Music in Church?

[dcontroversal]

The bible (not any man) commands Christians to sing. Those that follow the bible will sing and not change that command but accept it as it is.

Those that follow men will do as they please regardless of what the bible says.....and this is how you end up with thousands of religious groups that contradict each all over the place yet all claim to be "right".


(The corruption of men adding IM to their own worship took place many centuries before Campbell was even born)

I suggest the INSPIRED SONGS (PSALMS) of worship......God inspired them and your view contradicts what God inspired.....if it was GOOD enough and INSPIRED in the OT WORSHIP of GOD then it is FINE and acceptable in the worship of God to this very day.....I really don't care if your you reject the truth and are blind to the truth...maybe trust Jesus biblically and then your eyes will be opened to the truth instead of the doctrines and traditions of men!

 

[posthuman]

Do you think is wrong to worship God using animal sacrifice as David did?

i'm sure we've had exactly this exchange in the past, but here goes again:

Christ made the perfect and final sacrifice. it was not abominable in the past to sacrifice to Him as He commanded the Jews to do. also it was clearly never abominable to Him to come before Him with singing, making music and praising Him, even in the very temple.

so music in itself has never been condemned by Him, but a wrong heart. and we have Christ clearly putting an end to sacrifice.

has Christ become the final and perfect psalm, so that music is now done away with and any more sound is an abomination? NO.

you're presenting a false parallel.
music in worship was clearly acceptable to Him in the past, and clearly acceptable in the afterwards. the only argument you have in scripture is that it is not specifically commanded of you. it is nowhere in scripture condemned for us as found in Christ.

 

[SeaBass]

I suggest the INSPIRED SONGS (PSALMS) of worship......God inspired them and your view contradicts what God inspired.....if it was GOOD enough and INSPIRED in the OT WORSHIP of GOD then it is FINE and acceptable in the worship of God to this very day.....I really don't care if your you reject the truth and are blind to the truth...maybe trust Jesus biblically and then your eyes will be opened to the truth instead of the doctrines and traditions of men!

I reject your flawed reasoning.

When Christ died, He took all the OT out of the way making in inactive, of no effect, Col 2:14, Christ abolished it, Eph 5:15.

Since you cannot undo what Christ did on the cross, then it is in error to go back to the OT law to justify the use of IM. You cannot make it active, effective or un-abolished it again.

The Galatian epistle is all about Paul condemning some of the Christians in Galatia for returning to the OT law thinking they could be made righteous by keeping that law. Paul also points out one cannot go back to that OT law and just cherry-pick out of what they like for one is a debtor to the WHOLE law. So if one goes back to the OT law to justify IM, not only are they trying to make Christ's death in vain (Gal 2:21) they have an OBLIGATION to keep ALL the OT law including the animal sacrifices, purifications, tithing, keeping Sabbaths, etc, etc, etc.
Rom 7:1-6 it would be spiritual adultery for a Christian, who is married to Christ and His gospel, to also try and follow Moses and his law at the same time.


I have seen where many of the pro-IM users on here disagree with the "Sabbath Keepers" who post on this forum. Ironically, the pro-IM users are not doing anything different from the Sabbath Keepers in trying to find righteousness by keeping the OT law, again, Gal 2:21. So if using IM and keeping the Sabbath is 'right doing' then Christ is dead in vain.

 

[notuptome]

Be straight up. Does contemporary worship bother you?

From what I have heard I would say yes. I have not attended any contemporary worship churches but the ones I have driven past are know for their apostasy and lukewarm stand on scripture and biblical truth. They are a reason the church has no influence on the society. Lack of separation to the Lord and the holy things of God.

This is my opinion and it is not intended to offend but you did solicit it. There are of course Christians in contemporary churches so while we may not agree on style of worship or music standards we are accountable only to God on the matter.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[SeaBass]

When Christ died, He took all the OT out of the way making in inactive, of no effect, Col 2:14, Christ abolished it, Eph 5:15.

[Should be Eph 2:15 not Eph 5:15.]

 

[Jabberjaw]

i'm sure we've had exactly this exchange in the past, but here goes again:

Christ made the perfect and final sacrifice. it was not abominable in the past to sacrifice to Him as He commanded the Jews to do. also it was clearly never abominable to Him to come before Him with singing, making music and praising Him, even in the very temple.

so music in itself has never been condemned by Him, but a wrong heart. and we have Christ clearly putting an end to sacrifice.

has Christ become the final and perfect psalm, so that music is now done away with and any more sound is an abomination? NO.

you're presenting a false parallel.
music in worship was clearly acceptable to Him in the past, and clearly acceptable in the afterwards. the only argument you have in scripture is that it is not specifically commanded of you. it is nowhere in scripture condemned for us as found in Christ.

In post 543, SeaBass brings up the "Sabbath", with your reasoning we should be keeping the sabbath, do you? if not why not? where was the sabbath condemned?

It was nailed to the cross like IM or any other OT form of worship that was not carried over into the NT worship. (Col 2:14)

 

[dcontroversal]

I reject your flawed reasoning.

When Christ died, He took all the OT out of the way making in inactive, of no effect, Col 2:14, Christ abolished it, Eph 5:15.

Since you cannot undo what Christ did on the cross, then it is in error to go back to the OT law to justify the use of IM. You cannot make it active, effective or un-abolished it again.

The Galatian epistle is all about Paul condemning some of the Christians in Galatia for returning to the OT law thinking they could be made righteous by keeping that law. Paul also points out one cannot go back to that OT law and just cherry-pick out of what they like for one is a debtor to the WHOLE law. So if one goes back to the OT law to justify IM, not only are they trying to make Christ's death in vain (Gal 2:21) they have an OBLIGATION to keep ALL the OT law including the animal sacrifices, purifications, tithing, keeping Sabbaths, etc, etc, etc.
Rom 7:1-6 it would be spiritual adultery for a Christian, who is married to Christ and His gospel, to also try and follow Moses and his law at the same time.


I have seen where many of the pro-IM users on here disagree with the "Sabbath Keepers" who post on this forum. Ironically, the pro-IM users are not doing anything different from the Sabbath Keepers in trying to find righteousness by keeping the OT law, again, Gal 2:21. So if using IM and keeping the Sabbath is 'right doing' then Christ is dead in vain.

I could care less what you think dude....your views constantly contradict scripture and last time I checked the OT LAW was found written in the 1st 5 books of the Torah and not the PSALMS....so....you being a COC'er would reject ANY truth that has instruments used in Music.....when you come on line with biblical salvation and then after many years of study, your view might mean something....until you can get biblical salvation right...everything else you express a view on is moot!

 

[oldthennew]

EX.15:1.
Then sang Moses and the children of Israel this song unto the LORD, and spake, saying,
I will sing unto the LORD, for He has triumphed gloriously: the horse and his rider
hath He thrown into the sea.

HEB.2:11-12.
For both He that sanctifies and they who are sanctified are all of God,
for which cause He is not ashamed to call them brethren.

Saying, I will declare Thy name unto My brethren, in the midst of the church
will I sing praise unto Thee.

REV.15:3.
....And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb
saying, Great and marvelous are Thy works, Lord God Almighty;
just and true are Thy ways, Thou King of saints.


may all tongues be unbound, may they sing heartily unto their God,
the King of the universe, Who is worthy and just, righteous.

 

[SeaBass]

I could care less what you think dude....your views constantly contradict scripture and last time I checked the OT LAW was found written in the 1st 5 books of the Torah and not the PSALMS....so....you being a COC'er would reject ANY truth that has instruments used in Music.....when you come on line with biblical salvation and then after many years of study, your view might mean something....until you can get biblical salvation right...everything else you express a view on is moot!

Jesus, in proving His Deity, said to the Jews in John 10:34 "Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?" Jesus was quoting Psa 82:6 and calls Psalms "law".


I still accept the bible and reject your continued flawed reasoning.

 

[posthuman]

In post 543, SeaBass brings up the "Sabbath", with your reasoning we should be keeping the sabbath, do you? if not why not? where was the sabbath condemned?

if i do, what is it to you? and what is it to justify condemning the sacrifice of praise others have?
it's not for man, but for God -- and if i ring a bell for God, it is for God, not for man either.

this isn't a point to bear on whether making music to the Lord is good or not -- but to judge me on this point or that point, and it's written "let no man judge you with regard to a Sabbath day"

it's not been anyone's argument to command you to strum a guitar for the Lord. we are free-will offerings to Him, being saved by His grace, not by our works.

 

[posthuman]

Jesus, in proving His Deity, said to the Jews in John 10:34 "Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?" Jesus was quoting Psa 82:6 and calls Psalms "law".


I still accept the bible and reject your continued flawed reasoning.

if you will accept the Psalms as law, why do you say it is evil to keep them out of love and free-will, not as a command? but you're commanding us not to do the things written in the law.

What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not!
(Romans 7:7)

 

[dcontroversal]

Jesus, in proving His Deity, said to the Jews in John 10:34 "Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?" Jesus was quoting Psa 82:6 and calls Psalms "law".


I still accept the bible and reject your continued flawed reasoning.

Key word "YOUR" law......so.......like I said.....the Psalms speak a great deal to instruments in worship which your COC doctrine blinds you to!

 

[Sirk]

So from what I gather, it's not worship unless it is painfully boring and any joy or fun you feel doing it is evil if it is felt on a human level. Makes perfect sense if you believe we were designed to be miserable creatures with no personality of our own.

 

[notuptome]

So from what I gather, it's not worship unless it is painfully boring and any joy or fun you feel doing it is evil if it is felt on a human level. Makes perfect sense if you believe we were designed to be miserable creatures with no personality of our own.

Do you consider this an example of sound reasoning? Is a wanton disregard for sanctity of Gods house a good thing. Can Gods people worship in a respectful manner? Respectful of Gods house and His Holy Presence?

I do not mean to be unkind but why should the house of worship to the living God look like a country club, night club or worse? Why should Gods people be assaulted with worldly music when they gather to commune with God Who is holy and pure? Be separate from the world. Be holy unto the Lord.

If you do not do it at home you will not do it at church.

I see a lot of joy even tears of rejoicing and nothing painfully boring about hearing Gods word declared by Gods man.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[MsLimpet]

So from what I gather, it's not worship unless it is painfully boring and any joy or fun you feel doing it is evil if it is felt on a human level. Makes perfect sense if you believe we were designed to be miserable creatures with no personality of our own.

Who are you there to worship?

 

[Sirk]

Do you consider this an example of sound reasoning? Is a wanton disregard for sanctity of Gods house a good thing. Can Gods people worship in a respectful manner? Respectful of Gods house and His Holy Presence?

I do not mean to be unkind but why should the house of worship to the living God look like a country club, night club or worse? Why should Gods people be assaulted with worldly music when they gather to commune with God Who is holy and pure? Be separate from the world. Be holy unto the Lord.

If you do not do it at home you will not do it at church.

I see a lot of joy even tears of rejoicing and nothing painfully boring about hearing Gods word declared by Gods man.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

I suppose if the house of God were a building.

 

[SeaBass]

if you will accept the Psalms as law, why do you say it is evil to keep them out of love and free-will, not as a command? but you're commanding us not to do the things written in the law.

What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not!
(Romans 7:7)

Paul is not saying one should keep the law in Rom 7:7.

To the Christian Jews to whom Paul was writing Paul told them they were "dead to the law" Rom 7:4 and they had been delivered/released/discharged from the law, Rom 7:6. Those Jews were dead to the law so they could be married to Christ and His NT gospel. They could not keep both Christ's NT and the OT law at the same time else they commit spiritual adultery, so they were made dead to the law, discharged from the law by the death of Christ in taking the law out of the way so they can be married to Christ and His NT.

 

[SeaBass]

Key word "YOUR" law......so.......like I said.....the Psalms speak a great deal to instruments in worship which your COC doctrine blinds you to!

The key word is "law". The law had been given to those Jews so it was their law. By Jesus quoting from Psalms He was quoting from their law.

 

[notuptome]

I suppose if the house of God were a building.

Please don't play cute on this. I prefer to think better of you.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Sirk]

Who are you there to worship?

Obviously I go to church to worship Jesus.