Free from sin

Somtincreatib · Jun 25, 2015

You refuse to accept the fact that Christ said with man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible. You refuse to accept the fact that Paul said neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything in all creation will be able to separate us from the love of God that is Christ Jesus. [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]You refuse to accept the fact that Paul said that if you confess with your mouth that "Jesus is Lord" and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead you will be saved. [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]You refuse to accept the fact that Isaiah wrote your righteousness and your works will be exposed and they will not benefit you. [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]You refuse to accept the fact that Romans 3 is just as biblical and binding as Romans 6 and they don't contradict. [/FONT]You have lied yourself to the falsehood that you wont sin, and that you are going to be more perfect than the pharisees. You have already made that choice by so thinking like that.
You have made your mind up.

Somtincreatib · Jun 25, 2015

Friend, it is unseemly for you to continue in your pharisaical ways then sit back and snipe at others.

Somtincreatib · Jun 25, 2015

>wall of excellent explanation
jason: it doesnt make sense

Jason0047 said:

notuptome · Jun 25, 2015

Skinski7 said:

Huh? Can't say what I would like to say but the world is no doubt impressed with your theology. God not at all but the world loves you.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Jason0047 · Jun 25, 2015

Somtincreatib said:

There are three lines of thought that I am seeing so far here in this thread.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Belief #1. A person can sin and still be saved (i.e. they can abide in unrepentant sin like lying, cheating, etc.) and still be in God's good graces.

Belief #2. The Substitutionary Atonement is denied and the believer is to work out his salvation (Placing way more of an emphasis on what we do then what Christ does).

Belief #3. The Substitionary Atonement is true and the believer is to yield to Christ whereby He does the good work in them.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Belief #1 is essentially giving a person a license to sin. This is wrong because it ignores everything we know about morality and goodness.

Belief #2 is denial of what Christ did for us and places way too much emphasis on us in order to save ourselves.

Belief #3 acknowledges that Christ is the author of our salvation in both Justification and in Sanctification whereby he works in the believer to make them holy and perfect (When we yield and surrender to Him).

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sinless perfectionism is a Biblical doctrine (See 1 Peter 4:1) (Galatians 5:24) (2 Peter 2:1, 14) (Romans 6:14); It doesn't matter if you do not see anyone putting it into practice or not. Faith is a walk that is sight unseen; And we cannot see every person and what they do on the planet. Christ calls us to walk as he walked.

Jason0047 · Jun 25, 2015

[VIDEO=youtube;-AQtoN_HdIo]https://youtu.be/-AQtoN_HdIo[/VIDEO]

phil112 · Jun 25, 2015

Somtincreatib said:

I have enough courage to talk to someone face to face.
You have something you want to say to me?
Call me by name so I know you're talking to me, and spit it out.
Don't be a coward and take pot shots from behind a thicket of anonymity.

I bring scripture to the table. You bring what?

InSpiritInTruth · Jun 25, 2015

I want you guys and gals to meditate on this concept real hard, because it proves that you cannot be "in sin" and also "in Christ" at the same time.

1 John 3:5
And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.

Somtincreatib · Jun 25, 2015

Oh lol dont take my comment to be. Agreeing with skinski. I simply was chuckling about how it is pretty clear what skinski believes after that wall of text and you basically said "what"

Jason0047 said:

There are three lines of thought that I am seeing so far here in this thread.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Belief #1. A person can sin and still be saved (i.e. they can abide in unrepentant sin like lying, cheating, etc.) and still be in God's good graces.

Belief #2. The Substitutionary Atonement is denied and the believer is to work out his salvation (Placing way more of an emphasis on what we do then what Christ does).

Belief #3. The Substitionary Atonement is true and the believer is to yield to Christ whereby He does the good work in them.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Belief #1 is essentially giving a person a license to sin. This is wrong because it ignores everything we know about morality and goodness.

Belief #2 is denial of what Christ did for us and places way too much emphasis on us in order to save ourselves.

Belief #3 acknowledges that Christ is the author of our salvation in both Justification and in Sanctification whereby he works in the believer to make them holy and perfect (When we yield and surrender to Him).

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sinless perfectionism is a Biblical doctrine (See 1 Peter 4:1) (Galatians 5:24) (2 Peter 2:1, 14) (Romans 6:14); It doesn't matter if you do not see anyone putting it into practice or not. Faith is a walk that is sight unseen; And we cannot see every person and what they do on the planet. Christ calls us to walk as he walked.

Somtincreatib · Jun 25, 2015

Lol. After i quoted scripture and showed your own words work both ways you want to act like an internet tough guy? Too cute bro.

**link edited..inappropriate content**

phil112 said:

Somtincreatib · Jun 25, 2015

...........

dcontroversal · Jun 25, 2015

Somtincreatib said:

Oh make no mistake...There are a few who are blind to the fact that many of the inspired writers testified of their own sins and short comings after they were already eternally saved and sealed....they will find out one day that they were not as sinless as they claim to be...albeit too late....

Utah · Jun 25, 2015

phil112 said:

You're right, Phil, and I apologize . . . but am I correct?

Utah · Jun 26, 2015

phil112 said:

Phil! Phil! Seriously? Anonymity? Fore real? Come on man. Is that the best you've got? I'm disappointed.

Jason0047 · Jun 26, 2015

dcontroversal said:

So the guys who were living according to the Word and living righteously are going to suffer versus say the ones who treat sin as if it was no big deal? Something doesn't seem right with such a picture.

Jason0047 · Jun 26, 2015

Somtincreatib said:

The pharisees were judged by Jesus Christ because they ignored the weightier matters of the law like justice, love, and mercy. Jesus also called them hypocrites, too. A hypocrite judges another for the very same thing that they do. How exactly does one who believes in a sin and still be saved doctrine paint themselves in a favorable light in relation to this?

know1 · Jun 26, 2015

InSpiritInTruth said:

You are not going to be able to persuade any on this forum with your arguments using scripture.
Every time you try to use scripture and/or talk about faith, the unbelieving, evil hearted, carnally minded, worldly Christians, will always go to the natural. That is where their world is. They rationalize and reason away the truths of God's word with worldly logic. The only thing they know is how the natural course of this world works. To them, anything outside the natural course of nature and the laws that govern the physical world, is a lie. To them, the only truth they know, is what is happening the natural world. And to them, what is happening in the natural, must be the will of God.
Ask them how faith works, like I did, or even what it is. Only one person came close to knowing how it works. Some, outside salvation, have very little faith, the rest have none.
You are trying to get the carnally/natural/worldly minded to see the spiritual, and it's not going to happen.
Even as you cannot get a lying devil to agree with you and see the truth, you cannot get those controlled by an evil spirit to agree with, see, or hear what you are saying.
For as the spirit is in the man, so is the man. The spirit controls the thoughts of the heart, and as the man thinks in his heart, so is he.
In order to get the unbelieving believers to see, one must first bind the strong man in them that is blinding their minds. Then ask God to open their eyes and ears, that they may see and hear, or perceive and understand.
Either that, or pray for God to get them saved. For many have the form of Godliness but deny the power thereof.
So they are either blinded babies or wolves in sheep's clothing, portraying themselves as godly people.
Until then, they will not be able to see or receive the truth of God's word nor hear what you are saying. For if they were of God, they would hear you.
1Jn 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.
To him that has the spirit of truth or of Christ, he will be able to receive the truth of God's word, but to him that has the spirit of error, the spirit himself will prevent the them from seeing or receiving the truth. They will only be allowed to see part of the truth, but always tainted with a lie.

Ugly · Jun 26, 2015

BDF sounds so much like political parties. Pointing fingers at one another, calling each other corrupt, calling each other closed minded, accusing each other of ignoring truth... you people should give up CC and go into politics.

know1 · Jun 26, 2015

Somtincreatib said:

Mat 7:12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.

Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Rom 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Rom 1:17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

If one walks in faith, love, and obedience to God's Spirit, how can one sin?

Skinski7 · Jun 26, 2015

Jason0047 said:

That is you saying, "if it is all us, and none of Christ."

I never said anything remotely close to that. You are just like many others who respond with rhetoric and ignore the substance Jason.

The purpose that Jesus went to the cross was to...

Tit 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

1. Redeem us from all iniquity.
2. Purify us that we be zealous of righteousness.

Thus we are "made the righteousness of God in Him"...

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
2Co 6:1 We then, as workers together with him, beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain.

...via working together with God whereby we WALK according to the Spirit...

Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

In light of the above, which I have stated many times, how can you possibly conclude I am saying, "it is all us, and none of Christ" ?????

How can you honestly conclude in your mind that I am saying, "it is all us, and none of Christ."

I think you are being dishonest to conclude that because I clearly state that God leads and we follow. I clearly state that is the Spirit of life IN Jesus Christ by which we operate. There is no "all us and none of Christ" in ANYTHING I have written. Stop misrepresenting me Jason. I know others constantly misrepresent me but for you who claim to be in favour of serving righteousness? You doing it? It is surprising.

The purpose that Jesus went to the cross was this...

Heb 9:14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
Heb 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
Heb 9:16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
Heb 9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
Heb 9:18 Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.
Heb 9:19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,
Heb 9:20 Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.

Yet you do not seem to care about what the Bible says in Hebrews. You ignore it and somehow twist my premise in your mind to be "all of us and none of Christ." You then respond to this fictional premise instead of actually addressing what I actually wrote. That does not seem like a very honest thing to do.

Where a testament is there must also be the death of the testator. Jesus gave Himself as a sin offering for the redemption of transgressions which were under the Old Testament by instituting the New Covenant. The blood of Christ is sprinkled on the offering cleansing it once and for all. We present ourselves to God upon the Mercy Seat and the blood of Christ is sprinkled upon us cleansing us of our past transgressions once and for all.

The sin offering of Jesus Christ has NOTHING to do with a substitution of any sort. Not a single supporter of the various substitutional views can provide any Biblical texts which substantiate anything close to any "sin debt being paid" or Jesus "swapping places with the sinner." People merely grab hold of isolated verses and heap rhetoric upon them. They ignore the Book of Hebrews which clearly refutes any notion of substitution.

You didn't get your substitutional view from the Bible Jason, you were taught it by men. You ought to dig into the history of it and let the chips fall where they may. If substitution is truth then scripture will not contradict it.

Free from sin

Banned

Banned

Banned

Senior Member

Banned

Banned

phil112

Guest

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned

Senior Member

Ugly

Guest

Senior Member

Banned