The Bible does not say anywhere that the death of Christ served as a substitution for your death. Only theologians say such a thing.
The death of Christ is presented as an example for us which we then follow/partake in also.
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Rom 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
Being buried with him by baptism into death (baptism of repentance) is not a substitution. Jesus clearly taught that we have to pick up our cross, deny ourselves and follow him. Such a teaching is the very opposite of a substitution.
Our old man is crucified with Him for the express purpose that the service of sin ceases. Paul is speaking of us dying to the world and the lusts thereof via the cross from which we are raised anew unto the service of righteousness through the washing of regeneration of the Holy Ghost.
The teaching of substitution destroys this concept and replaces it with a POSITIONAL or LEGAL standing set apart from any actual manifest transformation.
Substitution twists the death of Christ into effecting a change in how God views things as opposed to the death of Christ effecting an actual real manifest change in the individual. Think about this point Jason.
The problem between sinners and God is sin. The issue is the rebellion of sinners. The sinner is the offending party and therefore it is the sinner who has to change. GOD DOES NOT HAVE TO CHANGE.
The substitution deception presents God as the one changing in that He PRETENDS that the sinner is no guilty due to Jesus serving as a guilty substitute. Under the Penal Substitution model (post 1600 CE) a positional transaction is said to take place whereby God PRETENDS that the sinner is righteous and not guilty when the sinner is still manifestly unrighteous and guilty. This teaching has God changing.
Look at what you have written...
Where does the Bible teach that Jason?
Where does the Bible teach anything about a "substititionary atonement going into effect" ?????????
The Bible says this...
Heb 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
Heb 10:17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
Heb 10:18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
Heb 10:19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
Heb 10:20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;
Heb 10:21 And having an high priest over the house of God;
Heb 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
Heb 10:23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised
Heb 10:24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
Heb 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
Heb 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Read that over and over. The death of Christ had NOTHING to do with any kind of legal exchange or legal substitution.
The death of Christ is the MEANS by which we approach God in order to be reconciled, ie. the means by which we may be restored to favour.
Believe what the Book of Hebrews teaches. We approach God via the blood of Christ in a new and living way (the inward approach [ie. repentance and faith] as opposed to outward rote legalism [ie. law keeping]). In approaching God with a TRUE HEART in repentance and faith God is willing to forgive us our PAST crimes once and for all. We are then given a fresh start from which we then grow in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. Due to this fresh start and having been purged of our old sins it is obvious that ongoing rebellion is out of the question.
This is all very simple to understand and the Bible teaches it so very clearly.
Jesus died on your behalf, not in your place. Jesus taught in the Gospels that YOU HAVE TO DIE IN ORDER TO LIVE. The death of Christ is an EXAMPLE for you to follow. Peter knew this...
1Pe 2:21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:
1Pe 2:22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:
1Pe 2:23 Who, when he was reviled, reviled not again; when he suffered, he threatened not; but committed himself to him that judgeth righteously:
1Pe 2:24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.
Does that sound like a substitution to you?
Peter says EXAMPLE. Jesus bore our sins in his own body (He was the sin offering) that WE, being dead to sin (through repentance), should LIVE unto righteousness.
Paul taught the exact same thing...
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Rom 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
The service of sin ceases when we die with Christ for we no longer yield our members unto unrighteousness. We instead yield to righteousness.
This substitution message which is preached almost everywhere is a total perversion of the truth. This perversion implants into the minds of ignorant people that reconciliation is premised off the mercy of God via a LEGAL TRANSACTION as opposed being premised off the mercy of God in concordance with a MANIFEST TRANSFORMATION.
Thus a LEGAL TRANSACTION or LEGAL POSITION replaces the reality of the HEART BEING PURIFIED in genuine redemption.
Is that what the Bible teaches? That same cup that Jesus drank of...
Mar 10:37 They said unto him, Grant unto us that we may sit, one on thy right hand, and the other on thy left hand, in thy glory.
Mar 10:38 But Jesus said unto them, Ye know not what ye ask: can ye drink of the cup that I drink of? and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with?
Mar 10:39 And they said unto him, We can. And Jesus said unto them,
Ye shall indeed drink of the cup that I drink of; and with the baptism that I am baptized withal shall ye be baptized:
Mar 10:40 But to sit on my right hand and on my left hand is not mine to give; but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared.
Mar 10:41 And when the ten heard it, they began to be much displeased with James and John.
STOP buying into the doctrines of deceivers who quote isolated portions of the Bible completely out of their context and fluff it out with worthless rhetoric. Those people are Bible Butchers and they deceive those who do not diligently study the scripture with sincere and honest hearts.
Why would Jesus bear our sins? He did it as a SIN OFFERING on our behalf to effect the purchase of the Church through being our kinsman redeemer. Read the book of Ruth and you will see the pattern. The reason Jesus had to die was to put into effect the New Covenant exactly as the Bible states...
Heb 9:14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
Heb 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
Heb 9:16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
Heb 9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
Heb 9:18 Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.
Heb 9:19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,
Heb 9:20 Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.
Heb 9:21 Moreover he sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle, and all the vessels of the ministry.
Heb 9:22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
Believe the above. The writer of Hebrews lays it out so clearly.
God deals in covenants and God has chosen that the New Covenant is the means by which a sinner may be reconciled back to favour, not via substitution, but via a TRANSFORMATION whereby the ROOT CAUSE of sinning is dealt with. We have to be PURGED of our past sins, we have to have our hearts PURIFIED, whereby we are REDEEMED from all iniquity.
The modern theologians are blind to all this even though it is all right in front of their noses. Instead of defending righteousness, purity of heart, and a clean conscience they defend ongoing wickedness and a sin cloak and then pretend that recognising such humbles them. The truth is that the deceitfulness of sin hardens them unto reprobation because they do not have a love for the truth and the vast majority will never awake to their peril until it is too late at the judgement.
Isaiah 53 does not teach a substitionary atonement. People read such a view into the text. Isaiah 53 prophecies of Jesus suffering on our behalf, of Jesus, in all His innocense, being subjected to the wickedness of the world and being murdered. He gave Himself for us that...
Tit 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
A redemption from ALL iniquity and being made PURE by which we are zealous for righteousness. Not some forensic position or legal transaction, that is pure nonsense.
You reference 2Cor 5:21 but just like every other Penal Substitution promoter you ignore 2 Cor 6:1 which is the VERY NEXT VERSE.
Co 6:1 We then, as workers together with him, beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain.
We are "made the righteousness of God in Him" via WORKING TOGETHER WITH GOD.
In other words we ABIDE in the Spirit of life IN Jesus Christ.
Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Being made the righteousness of God in Him is the SAME THING as the righteousness of the law being fulfilled in us through the Spirit of life IN Jesus Christ. Even Jesus taught it with these words...
Joh 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
Joh 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
Joh 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Jesus did not teach any Penal Substitution nor did anyone of the other Bible writers. Peter, Paul and Jesus all taught the SAME THING.
The wolves IGNORE Jesus and then TWIST PAUL with this Penal Substitution deception and imply that salvation is wrought via TRUSTING in the FINISHED WORK (a finished legal transaction based on a penal substitution). Then those whom buy into it end up defending ongoing wickedness and ongoing "sinning some more" as they deceive themselves into thinking "Jesus obeyed for them" because "they can't."
Jason, your doctrine is a contradiction. You argue in favour of obedience one moment and then argue in favour of reconciliation being premised off the obedience of Jesus being your substitute. You cannot have it both ways. If Jesus died in your place then that means you don't have to die. A substitute and an example are mutually exclusive.
Jesus does not push anyone out of the way of the judgement of God. Jesus preached a message of HEAR and DO and implored people to DO IT AND LIVE. Jesus served as an EXAMPLE of how we are to walk and Jesus also offered Himself on our behalf to put into effect the New Covenant which is the means by which we may have our past sins forgiven once and for all.. That is what the Bible teaches, not moving trust push stories.
Who OBEY Him. Those who HEAR AND DO because salvation is a MANIFEST STATE OF WALKING WITH GOD. The Spirit of life IN Jesus Christ sets us free from the law of sin and death whereby the righteousness of the law is fulfilled IN us. In other words we are QUICKENED WITHIN by the very power of God as we are wholehearted yielded to Him having repented and thus forsaken our rebellion to God. Salvation is INTERNAL and is representative of an INTERNAL TRANSFORMATION. Such a transformation can only occur as a result of us yielding with all our being which is why so FEW will be saved.
Yes, absolutely correct. Read 2 Cor 6:1 in conjunction with 2Cor 5:15-21.
Get this substitution nonsense out of your head and believe...
2Co 5:15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.
Joh 12:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.
Joh 12:25 He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal.
Consider these things Jason.
Go and reads early Church writings. The Penal Substitution model is only 400 years old, it was a further development of the Satisfaction model put forth by Anselm 400 years before that. The early church taught Ransom, Recapitulation, Moral Example, and Christus Victor. They viewed the death of Christ as effecting a PURCHASE of a people who lived unto the EXAMPLE of Jesus Christ, through whom they had victory over the works of the devil in their lives. Their message was "go and sin no more" just like the message of Jesus. They taught about heart purity and walking blameless before God with a clean conscience. Not perfection as in never making a mistake, but perfection in the context of a pure heart whereby we truly loved God and truly loved our neighbour.
It is a simple message and theologians obfuscate it with various deceptions.
HEAR AND DO. No one can go wrong if they will simply hear and do.
God bless.
