Jesus turned water into unfermented wine and not fermented wine.

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kennethcadwell

Guest
#863
#863
StandingFirmInChrist said:
Since God's Word tells me to abstain, if I drink one sip, I have denied God and chosen that which He has forbidden. Like Adam, if I partake of that which God has showed me is taboo, I will have rebelled against Him.
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There is nothing wrong with teaching abstinence.

But to teach it to all in the manner that we can not even drink one glass of wine a day is wrong.

You probably still believe we are restrained from eating certain foods to that the OT talked about.
 
StandingFirmInChrist

StandingFirmInChrist

Senior Member
#864
Aug 28, 2013
955
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#864
Re: No grape juice here...

Kerry said:
It was grape juice. God would not drink anything that is decayed or processed by bacteria meaning their poop. Alcohol is yeast poop. But, the fruit of the vine is pure grape juice packed with vitamins and nutrients.

Melchizedek is Jesus, Abraham fell down and worshiped Him, this is not a man, Then gave Him 10% of everything He had. The name means Prince of peace and that is Jesus is Jehovah Shalom My Prince of Peace and provides the peace that surpasses all understanding.
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Actually, Melchizedek was not Jesus. Hebrews 7 reveals that Melchizedek was "made like unto the Son of God." He was like Jesus, but he was not Jesus. Also, the Bible does not say Abram "fell down and worshiped him".
 
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kennethcadwell

Guest
#865
#865
Re: No grape juice here...

StandingFirmInChrist said:
Ask a doctor about the healthy qualities of grape juice. You may be surprised.
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Ask them about the health qualities of a glass of fermented wine a day to. You to will be surprised.
 
StandingFirmInChrist

StandingFirmInChrist

Senior Member
#866
Aug 28, 2013
955
11
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#866
Re: No grape juice here...

JackH said:
Look closer. The Hebrew word yayin is translated to wine in Ps. 104:15. Yayin comes from the root yayan, which means to ferment. That means, to anybody with a brain bigger than a pea, the wine is alcoholic.
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I've studied the verse thoroughly, comparing it with other Scripture concerning wine. God doesn't give man the same drink that he tells man to not even look at when it is fermented.
 
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Kerry

Guest
#867
#867
What good comes from drinking intoxicating drinks? a good night sleep, So you depend on a drug to sleep. What other good can come from it?
 
StandingFirmInChrist

StandingFirmInChrist

Senior Member
#868
Aug 28, 2013
955
11
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#868
kennethcadwell said:
Sorry but that is wrong, oy'-nos is fermented.

And along with oy'-nos here are the other words used for wine in the NT and their meanings.

oy'-nos: wine, from yah-yin: meaning to effervesce (or fermented). (Used most places throughout the New Testament.)
glyoo'-kos: (or glucose or a liquid fruit sugar), or a syrupy sweet fruit juice. (Used only one time.)
par'-oy-nos: (From two words: 1. Para: near and 2. G3631 wine), meaning addicted to wine. (Used only twice.)
oy-of-loog-ee'-ah: (From two words: 1. G3631 wine and 2. Floo'or-os: bubbly or to talk incessantly), meaning drunkenness or drunk on wine. (Used only once.)
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[FONT=&quot]In the Greek New Testament, two words are generally [/FONT][FONT=&quot]employed when referring to wine; oinos and gleukos. Oinos is the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Greek equivalent to the Hebrew yayin, and refers to wine in its [/FONT][FONT=&quot]fermented and unfermented state (Ephesians 5:18, fermented; [/FONT][FONT=&quot]John 2:9, unfermented). [/FONT]
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#869
#869
StandingFirmInChrist said:
In the Greek New Testament, two words are generally employed when referring to wine; oinos and gleukos. Oinos is the Greek equivalent to the Hebrew yayin, and refers to wine in its fermented and unfermented state (Ephesians 5:18, fermented; John 2:9, unfermented).
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As previously stated grape juice was not separated from term wine until prohibition in the U.S. of A.
 
StandingFirmInChrist

StandingFirmInChrist

Senior Member
#871
Aug 28, 2013
955
11
0
#871
Re: No grape juice here...

kennethcadwell said:
Ask them about the health qualities of a glass of fermented wine a day to. You to will be surprised.
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fermented wine does have good qualities. I don't deny that. But it is also toxic. Why even defend a drink that has the power to deceive you into drinking until you are drunk when you can have a drink that is healthy to the heart without the toxins that fermented wine has?
 
tourist

tourist

Senior Member
#873
Mar 13, 2014
42,715
17,175
113
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Tennessee
#873
Re: No grape juice here...

StandingFirmInChrist said:
fermented wine does have good qualities. I don't deny that. But it is also toxic. Why even defend a drink that has the power to deceive you into drinking until you are drunk when you can have a drink that is healthy to the heart without the toxins that fermented wine has?
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Almost all foods are toxic. Our organs filter out the toxicities. Grape juice may be healthy but wine is happy. Healthy and Happy must be balanced to lead a full and enjoyable life.
 
Bowman

Bowman

Banned
#874
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
27
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#874
Re: No grape juice here...

tourist said:
Almost all foods are toxic. Our organs filter out the toxicities. Grape juice may be healthy but wine is happy. Healthy and Happy must be balanced to lead a full and enjoyable life.
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That's why they call it happy juice....:)
 
Bowman

Bowman

Banned
#875
Nov 19, 2012
5,484
27
0
#875
Brother Jason is pretty quiet...he must be doing some more googling...
 
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JackH

Banned
#876
Jun 5, 2014
1,750
6
0
#876
Re: No grape juice here...

Kerry said:
It was grape juice.

Melchizedek is Jesus,
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It was wine that contained alcohol. The Hebrew word yayin, as I said, comes from a root that means fermented.

So Jesus (Melchizedek according to you) provided wine (not grape juice) for Abraham.

I guess we have a precedent for Jesus providing wine (not grape juice). The wedding at Cana may not not have been the first time.
 
tourist

tourist

Senior Member
#877
Mar 13, 2014
42,715
17,175
113
70
Tennessee
#877
Re: No grape juice here...

JackH said:
It was wine that contained alcohol. The Hebrew word yayin, as I said, comes from a root that means fermented.

So Jesus (Melchizedek according to you) provided wine (not grape juice) for Abraham.

I guess we have a precedent for Jesus providing wine (not grape juice). The wedding at Cana may not not have been the first time.
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It probably was not the last time either.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#878
#878
Re: No grape juice here...

JackH said:
It was wine that contained alcohol. The Hebrew word yayin, as I said, comes from a root that means fermented.

So Jesus (Melchizedek according to you) provided wine (not grape juice) for Abraham.

I guess we have a precedent for Jesus providing wine (not grape juice). The wedding at Cana may not not have been the first time.
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Okay lets look at Socrates, the wine that he describes is 23 parts water. Then his pupil Homer describes wine as 13 parts water. With homers description one would have to drink 15 glasses of wine to equal one vodka martini. the info is web available, so have another.
 
tourist

tourist

Senior Member
#879
Mar 13, 2014
42,715
17,175
113
70
Tennessee
#879
Re: No grape juice here...

Kerry said:
Okay lets look at Socrates, the wine that he describes is 23 parts water. Then his pupil Homer describes wine as 13 parts water. With homers description one would have to drink 15 glasses of wine to equal one vodka martini. the info is web available, so have another.
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I'll have mine over ice. Shaken, not stirred.
 
J

JackH

Banned
#880
Jun 5, 2014
1,750
6
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#880
Kerry said:
As previously stated grape juice was not separated from term wine until prohibition in the U.S. of A.
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Grape juice became wine, like real quick, until Dr. Welch figured out how to stop that from happening.

Back in the days of the Bible, grape juice turned into wine, like real quick.

Yeah, back in the days of the Bible, if you picked a cluster of grapes and immediately squeezed the juice into your mouth, I guess you drank grape juice.

But you better have drunk it like real quick, otherwise you are going to have some alcoholic wine due to fermentation.
 
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