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N
WOW, i finally see someone post what it means to meet the Lord in the "AIR" Pneuma, breath, Spirit, etc.. We who are alive and remain shall be caught up...........meeting the Lord in spirit.
note Paul said "WE" which are alive and remain. Not "those" or "they" speaking of a time some 2,000 plus years in his future. This is only one instance of many in Paul's writings that show he believed it to be extremely near, even in his lifetime if he were to live to that day.
note Paul said "WE" which are alive and remain. Not "those" or "they" speaking of a time some 2,000 plus years in his future. This is only one instance of many in Paul's writings that show he believed it to be extremely near, even in his lifetime if he were to live to that day.
S
There is a table being prepared (categorical doctrine) with fine linen (the righteousness of the saints) right in the presence of the enemy. On that table there will be unleavened shewbread with a multiple course meal that will include lamb and the greatest selection of choice meats cooked with a cruise of the finest oil and flour mix that can be purchased. The feast will be complimented with nine fruit of the Holy Spirit, that has been plucked from the tree of life on both sides of the river that proceeds from the throne of God. Each place that has been set at the table will include a cup that will be running over with the best of the fruit of the vine.
All are invited to eat of the dainty morsels especially prepared for those that have put on their wedding garments for the feast of the marriage supper of the Lamb. Those who are invited without putting on their garment, have only come to be critical and judgmental of the preparation, the presentation and provision and will forfeit their part in the feast and be cast out into the presence of the enemy. Those that partake of the feast will enter into the everlasting joy of the One who prepared and presented it through a labor of love in the fulness of joy and in the hospitality of great peace.
The ones that will be sitting at this feast and enjoying what has been prepared for them to eat are those that have been washed clean by the blood of the Lamb and are wearing their robe of righteousness that was given to them by the grace of God's salvation. Each one will be focused upon the Lamb, sitting at the head of the table because they know and understand and have eaten His flesh and drank His blood to have life in them. Then they will all sing a new song about the blood of the Lamb, who is worthy and has put away all their sin and given them eternal redemption through the righteousness of God.
Keep watching because that day is drawing near and we will be raptured and taken out (ek) before the great tribulation and terrible day of the Lord. All of those natural minded concepts that come from those that give heed to wrong thinking about the the body and bride of Christ (the church) will be consumed because they are not eternal and have no substance of the faith of the Son of God.
All are invited to eat of the dainty morsels especially prepared for those that have put on their wedding garments for the feast of the marriage supper of the Lamb. Those who are invited without putting on their garment, have only come to be critical and judgmental of the preparation, the presentation and provision and will forfeit their part in the feast and be cast out into the presence of the enemy. Those that partake of the feast will enter into the everlasting joy of the One who prepared and presented it through a labor of love in the fulness of joy and in the hospitality of great peace.
The ones that will be sitting at this feast and enjoying what has been prepared for them to eat are those that have been washed clean by the blood of the Lamb and are wearing their robe of righteousness that was given to them by the grace of God's salvation. Each one will be focused upon the Lamb, sitting at the head of the table because they know and understand and have eaten His flesh and drank His blood to have life in them. Then they will all sing a new song about the blood of the Lamb, who is worthy and has put away all their sin and given them eternal redemption through the righteousness of God.
Keep watching because that day is drawing near and we will be raptured and taken out (ek) before the great tribulation and terrible day of the Lord. All of those natural minded concepts that come from those that give heed to wrong thinking about the the body and bride of Christ (the church) will be consumed because they are not eternal and have no substance of the faith of the Son of God.
Pretrib ''Theologians'' teach that Jesus comes before the tribulation, secretly in the clouds, to snatch the church from the earth, and take us to Heaven. So that we will miss the tribulation period, spending it in Heaven, celebrating the Marriage Supper of the Lamb. While the unbelievers are left behind to suffer the wrath of God here on earth.
Sounds real nice, only problem is, the Bible never teaches that Jesus comes before the tribulation. It doesn't say there will be a secret return of Christ at all. It never teaches us that we go to Heaven after the resurrection and/ or ''rapture'' of the just. The Bible does not say that we will miss the tribulation period, nor does it say when or where the Marriage Supper of the Lamb takes place. You will not find any aspect of the pretrib teaching in scripture.
Sounds real nice, only problem is, the Bible never teaches that Jesus comes before the tribulation. It doesn't say there will be a secret return of Christ at all. It never teaches us that we go to Heaven after the resurrection and/ or ''rapture'' of the just. The Bible does not say that we will miss the tribulation period, nor does it say when or where the Marriage Supper of the Lamb takes place. You will not find any aspect of the pretrib teaching in scripture.
S
I guess you will just have to wait and find out the truth, because it's coming. Aren't you excited and filled with expectation? You should be because when you find out the real truth about the rapture of the church (pre-trib that is) and all those logistics, you'll be able to take a big sigh of relief and thank God that it is really true. You did say that you would love to go up with the church before the tribulation period and now you will finally know the truth and it should set you and 'MahoganySnail' free at last. There is nothing like really being free.
S
You don't know when He's coming because it's a mystery, but He will just appear for a moment and we will go up together with the dead in Christ, in a twinkling of an eye, and as far as the earth goes it's over and done and the church is gone. No big fan fare or anything like that. We are here one minute and we are gone the next, just like Enoch, he walked with God and was not (and I did not see any chaos from that). One will be taken and the other will be left. It's not like God can't do it. But those that know He's coming will be looking for it and won't be surprised when He appears. Those that are alive when He appears never experience death. WOW!
Then He will come back for His official second coming as the triumphet and victorious Christ and we will be with Him for a thousand year reign. How gracious and merciful He is to come for His bride, the church and keep us out of and out from the tribulation period that God intends to pour out His wrath on the children of disobedience. If God had appointed His church to wrath then we could be in a lot of trouble, but He didn't and thank God for that. I can't imagine having to go through that period and have to be around that last 3.5 years with the Antichrist, the beast, the false prophet, the wrath of Satan and finally the wrath of the Lamb that comes destroying it all after being stored up after all this time. The Lamb has no intention of putting His bride through this period.
I have a question for 'watchmen'. Your a married man and you love your wife as Christ loves the church, would you put your own bride and wife through a tribulation period such as the great tribulation when you had the power to keep her from it? What do you want for your bride and wife? Don't you think that God has a greater heart of love for His own bride than we do for our own? If you think that Christ wants to put His bride through the tribulation period and you call that laying your life down then why don't you love your own bride and wife in the same way? I am sure she would appreciate that.
I have all the verses and then some and they are scriptural and true. They are precious to me and to those that believe them and live by them because they have been written upon our heart. We have Him and know Him and we are known of Him. He is our life and we live by Him and through Him. He is our all in all.
I come quickly / Rev 22:7,12,20, Amen, Even so, come Lord Jesus.
Then He will come back for His official second coming as the triumphet and victorious Christ and we will be with Him for a thousand year reign. How gracious and merciful He is to come for His bride, the church and keep us out of and out from the tribulation period that God intends to pour out His wrath on the children of disobedience. If God had appointed His church to wrath then we could be in a lot of trouble, but He didn't and thank God for that. I can't imagine having to go through that period and have to be around that last 3.5 years with the Antichrist, the beast, the false prophet, the wrath of Satan and finally the wrath of the Lamb that comes destroying it all after being stored up after all this time. The Lamb has no intention of putting His bride through this period.
I have a question for 'watchmen'. Your a married man and you love your wife as Christ loves the church, would you put your own bride and wife through a tribulation period such as the great tribulation when you had the power to keep her from it? What do you want for your bride and wife? Don't you think that God has a greater heart of love for His own bride than we do for our own? If you think that Christ wants to put His bride through the tribulation period and you call that laying your life down then why don't you love your own bride and wife in the same way? I am sure she would appreciate that.
I have all the verses and then some and they are scriptural and true. They are precious to me and to those that believe them and live by them because they have been written upon our heart. We have Him and know Him and we are known of Him. He is our life and we live by Him and through Him. He is our all in all.
I come quickly / Rev 22:7,12,20, Amen, Even so, come Lord Jesus.
M
This is what the entire subject of Matt 24 is about. Are you implying that the second advent of Christ has already happened and the world has already ended?
1And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
2And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
The rest of the chapter goes on to describe those events.
1And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
2And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
The rest of the chapter goes on to describe those events.
G
The Pretribulation Rapture
The Glorious Appearing
The Bible tells us this event will come unexpectedly, like a thief in the night, at a time when people are saying Peace and Safety’. (1 Thessalonians 5.1-3).
Jesus said: Therefore you also be ready for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect (Matthew 24.44)
It will be at a time when people are going about their everyday business, doing normal things like eating and drinking, buying and selling, planting and building. (Luke 17.26-37).
The only way this event can be unexpected is if it comes before the final 7-year tribulation. By the end of this time it will be obvious to anyone who knows the Bible that Jesus is coming back to the earth as the armies gather at Armageddon, 3 ½ years after the Antichrist and the False Prophet set up the Mark of the Beast system. No one will be saying ‘Peace and Safety’ after the horrors of the great tribulation. Life will not be going on as normal. And you should even be able to work out the date — 42 months after the setting up of the image to the beast in Revelation 13.
One of the strongest arguments for the Pre-Tribulation Rapture position is the Scriptural doctrine of inminency. Repeatedly the Bible tells us that this event could happen at any moment. No event must precede it.
- Christ comes for His own (John 14:3; 1 Thessalonians 4:17)
- He comes in the air (1 Thessalonians 4:17)
- He comes to claim his bride (John 14:3; 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17)
- Only His own see Him (1 Thessalonians 4:13-18)
- Saved are delivered from wrath (1 Thessalonians 1:10, 5:9; Revelation 3:10)
The Glorious Appearing
- Christ comes with His own (Jude 14-15; Revelation 1:7; 19:14)
- He comes to the earth (Zechariah 14:4-5; Acts 1:11)
- He returns with His bride (Revelation 19:6-1 4)
- Every eye shall see Him (Revelation 1:7; Matthew 24:30)
- Unsaved experience the wrath of God (Nahurn 1:2; Revelation 6-18)
The Bible tells us this event will come unexpectedly, like a thief in the night, at a time when people are saying Peace and Safety’. (1 Thessalonians 5.1-3).
Jesus said: Therefore you also be ready for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect (Matthew 24.44)
It will be at a time when people are going about their everyday business, doing normal things like eating and drinking, buying and selling, planting and building. (Luke 17.26-37).
The only way this event can be unexpected is if it comes before the final 7-year tribulation. By the end of this time it will be obvious to anyone who knows the Bible that Jesus is coming back to the earth as the armies gather at Armageddon, 3 ½ years after the Antichrist and the False Prophet set up the Mark of the Beast system. No one will be saying ‘Peace and Safety’ after the horrors of the great tribulation. Life will not be going on as normal. And you should even be able to work out the date — 42 months after the setting up of the image to the beast in Revelation 13.
One of the strongest arguments for the Pre-Tribulation Rapture position is the Scriptural doctrine of inminency. Repeatedly the Bible tells us that this event could happen at any moment. No event must precede it.
The destruction of the temple, which is what Jesus is talking about, is not a future thing it happened back then.
Actually it can be split into two things, prophecying for the short term to those who are listening and then a more general prophecy for us today. We need to divide God's Word rightly and sort out which parts are for them living in Jerusalem, and which are for us, living in America, or Australia, 1900+ years later.
It is clear that Jesus is speaking to the then Jews, as he refers to the Sabbath which the Jews kept and it was forbidden to travel long distances on the sabbath:
Mat 24:20 But pray that your flight is not in the winter, nor on the sabbath day;
Jesus predicts the coming invasion of the Roman armies right here:
Luk 21:20 And when you see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that its destruction has come.
Now what happened historically?
In the first Jew-Roman war, Cestius Gallus besieged Jerusalem suddenly, then withdrew his army very much unexpectedly, which provided the Christians an opportunity to escape, which they did, and many, remembering the words of Christ, fled to mount Libanus and so were saved. Such that there was not a Christian left in the city, and so were spared. In answer to their prayers (as Jesus told them to pray it would not occur in the winter), it occured in the summer time.
The many caves in the mountains of Palestine provided a safe refuge for those who fled.
The theologian Barnes says of this:
The coming of the Son of man - It has been doubted whether this refers to the destruction of Jerusalem, or to the coming at the day of judgment. For the solution of this doubt let it be remarked:
1. that those two events are the principal scenes in which our Lord said he would come, either in person or in judgment.
2. that the destruction of Jerusalem is described as his coming, his act.
3. that these events - the judgment of Jerusalem and the final judgment in many respects greatly resemble each other.
4. that they "will bear," therefore, to be described in the same language; and,
5. therefore, that the same words often include both events, as properly described by them.
The words had, doubtless, a primary reference to the destruction of Jerusalem, but they had, at the same time, such an amplitude of meaning as also to express his coming to judgment. See the introduction to Isaiah, section 7, (3).
Actually it can be split into two things, prophecying for the short term to those who are listening and then a more general prophecy for us today. We need to divide God's Word rightly and sort out which parts are for them living in Jerusalem, and which are for us, living in America, or Australia, 1900+ years later.
It is clear that Jesus is speaking to the then Jews, as he refers to the Sabbath which the Jews kept and it was forbidden to travel long distances on the sabbath:
Mat 24:20 But pray that your flight is not in the winter, nor on the sabbath day;
Jesus predicts the coming invasion of the Roman armies right here:
Luk 21:20 And when you see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that its destruction has come.
Now what happened historically?
In the first Jew-Roman war, Cestius Gallus besieged Jerusalem suddenly, then withdrew his army very much unexpectedly, which provided the Christians an opportunity to escape, which they did, and many, remembering the words of Christ, fled to mount Libanus and so were saved. Such that there was not a Christian left in the city, and so were spared. In answer to their prayers (as Jesus told them to pray it would not occur in the winter), it occured in the summer time.
The many caves in the mountains of Palestine provided a safe refuge for those who fled.
The theologian Barnes says of this:
The coming of the Son of man - It has been doubted whether this refers to the destruction of Jerusalem, or to the coming at the day of judgment. For the solution of this doubt let it be remarked:
1. that those two events are the principal scenes in which our Lord said he would come, either in person or in judgment.
2. that the destruction of Jerusalem is described as his coming, his act.
3. that these events - the judgment of Jerusalem and the final judgment in many respects greatly resemble each other.
4. that they "will bear," therefore, to be described in the same language; and,
5. therefore, that the same words often include both events, as properly described by them.
The words had, doubtless, a primary reference to the destruction of Jerusalem, but they had, at the same time, such an amplitude of meaning as also to express his coming to judgment. See the introduction to Isaiah, section 7, (3).
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M
Like I said, the entire chapter of Matthew 24's subject is Christ's answer about the coming of Christ at the end of the world. So unless you believe the Christ has came or the world has ended then those events can't of happened. I have a suspicion that you are only here to play a game and this is all funny to you.
1And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
2And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
1And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
2And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
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No I'm serious it is not just all about the end of the world you know. Read some bible commentaries and history. Jerusalem means Jerusalem, winter means winter, mountains mean mountains and flee means flee. Jesus is saying, when you see the invading roman armies encamp around Jerusalem, flee to the mountains. It's not cryptic. It's not that hard to understand. The only reason you can't understand it is because you've been taught for so long about pre-trib, mid-trib, and post-trib rapture and end-times events that you can't fathom that Jesus was speaking to real people at the time that refers to real historical events. And that not everything written in the bible is about you, or about the USA, or about Obama or Blair or the EU or the roman catholic church.
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