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L
yeah
no it is not WOF
and btw, words do have power
read scripture...they most certainly do
if we positively reflect and allow minds to be saturated with the word of God and we reflect in our speech what the Bible states, we will have that outcome
but if we moan and groan like the Israelites in the desert, we may very well have that outcome
not sure we need to follow that rabbit down that hole in this thread...let's put the carrots away...you actually posted some decent stuff lately
no it is not WOF
and btw, words do have power
read scripture...they most certainly do
if we positively reflect and allow minds to be saturated with the word of God and we reflect in our speech what the Bible states, we will have that outcome
but if we moan and groan like the Israelites in the desert, we may very well have that outcome
not sure we need to follow that rabbit down that hole in this thread...let's put the carrots away...you actually posted some decent stuff lately
I will have to trust you Willie when you say that Vineyard is nowhere near being WOF. In my experience any church can go off the rails. I have no problem with Vineyard Church's per say but there may be some which have gone a bit wrong. However I can think of when an Anglican Church I attended to veered off course badly and had a huge impact on members, spiritual. Don't question anything, just accept, no love or compassion everyone there just for the experience. It caused huge pain. I moved on to somewhere where scripture was faithfully taught, I could grown and contribute.
It appears you are right. I am sorry. I found this testimony of someone who had come
out of a vineyard group which is illuminating
The Cults and the Charismatic Church
"end-time elitism, Apostolic restoration, mysticism, exaltation of the prophetic and revelatory word, mindless acquiescence to prophetic leadership and directives, marginalization of Scripture, to name but a few."
My contact with the group seemed similar in many ways, but I have not been that interested.
I suppose the "magic wand approach" still applies in or outside "WOF"
Even in traditional evangelical circles, things going well, God blessing,
things going badly, sin present and judgement happening.
So I humbly apologize for darkening the name of vineyard with WOF.
I suppose I should have said Latter Rain and Kingdom domination theology.
Not sure that is actually any better, ho hum...
out of a vineyard group which is illuminating
The Cults and the Charismatic Church
"end-time elitism, Apostolic restoration, mysticism, exaltation of the prophetic and revelatory word, mindless acquiescence to prophetic leadership and directives, marginalization of Scripture, to name but a few."
My contact with the group seemed similar in many ways, but I have not been that interested.
I suppose the "magic wand approach" still applies in or outside "WOF"
Even in traditional evangelical circles, things going well, God blessing,
things going badly, sin present and judgement happening.
So I humbly apologize for darkening the name of vineyard with WOF.
I suppose I should have said Latter Rain and Kingdom domination theology.
Not sure that is actually any better, ho hum...
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From Wikipedia
The Association of Vineyard Churches, also known as the Vineyard Movement, is a nondenominational Christianity evangelical Christian denomination[SUP][2][/SUP] with over 1,500 affiliated churches worldwide.[SUP][1][/SUP]
The Vineyard Movement is rooted in the charismatic renewal and historic evangelicalism. Instead of the mainstream charismatic label, however, the movement has preferred the term Empowered Evangelicals (a term coined by Rich Nathan and Ken Wilson in their book of the same name) to reflect their roots in traditional evangelicalism as opposed to classical Pentecostalism. Members also sometimes describe themselves as the "radical middle" between evangelicals and Pentecostals, which is a reference to the book The Quest for the Radical Middle, a historical survey of the Vineyard by Bill Jackson.
It has been associated with the "Signs and Wonders" movement,[SUP][3][/SUP][SUP]:199[/SUP]the Toronto blessing,[SUP][3][/SUP][SUP]:222[/SUP] the Kansas City Prophets[SUP][3][/SUP][SUP]:160[/SUP] and a particular style of Christian worship music.[SUP][3][/SUP][SUP]:212
[/SUP]
The Association of Vineyard Churches, also known as the Vineyard Movement, is a nondenominational Christianity evangelical Christian denomination[SUP][2][/SUP] with over 1,500 affiliated churches worldwide.[SUP][1][/SUP]
The Vineyard Movement is rooted in the charismatic renewal and historic evangelicalism. Instead of the mainstream charismatic label, however, the movement has preferred the term Empowered Evangelicals (a term coined by Rich Nathan and Ken Wilson in their book of the same name) to reflect their roots in traditional evangelicalism as opposed to classical Pentecostalism. Members also sometimes describe themselves as the "radical middle" between evangelicals and Pentecostals, which is a reference to the book The Quest for the Radical Middle, a historical survey of the Vineyard by Bill Jackson.
It has been associated with the "Signs and Wonders" movement,[SUP][3][/SUP][SUP]:199[/SUP]the Toronto blessing,[SUP][3][/SUP][SUP]:222[/SUP] the Kansas City Prophets[SUP][3][/SUP][SUP]:160[/SUP] and a particular style of Christian worship music.[SUP][3][/SUP][SUP]:212
[/SUP]
No, neither of those, either. Rather than just going about guessing, why not look them up and see what they actually say? That is what I did before I ever even knew there was such a thing as The Vineyard.
I read numerous idiots claiming they were a cult. So I went online to their own site to find out the truth. Turns out they believed almost identically to the way I read the Bible. It was not long until they were our church home.
In the last five years, we have seen refugees from several other denominations we attended (people we used to know personally) who have begun attending there. This particular building seems to be a place where people who are fed up with Religion end up and come alive again.
I read numerous idiots claiming they were a cult. So I went online to their own site to find out the truth. Turns out they believed almost identically to the way I read the Bible. It was not long until they were our church home.
In the last five years, we have seen refugees from several other denominations we attended (people we used to know personally) who have begun attending there. This particular building seems to be a place where people who are fed up with Religion end up and come alive again.
To get back to my focus, an open heart, I am not sure if you want to walk
with the Lord you can without opening up your heart.
"I began by confessing all my sins that I was aware of and repenting of them, asking Him to forgive me and help me to change. I confessed especially my sin of unbelief and rebellion by not trusting Him to direct my life. I repented of my fear of what He may do with my life, and I handed my life fully over to Him, asking Him to come and be the Lord of my life and take charge completely." Taken from website The Cults and the Charismatic Church
What stood out to me, was these spiritual realities were neither preached or focused
on as important in the fellowships this man had attended.
Now these prayers occur in every church and every situation, but I get the feeling
some are in strong rebellion against the principles.
But without this foundation, what is the point of counselling or praying for healing,
because the framework will not work.
This is my view and insight into why people do not find spiritual reality or peace over
seem deep wounds and scars in their life.
with the Lord you can without opening up your heart.
"I began by confessing all my sins that I was aware of and repenting of them, asking Him to forgive me and help me to change. I confessed especially my sin of unbelief and rebellion by not trusting Him to direct my life. I repented of my fear of what He may do with my life, and I handed my life fully over to Him, asking Him to come and be the Lord of my life and take charge completely." Taken from website The Cults and the Charismatic Church
What stood out to me, was these spiritual realities were neither preached or focused
on as important in the fellowships this man had attended.
Now these prayers occur in every church and every situation, but I get the feeling
some are in strong rebellion against the principles.
But without this foundation, what is the point of counselling or praying for healing,
because the framework will not work.
This is my view and insight into why people do not find spiritual reality or peace over
seem deep wounds and scars in their life.