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M
You mean like these?
Ro 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another
Ro 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 ¶ What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Ro 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law,
Ro 4:13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.
14 For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect:
Ro 10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
rOUND AND ROUND WE GO.
Acts 24:14, "But I confess this to you, that after the way which they call heresy--so I worship the Father of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets."
Romans 7:25, "Thanks be to Yahweh, I have deliverance through Yahshua Messiah our King! So then, with this same mind, I myself serve the Law of Yahweh, while in the flesh that is yet subject to the law of sin."
Acts 21:24, "Take them, and be purified with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads. Then everyone will know that those things they were informed about you (forsaking the Law), were lies, and that you, yourself, walk orderly, and keep the Law."
2 peter 3:15-17, "And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability."
Mattithyah 22:36-40, "Teacher, what is the greatest commandment in the Law? Yahshua said to him: You must love Yahweh your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."
Yahchanan (John) 14:15, "If you love Me, keep My commandments."
Mattithyah 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh--the smallest of the letters--will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."
Luke 16:17, "But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."
Acts 24:14, "But I confess this to you, that after the way which they call heresy--so I worship the Father of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets."
Romans 7:25, "Thanks be to Yahweh, I have deliverance through Yahshua Messiah our King! So then, with this same mind, I myself serve the Law of Yahweh, while in the flesh that is yet subject to the law of sin."
Acts 21:24, "Take them, and be purified with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads. Then everyone will know that those things they were informed about you (forsaking the Law), were lies, and that you, yourself, walk orderly, and keep the Law."
2 peter 3:15-17, "And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability."
Mattithyah 22:36-40, "Teacher, what is the greatest commandment in the Law? Yahshua said to him: You must love Yahweh your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."
Yahchanan (John) 14:15, "If you love Me, keep My commandments."
Mattithyah 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh--the smallest of the letters--will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."
Luke 16:17, "But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."
Not what I said, and not even what Yahshua said:
“You have heard that it was said, ‘YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY’; but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. “If your right eye makes you stumble, tear it out and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to be thrown into Gehenna. “If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into Gehenna.
“You have heard that it was said, ‘YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY’; but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. “If your right eye makes you stumble, tear it out and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to be thrown into Gehenna. “If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into Gehenna.
M
No one is going around for those who believe Gods word and obey...the truth is established in clear and evident words. Why don't you obey the Commandments of the Lord? Why don't you pluck out your eye and teach others the standard you claim to uphold?
Ro 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 ¶ What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Ro 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 ¶ What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Mattithyah 7:23, "But then I will declare to them; I never knew you. Get away from Me, you who practice iniquity."
iniquity is:#0458 anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459
Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the condition of without law
1a) because ignorant of it
1b) because of violating it
2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness
iniquity is:#0458 anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459
Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the condition of without law
1a) because ignorant of it
1b) because of violating it
2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness
Mattithyah 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love Yahweh your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."
Romans 13:9-10, "For the commandments: You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not bring false testimony, You shall not covet, and all other commandments are summed up in these Laws; namely: You must love your neighbor as yourself. Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law."
Romans 13:9-10, "For the commandments: You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not bring false testimony, You shall not covet, and all other commandments are summed up in these Laws; namely: You must love your neighbor as yourself. Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law."
Still no reply, why will you not even speak upon these verses? You said you beliee all Scripture not just what Paul wrote.
Mitspa, please answer this;
OK, are these valid? Or is it a justified by works lie? or something else? (I really want to key in on that "and" in Rev 12:17.)
Revelation 22:12-15, "And behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work will be. I am the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Blessed are those who keep His Laws, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and worshipers of gods and everyone who professes to love, yet practices falsehood."
Revelation 12:17, "And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and went to make war with those who forsook her seed; her seed being those who keep the Laws of Yahweh, and have the testimony of Yahshua Messiah."
"Laws" is word #1785 entolé
Definition: an ordinance, injunction, command, law.
Mitspa, please answer this;
OK, are these valid? Or is it a justified by works lie? or something else? (I really want to key in on that "and" in Rev 12:17.)
Revelation 22:12-15, "And behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work will be. I am the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Blessed are those who keep His Laws, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and worshipers of gods and everyone who professes to love, yet practices falsehood."
Revelation 12:17, "And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and went to make war with those who forsook her seed; her seed being those who keep the Laws of Yahweh, and have the testimony of Yahshua Messiah."
"Laws" is word #1785 entolé
Definition: an ordinance, injunction, command, law.
K
That is not talking about the Holy Spirit, or what the Holy Spirit tells you to do.
It is about His moral laws of knowing right and wrong, and to allow the Holy Spirit working in our life to keep us from willful sin and strengthen us in areas that we are weak in still. Molding us to walk in His ways to fulfill all righteousness.
Just because you walk in the spirit, does not mean sin no longer can take hold of a believer again. Paul says more than once that can happen which is why he constantly warns about sins.
Ephesians 5:5
For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
1 Corinthians 5:11
But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
[h=1]1 Corinthians 6:9-10
Or do you not know that the unrighteous[a] will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality,[b] nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.[/h]
H
And I see on this forum that you are always eagerly seeking to charge people with sin (similar to the Pharisees).
Anyway, God does give us definitions of sin. Below are a few examples. And note how they do not apply to Christians.
1:Unbelief in Jesus is the sin the world is convicted of, John 16:9.
2:Unrighteousness is sin, 1John 5:17. Christians cannot be charged with this sin as our faith is counted for righteousness, Rom 4:5.
3:Transgression of the law is sin, 1John 3:4. Christians cannot be charged with this sin as we're not under the law (Rom 8:2, Rom 10:4, Gal 3:25, Gal 5:18, 1Tim 1:9). Remember that whatever the law says it says to those under it, Rom 3:19.
So can Christians be charged with sin when they believe on Jesus?
Rom 8:33
Who shall lay ANY THING (this includes sin) to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
As Christians cannot be charged with sin thus we see in scripture that we "cannot sin" (1John 3:9), we've "ceased from sin", 1Pet 4:1. As long as we continue to believe on Jesus, and not turn back to unbelief (such as turning back to works of the law), then our life is hid with Christ in God (Col 3:3) and we're covered by his sinlessness/righteousness/holiness/perfection.
Your claim above contradicts scripture which says Christians cannot be charged with ANY THING, Rom 8:33
I'm curious under the doctrine you follow, what if a Christian forgets to repent of some minor thing? Or what if they don't get an opportunity to repent because of issues, injury, whatever, that stops them from doing so before they die?
What a precarious and misleading doctrine you follow.
BTW, what did Christians repent of?
It was dead works of self-righteousness (which is sin).
Heb 6:1
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God
Are you claiming to be pure in your behavior/lifestyle?
Do you obey the law perfectly?
Now consider from scripture how Christians were made pure.
1John 3:3
And every man that hath this hope (that we who believe on Jesus are now the sons of God) in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.
The false doctrine you follow contradicts this. Hence you misunderstood 1Tim 5:22. The warning in 1Tim 5:22 to not be a partaker of another's "sin" is a warning about the sin of unbelief such as by turning back to works of the law, which is denying that Jesus is the Christ.
Consider Eph 5:6,7 which gives the same type of warning not to be partakers with deceivers (those who deny Jesus is the Christ, 1John 2:22).
Eph 5:6,7
Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
Be not ye therefore partakers with them.
Anyway, God does give us definitions of sin. Below are a few examples. And note how they do not apply to Christians.
1:Unbelief in Jesus is the sin the world is convicted of, John 16:9.
2:Unrighteousness is sin, 1John 5:17. Christians cannot be charged with this sin as our faith is counted for righteousness, Rom 4:5.
3:Transgression of the law is sin, 1John 3:4. Christians cannot be charged with this sin as we're not under the law (Rom 8:2, Rom 10:4, Gal 3:25, Gal 5:18, 1Tim 1:9). Remember that whatever the law says it says to those under it, Rom 3:19.
So can Christians be charged with sin when they believe on Jesus?
Rom 8:33
Who shall lay ANY THING (this includes sin) to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
As Christians cannot be charged with sin thus we see in scripture that we "cannot sin" (1John 3:9), we've "ceased from sin", 1Pet 4:1. As long as we continue to believe on Jesus, and not turn back to unbelief (such as turning back to works of the law), then our life is hid with Christ in God (Col 3:3) and we're covered by his sinlessness/righteousness/holiness/perfection.
Your claim above contradicts scripture which says Christians cannot be charged with ANY THING, Rom 8:33
I'm curious under the doctrine you follow, what if a Christian forgets to repent of some minor thing? Or what if they don't get an opportunity to repent because of issues, injury, whatever, that stops them from doing so before they die?
What a precarious and misleading doctrine you follow.
BTW, what did Christians repent of?
It was dead works of self-righteousness (which is sin).
Heb 6:1
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God
Are you claiming to be pure in your behavior/lifestyle?
Do you obey the law perfectly?
Now consider from scripture how Christians were made pure.
1John 3:3
And every man that hath this hope (that we who believe on Jesus are now the sons of God) in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.
The false doctrine you follow contradicts this. Hence you misunderstood 1Tim 5:22. The warning in 1Tim 5:22 to not be a partaker of another's "sin" is a warning about the sin of unbelief such as by turning back to works of the law, which is denying that Jesus is the Christ.
Consider Eph 5:6,7 which gives the same type of warning not to be partakers with deceivers (those who deny Jesus is the Christ, 1John 2:22).
Eph 5:6,7
Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
Be not ye therefore partakers with them.
Jesus words are still a mystery to you
did the eye make him stumble??? if a man looks at a woman to lust is the eye to blame or the mind...the scripture does not say be transormed by the renewing of your eye or the hand...if a man steal is it the hand to be blamed? do you think plucking an eye will stop the man from lust? or the lost of an arm stop the thief? men with their knowledge steal more than a man can ever with his hands...
so I conclude you are either really ignorant of the word or you are being very callous....by your response
did the eye make him stumble??? if a man looks at a woman to lust is the eye to blame or the mind...the scripture does not say be transormed by the renewing of your eye or the hand...if a man steal is it the hand to be blamed? do you think plucking an eye will stop the man from lust? or the lost of an arm stop the thief? men with their knowledge steal more than a man can ever with his hands...
so I conclude you are either really ignorant of the word or you are being very callous....by your response
H
But I thought you had implied that you were "pure" in your post about 1Tim 5:22?
So are you saying that when you "backslide" you are not pure and then when you confess then you are pure once again?
The doctrine you follow has you bouncing up and down on a see-saw of pure verses impure.
I suggest its a false doctrine you have been taught.
This doctrine you preach sounds like being perfected by the flesh (Gal 3:3).
You are not rightly dividing the word of truth.
These deeds that determine whether one gains eternal life or not is all about whether we believe on Jesus.
John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
John 6:40
this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life:
Kenneth, the doctrine you are following is a lukewarm mix of works of the law, with grace.
The doctrine you follow seek to corrupt your mind from the simplicity that is in Christ.
2Cor 11:3
But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
Repent of your dead works.
Believe on Jesus instead.
So are you saying that when you "backslide" you are not pure and then when you confess then you are pure once again?
The doctrine you follow has you bouncing up and down on a see-saw of pure verses impure.
I suggest its a false doctrine you have been taught.
This doctrine you preach sounds like being perfected by the flesh (Gal 3:3).
You are not rightly dividing the word of truth.
These deeds that determine whether one gains eternal life or not is all about whether we believe on Jesus.
John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
John 6:40
this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life:
Kenneth, the doctrine you are following is a lukewarm mix of works of the law, with grace.
The doctrine you follow seek to corrupt your mind from the simplicity that is in Christ.
2Cor 11:3
But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
Repent of your dead works.
Believe on Jesus instead.
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