The "Impossible" Gospel

[RedTent]

The only thing of importance to you in the OT is the law?

You didn't answer her question.

Because you have filtered your thinking through the false idea that when Christ was crucified in our time (Christ always was in eternal time) that wiped out everything you label old and there is only a fresh start with everything completely new, With that false idea you filter everything you say in falsehood. It means you can't see clearly at all. Even your questions to others reflect this. People have given you truth and you wipe it away with sneers.

Christians need to see what Christ did, they need to see clearly each change Christ made. No one can do that if they only see each change through a man made judgment as you are doing. Scripture doesn't help you, for each verse you read is pulled apart with your preconceived notion that everything must be new, never built from a firm foundation.

 

[prove-all]

where the new covenant law is put in our minds and written on our hearts, giving us to know
what is loving and what is not loving.

37Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart,
and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.

15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

 

[just-me]

You do understand that the condemnation of the law no longer is directed at those who are in Christ right?
You do understand that it is still biblical to Love God and Love our neighbor and that by doing the first two the rest will be fulfilled?...Jesus said ALL the commandments HINGE on the first two....
You do understand that Paul taught that by no one would be justified by the deeds of the Law right? Romans 3:20

So...If the deeds of the law cannot justify a man before God...what then can justify a man before God?

The FAITH OF JESUS<----pay attention to the word (OF) Galatians 2:16-21

What you say is true as far as it goes, but if that's all there is now because of the New Covenant, why didn't Jesus say right out that the law of His Father doesn't mean what it used to because of Me?

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

pay attention to the word (OF) in Luke 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle (of) the law to fail.

 

[Elin]

What you say is true as far as it goes, but if that's all there is now because of the New Covenant,
why didn't Jesus say right out that the law of His Father doesn't mean what it used to because of Me?

Ii's not ours to explain why Jesus did not say or do anything.

And how much plainer could he have said it in Mt 22:37-40?

 

[Mem]

You do understand that the condemnation of the law no longer is directed at those who are in Christ right?
You do understand that it is still biblical to Love God and Love our neighbor and that by doing the first two the rest will be fulfilled?...Jesus said ALL the commandments HINGE on the first two....
You do understand that Paul taught that by no one would be justified by the deeds of the Law right? Romans 3:20

So...If the deeds of the law cannot justify a man before God...what then can justify a man before God?

The FAITH OF JESUS<----pay attention to the word (OF) Galatians 2:16-21

We are justified by faith, thank God. The condemntion of the law is no longer directed..., but, is not the law still a directive?

 

[just-me]

It's a shame that some people cannot, or just flat out refuse to see the positive side of the law. Is it because of a carnal mind?

 

[just-me]

It's a shame that some people cannot, or just flat out refuse to see the positive side of the law. Is it because of a carnal mind?

Ii's not ours to explain why Jesus did not say or do anything.

And how much plainer could he have said it in Mt 22:37-40?

But He did make it clear. Luke 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.

This is clear about what Jesus is quoting Mt 22:37-40.
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it , Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

What part don't you understand?

Deuteronomy 6:5-6
5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.
6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:

Leviticus19:18 Thou shalt not avenge , nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

Doesn't appear to me that there was anything different in what Jesus said from the original law. Evidently you think Jesus replaced the law with something that was exactly the same. That's quite strange to say the least. Jesus' law is the same as God's law. Wow, what a change of venue.

 

[prove-all]

I am not saying that anyone is forced to keep the Sabbath.

I also believe Gods promises is still valid like

“If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day;
and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the [Eternal],honourable; and shalt honour him,
not doing thine own ways,nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words”(Isaiah 58:13)

“Then shalt thou delight thyself in the [Eternal]; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the [Eternal] hath spoken it”


Thus saith the Lord; If ye can break my covenant of the day,
and my covenant of the night, and that there should not be day
and night in their season;7And I will establish my covenant between me and thee
and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant,
to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

What you say is true as far as it goes, but if that's all there is now because of the New Covenant, why didn't Jesus say right out that the law of His Father doesn't mean what it used to because of Me?

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

pay attention to the word (OF) in Luke 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle (of) the law to fail.

Matt. 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am no come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Jesus Christ came to fulfill the law - pleroo - to make full, to fill up, i.e. to fill to the full; to cause to abound, to furnish or supply liberally (I abound, I am liberally supplied); to render full, i.e. to complete; to fill to the top: so that nothing shall be wanting to full measure, fill to the brim; to consummate: a number (to make complete in every particular, to render perfect, to carry through to the end, to accomplish, carry out, (some undertaking); to carry into effect, bring to realisation, realize (of matters of duty: to perform, execute; of sayings, promises, prophecies, to bring to pass, ratify, accomplish; to fulfil, i.e. to cause God's will (as made known in the law) to be obeyed as it should be, and God's promises (given through the prophets) to receive fulfilment -

If something has been fulfilled, executed, performed and accomplished what more can be done with that particular part that has been fulfilled, executed, performed and accomplished?

Matt. 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

till all be fulfilled - ginomai - to become, i.e. to come into existence, begin to be, receive being; to become, i.e. to come to pass, happen (of events); to arise, appear in history, come upon the stage (of men appearing in public) to be made, finished, (of miracles, to be performed, wrought); to become, be made

Jesus Christ fulfilled parts of the Law and He will come again to fulfill the rest before heaven and earth shall pass.

 

[just-us-2]

We are justified by faith, thank God. The condemntion of the law is no longer directed..., but, is not the law still a directive?

Well said.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

But He did make it clear. Luke 16:17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.

This is clear about what Jesus is quoting Mt 22:37-40.
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it , Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

What part don't you understand?

Deuteronomy 6:5-6
5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.
6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:

Leviticus19:18 Thou shalt not avenge , nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

Doesn't appear to me that there was anything different in what Jesus said from the original law. Evidently you think Jesus replaced the law with something that was exactly the same. That's quite strange to say the least. Jesus' law is the same as God's law. Wow, what a change of venue.

We understand that parts of the OT law were carried throughout and continued into the NT . . . The law is covered in ONE word in the NT - LOVE. When we love the Lord our God with all our heart, and with all our soul, and with all our mind and with all our strength and love others as ourselves then we have obeyed the law and commandments that were written in stone for on these two commandments HANG the law and the prophets. The commandments that are now written upon our hearts are obeyed and accomplished with our love and service to others. When we set our minds upon Christ and renew our minds to have the mind of Christ we will bear fruit acceptable and well-pleasing unto God.

 

[Elin]

We are justified by faith, thank God. The condemntion of the law is no longer directed..., but,
is not the law still a directive?

Our directive is the law of Christ which accomplishes all the law and the prophets (Mt 22:37-40).

The cermonial laws are not a directive for those in the new covenant.

 

[Elin]

It's a shame that some people cannot, or just flat out refuse to see the positive side of the law.
Is it because of a carnal mind?

It is because Christ has given them law for the new covenant, which accomplishes all the law and the prophets (Mt 22:37-40).

Is it that some flat out refuse to see the positive side of Christ's law because of a carnal mind?

 

[Elin]

And how much plainer could he have said it in Mt 22:37-40?

But He did make it clear.

This is clear about what Jesus is quoting Mt 22:37-40.
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it , Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

What part don't you understand?

I think we are in agreement regarding Mt 22:37-40.

 

[just-me]

Matt. 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am no come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Jesus Christ came to fulfill the law - pleroo - to make full, to fill up, i.e. to fill to the full; to cause to abound, to furnish or supply liberally (I abound, I am liberally supplied); to render full, i.e. to complete; to fill to the top: so that nothing shall be wanting to full measure, fill to the brim; to consummate: a number (to make complete in every particular, to render perfect, to carry through to the end, to accomplish, carry out, (some undertaking); to carry into effect, bring to realisation, realize (of matters of duty: to perform, execute; of sayings, promises, prophecies, to bring to pass, ratify, accomplish; to fulfil, i.e. to cause God's will (as made known in the law) to be obeyed as it should be, and God's promises (given through the prophets) to receive fulfilment -

If something has been fulfilled, executed, performed and accomplished what more can be done with that particular part that has been fulfilled, executed, performed and accomplished?

Matt. 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

till all be fulfilled - ginomai - to become, i.e. to come into existence, begin to be, receive being; to become, i.e. to come to pass, happen (of events); to arise, appear in history, come upon the stage (of men appearing in public) to be made, finished, (of miracles, to be performed, wrought); to become, be made

Jesus Christ fulfilled parts of the Law and He will come again to fulfill the rest before heaven and earth shall pass.

Very well said.

 

[Elin]

It would be helpful if you stated what you do not agree with, and
then showed from the Scriptures where it is not Biblical.

I do not agree that the commandments are no longer relevant,
and I am not sure if that is the belief that you do hold.

Thank you.

Are you familiar with the new covenant (Jer 31:33) law of Christ
which fulfills all the prophets and the law (Mt 22:37-40)?

What is missing that he left out there?
What did he make irrelevant in the Decalogue?

 

[just-me]

We understand that parts of the OT law were carried throughout and continued into the NT . . . The law is covered in ONE word in the NT - LOVE. When we love the Lord our God with all our heart, and with all our soul, and with all our mind and with all our strength and love others as ourselves then we have obeyed the law and commandments that were written in stone for on these two commandments HANG the law and the prophets. The commandments that are now written upon our hearts are obeyed and accomplished with our love and service to others. When we set our minds upon Christ and renew our minds to have the mind of Christ we will bear fruit acceptable and well-pleasing unto God.

The detailed instructions of love are in the law so we don't make up our own definitions of the love of God. Here is just a part of loving our neighbor as ourselves in principle and attitude toward one another.

Leviticus 19:10-18
10 And thou shalt not glean thy vineyard, neither shalt thou gather every grape of thy vineyard; thou shalt leave them for the poor and stranger: I am the LORD your God.
11 Ye shall not steal , neither deal falsely , neither lie one to another.
12 And ye shall not swear by my name falsely, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the LORD.
13 Thou shalt not defraud thy neighbour, neither rob him: the wages of him that is hired shall not abide with thee all night until the morning.
14 Thou shalt not curse the deaf, nor put a stumblingblock before the blind, but shalt fear thy God: I am the LORD.
15 Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour.
16 Thou shalt not go up and down as a talebearer among thy people: neither shalt thou stand against the blood of thy neighbour: I am the LORD.
17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.
18 Thou shalt not avenge , nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

Jesus agrees with all these concepts. These things are not replaced or brand new through Christ. All that came from the Father and comes from our Father in heaven is all relevant for today. Our minds cannot comprehend what hasn't been taught.

John 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.

 

[Elin]

The only thing of importance to you in the OT is the law?

You didn't answer her question.

It is answered in my question.

But for you I will answer it again.
I do not think the OT should be removed from the Bible.

 

[WomanLovesTX]

It is because Christ has given them law for the new covenant, which accomplishes all the law and the prophets (Mt 22:37-40).

Is it that some flat out refuse to see the positive side of Christ's law because of a carnal mind?

I have not found a Bible version yet that uses the word "accomplishes" as in your statement of Mt 22:37-40. What does accomplish mean to you and did you substitute that word yourself?

Mat 22:40 OnG1722 theseG5025 twoG1417 commandmentsG1785 hangG2910 allG3650 theG3588 lawG3551 andG2532 theG3588 prophets.G4396

G2910
κρεμάννυμι
kremannumi
krem-an'-noo-mee
A prolonged form of a primary verb; to hang: - hang.

 

[crossnote]

It is answered in my question.

But for you I will answer it again.
I do not think the OT should be removed from the Bible.

Just because a house needs a foundation doesn't mean the residents have to live in the basement.