Sunday Keepers Dare to explain this

john832 · Dec 31, 2014

elf3 said:

Depends. God says that He set apart (sanctified) and made holy (hallowed) the seventh day. So it depends on whether you believe God and whether it matters to you what God says.

By the way there will come a time when it will really matter.

john832 · Dec 31, 2014

posthuman said:

No, a New Moon is the first day of the month and the Sabbath is the seventh day...

Gen 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

1Sa 20:5 And David said unto Jonathan, Behold, to morrow is the new moon, and I should not fail to sit with the king at meat: but let me go, that I may hide myself in the field unto the third day at even.

1Sa 20:18 Then Jonathan said to David, To morrow is the new moon: and thou shalt be missed, because thy seat will be empty.

1Sa 20:24 So David hid himself in the field: and when the new moon was come, the king sat him down to eat meat.

Hmmm, treated as a particular day. Now if the New Moon is every day, then why mention it as a day?

2Ch 2:4 Behold, I build an house to the name of the LORD my God, to dedicate it to him, and to burn before him sweet incense, and for the continual shewbread, and for the burnt offerings morning and evening, on the sabbaths, and on the new moons, and on the solemn feasts of the LORD our God. This is an ordinance for ever to Israel.

2Ch 8:13 Even after a certain rate every day, offering according to the commandment of Moses, on the sabbaths, and on the new moons, and on the solemn feasts, three times in the year, even in the feast of unleavened bread, and in the feast of weeks, and in the feast of tabernacles.

There are many more scriptures concerning the New Moons, you can easily look them up. As far as the Sabbath...

Gen 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Now, if the Sabbath is every day and one CANNOT work on the Sabbath, when do we work? Who grows the food for us?, Who produces medicine? Who built your house and when did they build it?

The whole idea of making every day the Sabbath violates scripture and besides that, it is frankly stupid.

prove-all · Dec 31, 2014

Mitspa said:

weakness said:

there is 8 places in the new testement that have (first day of the week?)
lets see if God changed the day in any of them verses.

the first day of the week in verses
Mt 28:1 ,Mr 16:2,Mr 16:9,Lu 24:1

none of the verses above changes the 7th day to 1st day,
is not a day of worship, the first day people saw Jesus.
this was a normal work day for people

Joh 20:1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was (yet dark),
unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.

John tells use that while it was (still dark), Mary found the tomb empty.
this was not a sunrise service at all, he was allready gone from there.

believing a good friday to sunday would make Christ a false prophet.
in the earth at dusk, 3 days 3 nights later is resurrection just after dusk.

Joh 20:19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week,
when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews,
came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

the doors locked, assembled fear of there lives,was not a day of rest, a work day.
nothing here in verse changes the sabbath day, or not a religious meeting.

Ac 20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread,
Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

first off breaking bread is not a religious service, it is eating a meal.
also at times the apostles lived together.

this verse we see Paul was preaching on the 7th day sabbath,
it gets dark and they are eating a meal, paul continues to preach.

this now is a regularwork day,pauls companions had set sail around penisula,
Paul was going to walk those miles, at first lite, on first day of week.

11When he therefore was come up again, and had broken bread, and eaten,
and talked a long while, even till break of day, so he departed.

if this is a 1st day sabbath, why are they working on that day.

Paul , like Jesus custom was, preached on the 7th day sabbath about 83 times,
also working 6 days week as tent maker, keeping sabbath for year and half.

so far we see no command or change in the sabbath day, the last verse

1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store,
as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come

this was not a religious sabbath meeting, it was a regular work day.

1Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order
to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye.

there was a famine in Jerusalem, Paul was collecting food for the saints

4And if it be meet that I go also, they shall go with me.

Paul needed help carring heavy stuff like meat,
he would need no help if it was for money.
he would not be back every first day to collect food.

the church has made unknow amounts of money because of this verse.

one more verse to look at to see if changed sabbath

John sees the lords day in a future vision, no day of week even mentioned.

And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments;

and (rested )the sabbath day according to (the commandment).

nobody told them the sabbath was done away with.

Mitspa · Dec 31, 2014

prove-all said:

Mitspa said:

No they prove the church was not under the law and met on the first day of the week from the very beginning of the true church

john832 · Dec 31, 2014

elf3 said:

Oh, I don't know, what is our priority?

1Jn 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
1Jn 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

2Jn 1:6 And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.

Joh_14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Joh_14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Joh_15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

God says that if we love Him we WILL KEEP His Commandments and love is KEEPING the Commandments and if you want eternal life, KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS>

posthuman · Dec 31, 2014

john832 said:

you're grossly misunderstanding me.

granted the new moon is a particular day. it reoccurs periodically. let's just call it "1st day of lunar month" for sake of argument.

so.. if we were to worship God from the first of one month to the first of the next month, and from the end of one week to the end of the next...

that means every day we would glorify Him.

Mitspa · Dec 31, 2014

john832 said:

Yep and God said the sabbath was only a shadow of Christ and that those under the law are. Cut off from Him and have fallen from grace.

john832 · Dec 31, 2014

elf3 said:

I see it this way. We worry so much about other "commands" of God that we miss the main command...love God. We worry so much about the Sabbath or baptism or good works that we actually begin to forget the Gospel of Christ.

Why are we arguing over a day when we should be reminding each other of the Gospel.

We need to preach the Gospel of Christ.

See the previous post.

prove-all · Dec 31, 2014

Mitspa said:

9And it shall be for a sign unto thee upon thine hand, and for (a memorial) between thine eyes, that the Lord's law may be in thy mouth: for with a strong hand hath the Lord brought thee out of Egypt.

it is a memorial not a shadow

john832 · Dec 31, 2014

Mitspa said:

NO, it is not the shadow of Christ, if you would read Col 2:16-17 you would see that...

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Now this says that the Sabbaths are shadows of things yet to come and it was written nearly 30 years AFTER Christ came and fulfilled the sacrificial Laws.

The Sabbath is the shadow of the Millenium (you do remember that a day is as a thousand years, don't you?) The seven day week is a shadow of God's seven thousand year plan for man. It is no wonder then that man is confused about what God is doing, man has ignored and disregarded the shadows that reveal the entire plan of God.

john832 · Dec 31, 2014

posthuman said:

If I have misunderstood then please accept my sincerest apology.

john832 · Dec 31, 2014

Mitspa said:

prove-all said:

Well, first of all, why was the church KEEPING PENTECOST on it's inception?

The three scriptures that every young, aspiring student in cemetery learns to justify Sunday worship are Acts 20:7, I Cor 16:2 and Rev 1:10. None of which show Sunday go to meetin' but rather are not related to a Sunday keeping at all.

john832 · Dec 31, 2014

prove-all said:

The Sabbath looks back to creation (is it any wonder then that since man has completely disregarded and spurned the Sabbath that he is deceived into believing evolution?) and it also looks forward to the Millennium when Christ and the saints will rule on earth.

Mitspa · Dec 31, 2014

Some I think need to do some study in the NEW Covenant. Hint you can't be under both the old and the new you can't put old wine into New wineskins.

secularhermit · Dec 31, 2014

Let´s get some wine, then.

tourist · Dec 31, 2014

secularhermit said:

A splash of the bubbly...

posthuman · Dec 31, 2014

john832 said:

it's nothing

Mitspa · Dec 31, 2014

Mitspa said:

Mt 28:1 ¶ In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulcher.
Mr 16:2 And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.
Mr 16:9 ¶ Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
Lu 24:1 ¶ Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.
Joh 20:1 ¶ The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.
Joh 20:19 ¶ Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.
Ac 20:7 ¶ And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread,Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come

Ga 2:19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.
20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

So thankful the Holy Spirit recorded for us that the church met on the first day of the week in honor of Christ and His fulfillment of every jot and tittle of the law.

prove-all · Dec 31, 2014

Mitspa said:

you must have missed my post on #123,

please show where the sabbath was changed, you have not proved youre claim by those verses.

john832 · Dec 31, 2014

Mitspa said:

Let me help you understand what changed in the New Covenant (NKJV throughout)...

Psa 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul; The testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple;
Psa 19:8 The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart; The commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes;
Psa 19:9 The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring forever; The judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.
Psa 19:10 More to be desired are they than gold, Yea, than much fine gold; Sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.
Psa 19:11 Moreover by them Your servant is warned, And in keeping them there is great reward.
Psa 19:12 Who can understand his errors? Cleanse me from secret faults.
Psa 19:13 Keep back Your servant also from presumptuous sins; Let them not have dominion over me. Then I shall be blameless, And I shall be innocent of great transgression.
Psa 19:14 Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart Be acceptable in Your sight, O LORD, my strength and my Redeemer.

So the Law is PERFECT and it CONVERTS one, OK, then what would need to change in the New Covenant if the Law is perfect and capable of converting the soul?

Heb 8:8 Because finding fault with them, He says: "BEHOLD, THE DAYS ARE COMING, SAYS THE LORD, WHEN I WILL MAKE A NEW COVENANT WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AND WITH THE HOUSE OF JUDAH—

OK, here we are, the New Covenant.

Heb 8:9 NOT ACCORDING TO THE COVENANT THAT I MADE WITH THEIR FATHERS IN THE DAY WHEN I TOOK THEM BY THE HAND TO LEAD THEM OUT OF THE LAND OF EGYPT; BECAUSE THEY DID NOT CONTINUE IN MY COVENANT, AND I DISREGARDED THEM, SAYS THE LORD.

Because the people did not continue in His Covenant.

Heb 8:10 FOR THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAYS THE LORD: I WILL PUT MY LAWS IN THEIR MIND AND WRITE THEM ON THEIR HEARTS; AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.

Carefully note that He does not say He will do away with the Law or make a New Law, He says He will write His Law in the hearts and minds of people.

Heb 8:11 NONE OF THEM SHALL TEACH HIS NEIGHBOR, AND NONE HIS BROTHER, SAYING, 'KNOW THE LORD,' FOR ALL SHALL KNOW ME, FROM THE LEAST OF THEM TO THE GREATEST OF THEM.
Heb 8:12 FOR I WILL BE MERCIFUL TO THEIR UNRIGHTEOUSNESS, AND THEIR SINS AND THEIR LAWLESS DEEDS I WILL REMEMBER NO MORE."

Heb 8:13 In that He says, "A NEW COVENANT," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

God will be known by all (is He know by all right now?) and He will forgive sins. That is why verse 13 says the Old one is BECOMING (present tense) obsolete and PASSING (again, present tense) away.

Why a New Covenant?

Heb 3:10 THEREFORE I WAS ANGRY WITH THAT GENERATION, AND SAID, 'THEY ALWAYS GO ASTRAY IN THEIR HEART, AND THEY HAVE NOT KNOWN MY WAYS.'

The people erred in their heart.

By the way, Hebrews 8 is a direct quote of Jer 31:31-34

Jer 31:31 "Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—
Jer 31:32 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the LORD.
Jer 31:33 But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.
Jer 31:34 No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more."

Guess what the word Law in verse 31 is...

H8451

תֹּרָה תּוֹרָה
tôrâh tôrâh
to-raw', to-raw'
From H3384; a precept or statute, especially the Decalogue or Pentateuch: - law.
Total KJV occurrences: 219

So, according to the book of Hebrews (a New Testament book) the New Covenant is the writing of the Torah in the hearts and minds of people.

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