A strong and independent woman VS a weak and dependent woman

[Roh_Chris]

So, my friend (a girl) and I were talking about Sandra Bullock and the characters she played in The Blind Side and in The Proposal. Now, don't get me wrong - I love both movies, but I disliked her characters. To me, both characters came across as being too independent and head-strong. This led us to the topic of how strong and independent a woman should be, both, when in a relationship and when not in one.

My friend thought that it was good if a woman was strong and did not need a man to help her in her professional or personal life. I, on the other hand, thought that such a woman was not an ideal partner in a relationship because, for me, if my partner did not need me occasionally, then she was better off without me. Now, there is a fine line between needing someone occasionally and needed them all the time (in my opinion, that would be clingy).

So here are my questions -
1. To the ladies - how do you think women should be, with or without a relationship, if they must be successful in their professional and personal lives?
2. To the men - how would you feel about a partner who was as headstrong as Sandra Bullock? Would that make you feel threatened or would that add to your confidence?

(Please note - I am not trying to bash women here; in fact, I am trying to find out what both genders think about this issue.)​

 

[passing_through]

I think that women generally are strong, now both my mother and sister were very strong willed and I didn't like that in them. I am attracted to demure (reserved, modest, shy) women, but not to the extent that the Asian cultures take it where the women serve the men. The Bible says a meek and quite spirit.

 

[Lynx]

Real life isn't entertaining enough for movies and movie characters wouldn't work well in real life. (That's why certain people are good actors...)

In real life I think most people find their own balance. Those who are too independent chase away suitors and those who are too dependent usually wind up with an abusive spouse, but most people find out two things for themselves - they can't do it all on their own but they do have to do their part.

 

[Abing]

So here are my questions -
1. To the ladies - how do you think women should be, with or without a relationship, if they must be successful in their professional and personal lives?

Well, personally, I think women (applies to both genders, actually) can be successful without a partner, but can be more​ successful with a partner. I mean two is better than one, after all.

The question if they must be successful, is an entirely different topic.

 

[LiJo]

Speaking for myself, I'm not head strong but I am independent. As a single woman I need to be independent, I don't have any other option. I feel in a marriage my husband should be head of the house but I also will not be his doormat. I prefer to be treated as my husband's right hand partner, not his personal slave.

 

[JesusLives]

I am strong and independent and was single for 35 years between marriages..... During that time I chased a lot of guys away because of my not needing them....I didn't do it on purpose and I got sick and tired of thinking all men wanted were weak helpless women.

I had a lot of growing up to do and God knew that and it is true that I supported myself and raised my daughter alone with no financial help unless you call $750.00 in her lifetime help....from her father...

God helped me buy a house and then later move into a townhome that I and the bank own.....lol But there were a lot of different men who came and went because I just didn't fit into whatever package they thought I should fit into.

Over a year ago now one tourist came along and I warned him about my strong independence that chased men away and figured it would chase him away too and not only that I started telling him every bad thing I had done in my life to make sure he would want to run away as all the other men had and a big shocker to me is he didn't run.... and in fact shared his mistakes made in life and in the end we knew what we were getting into and decided it wasn't so bad after all.

We will be married one year 11/27/15 so strong and independent work for some I think you just have to talk things over and get to know someone before you take the leap don't assume you won't like it until you have explored the territory.

 

[Yeraza_Bats]

A woman being strong when she needs to be is not a problem.

A woman who doesnt treat me like she needs me is kinda a problem. Im gonna rely on her all the time, so Id like it if she did the same for me.

If a girl was like really stubborn about "not needing no man", Id probly be pretty turned away from her, yeah If you dont need me, then I dont really need to be there

The best relationship is one where the two rely on each other. One should need the other, otherwise the whole relationship is either one-sided, or totally just..... pointless

 

[Dino246]

2. To the men - how would you feel about a partner who was as headstrong as Sandra Bullock? Would that make you feel threatened or would that add to your confidence?

I've seen both movies, and I think there is a clear difference between them. In The Blind Side, Bullock played a kind of modern-day Proverbs 31 woman (don't react, just hear me out!). She sees a need and applies her resources to make a difference in the young man's life. Without abandoning her family, she reaches out to lend a helping hand, with firmness, as she saw that he was not emotionally able to make good choices (at first). In contrast, her character in The Proposal was definitely headstrong, but as the boss of Ryan Reynolds' character, it was inappropriate what she did. Even though he went along with it, her actions constituted harassment and emotional manipulation. To me, that's ugly, regardless of the package it comes in.

So, I think a woman who demonstrates the character seen in TBS is strong in a good way, but one who is like her in TP is actually weak, because she is not dealing rightly with her own emotional needs, instead expecting her direct report to meet them. Would I like either as a partner? Definitely the TBS over the TP. Generally, I appreciate confidence and self-reliance (certain kinds!) over weakness and neediness, but when those characteristics slur into demanding and critical behaviour, the attraction disappears. Also, just as there is a distinction between confidence and haughtiness, so there is between immature dependence and (openness to) godly mutual affirmation and interdependence. /sermon off

 

[alienfreelancer]

So, my friend (a girl) and I were talking about Sandra Bullock and the characters she played in The Blind Side and in The Proposal. Now, don't get me wrong - I love both movies, but I disliked her characters. To me, both characters came across as being too independent and head-strong. This led us to the topic of how strong and independent a woman should be, both, when in a relationship and when not in one.

My friend thought that it was good if a woman was strong and did not need a man to help her in her professional or personal life. I, on the other hand, thought that such a woman was not an ideal partner in a relationship because, for me, if my partner did not need me occasionally, then she was better off without me. Now, there is a fine line between needing someone occasionally and needed them all the time (in my opinion, that would be clingy).

So here are my questions -
1. To the ladies - how do you think women should be, with or without a relationship, if they must be successful in their professional and personal lives?
2. To the men - how would you feel about a partner who was as headstrong as Sandra Bullock? Would that make you feel threatened or would that add to your confidence?

(Please note - I am not trying to bash women here; in fact, I am trying to find out what both genders think about this issue.)​

You're are going to burn my friend.

 

[Jilly81]

You're are going to burn my friend.

Roh Chris is going to burn one of your friends?

 

[Shawn2516]

I believe most men want a submissive woman who does need them.

"In a multitude of people is the glory of a king, but without people a prince is ruined."

Men want to be respected and their authority listened to. However, since its the end of times, men have pretty much been thrown under the bus. They are laughed, mocked, and ridiculed at every turn on television, in the family courts, and downgraded to family jester. To evil women, men are nothing more than hand-accessories that they can exchange on the market when they feel like getting a new upgrade.

Then you have the whole feminism movement, which is spiritual symbolism for rebellion. Women telling men that they don't need them and that they can do it on their own. Except when news strikes that women are failing in a certain area of their lives, its men's fault and men need to pick up the tab to help the ladies out.

The more that the women embrace feminism, the more likely their chances of finding a man drop closer to zero. You cannot sow hatred in your heart to another gender and expect to reap rewards of love and kindness.

But to answer your question, a dependent woman is not necessarily should be equated with a weak woman.

 

[TriviaGirl86]

I believe most men want a submissive woman who does need them.

"In a multitude of people is the glory of a king, but without people a prince is ruined."

Men want to be respected and their authority listened to. However, since its the end of times, men have pretty much been thrown under the bus. They are laughed, mocked, and ridiculed at every turn on television, in the family courts, and downgraded to family jester. To evil women, men are nothing more than hand-accessories that they can exchange on the market when they feel like getting a new upgrade.

Then you have the whole feminism movement, which is spiritual symbolism for rebellion. Women telling men that they don't need them and that they can do it on their own. Except when news strikes that women are failing in a certain area of their lives, its men's fault and men need to pick up the tab to help the ladies out.

The more that the women embrace feminism, the more likely their chances of finding a man drop closer to zero. You cannot sow hatred in your heart to another gender and expect to reap rewards of love and kindness.

But to answer your question, a dependent woman is not necessarily should be equated with a weak woman.

The feminism movement isn't in and of itself a bad thing. When feminism as a movement started it was so women could vote in the US and worldwide, (see suffragettes Elizabeth Cady Stanton and Susan B. Anthony for example). Those women (in the example) were pro-life by the way and many early feminists were married and supported causes like the abolitionist movement. They were women who believed that things weren't right and should be changed and so they campaigned and suffered for their beliefs. "Feminists" now are just a segment of the whiny, entitled liberal faction who have reduced the causes of their ancestors into nothing more than posturing and pedantic/academic arguments on why anything traditional is essentially evil. I consider myself a feminist, but I also let people know that that word comes on my terms. No one can tell me how to define myself and so I do it as I see fit. I respect the legacy of the brave women back in the day who went to jail because they wanted a voice and the ability to go to college (Marie Curie being an example of a brilliant woman who had limited educational options at the time). That's my two cents anyway.

I believe "dependence" or "independence" are subjective terms and that if a man and a woman are equally yoked they will find a way to make things work. I am considered dependent because I live with my parents and have relied on them for much of my life. I also struggle with severe panic disorder and depression, something that has made my life a lot harder than that of my friends. They understand this about me but I'm always concerned a future partner would not accept this. I actually had a guy I met on ChristianMingle.com essentially dump me because of my dependence. Now, to be fair, I think he didn't like that I was overly shy and wouldn't even look at him so he made up an excuse. However, this is something that I worry about. I feel most men say they want a woman to rely on them but then dislike it if she struggles with emotional stability. The US and other parts of the western world demonize certain types of dependence (a woman living with her parents until she marries, for example) and all it does is cause insecurity and self-hate. I hope, someday, someone will love me for me, with all my flaws included.

Sorry for the long post. TL;DR

 

[TriviaGirl86]

The feminism movement isn't in and of itself a bad thing. When feminism as a movement started it was so women could vote in the US and worldwide, (see suffragettes Elizabeth Cady Stanton and Susan B. Anthony for example). Those women (in the example) were pro-life by the way and many early feminists were married and supported causes like the abolitionist movement. They were women who believed that things weren't right and should be changed and so they campaigned and suffered for their beliefs. "Feminists" now are just a segment of the whiny, entitled liberal faction who have reduced the causes of their ancestors into nothing more than posturing and pedantic/academic arguments on why anything traditional is essentially evil. I consider myself a feminist, but I also let people know that that word comes on my terms. No one can tell me how to define myself and so I do it as I see fit. I respect the legacy of the brave women back in the day who went to jail because they wanted a voice and the ability to go to college (Marie Curie being an example of a brilliant woman who had limited educational options at the time). That's my two cents anyway.

I believe "dependence" or "independence" are subjective terms and that if a man and a woman are equally yoked they will find a way to make things work. I am considered dependent because I live with my parents and have relied on them for much of my life. I also struggle with severe panic disorder and depression, something that has made my life a lot harder than that of my friends. They understand this about me but I'm always concerned a future partner would not accept this. I actually had a guy I met on ChristianMingle.com essentially dump me because of my dependence. Now, to be fair, I think he didn't like that I was overly shy and wouldn't even look at him so he made up an excuse. However, this is something that I worry about. I feel most men say they want a woman to rely on them but then dislike it if she struggles with emotional stability. The US and other parts of the western world demonize certain types of dependence (a woman living with her parents until she marries, for example) and all it does is cause insecurity and self-hate. I hope, someday, someone will love me for me, with all my flaws included.

Sorry for the long post. TL;DR

I want to clarify that what I mean to say is "Many feminists" not "all feminists"...because some feminists no matter how "extreme" do have some good or thought-provoking ideas and I don't want to be entirely dismissive of that.

 

[Shouryu]

You're are going to burn my friend.

This response is not vague or hard to decipher at all.


Rohith, I think all cases are unique, because all people are unique. When we just boil it down to general ideas, we can only go so far. Both of my past two relationships involved headstrong, independent women...who at the same time, are very very dependent in their own ways. My first really serious girlfriend was (is?) also such.

I won't speak much of the past relationship, because that's neither here or there; I only mention it because my relationship with The Ex was a completely different and foreign experience to the relationship I currently have with Angie. So I shall speak directly about GLR and how her independence and strengths are blessings rather than detriments, and how they actually attract me to her more, rather than scare me away.

Angie has been a single mother for the last four years, and her primary source of income is her home business. Yes, the father of her two daughters pays child support, but most of the time, by the nature of Angie's work, she lives by faith that God will provide her with enough jobs to shelter, clothe, feed, and educate her daughters.

That's the other part. Her oldest is in her first semester of university, and her youngest will be entering university in a year and a half. Most of us know and understand that higher education is not cheap, and even when her oldest has left for school, Angie still provides.

She also serves as the director of children's ministries in her church. As such, she coordinates and oversees nursery duties, vacation bible school, Harvest Festival, children's choir, and all activities at her church involving the kids. She is recognized as church leadership, and her church family stood by her, supported her, and prayed over/pleaded with her ex-husband when he became adulterous, and eventually abandoned his family. Her church family and leadership recognized her for who she was, and God provided them to help carry her through her storm.

So what does this add up to? This is a woman who raises her own children, actually having schooled them up through 7th grade, and provides for them. This is a woman who runs her own business in order to provide for her household. This is a woman who is a humble and willing servant of God, for whom He has imparted a compassionate heart for lost children. And she is all of these things without a man in her home serving as head and leader.

Am I to be intimidated or worried about this kind of woman? No.

She doesn't need that man in her home, because in all things, she looks to Christ as her Leader. If anything, I know that this woman loves Christ about all else, because I see the fruit she bears. All of the things that fearful men see in her life that would make her look too independent, too strong, not submissive enough...I look at those things and see them as the fruit of her love and devotion to God. In keeping her eyes on Him, she has become the ultimate example of Proverbs 31:10-31 minus one thing: she is not a wife, and she has no husband to praise and honour her. Aside from that, she is everything that Solomon describes, all because she loves the Lord and loves her daughters.

Are we, as men, to fear or avoid such a woman? God forbid! Her strength and independence is the very beauty that the Lord has formed in her! This is a woman who abides by His word...and she will not submit to just ANY man, but only to man of God who loves Jesus as much as she does. She has been submissive to the Lord, and only a man who is wholly submissive to the Lord is worth her love and devotion. I pray daily that I am that man, and I feel honoured and blessed that I get to "try out" for the job. The way I see it, a woman like this...I won't NEED her to submit to me. That won't even be a battle. If anything, her strength and independence and submission to God will make MY role as head of the house easy, because if we're both running towards Christ, then we're already both running in the same direction together. I don't need her to need me, I need her to need Christ. And she needs the same from me.

All things are a blessing and a benefit if they are from God. Even a strong, independent woman. ESPECIALLY, a strong, independant woman.

 

[Donkeyfish07]

Dependant, independant. I don't really care. in a perferct world, all of my female friends would be independant and comfortable in who they are. Im not going to avoid being friends with someone who happens to be dependant on someone else though. If any of them happens to be a secret gold digger at heart that I don't know about, that's not going to affect me either because they know if you want to go hang out with me all the time.....you better be ready to go dutch . Im not a good target for such people, they would just give up and find an easier mark.

 

[GodIsSalvation]

Strong and independent, or a brazen hussy? Weak and dependent, or cutely delicate and meek?

Fine lines I do opine.

 

[seoulsearch]

If any of them happens to be a secret gold digger at heart that I don't know about, that's not going to affect me either because they know if you want to go hang out with me all the time.....you better be ready to go dutch .

So... you're saying you'd take your date to a restaurant with a windmill, lots of tulips, and they wear wooden shoes?

 

[Donkeyfish07]

So... you're saying you'd take your date to a restaurant with a windmill, lots of tulips, and they wear wooden shoes?

Definitely. That would be so much fun. Its probably safer for your feet to wear wooden shoes anyway. Im a horrible dancer and WILL step on your toes, guaranteed. The only thing you left out is that she will pay her half . If your going 100% dutch, go all the way

 

[wwjd_kilden]

well, as you have us extremes to choose between.....

I would assume that a man who wants "weak and dependent woman" is abusive, whether physical or psychological.
Why do people have to assign gender roles to each other.

I expect my future husband to love God and me
He should expect me to love God and him
and then everything will follow

 

[cmarieh]

I think I'm a healthy combination of between an independent woman and allowing myself to be dependent on another. Now, I don't need anyone to talk or text me to affect how I am going to be each day, now on the other hand if I did something wrong to that said person and didn't hear from them I may not be very pleasant until I do because I don't want to risk losing that friendship. I know when to ask for advice or just need to talk about something and when I can take care of it on my own. One thing I remember with all my friendships is that we all have a life outside of each other.

Now, when I do find a man and we start a relationship I think the only thing I would expect is to at least hear from him first thing in the morning or right before I fall asleep that night and that can be as simple as one text message just knowing that he is thinking of me. I had that experience the end of last year and it felt good when that person has been thinking about you and let you know it.

I learned at an early age that one person should compliment your life and not conflict it.