Where did the idea that the soul is immortal originate?

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john832

Senior Member
#441
May 31, 2013
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eternally-gratefull said:
They can't see this.. Moses is living now, David is living now.; All in paradise, awaiting the return of their savior to ressurect them and give them new bodies!

God is not the God of the dead, as you have shown SO MANY TIMES.
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Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.

Act 2:34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,

You makin' this up as you go?
 
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john832

Senior Member
#442
May 31, 2013
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Elin said:
The spirit (pneuma) and the soul (pusche) are not the same thing.

And the answer to your question lies in your answer to my question:

what part of Abraham is still living, as Jesus said (Mt 21:31-32)?
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Somebody just shoot me.
 
homwardbound

homwardbound

Senior Member
#444
Oct 24, 2012
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#444
You know I find this amazing, grass dies, and is dead, yet comes back to live when water is applied, so was it dead or just asleep or both, yet never really dead. Just had the thought and posted it
 
homwardbound

homwardbound

Senior Member
#445
Oct 24, 2012
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#445
Shiloah said:
Wow. Your spirit is what's dead. Hint: that returns to God when the body dies. Right? That came from God and returns to God. It cannot be the consciousness, because when the body dies, the thoughts die, the plans die. Remember?

As in dead, like the ashes beneath our feet. That means NOT as scriptures describe it. Remember when the mothers in Bethlehem lost their babies? They wept and were inconsolable because those children were NOT. They no longer existed.

P.S. When I said NOT as scriptures describe it, I mean scriptures described being dead as being NOT. They were NOT.
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Sister we are not born here from Mom's womb, Spiritually alive we are born of the flesh and are in need of born again by god's Spirit. This is what I think ET meant in what was said
Only two were born of the Spirit form the womb that I know of recorded in the Bible and that be Jesus Christ and John the Baptist, in the Spirit of Elijah the forerunner before Christ and Christ plain as can be born of the virgin a life-giving Spirit that is today provided for us all through the cross and is received at the resurrection of Christ from God the Father.
Anyways only in prayers of edification each one to another, thanks
 
homwardbound

homwardbound

Senior Member
#446
Oct 24, 2012
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does this answer it
Genesis 2:7
And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
 
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Shiloah

Guest
#447
#447
Michael50 said:
I've shown you dozens of scriptures that prove beyond all doubt that the dead know nothing. You won't have any of them. God knows I have labored to show you these things. So have others.


"The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not love the truth, that they might be saved. And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie, that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness." (2 Thess 2:9-12)

Elin,, one of us is wrong. Satan won't be able to decieve me thru personating the dead.

But, if a dead loved one appeared before you in an apparition,, you would believe it. So it's quite apparent that Satan could decieve you thru the agency of the dead. You already have the foundation that the dead are alive in some fashion. I reject it, totally.

Satan cannot decieve me thru the agency of the dead. It would not be possible. Jesus said that Satan would attempt to decieve the "elect" if that were possible. But it isn't,, because I believe the dead are just that, DEAD! They can't communicate with the living. So,, I know immedietly that when a dead person appears before me,, it is a Demon!
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Hence, well represented here is exactly why believing souls are immortal is so dangerous and no minor issue-- right alongside the destructive teaching that God is such an unjust tyrant, He would condemn to never-ending torture those not written in the lambs book of life.
 
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Shiloah

Guest
#448
#448
homwardbound said:
does this answer it
Genesis 2:7
And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
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I'm not sure which side you're on Homewardbound, regarding this argument, but I feel that specific verse is perfect in explaining that that life you speak of is what came about when the breath of life quickened the body by way of the breath of life which brought into being the living soul, which is a living being-- that dies and then returns to the dust-- and the spirit that quickened it-- after leaving it-- returns again to God, which originally sent it-- to bring Adam to life, making him a living /a living SOUL.
 
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Shiloah

Guest
#449
#449
homwardbound said:
Sister we are not born here from Mom's womb, Spiritually alive we are born of the flesh and are in need of born again by god's Spirit. This is what I think ET meant in what was said
Only two were born of the Spirit form the womb that I know of recorded in the Bible and that be Jesus Christ and John the Baptist, in the Spirit of Elijah the forerunner before Christ and Christ plain as can be born of the virgin a life-giving Spirit that is today provided for us all through the cross and is received at the resurrection of Christ from God the Father.
Anyways only in prayers of edification each one to another, thanks
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Well I'm not talking about the Holy Spirit when I'm saying the spirit which is the breath of life. I'm talking about the quickening brought on by the breath of life which comes from God that brings us to life when we breath or kills us when we can't. Maybe that's where all this confusion comes in.

P.S. I certainly agree with all that other stuff. lol.
 
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Shiloah

Guest
#450
#450
john832 said:
Somebody just shoot me.
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This is so funny. Hahahaha!!! I go away from these forums feeling like my brain is whirling. I mean, how many times do we readdress the same question from so many angles we finally exhaust any possible way we can put the answer? And yet it's still not understand. I keep asking myself, is this really healthy for my mind? lol. If it was a math problem we were trying to figure out, we might as well keep asking over and over and over if this plus this equals that, and never get beyond that. Wow.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#451
#451
john832 said:
Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
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ok, you have proved he is physically dead. has anyone denied this??

Act 2:34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,

You makin' this up as you go?
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who said he was in heaven? has anyone been ressurected yet?

this does not prove, he is not alive. all this proves is that his body is dead.

you still have many issues.

Is God the God of the living or the dead? (not speaking physical death here. even you should know this!)
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#453
#453
Michael50 said:
Before someone steps up and accomadates your request,, see Daniel 12:10 it makes so much sense.
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ahh!! maybe this is why you do not understand??
 
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Elin

Banned
#454
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
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#454
john832 said:
Somebody just shoot me.
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Or you could just answer the question: what part of Abraham is still living, since Jesus said Abraham is living now (Mt 22:31-32).
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#455
#455
Shiloah said:
Well I'm not talking about the Holy Spirit when I'm saying the spirit which is the breath of life. I'm talking about the quickening brought on by the breath of life which comes from God that brings us to life when we breath or kills us when we can't. Maybe that's where all this confusion comes in.

P.S. I certainly agree with all that other stuff. lol.
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when does God say we are quickened? and what does this bring about?

And since when are we speaking of physical death here? I think we all agree on this.
 
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Michael50

Banned
#456
May 24, 2013
682
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#456
eternally-gratefull said:
ahh!! maybe this is why you do not understand??
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One of us is wrong. And one of us will probably be condemned. Not because we believe a lie,, but because we did not believe the Truth.

Satan cannot decieve me thru the agency of the dead.

You cannot claim that Safeguard!

Your foundation says the dead are alive and that they can communicate with living. Thus, I believe you have set yourself up to be deceived, all because you refused to believe the Truth.

Have it your way. Believe as you desire.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#457
#457
Michael50 said:
One of us is wrong. And one of us will probably be condemned. Not because we believe a lie,, but because we did not believe the Truth.
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lol. no one will be condemned because of this issue. Unless you think this is a part of the gospel. Which maybe you do?

Satan cannot decieve me thru the agency of the dead.

You cannot claim that Safeguard!

Your foundation says the dead are alive and that they can communicate with living. Thus, I believe you have set yourself up to be deceived, all because you refused to believe the Truth.

Have it your way. Believe as you desire.
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lol..

No.

I believe God had Samuel speek to sau, It was his will. is God not capable of doing this.

and I believe Moses and elijah were sent by God to talk and encourage jesus who was about to Go through hell.

I believe Jesus when he said he is the god of the living not the dead. (evidently you still do not believe this)

I do not believe that people can just come up and talk to anyone apart from the will of God. Who are you to say what God can and can not do??



 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#458
#458
Elin said:
Or you could just answer the question: what part of Abraham is still living, since Jesus said Abraham is living now (Mt 22:31-32).
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I do not know why people keep ignoring questions, then get mad when we do not see it their way. Seems to be a common occurrence.
 
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Michael50

Banned
#459
May 24, 2013
682
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#459
eternally-gratefull said:

lol. no one will be condemned because of this issue. Unless you think this is a part of the gospel. Which maybe you do?



lol..

No.

I believe God had Samuel speek to sau, It was his will. is God not capable of doing this.

and I believe Moses and elijah were sent by God to talk and encourage jesus who was about to Go through hell.

I believe Jesus when he said he is the god of the living not the dead. (evidently you still do not believe this)

I do not believe that people can just come up and talk to anyone apart from the will of God. Who are you to say what God can and can not do??
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So where did Samuel come from then. You claim he is alive, right?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#460
#460
Michael50 said:
So where did Samuel come from then. You claim he is alive, right?
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Physically alive? No, he was dead and buried. But we are not talking about this, or are we??

You never did answer me.

how can a demon know the future?
How can a demon know God left someone?
Why would a demon do something so foolish as to help a person who is doing what satan wants him to do (like saul was) stop doing that and listen to God?

why did you ignore those questions? (as if I had to ask!)
 
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