieve. Then let God teach you on the usage.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
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tongues and interpretation is prophesying which equal Prophecy which contextually in 1cor chapter 12 through 14 is speaking under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit
Both prophesying and tongues with interpretation do the same thing, they are equal in the outcome of edifying.
Both edify
both are inspired by the Holy Spirit
both are used in a church setting
Tongues is a sign to the unbeliever
prophesying is to the believer
praying in tongues is speaking to God
Prophesying is God speaking through a person to people
- the result of Prophesying is edification, comfort, and exhortation profitable for all in the church setting
- The result of speaking in tongues without an interpretation is self-edification and speaking to God not profitable for all in the church setting
- the result of tongues with an interpretation is edification, comfort, and exhortation, and profitable for all in the church setting
Both prophesying and tongues with interpretation do the same thing, they are equal in the outcome of edifying.
Both edify
both are inspired by the Holy Spirit
both are used in a church setting
Tongues is a sign to the unbeliever
prophesying is to the believer
praying in tongues is speaking to God
Prophesying is God speaking through a person to people
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Jist want to share that God was patient with me as my mind got in the way of allowing speaking in tongues to happen. It took a few months but when he got it through to me, I used it a lot.
One night when I was out by myself, I fell asleep praying in tongues and woke up singing in tongues. As I woke I thought "What is that beautiful melody?" Until I woke enough to realize it was my voice. Then I started to try to figure out what the next notes and such would be... and I messed it up. For the next few nights I would do similarly until I could figure out how to LET it happen instead of thinking I had to MAKE it happen. Now I can sing in tongues and let God lead the song almost any time (especially when I'm stressed because, as someone mentioned earlier, the Spirit is the Comforter)
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
One night when I was out by myself, I fell asleep praying in tongues and woke up singing in tongues. As I woke I thought "What is that beautiful melody?" Until I woke enough to realize it was my voice. Then I started to try to figure out what the next notes and such would be... and I messed it up. For the next few nights I would do similarly until I could figure out how to LET it happen instead of thinking I had to MAKE it happen. Now I can sing in tongues and let God lead the song almost any time (especially when I'm stressed because, as someone mentioned earlier, the Spirit is the Comforter)
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
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S
We’ve been given sooooo many gifts from God our Father in Heaven….speaking in tongues is just one of MANY! 
It is our Father’s Will that sinners be saved and sealed, baptized and filled with His Holy Spirit and filled with the knowledge of His Word!
Tongues is NOT false but, there is a counterfeit….you’ll know the difference….No Fear!
It is our Father’s Will that sinners be saved and sealed, baptized and filled with His Holy Spirit and filled with the knowledge of His Word!
Tongues is NOT false but, there is a counterfeit….you’ll know the difference….No Fear!
sadly some individuals resist these truths
one thing of note, is that those who oppose this gift seem to ignore the fact that tongues is both a gift and a sign
they ignore it or perhaps are ignorant of it, and get stuck on tongues in church
they do not understand that this gift is for every individual to use in their prayer life and to build themselves up in the Holy Spirit
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Some are, yes. Some people don't want what the Spirit has to offer. Some know little, if anything about it because their leaders teach nothing about it (even though the bible does). Some (like I did) might struggle with how it will happen, how does it manifest, how do you get it, etc.
People struggle in different ways, but the Holy Ghost today is the same Holy Ghost of the book of Acts, Romans, 1 Corinthians, etc. God hasn't lost effectiveness, and people haven't lost their need for edification, healings, prophecies, teachings, preachings, helps, etc.
As has been told in this and other threads, there are many occasions where a group of disciples start seeking God and the Holy Ghost gets poured out on them just like he did on the day of Pentecost and they start speaking in tongues. Other people receive it when they come up out of the water of baptism. Others receive it at the laying on of hands. I've seen it happen in both of the latter two methods repeatedly. It's still available JUST like it was in Acts. Some just don't want to believe it no matter how many witnesses there are.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
People struggle in different ways, but the Holy Ghost today is the same Holy Ghost of the book of Acts, Romans, 1 Corinthians, etc. God hasn't lost effectiveness, and people haven't lost their need for edification, healings, prophecies, teachings, preachings, helps, etc.
As has been told in this and other threads, there are many occasions where a group of disciples start seeking God and the Holy Ghost gets poured out on them just like he did on the day of Pentecost and they start speaking in tongues. Other people receive it when they come up out of the water of baptism. Others receive it at the laying on of hands. I've seen it happen in both of the latter two methods repeatedly. It's still available JUST like it was in Acts. Some just don't want to believe it no matter how many witnesses there are.
"Beware therefore, lest that come upon you, which is spoken of in the prophets; [41] Behold, ye despisers, and wonder, and perish: for I work a work in your days, a work which ye shall in no wise believe, though a man declare it unto you." - Acts 13:40-41 KJV
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
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