Judgement
- Thread starter Hizikyah
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The one who plants and the other who waters are what they were quarreling about (1:11-12, 3:3-5),
tearing the church apart (destroying it) with their factions and quarrels (v.17).
Yes, Paul is referring to God's servants of vv. 5, 8.
Yes, Paul warns them in v. 17 that God will destroy them if they destroy the church with the factions and quarrels he pointed out in 3:3-5, as well as 1:11-12.
Paul's presentation of awards flows right out of his assertion that the leaders of the church were all God's servants, each assigned his different task by the Lord, and each would be rewarded according to his labor (v. 8).
He then cautions God's servants to be careful how they build God's church (v.10) for the quality of each one's work will be tested by fire (v.13).
If the servant's work survives, he will be rewarded (v.14).
If the servant's work does not survive, he will suffer loss, but not the loss of his salvation (v.15).
Nevertheless, Paul is presenting awards for God's servants depending on the quality of their work (vv.8-15),
as well as God's punishment for the factions and quarrels of church members tearing the church apart over God's servants (v.17).
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Yes, their works are the manifestation of their faith, which saves.
Their lack of works are the manifestation of their lack of faith, and therefore they are condemned without it.
Did you read the verse?
Romans 2:6-11, "When He will reward each one according to his works: To the ones on one hand, who, by patient persistence in doing righteousness, seek for glory, honor and immortality, He will give eternal life. But to the ones on the other hand, who are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, He will give indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man who does evil: to the Yahdai first, and also to the Greek. But glory, honor, and peace to every man who works righteousness: to the Yahdai first, and also to the Greek. For there is no respect of persons with Yahweh."
I don't see a posting against working that can stand up.
One said that the work we are to do is to believe. That wouldn't say God says not to do any other work.
One said we are separated from our sins, Jesus became our sin. We all know Christ died for us so we can be forgiven of our sins through Him. That doesn't say we are not to repent and keep from sin.
One said "by grace you have been saved, not by works". We all know that if we could save ourselves through anything we do, we would be Gods and we aren't. Not being saved by works is not saying we aren't required to work.
I think all these do nothing people haven't a leg to stand on.
One said that the work we are to do is to believe. That wouldn't say God says not to do any other work.
One said we are separated from our sins, Jesus became our sin. We all know Christ died for us so we can be forgiven of our sins through Him. That doesn't say we are not to repent and keep from sin.
One said "by grace you have been saved, not by works". We all know that if we could save ourselves through anything we do, we would be Gods and we aren't. Not being saved by works is not saying we aren't required to work.
I think all these do nothing people haven't a leg to stand on.
'On one hand... on the other hand...' is an English figure of speech used to contrast two different things.
There are three resurrections...
First:
Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Now we have the rest of the dead to deal with. This phrase does not say they all come up together, it says that the rest do not live until after the Millenium....
Second:
Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.[/quote]
These are those who did not have a chance yet. Chinese from 4000 years ago did not have an opportunity...
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
They never heard the name of Jesus Christ. They are those who are blinded to the truth by God Himself...
Mat 13:11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
Why would God do this?
Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Notice this is future? "Shall be saved" is not past tense, it looks forward to the second resurrection when this miracle occurs...
Luk 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,
These are not judged on something they cannot understand by Divine Providence. The reason for this?
Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
Notice some more about the verse 11-12 The books are opened. These are the same 66 books that are opened to the called today. Also, the Book of Life is opened to be written in. These are judged (according to their works) and can have their name written in the Book of Life.
Finally, we come to the third resurrection...
Third:
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
The resurrection to the Lake of Fire for the incorrigibly wicked...
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
There are thre judgement periods, the church is under judgment today...
1Pe 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
This continues throughout the millenium. Then comes the second resurrection for those who never had a chance. Finally, comes the resurrection to the Lake of Fire for those who had their chance and spit in God's eye. Eternal death by fire. Burned to ashes...
Mal 4:1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.
Mal 4:2 But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.
Mal 4:3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the LORD of hosts.
Originally Posted by HizikyahWhy do so many people think they will not be judged by thier works? The "New Testament" tells us we will over and over:
Yahchanan (John) 5:28-30, “Do not be astonished at this-for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice, and will come forth. Those who have practiced righteousness will be resurrected in order to live; and those who have practiced wickedness will be resurrected in order to be damned."
Please give me your thoughts on this subject.
You highlighted:
Those who have practiced righteousness will be resurrected in order to live
practiced righteousness
?????????????????????
What does that mean? to be on who practiced righteousness?
If I may interject...
Psa 119:172 My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.
Such as this?
Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
or this?
Luk 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.
What about this?
Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
this is just another way to say we are under law. not grace.
why do some people want to continue to think they can be righteous enough to earn salvation? You will never be righteous enough to earn it. Only one man did this, and they crucified him on the cross.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
who practices iniquity? Those who are not saved and given the power of God to overcome.
many want to try to earn it. These are the ones who did all those "great works in jesus name" jesus said depart, for I NEVER KNEW YOU..
very important. these are not people who are saved, then lost it. these people never were children of god. yet they themselves praise their own work in jesus name why? They were trying to earn salvation. not recieve the gift God gave, thus they were never saved..
weeping and nashing of teeth, it will be worst for them than for the athiest.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
wrong. the law is powerless to save us, It can not save us, if it could. we would still be under law. and there would be no such thing as grace..
why do you want to try o perfect what you supposedly have gotten by the spirit by the works of the flesh? as paul said, are you so foolish??
Why do some continue to disagree with our Lord and Savior?
Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Luk 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.
Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
Being righteous means being just. Doing justice is doing righteousness.
Righteousness
G1343 δικαιοσύνη dikaiosune (dik-ai-os-oo'-nay) n.
1. equity (of character or act)
Quite simply, all justice comes from faith.
All injustice is sin ... 1 John 5:17
... the just one will live by faith. Galatians 3:11
... whatsoever is not of faith is sin. Romans 14:23
... the just one will live by faith. Galatians 3:11
... whatsoever is not of faith is sin. Romans 14:23
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
he did fulfill.
why do some want to claim Jesus lied, and he did not fulfill the law. and we have to fulfill it in ourselves??
at least they are in the kingdom of heaven? I would rather be in heaven, and have my works burned as wood hey and straw, then be outside in hell weeping and nashing my teeth..
yep. the law still does what it was intended to do. proves we are unworthy of heaven, and worthy of hell.
why do you think because of the law you are worthy of heaven? it is obvious the law is not doing what it was intended to do in YOUR life!
lol.. you did not get the twist.
Only one good is God. jesus is God. he was good.
Your not. so you can keep the commands all you want, you are still not good. and still fall short of the glory of God. thus christ fulfilling the law. You would have no hope.
stop trusting self. and look to the law. it condemns you, it doe snot make you righteous.
I guess Paul is least in the kingdom of heaven then. Circumcision was the law. Paul said if you follow that law you are cut off from Christ. By stating such, he effectively said that law is null and void.
Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God. 1 Corinthians 7:19
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And they have been fulfilled, and when the whole NT is considered, we find
they have been set aside (Heb 7:18-19) as the means of righteousness to salvation,
being replaced with the law of Christ, which is now the law of God (1Co 9:21; Gal 6:2),
and is the law of love (Mt 22:37-39) which fulfills (performs) the whole law (M t22:40; Ro 13:8-10),
but with the huge difference of no cursed attached for not keeping "every word" of it (Dt 27:26).
It is not the Mosaic Law if there is no curse attached, it is the law of Christ (1Co 9:21; Gal 6:2).
Two things:
1) both are in the kingdom of heaven, and
2) Jesus spoke these words when the law was the means of righteousness to salvation,
for which it has now been set aside (Heb 7:18-19),
and replaced with the law of Christ, which is now the law of God (1Co 9:21; Gal 6:2).
So how many entered eternal life by keeping the law, in which "every word" had to be kept
to avoid its curse (Dt 27:26)?
Hint: none.
Jesus referred them to the law because it showed them their need for a Savior from
God's punishment on their sin.
The NT does not command obedience to the law for righteousness to salvation.
Rather it shows that love in the heart from the Holy Spirit keeps the law as the result of salvation,
a law with no curse attached for not keeping it perfectly.