European refugee crisis: tensions mounting, nations reacting

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MadParrotWoman

Guest
#61
Seems to me Omni's problem is with Britain and I have to wonder why someone calling himself a "non-Christian" is here at all?
 
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tanach

Guest
#62
Seems to me Omni's problem is with Britain and I have to wonder why someone calling himself a "non-Christian" is here at all?
Good point. I was a victim of an attempted mugging a few weeks ago by two East Europeans. I know this because
they spoke to each other as they ran off. I am not saying that all immigrants are criminals but there should be more checks
on who comes here.
 
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#63
Omni your very welcome for the lecture and you did get more than one fact wrong but i am not even going to waste my time proving you wrong as i have better things to do like (have a life).
It is clear you have a problem with britain and from the way you talk down to people and call them names it does confuse me as to why you are on a christian web site? .
 
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Jan 25, 2015
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#64
These refugees are testing the waters and how Europe is handling this migration is going to determine what the rest of Syria and the other Moslem countries will do. In my opinion the EU should take these refugees back to their country or they are going to pay the price.

The UK, Netherland, France etc are already paying the price for the amount of Moslems and African foreigners in their countries...

Give the people aid but aid them in their countries..
 
Jan 25, 2015
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#65
If you want to emigrate apply through the formal process as we all should do.
 
A

AgeofKnowledge

Guest
#66
It's a far more dangerous and volatile situation than most realize. I have a number of posts in this thread addressing the topic which will open eyes as to what's actually coming in: http://christianchat.com/christian-...105-germany-makes-me-happy-3.html#post2294468

These refugees are testing the waters and how Europe is handling this migration is going to determine what the rest of Syria and the other Moslem countries will do. In my opinion the EU should take these refugees back to their country or they are going to pay the price.

The UK, Netherland, France etc are already paying the price for the amount of Moslems and African foreigners in their countries...

Give the people aid but aid them in their countries..
 
Apr 8, 2015
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#67
This is such a test for our civilisations. Posts over concerns about social upheaval, the potential for formations of ghettoes, formations of angry refugee factions and angry resident factions are all very real. Even if law and order remains cool its easy to see why refugee and resident alike can feel uneasy and even fearful.

On the other hand we have a terrible level of displacement with people who have lost everything and have been either thrown out or fled for their lives.... and now wander the earth trying to find a future for themselves and their family.

Both sides of the debate on this have justifications. What person wouldnt feel for someone suffering so much... but also what country opening the doors to a flood of humanity wouldnt wonder how this is going to affect their society, their security and their economy.


So whats the answer to all this?.... whats the middle ground?
 
T

tanach

Guest
#68
This is such a test for our civilisations. Posts over concerns about social upheaval, the potential for formations of ghettoes, formations of angry refugee factions and angry resident factions are all very real. Even if law and order remains cool its easy to see why refugee and resident alike can feel uneasy and even fearful.

On the other hand we have a terrible level of displacement with people who have lost everything and have been either thrown out or fled for their lives.... and now wander the earth trying to find a future for themselves and their family.

Both sides of the debate on this have justifications. What person wouldnt feel for someone suffering so much... but also what country opening the doors to a flood of humanity wouldnt wonder how this is going to affect their society, their security and their economy.


So whats the answer to all this?.... whats the middle ground?
Many British families emigrated to Australia in the 1960s. They had a stringent process to go through before they were accepted and were expected to work when they got there. In turn we accepted many people from the Caribbean during the 1950s the same applied for them. A lot of this mess is due to weak European Governments not taking a tough stand. Most of the people coming are not from Syria. They are economic migrants from elsewhere.
 
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#69
Many British families emigrated to Australia in the 1960s. They had a stringent process to go through before they were accepted and were expected to work when they got there. In turn we accepted many people from the Caribbean during the 1950s the same applied for them. A lot of this mess is due to weak European Governments not taking a tough stand. Most of the people coming are not from Syria. They are economic migrants from elsewhere.
You are spot on. If these people are not contributing economically they will either become part of the social grant systems in place (to assist local citizens) or they will steel for survival.

In South Africa we have an unemployment rate of close to 50%. My house could be mistaken for a jail in countries like Aussie where you don't need any form of safety. My boy can't play outside without supervision, I have big dogs not only because I like them but also to warn perpetrators that they are there to defend me and my family, don't get me started on gun laws in SA. The criminals have them (guns) and the general public are struggling to get one. I can't go outside after dark or I have to be careful to go outside after dark :)

Take this from somebody talking from experience, Europe is going to pay the price if they don't take a hard stance against these foreigners...
 
Aug 12, 2015
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#70
Many British families emigrated to Australia in the 1960s. They had a stringent process to go through before they were accepted and were expected to work when they got there. In turn we accepted many people from the Caribbean during the 1950s the same applied for them. A lot of this mess is due to weak European Governments not taking a tough stand. Most of the people coming are not from Syria. They are economic migrants from elsewhere.

Perhaps if you can look at it in a slightly different light, taking the US as an example, there are 50 states in the mainland USA which is a gigantic land mass where people can travel between states by car, plane, train, bus, and there are also a few territories offshore that people can either take a plane or a boat to, offshore territories which when combined aren't much bigger than the UK, while Europe is also a large land mass, with the exception of the UK and Ireland, which are islands, like the American offshore territories.

A member of any US territory or state, has practically free access to any of the other US territories or states, and the same principle applies with the EU member states.

The basic principles of the EU constitution are that when states become member states, populations can shift and migrate across, through and between other member states, kind of like how people can shift between the US states. It allows for social mobility across all Europe, which is great for graduates, working citizens and people who fancy living in a different European country. For instance, you or I (two people who have British citizenship) can go to France and receive the French benefits and settle in France to live and work, the same way a Frenchman could come to the UK and do likewise. And I, as a person who intends to spend a portion of my life living in different European states, am happy that I have such an opportunity. If I go to France with a job, I can get the same rights as a Frenchy, and if I fall on hard times, I have some leeway what with benefits and help to get back into work. Really, in that regard, as far as European Union citizens are concerned, immigration between member states is not very much different than a US citizen travelling between US states. EU citizens have, more or less, the same rights in each member state as their do in their home state. And an interesting fact regarding the UK's place in this: the immigrant population of the UK actually pay, relative to their population size, more taxes (when taken as a whole) than born-and-bred British citizens, and they are also, relative to their size, nearly three times as likely to have university degrees, so I don't necessarily think the point about weak immigration policies is valid. Perhaps the point about economic migrants is more valid. I do know that many asylum seekers (and remember, those aren't the same as EU immigrants) come to the UK in order to escape certain situations in their home countries, and they end up not working, at least for a considerable term, but I'm not sure that this is the big issue that people make it out to be, because the UK is only taking less than 20,000 asylum seekers (not EU immigrants) per year.

The numbers of Syrian or African asylum seekers who are currently coming to the UK, which is only a few thousand, is really not a fair portrayal of the entire immigrant population, nor is it a significant drain on resources when we consider the entire immigrant population as a whole, compared to the UK born nationals. I have dual citizenship between the UK and Ireland and, I suppose, the reason that I tend to get to heated about this topic is because I see a very black-and-white, staunch nationalistic anti-immigration attitude a lot, but in both countries (the UK and Ireland) the situation is fairly similar: it's actually the born-and-bred citizens who, proportionally, are more of a drain on the economy than immigrants are.

I don't know how many times I've been in Belfast city and walked by a house with the words "Polish, get out" or "No n*****s are welcome here" spray-painted on the front wall, and when you watch the news and read the papers, there's a great irony in it:

"Polish family of five forced out of their home by threatening thugs.

Mr and Mrs Baczewski, residents of the *insert area here*, came home from work on Friday afternoon after receiving a call from their babysitter notifying them that the police had been called, due to a small group of men and women gathering outside their home. The group began throwing stones at the windows and terrorizing the children. The mob, identified as a group of unemployed twenty-somethings, shouted anti-Polonist abuse at the childminder while the two young children were sat terrified in the living room".

The people who are most against immigration, at least where I come from, continually talk about how immigrants are "stealing our jobs" and "draining our economy", and those same people, more often than not, are the type of unemployed, uneducated dimwits who have the free time on a Friday afternoon to terrorize an innocent young family, instead of getting themselves to a college or an employment office.

I have a few close friends who are foreign and I know that they have endured some really tough times trying to educate themselves and get by in the UK, because even when they work and study, they aren't entitled to the same benefits as UK citizens until they have served their citizenship period. They would get serious abuse about their nationality, about being immigrants, at least once a fortnight when we were in college together, and the both of them worked two jobs at times, while they studied. So it's very much something that gets under my skin when immigrants are painted with this "lazy scroungers" brush. I know from experience that it isn't the case.
 
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#71
Seems to me Omni's problem is with Britain and I have to wonder why someone calling himself a "non-Christian" is here at all?
If I have a problem with Britain I think that as a person with dual Irish and British citizenship, that's absolutely by right, don't you? As for the rest, do you think that the site administrators, when they decided to create the option "non-Christian" under the "spiritual status" heading that you must fill in upon signing up, did so because they expected and accepted that there would be be non-Christians here, or did they just make that option for the lolz?
 
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MadParrotWoman

Guest
#72
If I have a problem with Britain I think that as a person with dual Irish and British citizenship, that's absolutely by right, don't you? As for the rest, do you think that the site administrators, when they decided to create the option "non-Christian" under the "spiritual status" heading that you must fill in upon signing up, did so because they expected and accepted that there would be be non-Christians here, or did they just make that option for the lolz?
You may or may not have British citizenship but your flag and "about" section indicates you are very much Irish and your comments back this up. Many Irish have a deep hatred of the British - and I know what I'm talking about.

Regarding your right to be here, I didn't say you shouldn't be here I asked why as a non-Christian you would WANT to be here - big difference.
 
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Viligant_Warrior

Guest
#73
... do you think that the site administrators, when they decided to create the option "non-Christian" under the "spiritual status" heading that you must fill in upon signing up, did so because they expected and accepted that there would be be non-Christians here, or did they just make that option for the lolz?
I figured it was because that would inform the rest of us as to when we were dealing with a troll.
 
Mar 11, 2015
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#74
Mad parrot woman and Vilidant Warrior well said i couldnt of put it better myself :)
 
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AgeofKnowledge

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#75
The Muslims I've interacted with here in the states (e.g. southern California) range from the ones who want to buy you coffee and convert you over to their false religious cult (note that the mosques these "friendly" Muslims attend have had numerous members arrested by the FBI and local law enforcement for jihad related activities ranging from attempting to fly over and join ISIS to planning acts of domestic terror as well as a number imprisoned for sexual crimes against women) to hardcore violent anti-kafir haters.

Example of the latter, I once rounded the back of a restaurant complex in the middle of the night and came face to face with an orthodox pious Muslim man in full Islamic garb. I never bumped into him or disrespected in any way. In fact, I yielded the sidewalk and right of way to him and began walking around when he violently attacked. Fortunately, my martial arts training was enough to win the day but I was just a dirty kafir that could be assaulted in his view. Nothing more.

Another time I walked into a computer store owned by Muslims. Looked like Saudis, they were in full white neck to ankle garb. This was in Santa Fe Springs, CA. They refused to serve me and kept looking at each other as if their store was being contaminated by an unclean dirty kafir. I felt violence was imminent if I stayed. Fortunately, I was able to leave without incident that day for I have no doubt they were well armed and the murder of an unclean filthy kafir would have been celebrated in the mosque by all who learned of it as a "blessing."

Etc...

Sharia Law for Non-Muslims Chapter 5-The Kafir - Political Islam

The orthodox Muslim male is the most prejudiced type of person, on average, that I have ever encountered in my life and I've dealt with La Raza street gang members, eme dropouts, black power ex-gang members, etc... during my volunteer work at Victory Outreach in the 90s.

My belief is that ALL Islamic immigration into the West should be completely prohibited and the immigration of progressive liberals into Muslim countries actively encouraged.

"Progressive" liberals should be made to put their money where their mouths are and encouraged to emigrate to Muslim nations to "diversify" them and work to change those nations for the better rather than the destructive course they're presently engaged in (e.g. wholly unqualified mass Islamic demographic replacement) which is going to escalate into much more violence and sexual crimes against women in mere decades as Islam’s unwavering Rule of Numbers begins to manifest. Whenever and wherever Muslims grow in numbers, the same “anti-infidel” violence endemic to Muslim-majority nations grows with them.

Islam’s ‘Rule of Numbers’ | Raymond Ibrahim
 
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MadParrotWoman

Guest
#76
I find the whole situation extremely worrying and I constantly have to remind myself that God is in control and that these things must come to pass. We have to trust in God's word...we certainly can't trust our politicians.
 
Aug 12, 2015
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#77
The Muslims I've interacted with here in the states (e.g. southern California) range from the ones who want to buy you coffee and convert you over to their false religious cult (note that the mosques these "friendly" Muslims attend have had numerous members arrested by the FBI and local law enforcement for jihad related activities ranging from attempting to fly over and join ISIS to planning acts of domestic terror as well as a number imprisoned for sexual crimes against women) to hardcore violent anti-kafir haters.

Example of the latter, I once rounded the back of a restaurant complex in the middle of the night and came face to face with an orthodox pious Muslim man in full Islamic garb. I never bumped into him or disrespected in any way. In fact, I yielded the sidewalk and right of way to him and began walking around when he violently attacked. Fortunately, my martial arts training was enough to win the day but I was just a dirty kafir that could be assaulted in his view. Nothing more.

Another time I walked into a computer store owned by Muslims. Looked like Saudis, they were in full white neck to ankle garb. This was in Santa Fe Springs, CA. They refused to serve me and kept looking at each other as if their store was being contaminated by an unclean dirty kafir. I felt violence was imminent if I stayed. Fortunately, I was able to leave without incident that day for I have no doubt they were well armed and the murder of an unclean filthy kafir would have been celebrated in the mosque by all who learned of it as a "blessing."

Etc...

Sharia Law for Non-Muslims Chapter 5-The Kafir - Political Islam

The orthodox Muslim male is the most prejudiced type of person, on average, that I have ever encountered in my life and I've dealt with La Raza street gang members, eme dropouts, black power ex-gang members, etc... during my volunteer work at Victory Outreach in the 90s.

My belief is that ALL Islamic immigration into the West should be completely prohibited and the immigration of progressive liberals into Muslim countries actively encouraged.

"Progressive" liberals should be made to put their money where their mouths are and encouraged to emigrate to Muslim nations to "diversify" them and work to change those nations for the better rather than the destructive course they're presently engaged in (e.g. wholly unqualified mass Islamic demographic replacement) which is going to escalate into much more violence and sexual crimes against women in mere decades as Islam’s unwavering Rule of Numbers begins to manifest. Whenever and wherever Muslims grow in numbers, the same “anti-infidel” violence endemic to Muslim-majority nations grows with them.

Islam’s ‘Rule of Numbers’ | Raymond Ibrahim
My experience couldn't be more different. My friend and his father, two Muslims from Pakistan, moved here when my friend was only a child. They now own a local restaurant and have done for the past 18 years. His father ran it when I was a kid, and my family and I used to eat there frequently. Now, his son runs the place, and every time I've gone in, without fail, they've been nothing but pleasant and polite. Have a habit of giving me a free drink, too. I see his father on the street sometimes on my way around town and he always asks me about my day. "How have you been, young sir?"

I also spent a summer in Turkey (supposed to be a very anti-Western place full of crazy Muslims, if you believe American right wing news), and almost every day I would eat at this same restaurant by the beach. The owner of the restaurant and I became good friends. We would go out into the town on his days off, and sometimes in the evenings after he and his staff (three of whom were female Muslim Turks) finished work we would all go for drinks. He, the girls, and I, would dance away, enjoy normal friendly conversations and not once did he ever speak evangelically about his religion. The girls didn't wear the Hijab, the Niqqab or the Burkha, in fact they were dressed pretty much like any other women out around the town. Some people did give us looks at times, but when I asked what it was about he would say that, not unlike the Christians in the West, older generations were more traditional, while younger generations were moving away from that into more liberal ideology.

When I was in London as an adult I lived with two Muslims, an Egyptian and a Caribbean, and they were nothing but good fun. We used to play pranks on one another. When I was a child I lived in London briefly, too, and my best friend was a boy from the Congo who had Muslim parents. Not to mention the other friends I've kept: Poles, Latvians, Luthuanians, (one of whom a good Irish friend of mine married), Yemenis, Spaniards, Venezuelans, Basques, Swiss, French, English, Irish, Welsh, Scottish, Americans, Italians, you name it.

Some of them were atheist, some Protestant, some Catholic, some Muslim. I've found one thing they all had in common: they were all decent people.

The fact that your ideology is so extreme as to posit sending all liberals to Muslim countries, and completely banning all Muslim immigration, shows that you have a deeply skewed perception of the world around you. It sounds as though you have not taken the opportunity to get out and experience it fully. In all my experiences in various countries throughout Europe, I have rarely met a person whom if I treated as a human being, failed to reciprocate in kind.
 
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AgeofKnowledge

Guest
#78
My worldview is just fine Omni. There's nothing wrong with it. Your continuing personal attacks though are being recorded. If you keep engaging in them, I suspect the mods will finally ban you. Bye.
 
A

AgeofKnowledge

Guest
#79
It's not the first Islamic invasion Europe's suffered. However, it's the first one they've invited. The last one was finally repelled by sincere genuine Christians who put their lives on the line to save Europe from total Islamization and you should thank God they did or you would be one bowing to Mecca five times a day fully veiled and in subjection under sharia.

The brave Christianized Franks (a once pagan Germanic people who had been Christianized after the conversion of their king Clovis in 496 AD) moved into France and won the Battle of Tours against a superiorly outfitted Islamic army. They freed the Muslim's European slaves and then began the long hard process of freeing the rest of Europe.

The end result of a successful Christian European Reconquista was the rise of the modern Western Civilization you presently enjoy and all of the many advancements that accompanied it.



I find the whole situation extremely worrying and I constantly have to remind myself that God is in control and that these things must come to pass. We have to trust in God's word...we certainly can't trust our politicians.
 
A

AgeofKnowledge

Guest
#80
Indeed. And as columnist Dennis Prager noted, "It is difficult to imagine any other future scenario for Western Europe than its becoming Islamized or having a civil war."

As occurred during the first epic war with the Muslims over Europe, they refused to assimilate. Centuries ago, after their invading armies were militarily defeated and their rule in Europe subjugated, they were given the choice to assimilate or be expelled. All attempts at assimilation failed and they were finally expelled.

They still mourn the loss of Andalus to this day; however, Europeans tried everything to get them to assimilate before expelling them. They were given religious freedom, exempted from all taxes for a number of years, and no one was permitted to insult them. Christians were to be punished for laughing at muezzins and Muslims were allowed to institute sharia (for Muslims only, of course). Christians were forbidden from entering any mosque or Muslim household and interfering. The pope himself agreed to these terms.

Yet the Muslims insisted on striving for jihad and Islamic supremacy refusing to assimilate. Initially persuasion and debate was tried, when that failed to bring about assimilation forced conversions were attempted, when that too failed finally the Muslims were expelled.

Now, "progressive" (e.g. regressive) liberals work hard to reverse all the hard won gains of their Christian forbearers to Islamize Europe once more. But Europeans do have a history of not quietly submitting to Islam and sharia. So we shall just see. The decisive events have not yet occurred which reveal how it ends. However, they are going to as the costly and chaotic consequences of mass Islamic immigration into Europe continue to rapidly escalate and the continent's future takes form.

They are economic migrants from elsewhere.