Westboro

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#62
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#62
DBurrage said:
What do you mean that they profess what they do not possess?

Westboro have argued many times that they love their fellow man because they earn them of their sins.

Warning others of the consequence of their sins is biblical (see previous comments).
Click to expand...
There are many folks today that claim to be Christian but their conduct demonstrates that they are not what they claim. They are pretenders or what the bible describes as tares. You shall know them by their fruits correct?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
D

DBurrage

Banned
#63
Apr 21, 2020
621
176
43
#63
Dave-L said:
How so. Spell it out.
Click to expand...
You said in one of your previous posts (page 3):

"People cannot repent as far as salvation is concerned until after God produces the New Birth in them".

This doctrine is similar to Westboro's in that you're essentially saying that God selects who to put 'new birth' in to, and therefore God selects who will be saved.

You've said that people only repent when God produces new birth in them.
But Acts 2:38 tells us that people will receive the Holy Spirit when they repent:

"And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit" ".
 
D

DBurrage

Banned
#64
Apr 21, 2020
621
176
43
#64
notuptome said:
There are many folks today that claim to be Christian but their conduct demonstrates that they are not what they claim. They are pretenders or what the bible describes as tares. You shall know them by their fruits correct?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...
You're right, we are told to take note of the fruit people produce.

But no Church nor any Christian is perfect.
Belief in Jesus and repentance of sins doesn't make you perfect, it means that you will not be judged on your sins.

We can throw the mud at Westboro for being hyper-calvinist, or for protesting.
Similarly, they may throw the mud in the opposite direction because other Churches have become more accepting of behaviours that the Bible defines as sin.

I'm simply asking whether Westboro have a point...
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#65
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#65
DBurrage said:
You said in one of your previous posts (page 3):

"People cannot repent as far as salvation is concerned until after God produces the New Birth in them".

This doctrine is similar to Westboro's in that you're essentially saying that God selects who to put 'new birth' in to, and therefore God selects who will be saved.

You've said that people only repent when God produces new birth in them.
But Acts 2:38 tells us that people will receive the Holy Spirit when they repent:

"And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit" ".
Click to expand...
We need to clear some things up. Why would Westboro preach repentance to those who cannot repent? They obviously do not believe or they would repent.

Acts 2:38 pertained to saved believing Jews who needed to repent from the Old Covenant and start trusting in Christ. It was not about salvation, they were already saved.

You must have been born-again (saved) before you can believe and repent. Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit.
 
D

DBurrage

Banned
#66
Apr 21, 2020
621
176
43
#66
Dave-L said:
We need to clear some things up. Why would Westboro preach repentance to those who cannot repent? They obviously do not believe or they would repent.

Acts 2:38 pertained to saved believing Jews who needed to repent from the Old Covenant and start trusting in Christ. It was not about salvation, they were already saved.

You must have been born-again (saved) before you can believe and repent. Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit.
Click to expand...
You're moving the goal posts.
We were not talking about whether faith is a virtue of the Holy Spirit, we were talking about repentance.

Biblically, people receive the Holy Spirit when they repent and follow Jesus.

But you've said that people repent AFTER they receive the Holy Spirit.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#67
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#67
DBurrage said:
You're moving the goal posts.
We were not talking about whether faith is a virtue of the Holy Spirit, we were talking about repentance.

Biblically, people receive the Holy Spirit when they repent and follow Jesus.

But you've said that people repent AFTER they receive the Holy Spirit.
Click to expand...
This is not true. You are confusing Law repentance that could not save. Only prolong earthly life. Salvation precedes repentance. Not of works (repentance).
 
D

DBurrage

Banned
#68
Apr 21, 2020
621
176
43
#68
Dave-L said:
This is not true. You are confusing Law repentance that could not save. Only prolong earthly life. Salvation precedes repentance. Not of works (repentance).
Click to expand...
Again, you're moving the goal posts.

I did not mention the law, I mentioned repentance and following Jesus.

I'm afraid that you are wrong:
People receive the holy Spirit AFTER they repent and invite Jesus into their lives, not the other way around.

This article explains it in detail:
https://www.theworkofgod.org/Library/Joseph/H_Spirit3.htm
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#69
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#69
DBurrage said:
Again, you're moving the goal posts.

I did not mention the law, I mentioned repentance and following Jesus.

I'm afraid that you are wrong:
People receive the holy Spirit AFTER they repent and invite Jesus into their lives, not the other way around.

This article explains it in detail:
https://www.theworkofgod.org/Library/Joseph/H_Spirit3.htm
Click to expand...
You mention law when you place repentance before salvation. OT style that cannot save.
 
D

DBurrage

Banned
#70
Apr 21, 2020
621
176
43
#70
Dave-L said:
You mention law when you place repentance before salvation. OT style that cannot save.
Click to expand...
No, you're confusing what salvation is.

Sin creates a separation between man and God.
Salvation builds a bridge between man and God, but there is no salvation without repentance.

Are you saying people are saved before they repent?
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#71
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#71
DBurrage said:
No, you're confusing what salvation is.

Sin creates a separation between man and God.
Salvation builds a bridge between man and God, but there is no salvation without repentance.

Are you saying people are saved before they repent?
Click to expand...
Yes.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#77
#77
DBurrage said:
No, you're wrong.

The Bible clearly states that we should warn people of their rebelliousness and sin
https://www.openbible.info/topics/confronting_sins

You need to read your Bible more
Click to expand...
That would be like going to a person who has a brain tumor and telling them they have a brain tumor. What good does it do them. They need healed. they CAN NOT stop or heal themselves. They need healed first

And I have read my bible.. You want to act Like God and judge people. Your out of line
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#78
#78
Dave-L said:
But they make salvation depend on repentance. People cannot repent unless first saved by the new birth which then believes the gospel. And then they want nothing more than to repent.
Click to expand...
This is wrong man

You have people being justified in sin and this is error

Any person can repent..
 
D

DBurrage

Banned
#79
Apr 21, 2020
621
176
43
#79
eternally-gratefull said:
That would be like going to a person who has a brain tumor and telling them they have a brain tumor. What good does it do them. They need healed. they CAN NOT stop or heal themselves. They need healed first

And I have read my bible.. You want to act Like God and judge people. Your out of line
Click to expand...
What you have said does not relate in any way to what I have actually said.

Can you please state very clearly, providing examples, where I have judged anyone, or where I have said that we should judge anyone?

Warning people of the consequences of their sins, which the Bible repeatedly asks us to do, is not the same as judging people on their sins.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#80
#80
DBurrage said:
What do you mean that they profess what they do not possess?

Westboro have argued many times that they love their fellow man because they earn them of their sins.

Warning others of the consequence of their sins is biblical (see previous comments).
Click to expand...
Its hard to warn others of their sins when you ignore your own.

Are you a westboro activist?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.