Holiness

[chubbena]

This is a Good explanation for Holiness,chubbena

"There is no inbetween. If you understnad this then the rest is really easy...." like he said.
However,we don't really understand the measures God have kept.
From what we have been provided through Holy Scripture the same Growth to Perfection is the journey to God's Perfect Holiness...which is not easy(is a struggle) since the road is narrow and troublesome...

"These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world." John 16:33 KJV
A person who is in God's Holiness will have trials,
worldly person will not have..because satan has blinded his/her eyes.

And if anyone tells anyone that they are walking in 100% holiness in their walk with Christ,ask them to share their life..if they make excuse/avoid then you just saw a hypocrite

God Bless

Not sure if you realized but you just said "a person who is in God's Holiness...". We are in His presence and He is holy... If only I could always remember that.

 

[RedTent]

Here are bible references to holiness. It doesn't give a definition, but says what comprises holiness.

2 Corinthians 7:1 Since we have these promises, beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from every defilement of body and spirit, bringing holiness to completion in the fear of God.

This scripture says not only cleansed from sin, but it includes what we practice.

1 John 3:6-8 No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him. Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he is righteous. Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil. No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God. By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

 

[Karraster]

I found this link.. Come out of Her, My People (Pre-Edition) - The Final Reformation ,,that has a section #7 about Holy. I won't post any here, it is probably controversial, as it has lots of information about the corruption at the very beginning of the Catholic Church and how Hebrew words were not translated, (optimal?) which I agree.

 

[Cobus]

you are driving me nuts here
Your post #38 said we are already made holy. So are you saying we can be in and out and in and out of holiness in our life time
The other question which I hope would not lead to another endless strife is, does the Holy Spirit in line with the teachings in OT (remember the Leviticus verses I quoted in post #1)?

Chubbena, I am NOT HOLY.... And if you were God would witness with power that you are. If I say WE ARE ALREADY HOLY, I mean we are complete and exactly like the saints that are perfected in Eph 4:11 to 13. I am speaking hypothetical in the maaner we SHOULD BE LIKE how God teach what He does with His people.

So let us assume we are MATURE in God and that God has FINISHED His whole process on us. Let us assume we are what God makes of EVERY believer as He explains it in the Bible. I am not holy but I will speak as though we (all who are debating here in your thread ARE HOLY AS GOD IS HOLY) Although I doubt a single on is. So please forgive me if I confuse you, that is not my intention or job. Actually Satan confuses us with all kinds of lies.

Chubbena so for the purpose of the question you ask about HOLY, we will ASSUME we are already saved by God. OK! Maybe now if you reread my posts you will understand. But you do not have to, I will go through the process how we arer made holy by God ... Step by step as God gives it in His Word.

Rom 8:29...For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. (we will assume we are all predestinated to be conformed to the image of His Son)

Now we will use Scripture to SHOW how god makes us as holy and as perfect and as powerful as His Son who is only the FIRST OF MANY. Jesus is NOT the only holy person God ever made. ALL God predestined to be saved is made as holy AS Jesus and Father Himself here on earth... How? This is how...

Rom 8:30... Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Now look at the process:

Step 1. God calls us. (called to be saints Rom 1. Saints are MOST HOLY (greek : hagios))

Step 2. God justify us. (Justification is the process of repenting, cleansing and forgiving. Part of this JUSTIFICATION is the sanctification process to SEPERATE us from evil) This is the SET APART from God.

Step 3. Glorification. Glorification means to MAKE GODLY. TO LIFT UP. To exhalt a spirit. To make HOLY/PERFECT/JESUS'S IMAGE AND LIKENESS.

So the CONFORMING us to the Image of His Son God has to do ALL three steps. And the steps END with glorification. Glorification is the moment God LIFTS YOUR SPIRIT OUT OF THE FLESH AND INTO HIM. AND HE REPLACE YOUR SPIRIT WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT. THEN THIS FLESH OF YOURS IS HOLY, AND YOU ARE HOLY IN HIM. AND JESUS IS GLORIFIED IN YOU!

So it is PRETTY clear that BORN OF GOD (Born of Spirit) and Rebirth (born again) is at the END of sanctification/justification. When God has DONE ALL the previous steps Glorification is the BORN OF GOD MOMENT. The LAST thing God will EVER do for you.

Let me show you where ALL the saint spirits go the moment God glorifies them.... ALL OF THE SAINT SPIRITS are there, not one is in flesh, not one!

Col 3... If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
Col 3:2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
Col 3:3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
Col 3:4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

And look what Jesus asked the Father.... John 17... And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
Joh 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
And here is an example where God did it with 5000 men... Acts 4. And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.
Act 4:32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul:

God at work and GLORIFY JESUS IN 5000 MEN WOW!!!!! God making 5000 men PERFECTLY one as HE AND JESUS IS ONE, He makes them ALL ONE WITH HIM.... WOW!!!

 

[Cobus]

There will be NO strife my friend. I will go away son as I feel there is strife coming. It takes two parties for a fight. I do not fight! I turn the other cheek....

We CANNOT go in and out of holiness. Look what happened to Ananias and his wife when they WENT OUT OF HOLINESS... They died on the spot. God only makes holy ONCE! But it is really a POWERFUL thing. There is only like four of five people mentioned in the Bible that did not KEEP their salvation. And 1 John makes it clear that it is very unlikely that God's children lose their Godliness. But it is possible I believe reading about Ananias. I am pretty sure he and his wife was also a couple made ONE with the others. That is why they sold their land and brought the money to the apostles. but then they lied about the price they got for the land...

God says this, and remember this becomes real for us the moment God FILLS us with His Spirit (glorification)..... For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Note all the AMAZING things that we get when God makes us part of HIM! Enlightened, taste heavenly gifts, partaker of Holy Spirit, Taste the Good Word of God, Powers of the world to come.... WOW! Pretty powerful stuff this? May I also get all this...

God bless you my friend WITH HIS WORD, So let us TASTE HIS GOOD WORD....

 

[RedTent]

Chubbena, I am NOT HOLY.... And if you were God would witness with power that you are. If I say WE ARE ALREADY HOLY, I mean we are complete and exactly like the saints that are perfected in Eph 4:11 to 13. I am speaking hypothetical in the maaner we SHOULD BE LIKE how God teach what He does with His people.

So let us assume we are MATURE in God and that God has FINISHED His whole process on us. Let us assume we are what God makes of EVERY believer as He explains it in the Bible. I am not holy but I will speak as though we (all who are debating here in your thread ARE HOLY AS GOD IS HOLY) Although I doubt a single on is. So please forgive me if I confuse you, that is not my intention or job. Actually Satan confuses us with all kinds of lies.

Chubbena so for the purpose of the question you ask about HOLY, we will ASSUME we are already saved by God. OK! Maybe now if you reread my posts you will understand. But you do not have to, I will go through the process how we arer made holy by God ... Step by step as God gives it in His Word.

Rom 8:29...For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. (we will assume we are all predestinated to be conformed to the image of His Son)

Now we will use Scripture to SHOW how god makes us as holy and as perfect and as powerful as His Son who is only the FIRST OF MANY. Jesus is NOT the only holy person God ever made. ALL God predestined to be saved is made as holy AS Jesus and Father Himself here on earth... How? This is how...

Rom 8:30... Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Now look at the process:

Step 1. God calls us. (called to be saints Rom 1. Saints are MOST HOLY (greek : hagios))

Step 2. God justify us. (Justification is the process of repenting, cleansing and forgiving. Part of this JUSTIFICATION is the sanctification process to SEPERATE us from evil) This is the SET APART from God.

Step 3. Glorification. Glorification means to MAKE GODLY. TO LIFT UP. To exhalt a spirit. To make HOLY/PERFECT/JESUS'S IMAGE AND LIKENESS.

So the CONFORMING us to the Image of His Son God has to do ALL three steps. And the steps END with glorification. Glorification is the moment God LIFTS YOUR SPIRIT OUT OF THE FLESH AND INTO HIM. AND HE REPLACE YOUR SPIRIT WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT. THEN THIS FLESH OF YOURS IS HOLY, AND YOU ARE HOLY IN HIM. AND JESUS IS GLORIFIED IN YOU!

So it is PRETTY clear that BORN OF GOD (Born of Spirit) and Rebirth (born again) is at the END of sanctification/justification. When God has DONE ALL the previous steps Glorification is the BORN OF GOD MOMENT. The LAST thing God will EVER do for you.

Let me show you where ALL the saint spirits go the moment God glorifies them.... ALL OF THE SAINT SPIRITS are there, not one is in flesh, not one!

Col 3... If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
Col 3:2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
Col 3:3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
Col 3:4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

And look what Jesus asked the Father.... John 17... And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
Joh 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
And here is an example where God did it with 5000 men... Acts 4. And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.
Act 4:32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul:

God at work and GLORIFY JESUS IN 5000 MEN WOW!!!!! God making 5000 men PERFECTLY one as HE AND JESUS IS ONE, He makes them ALL ONE WITH HIM.... WOW!!!

I think you are just adding a lot to a simple truth that God gives. You talk of maturity in God, predestination, God calling us, justifying, and glorification. Each could have a separate thread.

Holiness is being cleansed by Christ and staying away from sin. See my post #82.

 

[Cobus]

I agree REDTENT, Holiness is the Spirit of God filling us. And He does keep away from sin and all unrighteousness... Even the sin for NOT doing good when God wants GOOD WORKS to be done... And that is the empowerment of the Holy Spirit.

Here is the verse that says how the HOLY SPIRIT keepeth himself..... 1 John 5:18.... We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

Begotten the HOLY SPIRIT of GOD.... It is by the POWER of the Holy Spirit htat these men sinneth not... NOT AT ALL. That menas they do the right thing ALL THE TIME... Holy and perfect... WOW!

Thank you Lord that I know this even better now.
Redtent thank you for pointing it out. And I totally agree but I think Subbena will want to know HOW he cleanse us and glorify us to be holy....The completion of Holiness is the glorification... God takes you from 0% holy to 100% holy the moment he BEGOT you from sin.... The SEAL of the Holy Spirit is given when the Holy Spirit is given. The Holy Spirit IS the SEAL. Taht is why the wicket one toucheth him NOT...

 

[RedTent]

I agree REDTENT, Holiness is the Spirit of God filling us. And He does keep away from sin and all unrighteousness... Even the sin for NOT doing good when God wants GOOD WORKS to be done... And that is the empowerment of the Holy Spirit.

Here is the verse that says how the HOLY SPIRIT keepeth himself..... 1 John 5:18.... We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

Begotten the HOLY SPIRIT of GOD.... It is by the POWER of the Holy Spirit htat these men sinneth not... NOT AT ALL. That menas they do the right thing ALL THE TIME... Holy and perfect... WOW!

Thank you Lord that I know this even better now.
Redtent thank you for pointing it out. And I totally agree but I think Subbena will want to know HOW he cleanse us and glorify us to be holy....The completion of Holiness is the glorification... God takes you from 0% holy to 100% holy the moment he BEGOT you from sin.... The SEAL of the Holy Spirit is given when the Holy Spirit is given. The Holy Spirit IS the SEAL. Taht is why the wicket one toucheth him NOT...

It is amazing how the Holy Spirit works. I am reading a book by a lady who reports on how badly women are treated in Muslim countries. They have copied a lot of our laws, they say they are to obey them but without the Holy Spirit some even say it is right to murder women to protect their honor. This poor woman does not know we must have the Holy Spirit to guide us to law, and obey through the spirit. It is only through Christ, it cannot be through a man made God. It cannot be by our own power.

 

[Cobus]

Amen Redtent. Only God can make holy. If we could we would not need a God or we will be God's ourselves. And imagine how many HOLIES there then will be Each God his own.... Actually Redtent ONLY GOD CAN LIVE OUR LIVES as CHILDREN of God in us.

Eph 4 says it SO well.... It is ONE FATHER, above, in and through us ALL.... Oh what a MAGNIFISENT God we have in Jesus. He that will live in my place here on earth. MAy I go to Him VERY SOON.

I love You Jesus, and thank you for being my Lord and Saviour. Let thou will be done in me and Redtent AS IT IS DONE IN HEAVEN. Amen!

 

[pastac]

I sure do want to jump into this but havent been lead to just yet waiting to see if it gets any deeper than this surface stuff that is being addressed first.
This is sooooo good right now but dig deeper!!! Bu I will add that one must consider wholeness as a part of holiness. Taking hold of holiness,being whole, being holy, being brought from the holes in our lives into wholeness just some thoughts.

 

[ji]

Not sure if you realized but you just said "a person who is in God's Holiness...". We are in His presence and He is holy... If only I could always remember that.

we are living in this world...

you can always remember God's Presence,..but that doesn't mean you won't have troubles..
That means you are not following Jesus...

He is Holy,yes,Jesus is Lord God and HE is holy..
The same also said
"In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world"

Ignoring that 'suffering or tribulation' is like demanding God to take you to Heaven without going through the Christian's Growth to the Christ's Image...
That's laziness...

And having troubles and overcoming is acquired, receiving God's Holiness is not because our abilities,but because Jesus overcame the world.we have to move in that path which He led to Overcome this world.And that gives us His Holiness...
Its all by the Grace of God..

Its not the first time saved experience,but its the final Crowning of ours as co-heirs of God's Heaven..

 

[Cobus]

I sure do want to jump into this but havent been lead to just yet waiting to see if it gets any deeper than this surface stuff that is being addressed first.
This is sooooo good right now but dig deeper!!! Bu I will add that one must consider wholeness as a part of holiness. Taking hold of holiness,being whole, being holy, being brought from the holes in our lives into wholeness just some thoughts.

Ok let us go deeper.... How holy is this holiness? Well it is this Holy... Father I (Jesus Your Son) am GLORIFIED IN THEM. For the GLORY THOU HAST GIVEN ME, I HAVE GIVEN THEM... that they may be ONE Father, as Thou and I are ONE! Father that they will be made PERFECT ONE!

This Holness of God has the ability to make ALL the members in the holiness PERFECTLY ONE. One with GOD HIMSLEF. A oneness that CANNOT be broken. A perfect ONE BODY. The True Church where Jesus s the head and the Body is FITLY (perfectly) put together for the GLORY OF GOD. How can ANYTHING imperfect bring glory to God? It cannot that is why God's Holiness is HIS GLORY TO HIMSELF.

God gives us the GLORY of JESUS to prove HIS GLORY. God does it to SHOW He is God. That is why Jesus taught us to pray....Our Father whom art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name (God keeps His Name Holy in all bodies He lives in, Jesus is the example how) Thy Kingdom come (is there not perfect holiness in His Kingdom?) Thy will be done (His will is Matthew 5:48.. Be perfect) on earth (in me) as it is done in heaven. (how is His will done in heaven? Perfect? Yes!)

And ALL this is confirmed by one STRONG Word of God.... 1 John 4:17... Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

Imagine having BOLDNESS in the day of judgment becasue AS GOD IS SO ARE YOU IN THIS WORLD... (How is Father God in heaven?) PERFECT AND HOLY! How are you in this WORLD? PERFECT AND HOLY! Amen!

Praise God that His wisdom is foolish to the world and the world's wisdom is foolish for God.

 

[Bookends]

If God were to make us Holy just by the snap of His fingers, there would have been no need for Christ's atonement sacrifice.

[h=3]Hebrews 2:17[/h]Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)


17 Therefore, He had to be like His brothers in every way, so that He could become a merciful and faithful high priest in serviceto God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people.

 

[Cobus]

Bookie we are made PURE / CLEAN by the cross and the blood, and we are made NEW / HOLY by the Spirit! And we are perfected by the RESURRECTION of HIM in us!


Jesus performed THREE things for all who He saves.... First He gave them the LIVING WATERS / The Word of God.
Then He paid the sacrifice to get them clean... The Blood. Then He gave His Spirit to make LEAD / TEACH them in Truth / The Word. Remember what Jesus said... Just before HE was crucified HE said.... There are still many things He wants to teach say unto them, but THEY CANNOT BEAR IT YET John 16:12.... So there is still things God has to do for them even AFTER Jesus left them.

Then Jesus said... The Holy Ghost that the Father will SEND in my Name, He shall teach you all things... See! Only AFTER they receive the Holy Spirit will they know ALL things. Without the Spirit they would be INCOMPLETE. It shows us that they will only be ABLE to BEAR all things AFTER they recieve the Holy Spirit, not before. John 16:12.

The Holy part is well described in Acts 10 and look how the Spirit FALLS on Cornelius and the other people. I do not think you read the whole thread but for your sake I will show Scripture how INSTANT it is for God to MAKE HOLY. While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.


I know Cornelius was NOT holy before the Spirit of God FELL o him, and he was TRULY HOLY when God did have His Spirit fall on him.


Bookie read Acts 8 where Philip came to the City in Samaria, and how they Received the Holy Spirit. That also was in an instant! Bookie ask yourself, when were those people made HOLY OK! At what stage were they made Holy!

Just a thought. A man with a 1000 sins and a man with one sin are EQUALLY UNHOLY....

 

[Bookends]

Bookie we are made PURE / CLEAN by the cross and the blood, and we are made NEW / HOLY by the Spirit! And we are perfected by the RESURRECTION of HIM in us!


Jesus performed THREE things for all who He saves.... First He gave them the LIVING WATERS / The Word of God.
Then He paid the sacrifice to get them clean... The Blood. Then He gave His Spirit to make LEAD / TEACH them in Truth / The Word. Remember what Jesus said... Just before HE was crucified HE said.... There are still many things He wants to teach say unto them, but THEY CANNOT BEAR IT YET John 16:12.... So there is still things God has to do for them even AFTER Jesus left them.

Then Jesus said... The Holy Ghost that the Father will SEND in my Name, He shall teach you all things... See! Only AFTER they receive the Holy Spirit will they know ALL things. Without the Spirit they would be INCOMPLETE. It shows us that they will only be ABLE to BEAR all things AFTER they recieve the Holy Spirit, not before. John 16:12.

The Holy part is well described in Acts 10 and look how the Spirit FALLS on Cornelius and the other people. I do not think you read the whole thread but for your sake I will show Scripture how INSTANT it is for God to MAKE HOLY. While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.


I know Cornelius was NOT holy before the Spirit of God FELL o him, and he was TRULY HOLY when God did have His Spirit fall on him.


Bookie read Acts 8 where Philip came to the City in Samaria, and how they Received the Holy Spirit. That also was in an instant! Bookie ask yourself, when were those people made HOLY OK! At what stage were they made Holy!

Just a thought. A man with a 1000 sins and a man with one sin are EQUALLY UNHOLY....

What you preach is that the atoning sacrifice of our Lord is only partial payment, not enough, for God the Father to forgive our sins and grant us entrance into His kingdom/heaven. Not one biblical character ever claimed to have perfect holiness except our Lord. Even Paul said he had not obtained it, but yet through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit he wrote majority of the NT. What you don't understand, IMO, is the functions of the Holy Spirit, the indwelling HS (received upon genuine repentance and 100% faith in God's gift to mankind for the atonement of our sins past, present and future) which makes us grow spiritually by teaching us, convicting us, comforting us etc. etc. and the infilling of the Holy Spirit in which empowers us for Christian service, so that we don't credit His work to our own power and strength for it's by His power and might we are able to work.

Until you genuinely repent and rely totally on Christ's sacrifice alone for the atonement of your sins, you will never be a new creation, you will never receive the indwelling nor the infilling Holy Spirit. Those people you speak of, and God's Children become holy positionally before God upon their genuine repentance and 100% faith in Christ's work on earth (His sacrifice) in which the indwelling Holy Spirit enters our lives and begins to mold us into His likeness. But I feel you won't receive this, therefore, all I can do is pray for your salvation my friend.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Just a thought. A man with a 1000 sins and a man with one sin are EQUALLY UNHOLY....

You are 100% right here.

What separates the man with the 1000 sins and the 1 sin? And would make them holy?

If the man with the 1000 sins had his sins washed by the blood of Christ, through his faith in the promise of God of justification through faith. He is DECLARED holy. If the man wiht the 1 sin has not had his sin washed, He is headed to hell.

 

[chubbena]

why did Jesus have to die then?

Not for the saved who wilfully and intentionally sin I suppose.

 

[chubbena]

Chubbena, I am NOT HOLY.... And if you were God would witness with power that you are. If I say WE ARE ALREADY HOLY, I mean we are complete and exactly like the saints that are perfected in Eph 4:11 to 13. I am speaking hypothetical in the maaner we SHOULD BE LIKE how God teach what He does with His people.

So let us assume we are MATURE in God and that God has FINISHED His whole process on us. Let us assume we are what God makes of EVERY believer as He explains it in the Bible. I am not holy but I will speak as though we (all who are debating here in your thread ARE HOLY AS GOD IS HOLY) Although I doubt a single on is. So please forgive me if I confuse you, that is not my intention or job. Actually Satan confuses us with all kinds of lies.

Chubbena so for the purpose of the question you ask about HOLY, we will ASSUME we are already saved by God. OK! Maybe now if you reread my posts you will understand. But you do not have to, I will go through the process how we arer made holy by God ... Step by step as God gives it in His Word.

Rom 8:29...For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. (we will assume we are all predestinated to be conformed to the image of His Son)

Now we will use Scripture to SHOW how god makes us as holy and as perfect and as powerful as His Son who is only the FIRST OF MANY. Jesus is NOT the only holy person God ever made. ALL God predestined to be saved is made as holy AS Jesus and Father Himself here on earth... How? This is how...

Rom 8:30... Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Now look at the process:

Step 1. God calls us. (called to be saints Rom 1. Saints are MOST HOLY (greek : hagios))

Step 2. God justify us. (Justification is the process of repenting, cleansing and forgiving. Part of this JUSTIFICATION is the sanctification process to SEPERATE us from evil) This is the SET APART from God.

Step 3. Glorification. Glorification means to MAKE GODLY. TO LIFT UP. To exhalt a spirit. To make HOLY/PERFECT/JESUS'S IMAGE AND LIKENESS.

So the CONFORMING us to the Image of His Son God has to do ALL three steps. And the steps END with glorification. Glorification is the moment God LIFTS YOUR SPIRIT OUT OF THE FLESH AND INTO HIM. AND HE REPLACE YOUR SPIRIT WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT. THEN THIS FLESH OF YOURS IS HOLY, AND YOU ARE HOLY IN HIM. AND JESUS IS GLORIFIED IN YOU!

So it is PRETTY clear that BORN OF GOD (Born of Spirit) and Rebirth (born again) is at the END of sanctification/justification. When God has DONE ALL the previous steps Glorification is the BORN OF GOD MOMENT. The LAST thing God will EVER do for you.

Let me show you where ALL the saint spirits go the moment God glorifies them.... ALL OF THE SAINT SPIRITS are there, not one is in flesh, not one!

Col 3... If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
Col 3:2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
Col 3:3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
Col 3:4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

And look what Jesus asked the Father.... John 17... And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
Joh 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
And here is an example where God did it with 5000 men... Acts 4. And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.
Act 4:32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul:

God at work and GLORIFY JESUS IN 5000 MEN WOW!!!!! God making 5000 men PERFECTLY one as HE AND JESUS IS ONE, He makes them ALL ONE WITH HIM.... WOW!!!

Neither am I but Peter said "as it is written 'be holy as I am holy'". He said this to believers which I suppose it's also for you and me.
I think we are saved alright like those who came out of Egypt. They are saved from slavery in Egypt while we are saved from slavery in sin.
However, I don't think being saved means we are holy nor we have arrived. The reason why He said to them through Moses "be holy as I am holy". It's probably a process. In the OT they had to learn to obey the commandments to come to terms with holiness which I quoted in Leviticus and there are probably more to it. Today we have them as an example of failure, unfortunately. And may be, just may be, we assumed too soon that we are those Paul spoke about in Romans 8:29-30. May be we still do have choices to make. He spoke of quite a few if's in chapter 8.
"If indeed the Spirit of God lives in you."
"If anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ."
"If Christ is in you, then even though your body is subject to death because of sin, the Spirit gives life[SUP] [/SUP]because of righteousness."
"If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies because of[SUP] [/SUP]his Spirit who lives in you."
And I believe this is a warning - "If you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live."
And another one - "For those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God."
So looks to me Romans 8:29-30 is the promise to those who love Him in verse 28 and we are to response in words and deeds as in verse 31 and on.
I tend to believe we are in the desert and there are two directions - one back to slavery and the other to the promised land. It's the way I see Colossians 3 too. We died and born again through the baptism into Christ just as the Israelites baptised into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. It's our choice.

 

[chubbena]

There will be NO strife my friend. I will go away son as I feel there is strife coming. It takes two parties for a fight. I do not fight! I turn the other cheek....

We CANNOT go in and out of holiness. Look what happened to Ananias and his wife when they WENT OUT OF HOLINESS... They died on the spot. God only makes holy ONCE! But it is really a POWERFUL thing. There is only like four of five people mentioned in the Bible that did not KEEP their salvation. And 1 John makes it clear that it is very unlikely that God's children lose their Godliness. But it is possible I believe reading about Ananias. I am pretty sure he and his wife was also a couple made ONE with the others. That is why they sold their land and brought the money to the apostles. but then they lied about the price they got for the land...

God says this, and remember this becomes real for us the moment God FILLS us with His Spirit (glorification)..... For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Note all the AMAZING things that we get when God makes us part of HIM! Enlightened, taste heavenly gifts, partaker of Holy Spirit, Taste the Good Word of God, Powers of the world to come.... WOW! Pretty powerful stuff this? May I also get all this...

God bless you my friend WITH HIS WORD, So let us TASTE HIS GOOD WORD....

No strife my brother. Just looking for edifying words from each other. I think we are good so far and I do hope this lasts.
Ananias is such a good example for us believers - I am not even sure if they were ever in holiness (or is it righteousness?) to begin with.
Hebrew 6 - Is "for it is impossible" referring to repentance or falling away? Please elaborate.

 

[Cobus]

Thank you Bookie and I will tell you this. I am the man with the 1000 sins. And if Jesus did not pay for them on the cross I will have to pay for them in HELL. Since there is no more animal sacrifice. The LAMB was sacrificed for me too. I believe with my whole heart that the blood of Jesus is what will wash me PURE AS HE IS. So to think I devalue the crosswork, I do NOT. But Jesus did not stay on the cross or in the grave. He was resurrected to SHOW ME THERE IS LIFE AFTER DEATH.

And here is the thing BOOKIE... WHAT LIFE IS THERE AFTER DEATH? Another life of sin? Or the life He lived? Why did God not take Jesus up at the moment He resurrected Him? Bookie you know we grew to be quite good mates. And you know my heart as well as God does. I have always been stright with you and God. I cannot walk wide or winding roads. My spirit is straight and to the point and I never mean to be hurting anyone. But I am here to RECEIVE the Holy SPirit of God IN FULL! I am here because I OBEY my heart.

My heart tells me to teach 1 John 3:9 and 1 John 5:18. My heart tells me that God is my saviour and that THROUGH Jesus I will get to Him... Now... When I pass THROUGH Jesus, will I have sin in me on the OTHER SIDE OF JESUS (the narrow gate) or will Jesus WASH ME AS PURE AS HE IS PURE? So we agree PURE absolutely CLEAN. Then what? Why do we need to PASS through the gate? And is there sinners on the other side?

Bookie let us go slow on this one... what is on the other side of Jesus? Sin? Where are we when we are through the narrow gate? And here is the thing... God says.. Luk_13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

Bookie what is it that prohibit the many that are not able to enter? I will tell you, as EG also said... They do not REPENT from all sin. They do not LEAVE sin. They want to take some sin with them to the other side.... God will NEVER allow any sin in on that side. Not ONE goat will enter into His pen. And that is NOW! We enter that gate HERE on earth.

Bookie, NO man will enter in the gate with a single spot on him. ALL will be perfectly washed by Jesus. But that is NOT where it ends for God. IT ends there for you but NOT for Him. If he takes that washed spirit of yours to BE IN HIM (in Him is NO SIN) and He puts His Spirit in your flesh then GOD LIVES IN FLESH ONCE AGAIN. That is the PERFECT MAN OF GOD. Not me HIM.

Bookie I cannot take my flesh through the gate, only my spirit. And if my spirit leaves my flesh the flesh will DIE! No flesh can live without spirit. So here is the thing.... I can get my spirit cleansed only through Jesus. No man comes to the Father accept by JESUS. and no man comes to Jesus if the Fahter does not DRAW HIM...God CANNOT implant his Spirit in a FILTHY BODY. My spirit has to take my body through the wash. And when I PRESENT MY BODY a HOLY sacrifice to God, God can make the flesh His temple. And then HE lives in me. Where am I the old sinner? Washed and on the other side of Jesus (the gate) IN GOD.

The ONLY thing otherside the narrow gate IS GOD HIMSELF... His Kingdom here on earth. I know Jesus is the ONLY way to God and I know the Father DRAWS me to Jesus, through the Holy Spirit THAT LEADS me. And he leads me to REPENT and OUT OF SIN. And the moment I am washed as white as snow, I enter into the gate... Pass through Jesus. Then I am IN GOD and if he does quicken my flesh with His spirit, the flesh I used to occupy is now filled with HIS HOLY SPIRIT. Then that Quickening Spirit of God gave life to ANOTHER HOLY MAN OF GOD.....

Then Jesus lives IN ME and ME IN HIM. AND THERE IS NO SIN IN THE PICTURE. I DIED in Christ and HE Lives in me. I am dead and He is alive IN ME. Holy and perfect AS ONLY HE CAN BE. Where am I? where is MY LIFE? It is holy and Hid in God WITH CHRIST... WOW!

Bookie, EG we come a long way and all three of us grew exactly like God wants us to grow.. let us keep the bond of peace and get that perfect love God has for us. Chubbena and I am glad we met. May God's will be done in us, my friend.