Not By Works

[PeterJens]

Ministry is worthy of reward

Who serves as a soldier at his own expense? Who plants a vineyard and does not eat its grapes? Who tends a flock and does not drink the milk? 8 Do I say this merely on human authority? Doesn’t the Law say the same thing? 9 For it is written in the Law of Moses: “Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.” Is it about oxen that God is concerned? 10 Surely he says this for us, doesn’t he? Yes, this was written for us, because whoever plows and threshes should be able to do so in the hope of sharing in the harvest. 11 If we have sown spiritual seed among you, is it too much if we reap a material harvest from you? 12 If others have this right of support from you, shouldn’t we have it all the more?
1 Cor 9:7-12

 

[PeterJens]

I get the feeling people dislike organised fellowships.

But we are the body of Christ, gifted by the Holy Spirit to minister to one another.
If we live in isolation we cannot exercise this gifting and learn how to love and
bear each others burdens.

But maybe the reason why you are here is because you do not get on in fellowships
with normal people.

 

[Grace777x70]

I personally love to gather with those that have like-minded faith in what the Lord Jesus Christ has already done on the cross and resurrection. We can encourage each other in the Lord and the gift that is in them as their part of the body needs to function so that we all can grow up in Him.

Ephesians 4:14-16 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] As a result, we are no longer to be children, tossed here and there by waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, by craftiness in deceitful scheming;

[SUP]15 [/SUP] but speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in all aspects into Him who is the head, even Christ,

[SUP]16 [/SUP] from whom the whole body, being fitted and held together by what every joint supplies, according to the proper working of each individual part, causes the growth of the body for the building up of itself in love.


2 Corinthians 13:11 (NASB)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Finally, brethren, rejoice, be made complete, be comforted, be like-minded, live in peace; and the God of love and peace will be with you.

 

[Ariel82]

◄ Matthew 6:1 ►
New International Version
"Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven.

New Living Translation
"Watch out! Don't do your good deeds publicly, to be admired by others, for you will lose the reward from your Father in heaven.

English Standard Version
“Beware of practicing your righteousness before other people in order to be seen by them, for then you will have no reward from your Father who is in heaven.

Berean Study Bible
Be careful not to perform your righteous acts before men to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven.

Berean Literal Bible
And beware not to do your righteousness before men in order to be seen by them. Otherwise you have no reward in the presence of your Father in the heavens.

New American Standard Bible
"Beware of practicing your righteousness before men to be noticed by them; otherwise you have no reward with your Father who is in heaven.

King James Bible
Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.

 

[dcontroversal]

AMEN......I agree and have no issue with it either....

I personally love to gather with those that have like-minded faith in what the Lord Jesus Christ has already done on the cross and resurrection. We can encourage each other in the Lord and the gift that is in them as their part of the body needs to function so that we all can grow up in Him.

Ephesians 4:14-16 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] As a result, we are no longer to be children, tossed here and there by waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, by craftiness in deceitful scheming;

[SUP]15 [/SUP] but speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in all aspects into Him who is the head, even Christ,

[SUP]16 [/SUP] from whom the whole body, being fitted and held together by what every joint supplies, according to the proper working of each individual part, causes the growth of the body for the building up of itself in love.


2 Corinthians 13:11 (NASB)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Finally, brethren, rejoice, be made complete, be comforted, be like-minded, live in peace; and the God of love and peace will be with you.

 

[dcontroversal]

I get the feeling people dislike organised fellowships.

But we are the body of Christ, gifted by the Holy Spirit to minister to one another.
If we live in isolation we cannot exercise this gifting and learn how to love and
bear each others burdens.

But maybe the reason why you are here is because you do not get on in fellowships
with normal people.

A two way street pal.....and could the same thing be said about you?

 

[dcontroversal]

In Him we have redemption - the forgiveness of sins - because of His blood. Eph. 1:7 & Col. 1:6

We can either believe the gospel of the grace of God in the Lord Jesus Christ or live by our humanistic mindset beliefs that are from this world and the religion of Christianity that we create from man's carnal mind.

View attachment 170956

Thank God for the buy back that is found in Christ....eternally bought back (redeemed)!!

 

[willybob]

it’s more than obvious that man cannot save himself, for only God can forgive past sins, however he is commanded to do works worthy of salvation. The very first work is repentance and obedience to the truth…. Hence salvation comes after repentance, whereas the rebellion has ceased. We are then commanded (not a suggestion) to bring forth works that prove our repentance, such as these doers of righteousness are known as the “worthy” in the NT, of whom endure to the end and are found worthy to wear white robes, not filthy-rags…Jesus said to the obedient servants at Ephesus, that He knew of their good works, and had discerned the false prophets among them and found them to be liars, and they hated the religious works of the pagan Clergy-laity system, of the which Jesus had previously told His disciples that it shall not be so among you.However, they had fallen into sin, and Jesus told them to go back and do their first works of repentance, lest heir candlestick be not removed (removed from the book of life)….. what many do not understand is the fact that Jesus, an UNSPOTTED VOLUNTARY SIN OFFERING, died on our behalf, not in our place…..the flesh hates this truth, and will fight against it tooth and nail

 

[dcontroversal]

it’s more than obvious that man cannot save himself, for only God can forgive past sins, however he is commanded to do works worthy of salvation. The very first work is repentance and obedience to the truth…. Hence salvation comes after repentance, whereas the rebellion has ceased. We are then commanded (not a suggestion) to bring forth works that prove our repentance, such as these doers of righteousness are known as the “worthy” in the NT, of whom endure to the end and are found worthy to wear white robes, not filthy-rags…Jesus said to the obedient servants at Ephesus, that He knew of their good works, and had discerned the false prophets among them and found them to be liars, and they hated the religious works of the pagan Clergy-laity system, of the which Jesus had previously told His disciples that it shall not be so among you.However, they had fallen into sin, and Jesus told them to go back and do their first works of repentance, lest heir candlestick be not removed (removed from the book of life)….. what many do not understand is the fact that Jesus, an UNSPOTTED VOLUNTARY SIN OFFERING, died on our behalf, not in our place…..the flesh hates this truth, and will fight against it tooth and nail

The candlestick had zero to do with the salvation of each member of that church, but was indicative of them losing their collective authority as a New Testament church.....not everything is about salvation...geesh....do you even pay attention to context?

 

[willybob]

◄ Matthew 6:1 ►
New International Version
"Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven.

New Living Translation
"Watch out! Don't do your good deeds publicly, to be admired by others, for you will lose the reward from your Father in heaven.

English Standard Version
“Beware of practicing your righteousness before other people in order to be seen by them, for then you will have no reward from your Father who is in heaven.

Berean Study Bible
Be careful not to perform your righteous acts before men to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven.

Berean Literal Bible
And beware not to do your righteousness before men in order to be seen by them. Otherwise you have no reward in the presence of your Father in the heavens.

New American Standard Bible
"Beware of practicing your righteousness before men to be noticed by them; otherwise you have no reward with your Father who is in heaven.

King James Bible
Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.

Jesus was speaking to religious hypocrites still in sin, who thought that by following ceremonial ordinances of Moses (religious works) somehow made them righteous before God...Paul told the multitudes to sometimes listen to what they say, but not to do what they do...

 

[Grace777x70]

The candlestick had zero to do with the salvation of each member of that church, but was indicative of them losing their collective authority as a New testament church.....not everything is about salvation...geesh....do you even pay attention to context?

I agree...the candlestick is definitely the whole church that was there which represented their witness of the light of Him.

Revelation 1:20 (KJV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.

 

[willybob]

The candlestick had zero to do with the salvation of each member of that church, but was indicative of them losing their collective authority as a New Testament church.....not everything is about salvation...geesh....do you even pay attention to context?

like i said; those that walk after the flesh hate this message, and will argue in favour of sin at all cost..
l

 

[PeterJens]

A two way street pal.....and could the same thing be said about you?

The point I was making was not a dig but a reality check.
Unless love is real between people it is easy to dream alone on the internet with
a few buddies who actually are very different in real life than their personas on
the forum, lol But then it is in real life that the emotions have to actually
work and losing it has real consequences, and I am sure based on how people
cannot hold it in in just a discussion it is not very pleasant when it becomes
real with no way of hiding it.

 

[dcontroversal]

like i said; those that walk after the flesh hate this message, and will argue in favour of sin at all cost..
l

Like I said, you reject context and make everything about salvation when it is not.....it speaks to their authority and I love the truth it sets forth....and now your just a deceptive, quote me where I argued in favor of sin!

 

[Ariel82]

1st work is faith in Jesus unto salvation.

You aren't saved by repentance and obedience...,you are saved by faith....obedience follows.

 

[Ariel82]

Jesus was speaking to religious hypocrites still in sin, who thought that by following ceremonial ordinances of Moses (religious works) somehow made them righteous before God...Paul told the multitudes to sometimes listen to what they say, but not to do what they do...

No he was speaking TO HIS DISCIPLES...

◄ Matthew 6 ►
New American Standard Bible

1“Beware of practicing your righteousness before men to be noticed by them; otherwise you have no reward with your Father who is in heaven.
2“So when you give to the poor, do not sound a trumpet before you, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, so that they may be honored by men. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full. 3“But when you give to the poor, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, 4so that your giving will be in secret; and your Father who sees what is done in secret will reward you.

 

[Meggido]

Jesus was speaking to religious hypocrites still in sin, who thought that by following ceremonial ordinances of Moses (religious works) somehow made them righteous before God...Paul told the multitudes to sometimes listen to what they say, but not to do what they do...

You need a V8 head slap

 

[Calmador]

What is your point?

The context of JAMES is men being able to see the invisible faith that saves "SHOW ME"

The context of Romans is FAITH alone is what saves VOID of works "Justified by faith without the deeds of the law-->works"

And the thief on the cross contradicts your first statement.....LORD remember me when you come into your kingdom.....

My point is just that faith is not a work.

Otherwise, it's impossible for faith to save us in the biblical context, like you described. I agree with the idea that faith in Christ saves you without works.

But, if faith was a work... then you'd be saved by a work.

That's why I'm saying faith is not a work.

 

[willybob]

Like I said, you reject context and make everything about salvation when it is not.....it speaks to their authority and I love the truth it sets forth....and now your just a deceptive, quote me where I argued in favor of sin!

If one loves the word he/she will come to the light, in that the commandments of God are not grievous to the soul, but if he/she loves darkness the commandments of God become a burden to their soul, because through pride and intellectual conceit he/she fights against obedience to the truth. Therefore, like Pharisees, they compare themselves, among themselves, for themselves (perceiving strength in numbers) . Knowing this first; if they don’t want to deal with the whole council of God they are not in the gospel anyway, but have a form of godliness denying the power (grace) therein..Through much suffering (dying to the lusts of the flesh in repentance) does one cease from sin.. 1 Peter 4-1

 

[willybob]

My point is just that faith is not a work.

Otherwise, it's impossible for faith to save us in the biblical context, like you described. I agree with the idea that faith in Christ saves you without works.

But, if faith was a work... then you'd be saved by a work.

That's why I'm saying faith is not a work.

The biblical definition of faith is steadfast faithfulness to God's commands from heart purity. if that is not works, then what is it? Paul said six times in the text that religious works cannot save you "ie" the works of the law". He wasn't speaking of works of faith in that context. (big difference) Abraham did the works of faith and it was accounted to him as righteous..Salvation is a two fold dynamic (man working to gather with God to achieve a relationship of love that cannot be achieved by any other means. 1) man humbles himself, repents, and ends his rebellious ways, coupled with 2) Gods' mercy and forgiveness, In other words, its like the apostle Paul said "we are saved by grace (Gods part), through faith (man's part) Eph. 3-8...Notwithstanding, only God can forgive past sins through His mercy, and dispense the empowerment of the Spirit (grace) to live godly, righteously, and of a sober mind in this present world...