Hyper grace
- Thread starter PeterJens
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
The flesh is not the old man..the flesh is in the body..the old man died..you have a new nature now..Christ is in you!
Romans 7:18 (NASB)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not.
Romans 7:22-23 (NASB)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] For I joyfully concur with the law of God in the inner man,
[SUP]23 [/SUP] but I see a different law in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin which is in my members.
The law of sin is in the flesh which in the members of his body.
old man = old self before being born-again ( The power of sin in the flesh made the old man a sinner )
Flesh ( where the power of sin resides ) in body = yes
New Man = new self in Christ
Flesh in body = yes
The flesh in the body has stayed in us while the old man died and the new man came in Christ.
So, now we walk after the Spirit ( the new man ) or we can walk after the flesh ( which in our body still as it was before we were born again)
Again this is where understanding circumcision of the new man of the hear comes in. It's also called ion scripture the circumcision of the flesh and the circumcision of Christ..which is 2 sides of the same coin.
God cut away our inner man from the flesh and sealed our inner man in the Holy Spirit.
God left the power of sin in the flesh so that we would have to rely on Him totally!..much like He left the giants in the promised land so that they would have to depend on Him. The promised land is a type of "resting in Christ".
Romans 7:18 (NASB)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not.
Romans 7:22-23 (NASB)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] For I joyfully concur with the law of God in the inner man,
[SUP]23 [/SUP] but I see a different law in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin which is in my members.
The law of sin is in the flesh which in the members of his body.
old man = old self before being born-again ( The power of sin in the flesh made the old man a sinner )
Flesh ( where the power of sin resides ) in body = yes
New Man = new self in Christ
Flesh in body = yes
The flesh in the body has stayed in us while the old man died and the new man came in Christ.
So, now we walk after the Spirit ( the new man ) or we can walk after the flesh ( which in our body still as it was before we were born again)
Again this is where understanding circumcision of the new man of the hear comes in. It's also called ion scripture the circumcision of the flesh and the circumcision of Christ..which is 2 sides of the same coin.
God cut away our inner man from the flesh and sealed our inner man in the Holy Spirit.
God left the power of sin in the flesh so that we would have to rely on Him totally!..much like He left the giants in the promised land so that they would have to depend on Him. The promised land is a type of "resting in Christ".
Again you are "reading" stuff into what is being said... the scriptures say that Abraham used self-effort to "try" to get the promises of God to be done.
We pray and go out of our way to do something for others from the life of Christ that is flowing out of us....all the works of God flow from us...they originate in Him amd flow out of us...not we do them on our own.
Did you ever notice that the people that said Lord, Lord..did all these good works...the same works as the apostles?
Both had good works..one group it was THEM doing the good works
The other group was the Lord working with them the good works
Both had the same outward works..one was from God the other was from themselves...
There is a vast difference although outwardly they look the same.
We pray and go out of our way to do something for others from the life of Christ that is flowing out of us....all the works of God flow from us...they originate in Him amd flow out of us...not we do them on our own.
Did you ever notice that the people that said Lord, Lord..did all these good works...the same works as the apostles?
Both had good works..one group it was THEM doing the good works
The other group was the Lord working with them the good works
Both had the same outward works..one was from God the other was from themselves...
There is a vast difference although outwardly they look the same.
What Christian has not walked after the flesh?..LOL +holding my hand up high+ I have!!!
Paul says that he joyfully concurs with the law of God in the inner man. That is a Christian with a new heart. The new creation in Christ. No sinner "joyfully concurs with the law of God in their inner man )..lol..they want to sin all they want and don't even think about it...thye joyfully consur with sinninas much as they can!..it's their nature..the old man in them!
Paul says that he joyfully concurs with the law of God in the inner man. That is a Christian with a new heart. The new creation in Christ. No sinner "joyfully concurs with the law of God in their inner man )..lol..they want to sin all they want and don't even think about it...thye joyfully consur with sinninas much as they can!..it's their nature..the old man in them!
There's no question that Paul was referring to his life as a believer. He asked who would deliver him from his body of death, then thanked GOD for freeing him from the power of sin in his flesh, then said his mind (of Christ) served the law of GOD, but his carnal mind (flesh) served the law of sin.
Wretched man [that] I [am]! Who will rescue me from this body of death? But thanks [be] to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself with my mind am serving the law of God, but with my flesh [I am serving] the law of sin. Romans 7:24-25
In rom 6:16 Paul says if you are a slave to sin it leads to death
In rom 7:14 he states he is sold as a slave to sin. Therefore I he is speaking as a christian he is condemning himself according to 6:16
In 6:14 he states sin shall not be your master for you ate not under law but under grace. In 7:14-25 sin was definitely Paul's master. I could go on and on
There is a huge difference between perfection and the state Paul was in, in 7:14-25. The christian who understands grace should be between the two if they are not a new christian
However, people who believe they must crucify their own flesh will relate to the Paul of 7:14-25 therefore they must believe he is speaking as a christian in those verses( I don't mean you)
In rom 7:14 he states he is sold as a slave to sin. Therefore I he is speaking as a christian he is condemning himself according to 6:16
In 6:14 he states sin shall not be your master for you ate not under law but under grace. In 7:14-25 sin was definitely Paul's master. I could go on and on
There is a huge difference between perfection and the state Paul was in, in 7:14-25. The christian who understands grace should be between the two if they are not a new christian
However, people who believe they must crucify their own flesh will relate to the Paul of 7:14-25 therefore they must believe he is speaking as a christian in those verses( I don't mean you)
In rom 6:16 Paul states if you ard a slave to sin it leads to death. In 7:14 he states he is sold as a slave of sin. He is condemning himself if he is speaking as a christian. If he is sold as a slave to sin, sin must be his master. Yet in 6:14 he states sin shall NOT be your master for you are not under law but under grace
Come on heftd.
Come on heftd.
Amen! Preach it!!
I love the very next verse...how does God deliver us from this mess?
1) There is no condemnation for those in Christ....(hyper-grace alert!)
2)..then he tells about the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set us free from the law of sin and death
3) walk after the spirit..our new nature in our inner man where the Holy Spirit is...then we will not give in to the lusts of that pesky flesh which is in our body
Ever notice it is the "works" of the flesh..stuff we do
It's the fruit of the spirit ( life flowing naturally out of us )
I love the very next verse...how does God deliver us from this mess?
1) There is no condemnation for those in Christ....(hyper-grace alert!)
2)..then he tells about the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set us free from the law of sin and death
3) walk after the spirit..our new nature in our inner man where the Holy Spirit is...then we will not give in to the lusts of that pesky flesh which is in our body
Ever notice it is the "works" of the flesh..stuff we do
It's the fruit of the spirit ( life flowing naturally out of us )
Paul recognized we have dual nature. If you obey one you die, if you obey the other you live. Simple. Unbelievers do not have this dual nature so they can only be slaves of sin. We have the choice of who we serve.
I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, [that] I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live: Deuteronomy 30:19
I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, [that] I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live: Deuteronomy 30:19
Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires, but those who live in accordance with the spirit have their minds set on what the spirit dezires.
The mind of sinful man is death but the mind controlled by the spirit is life and peach ch8:5&6
For if you live according to the sinful nature you will die ch8:13
In rom 7:14-25 Paul was sold as a slave to sin
He couldn't do the good he wanted to do, but what he hated he did
Paul has the desire to do what is good but he could not carry it out
Paul doesn't do the good he wants to do but the evil he does not want to do this he keeps on doing etc
Theres no way it aligns, however, I am sure you will find a way!!!!
The mind of sinful man is death but the mind controlled by the spirit is life and peach ch8:5&6
For if you live according to the sinful nature you will die ch8:13
In rom 7:14-25 Paul was sold as a slave to sin
He couldn't do the good he wanted to do, but what he hated he did
Paul has the desire to do what is good but he could not carry it out
Paul doesn't do the good he wants to do but the evil he does not want to do this he keeps on doing etc
Theres no way it aligns, however, I am sure you will find a way!!!!
You should be agreeing with me
Is there great power in the cross of Christ or not?
You keep quoting
Sin shall not be your master for you are not under law but under grace.
Paul plainly admits sin is his master n 7:14-25
It is perfectly understandable Tha people who believe they have to crucify their flesh by their own effort relate to the Paul of rom7:14-25, but you don't believe that lol.
Rom7:14-25 is out of sync with everything else Paul preached of the gospel message. Surely you can see that
Is there great power in the cross of Christ or not?
You keep quoting
Sin shall not be your master for you are not under law but under grace.
Paul plainly admits sin is his master n 7:14-25
It is perfectly understandable Tha people who believe they have to crucify their flesh by their own effort relate to the Paul of rom7:14-25, but you don't believe that lol.
Rom7:14-25 is out of sync with everything else Paul preached of the gospel message. Surely you can see that