Valley of Decision.... It's time to make a choice!

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Lafftur

Lafftur

Senior Member
#101
Apr 18, 2017
6,886
3,631
113
#101
Getting twisted crazy posts on this thread.
 
Lafftur

Lafftur

Senior Member
#104
Apr 18, 2017
6,886
3,631
113
#104
Dave-L said:
But you save yourself by choosing to do so.
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No. I choose Life. I choose to receive the works that Christ did to save me.

My works for salvation are just filthy rags that cannot EVER save me.

After I receive the GIFT of SALVATION from Christ, the good works that I do are for the Kingdom of God, NOT for salvation - not even to "maintain" my salvation. Salvation is COMPLETE in Christ alone.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#107
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#107
Lafftur said:
No. I choose Life. I choose to receive the works that Christ did to save me.

My works for salvation are just filthy rags that cannot EVER save me.

After I receive the GIFT of SALVATION from Christ, the good works that I do are for the Kingdom of God, NOT for salvation.
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But you saved yourself by choosing to receive it. The way it works is we receive Christ in the same way we receive a pat on the back. The will has nothing to do with it. You believe because God first gave you the Holy Spirit and the experience causes you to believe.

“But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:” John 1:12 (KJV 1900)

“Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.” John 1:13 (KJV 1900)
 
Lafftur

Lafftur

Senior Member
#108
Apr 18, 2017
6,886
3,631
113
#108
Dave-L said:
But you saved yourself by choosing to receive it. The way it works is we receive Christ in the same way we receive a pat on the back. The will has nothing to do with it. You believe because God first gave you the Holy Spirit and the experience causes you to believe.

“But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:” John 1:12 (KJV 1900)

“Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.” John 1:13 (KJV 1900)
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No, I did NOT save myself. Yeshua/Jesus saved me.

No. The Gift of the Holy Spirit was NOT given to me until AFTER I believed and received the Body and Blood of Yeshua/Jesus Christ the ONLY SAVIOR for man.

The Holy Spirit opens our understanding to hear the truth of the gospel of Salvation in Christ, BUT the Holy Spirit is NOT inside of us at this time.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#109
#109
Dave-L said:
The passage says people cannot discern spiritual truth. “Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” John 3:3 (KJV 1900)
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Two different verses meaning two different things.
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#110
#110
Dave-L said:
But you saved yourself by choosing to receive it. The way it works is we receive Christ in the same way we receive a pat on the back. The will has nothing to do with it. You believe because God first gave you the Holy Spirit and the experience causes you to believe.

“But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:” John 1:12 (KJV 1900)

“Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.” John 1:13 (KJV 1900)
Click to expand...

nah nah nah nah but you saved yourself awrk awrk awrk

polly wants a cracker

awrk awrk awrk

 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#111
#111
EleventhHour said:
Two different verses meaning two different things.
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oh you don't have the hyper Calvinist amalgamated reformed repeater Bible still sold on Calvins' personal website?

only sold in euros though
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#113
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#113
Lafftur said:
No, I did NOT save myself. Yeshua/Jesus saved me.

No. The Gift of the Holy Spirit was NOT given to me until AFTER I believed and received the Body and Blood of Yeshua/Jesus Christ the ONLY SAVIOR for man.

The Holy Spirit opens our understanding to hear the truth of the gospel of Salvation in Christ, BUT the Holy Spirit is NOT inside of us at this time.
Click to expand...
Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit you must have before you can believe. “But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,” Galatians 5:22 (KJV 1900)
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#114
#114
7seasrekeyed said:
oh you don't have the hyper Calvinist amalgamated reformed repeater Bible still sold on Calvins' personal website?

only sold in euros though
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Sometimes I wish we could put more than one reaction.....lol this is pretty funny..:D
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#116
#116
Dave-L said:
Has it occurred to you how much people hate God if Calvin was right about sin and grace?
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He was only partly right ... has it occurred to you how much if he was wrong (which he was mostly) how he has maligned the nature of God.

There is no way around the fact that if God selects those He wants leaving others no choice...then he is a morally ambiguous God.

And Calvin as clever as he was did not follow his own dogma to is moral logical conclusion......
which is not good.

As well you you are listening to a man whose lens was completely shaped by St Augustine and Augustine did not get much right either having been influenced by the Roman church which definitely did not get much right.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#117
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#117
EleventhHour said:
He was only partly right ... has it occurred to you how much if he was wrong (which he was mostly) how he has maligned the nature of God.

There is no way around the fact that if God selects those He wants leaving others no choice...then he is a morally ambiguous God.

And Calvin as clever as he was did not follow his own dogma to is moral logical conclusion......
which is not good.

As well you you are listening to a man whose lens was completely shaped by St Augustine and Augustine did not get much right either having been influenced by the Roman church which definitely did not get much right.
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It can go both ways. But Luther, Calvin, and all the Reformers were Augustinians. Augustine proved free will is a heresy. So people are either aligned with Catholicism that depends on free will. Or Augustinianism which proves salvation is by grace alone, apart from works of the flesh. Take your pick.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#118
#118
Dave-L said:
It can go both ways. But Luther, Calvin, and all the Reformers were Augustinians. Augustine proved free will is a heresy. So people are either aligned with Catholicism that depends on free will. Or Augustinianism which proves salvation is by grace alone, apart from works of the flesh. Take your pick.
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Since "free will"
is not a biblical concept it does not matter what Augustine proved.

Error refuting error ... between "free will" and God selecting some from the path of hell.
It is neither.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#119
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#119
EleventhHour said:
Since "free will"
is not a biblical concept it does not matter what Augustine proved.

Error refuting error ... between "free will" and God selecting some from the path of hell.
It is neither.
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But free will is not a New Covenant biblical concept. It becomes a false doctrine when people teach it as biblical truth.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#120
#120
Dave-L said:
But free will is not a New Covenant biblical concept. It becomes a false doctrine when people teach it as biblical truth.
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Well I do not.
We have a will ...we make choices everyday that is plainly obvious .... most of our choices revolve around our beliefs which meand belief comes first.

I do not believe we make a choice to be saved as I have told you many times.... we are persuaded, convicted, convinced...it is a passive response to truth that has been heard.
 
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