Not By Works

[Stephen63]

The transformation of the mind comes by the WORD of God...obviously you know we get the word metamorphis from the Greek word translated transformed....a steady diet of the word of God will grow and mature the spieit we bave that has been born of God (of incorruptable seed) combined with the lead, guide, conviction and enlightment of the Spirit of God.

Well said.

It's this part (blue) that some of certain beliefs cannot accomplish.

Their first mistake is they believe there's no more conviction after accepting Christ. Conviction does two things, first convicting us of sin as we put off the old man & his deeds, & secondly, convicting us of righteousness to promote spiritual maturity as we put on the new man made in the image of Christ.

Their first mistake leads them to their second one: no repentance after conversion.

True repentance brings change. We become sorry for our sins & our will changes to want to perform God's will, & not ours.

Yet without these two active in their lives, they will claim the Holy Spirit promotes change in their lives, while tying His hands so he can't convict & lead to repentance & maturity.

It's a catch-22.

So far, the only response I received to that predicament is that grace changes us without our intervention into full maturity.

My question to this is, "If God does everything perfectly, why aren't we all perfect then?"

And just as I expected, no answer.

It's like every time you catch a glitch in their doctrine, they patch it with a quick excuse.

But if it were true doctrine, God's doctrine, it wouldn't need patching.

To this day, I cannot get them to answer me how they can mature without conviction & repentance.

It's this huge hole in their doctrine, proving it to be false.

 

[Ariel82]

Perhaps you're searching for something very rare, & it's emotionally draining to feel like searching in vain.

You know like a gold miner desperately searching only to discover fool's gold..... only a "form" of the real thing.

I have often been caught up into such "fool's gold debates" that are absolutely worthless..... wasting days at a time on vanity & vexation of spirit.

I may not be able to comfort you, just showing you you're not alone.

I would rather be God's fool than the richest Wiseman on this earth.

We can mine for gold or we can just set it all on fire and see who gets caught up and who remains true.

What I don't understand is why people always talk about hellfire and not God's refining fire?

*****
Galatians 6

6 My friends, you are spiritual. So if someone is trapped in sin, you should gently lead that person back to the right path. But watch out, and don’t be tempted yourself. 2 You obey the law of Christ when you offer each other a helping hand.

3 If you think you are better than others, when you really aren’t, you are wrong. 4 Do your own work well, and then you will have something to be proud of. But don’t compare yourself with others. 5 We each must carry our own load.

6 Share every good thing you have with anyone who teaches you what God has said.

7 You cannot fool God, so don’t make a fool of yourself! You will harvest what you plant. 8 If you follow your selfish desires, you will harvest destruction, but if you follow the Spirit, you will harvest eternal life. 9 Don’t get tired of helping others. You will be rewarded when the time is right, if you don’t give up. 10 We should help people whenever we can, especially if they are followers of the Lord.

*****

1 Peter 1:7
so that the proof of your faith, being more precious than gold which is perishable, even though tested by fire, may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ;

****

Revelation 3:18
I advise you to buy from Me gold refined by fire so that you may become rich, and white garments so that you may clothe yourself, and that the shame of your nakedness will not be revealed; and eye salve to anoint your eyes so that you may see.
****

 

[Ariel82]

Well said.

It's this part (blue) that some of certain beliefs cannot accomplish.

Their first mistake is they believe there's no more conviction after accepting Christ. Conviction does two things, first convicting us of sin as we put off the old man & his deeds, & secondly, convicting us of righteousness to promote spiritual maturity as we put on the new man made in the image of Christ.

Their first mistake leads them to their second one: no repentance after conversion.

True repentance brings change. We become sorry for our sins & our will changes to want to perform God's will, & not ours.

Yet without these two active in their lives, they will claim the Holy Spirit promotes change in their lives, while tying His hands so he can't convict & lead to repentance & maturity.

It's a catch-22.

So far, the only response I received to that predicament is that grace changes us without our intervention into full maturity.

My question to this is, "If God does everything perfectly, why aren't we all perfect then?"

And just as I expected, no answer.

It's like every time you catch a glitch in their doctrine, they patch it with a quick excuse.

But if it were true doctrine, God's doctrine, it wouldn't need patching.

To this day, I cannot get them to answer me how they can mature without conviction & repentance.

It's this huge hole in their doctrine, proving it to be false.

I have found that G777 talks about different types of grace and takes away from the Holy spirit ministry the conviction of sins and the repentance when we sin and instead renamed concepts which seem very similar to what the Bible says and if you jump through hoops says basically the same thing...maybe...but I don't get the need to jump through hoops.

The bible uses the word "convict" and yes it doesn't mean like a criminal to be punished but more like a child to be taught right and wrong.

I feel that if people want to use the word "convict" it should be understood in the same sense as the word "correct" or "chastens."

Some folks need to get over their negative association with the Word and learn its biblical application.

I want to know if people still call sin sin?

Does the Holy spirit chastens you when you sin?

Does He correct you when you do wrong or does he go like a parent who thinks their precious hellion can do no wrong and make excuses for you?

Satan makes excuses for sin.

God calls it out and tells people to REPENT OF THEIR SINS and turn back to Him.

What is the punishment for NOT LISTENING to God's chastensment?

If you are His child, he will throw you into a refining fire to try you and burn off all the lies you tell yourself.

If you are not, the world will consume you and eventually God will stop sending prpphets to speak into your life and you will be tossed into hell.

Will the Rock break you or crush you?

Anyway those are the questions I ponder and wonder if anyone will answer truthfully.

 

[Stephen63]

What I don't understand is why people always talk about hellfire and not God's refining fire?

That actually has a simple answer to it, Ariel.

1. Refining fire means having the heat applied to them, demanding change. Refining takes a lot out of them, stripping them of the worldly things they love.
2. As a result, they won't talk about something biblical that exposes their fruitlessness.

3. Such people want a "quick fix", because they're hooked on excitement instead of holiness.

Their doctrine is the "new" replacement doctrine..... replacing everything that demands change in a believer to something that's "easy" to believe, requiring nothing.

 

[Ariel82]

Hi Desertsrose,

I agree with this principle except for the need to confess sins in order to be righteous once we have received the gift of righteousness when we hear the gospel message of Christ. Christ alone is our righteousness and there are tons of scriptures that speak to that truth.

Also the "sap" is the life of Christ which is in us by means of the Holy Spirit.....

There is two types of righteousness.

Luther speaks of it...alien righteousness which is Christ imputed righteousness on us and our own proper righteousness which can only happen after we receive Christ righteousness.

However our proper righteousness is established by walking with the Holy spirit and learning to live godly lives.

It's an important part of becoming rootted in Christ and mature ....The milk is knowing our breastplare is Christ righteousness upon us..5he meat is learning how to have our own proper righteousness by walking with God and doing the good works He prepared for us to do.

Martin Luther: Two Kinds of Righteousness

[6] The second kind of righteousness is our proper righteousness, not because we alone work it, but because we work with that first and alien righteousness. This is that manner of life spent profitably in good works, in the first place, in slaying the flesh and crucifying the desires with respect to the self, of which we read in Gal. 5:24, “And those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.” In the second place, this righteousness consists in love to one’s neighbor, and in the third place, in meekness and fear towards God. The Apostle is full of references to these, as is all the rest of Scripture. He briefly summarizes everything, however, in Titus 2:12, “ In this world let us live soberly (pertaining to crucifying one’s own flesh), justly (referring to one’s neighbor), and devoutly (relating to God).”
[7] This righteousness is the product of the righteousness of the first type, actually its fruit and consequence, for we read in Gal. 5:22, “But the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.”

What is this "sap" which you call the life of Christ in us?

It sounds too mystical.

Jesus does live in us through the Holy spirit.

We live our lives to glorify God.

The "sap" is the Holy spirit itself that teaches us. The holy spirit empowers us.

Being who God made us in Christ is totally different than telling people to BE CHRIST.

It's just too New Age. So if you could explain what you mean by "life of Christ in us" and how that is Biblical and how that works in a practical sense, that would be great.

 

[Stephen63]

I have found that G777 talks about different types of grace and takes away from the Holy spirit ministry the conviction of sins and the repentance when we sin and instead renamed concepts which seem very similar to what the Bible says and if you jump through hoops says basically the same thing...maybe...but I don't get the need to jump through hoops.

The bible uses the word "convict" and yes it doesn't mean like a criminal to be punished but more like a child to be taught right and wrong.

I feel that if people want to use the word "convict" it should be understood in the same sense as the word "correct" or "chastens."

Some folks need to get over their negative association with the Word and learn its biblical application.

I want to know if people still call sin sin?

Does the Holy spirit chastens you when you sin?

Does He correct you when you do wrong or does he go like a parent who thinks their precious hellion can do no wrong and make excuses for you?

Satan makes excuses for sin.

God calls it out and tells people to REPENT OF THEIR SINS and turn back to Him.

What is the punishment for NOT LISTENING to God's chastensment?

If you are His child, he will throw you into a refining fire to try you and burn off all the lies you tell yourself.

If you are not, the world will consume you and eventually God will stop sending prpphets to speak into your life and you will be tossed into hell.

Will the Rock break you or crush you?

Anyway those are the questions I ponder and wonder if anyone will answer truthfully.

His definitions of everything in christian beliefs are much less than the true article, with grace as the exception, being waaay over the top..... a true sign of a cult.

 

[Grace777x70]

There is two types of righteousness.

Luther speaks of it...alien righteousness which is Christ imputed righteousness on us and our own proper righteousness which can only happen after we receive Christ righteousness.

However our proper righteousness is established by walking with the Holy spirit and learning to live godly lives.

It's an important part of becoming rootted in Christ and mature ....The milk is knowing our breastplare is Christ righteousness upon us..5he meat is learning how to have our own proper righteousness by walking with God and doing the good works He prepared for us to do.

Martin Luther: Two Kinds of Righteousness



What is this "sap" which you call the life of Christ in us?

It sounds too mystical.

Jesus does live in us through the Holy spirit.

We live our lives to glorify God.

The "sap" is the Holy spirit itself that teaches us. The holy spirit empowers us.

Being who God made us in Christ is totally different than telling people to BE CHRIST.

It's just too New Age. So if you could explain what you mean by "life of Christ in us" and how that is Biblical and how that works in a practical sense, that would be great.

There is no such thing as 2 kinds of righteousness - other than one "you do" or the gift of righteousness.

In Hebrews 4:13 the mature know the "word of righteousness" which is to live by His righteousness and not our own. Get this backwards and you create a religion.

My goodness Ariel - using analogies is not New Age unless The Lord Jesus Himself was a New Ager too. He told the people to "look at the lilies of the valley, the birds of the air, how a seed grows..etc."

The "sap" was in reference to He is the Vine in John 15.

Is English your first language?

Without understanding the new creation in which has been created in righteousness and holiness - the true whole Christian life will seem to be "mystical" to our natural minds.

 

[Ariel82]

That actually has a simple answer to it, Ariel.

1. Refining fire means having the heat applied to them, demanding change. Refining takes a lot out of them, stripping them of the worldly things they love.
2. As a result, they won't talk about something biblical that exposes their fruitlessness.

3. Such people want a "quick fix", because they're hooked on excitement instead of holiness.

Their doctrine is the "new" replacement doctrine..... replacing everything that demands change in a believer to something that's "easy" to believe, requiring nothing.

I believe a more accurate summary is that some people believe that when anyone is born again, they are already changed and have pure spirit men that need to clothe themselves in Christ.....

Not sure what that really means.

I always believe that when we are born again we are not born as mature spirit beings but babies learning to take control of our minds and bodies to the glory of God..,,our first spiritual battlefield is our minds where we tear down the spiritual strongholds that war against God's wisdom, our next is learning self control of our minds and our bodies so that our bodies are worthy temples into the Lord.

We are not full grown and mature upon being born again...we don't have "spirit men" but spirit babies that grow into men and women of God.

While we are babies we are like slaves...when we learn self control, discernment between Good and evil and sound doctrine..after we learn how to use our spiritual gifts and armor and our ministry in the body of Christ...at that time in our lives We are called friends of God...before that point we are like slaves even though we are heirs.

 

[Grace777x70]

Some people have an evangelical anaphylaxis event in their minds when they hear that the Holy Spirit does not "convict" the believer of sins because we have been taught differently.

The Holy Spirit convicts/convinces the believer of the righteousness that is in us which indirectly points to the "works of the flesh" that we need to repent of ( change our minds on how we view them ).

For example things like malice and the slandering of others in the body of Christ.

His life that is in us because of righteousness causes the works of the flesh to drop off us as we "become" who we really are in Christ in our new man - the new creation.

This is "walking by the spirit" which will stop the flesh from fulfilling "it's" desires.

The word " convict/reprove/convince/expose" in question has many meanings attached to it as well.

It is only used 1 time in KJV as "convict"....it is used more often with the word "to reprove/rebuke/convince/expose"...the word needs to be looked at in the "context" that it is used...

It is a revealing of things.....to the world the Holy Spirit reveals/convinces/expose their sin of unbelief in Jesus..

To the believer He reveals/convinces/expose that they are the righteousness of Christ because He went to the Father to stand as an Advocate.

John 16:8-10 (NASB)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] "And He, when He comes, will convict the world ( unbelievers ) concerning sin and righteousness and judgment;

[SUP]9 [/SUP] concerning sin, because they ( unbelievers ) do not believe in Me;

[SUP]10 [/SUP] and concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father and you ( believers ) no longer see Me;

1 John 2:1-2 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous;

[SUP]2 [/SUP] and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.


Here are a few examples of the same exact word used in scripture...as one can clearly see....this word has many uses depending on the context.

1 Corinthians 14:24 (KJV)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all:

Titus 1:9 (KJV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.

Matthew 18:15 (KJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

John 8:46 (KJV)
[SUP]46 [/SUP] Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me?

So, we can clearly seen the Greek word translated once in the KJV as "convict" really means to expose, reveal, convince people of something.

 

[Ariel82]

There is no such thing as 2 kinds of righteousness - other than one "you do" or the gift of righteousness.

In Hebrews 4:13 the mature know the "word of righteousness" which is to live by His righteousness and not our own. Get this backwards and you create a religion.

My goodness Ariel - using analogies is not New Age unless The Lord Jesus Himself was a New Ager too. He told the people to "look at the lilies of the valley, the birds of the air, how a seed grows..etc."

The "sap" was in reference to He is the Vine in John 15.

Is English your first language?

Without understanding the new creation in which has been created in righteousness and holiness - the true whole Christian life will seem to be "mystical" to our natural minds.

You act like "religion" is a dirty word.

"Life of Christ in us" is not an analogy. What it sounds like is the Hindu concept of Arman or some type of "spiritual" possession of a spirit that calls itself Christ.I

t doesn't explain how the Holy spirit actually works in a belivers life. What does the Holy spirit chastens people of it not their sins?

I grew up bilingual and it's not my grasp of the English language that is lacking, it's your explanation of your term "life of Christ in us".

I understand the new creation, what I don't understand is what you believe happens when someone sins?

What I also don't understand is that you don't understand that the Bible talks of proper personal righteousness and the need to live godly lives.

 

[Grace777x70]

Here is the Holy Spirit's role in the Christian's life from the words of the Lord Jesus Christ. One can believe them or believe our church traditional teachings that say something else.

There is not one scripture that says the Holy Spirit convicts the believer of sin.

John 16:10 is very clear - He convicts/convinces the believer of their righteousness in Christ.


He is our teacher and brings to remembrance what the Lord has said to us.

John 14:26 (NASB)
[SUP]26 [/SUP] "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.

The Holy Spirit "testifies" of the things of Christ.

John 15:26 (NASB)
[SUP]26 [/SUP] "When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify about Me,

The Holy Spirit's role is to take the things of Christ and reveal them to us. - like His righteousness, his life we live by, His love we love with, His forgiveness that allows us to forgive...etc.

John 16:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] "He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you.

 

[Ariel82]

The Bible tells us to strive against sin..,, one truth does not deny another....yes we are clothed in Jesus righteousness but we must also learn to live godly lives and the Holy spirit chastens God's children when they SIN. Not just the sin of unbelief in Jesus (which was fixed when we confess Him as our Lord and Savior, which is the sin into death), but also of sins NOT into death.

Hebrews 12

4Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.

5And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:

6For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

7If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not? 8But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons. 9Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live? 10For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness. 11Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.

 

[Ariel82]

Here is the Holy Spirit's role in the Christian's life from the words of the Lord Jesus Christ. One can believe them or believe our church traditional teachings that say something else.

There is not one scripture that says the Holy Spirit convicts the believer of sin.

John 16:10 is very clear - He convicts/convinces the believer of their righteousness in Christ.


He is our teacher and brings to remembrance what the Lord has said to us.

John 14:26 (NASB)
[SUP]26 [/SUP] "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.

The Holy Spirit "testifies" of the things of Christ.

John 15:26 (NASB)
[SUP]26 [/SUP] "When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify about Me,

The Holy Spirit's role is to take the things of Christ and reveal them to us. - like His righteousness, his life we live by, His love we love with, His forgiveness that allows us to forgive...etc.

John 16:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] "He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you.

Yes you can follow Church traditions that God established as to how he grows and matures people in Him BY CHASTENING THEM WHEN THEY SIN AND TEACHING THEM TO LIVE GODLY LIVES...or you can join this new age movement that turns a blind eye to sin and just tells people how wonderful they are?

 

[Grace777x70]

You act like "religion" is a dirty word.

"Life of Christ in us" is not an analogy. What it sounds like is the Hindu concept of Arman or some type of "spiritual" possession of a spirit that calls itself Christ.I

t doesn't explain how the Holy spirit actually works in a belivers life. What does the Holy spirit chastens people of it not their sins?

I grew up bilingual and it's not my grasp of the English language that is lacking, it's your explanation of your term "life of Christ in us".

I understand the new creation, what I don't understand is what you believe happens when someone sins?

What I also don't understand is that you don't understand that the Bible talks of proper personal righteousness and the need to live godly lives.

That's nonsense Ariel - I have posted many times that the true Christian life lived by complete dependence on Christ's work of grace will produce a godly life.

The reason why I ask you if English is your first language is because one time I said "Take up shooting heroin and you will see destruction come to your life." Then you said to me - "Why are you trying to get people to shoot heroin?" There is a missive dis-connect there so I thought you don't have English as your first language because how in the world someone could get that out of my statement that I want people to shoot heroin was unthinkable unless they didn't understand the statement.

I have posted this many times and will do it again in the hope it'll help some viewers of the thread.

Sometimes people mis-interpret what is really being said and other times they deliberately mis-represent what is said too, so I will say this to hopefully stop both from occurring.

Here is what I do when I sin.

I love to kneel quickly and tell my Father how I trust in Him. How what I did was wrong.

Sometimes I use the word sin and sometimes I don't. I think that is irrelevant. I run to my Father and tell Him how that His Son is my Lord and is my life and my righteousness - that Jesus' Blood has secured my redemption and forgiveness of sins.

I confess what God says about me. I tell Him I love Him and trust in Him.

I have not asked for forgiveness in order to be forgiven or to be cleansed for quite some time now because I believe in what Christ has already done for me on the cross and resurrection....but I always talk with my Lord about what I do or don't do.

You know - He always loves on me and tells me He loves me and that He is my life and strength. Sometimes I have felt a warm liquid like feeling of pure love fall on me and I just sit there in His presence and weep. I can't move a muscle. He is so mighty in power yet His love and total acceptance is the most overwhelming aspect of His presence.


To me - all sin is relational. All sin is a failure to see the life of Christ in me. I am ignorant of His life in me. To me - most outward sin is just a "fruit" of the real sin.

For example - If I steal something - that is a sin but the real sin behind that is the failure to recognize my Father will take care of me. I am operating in the flesh. I want to take things into my own hand and "do" things.

The other part is when you see how horrid it really is when we mess up....sin....transgress.... whatever term you want to use.

..what I see is my unbelief in the goodness and love of my Father and Lord Jesus for me. That is the horrid part because I know that is not Their character nor is it really my true nature now and what He has made me in Christ.

 

[Grace777x70]

Yes you can follow Church traditions that God established as to how he grows and matures people in Him BY CHASTENING THEM WHEN THEY SIN AND TEACHING THEM TO LIVE GODLY LIVES...or you can join this new age movement that turns a blind eye to sin and just tells people how wonderful they are?

Nonsense again. I have said many times that the Father chastens His children. He doesn't do it like our earthy fathers. He does it by His word.

Look to Jesus and His earthly ministry and see how He chastised the disciples and you will see how the Father does us too.


It is not a "blind eye" to sin. It's in Beholding Christ and what He has done and believing that truth. Then it is standing in His armor.

 

[Ariel82]

Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness,
for they will be filled.
Matthew 5:6 |

Learn to do right; seek justice.
Defend the oppressed.
Take up the cause of the fatherless;
plead the case of the widow.
Isaiah 1:17 |

The wicked borrow and do not repay,
but the righteous give generously.
Psalm 37:21

No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it.
Hebrews 12:11

 

[Ariel82]

Nonsense again. I have said many times that the Father chastens His children. He doesn't do it like our earthy fathers. He does it by His word.

Look to Jesus and His earthly ministry and see how He chastised the disciples and you will see how the Father does us too.


It is not a "blind eye" to sin. It's in Beholding Christ and what He has done and believing that truth. Then it is standing in His armor.

Yet you say the holy spirit does NOT chasten people of sin, and I noticed that even in this post you avoid saying it.

The Gospels don't speak of how Jesus individually rebukes people of their sin. Jesus corrects doctrine.

Also I would hope those earthy fathers who follow Jesus, discpline their kids as God does.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

No actually it is a biblication of the 4 words mentioned as applied into all who believe.....
maybe you should set your cafe blend dogma down and open your eyes to the truth....!

hey bro, kind of hard for me to cal out one person for this and not all, know it becomes frustrating, but these do not help.

 

[UnderGrace]

..run with perseverance the race that is set before us, [SUP]2 [/SUP]looking to Jesus the pioneer and perfecter of our faith,
Hebrews 12

When does God need to chastise, when we look away from Jesus the perfecter of our faith, the warning is against rejecting God's grace.

Jesus is the remedy for sin

That's nonsense Ariel - I have posted many times that the true Christian life lived by complete dependence on Christ's work of grace will produce a godly life.

The reason why I ask you if English is your first language is because one time I said "Take up shooting heroin and you will see destruction come to your life." Then you said to me - "Why are you trying to get people to shoot heroin?" There is a missive dis-connect there so I thought you don't have English as your first language because how in the world someone could get that out of my statement that I want people to shoot heroin was unthinkable unless they didn't understand the statement.

I have posted this many times and will do it again in the hope it'll help some viewers of the thread.

Sometimes people mis-interpret what is really being said and other times they deliberately mis-represent what is said too, so I will say this to hopefully stop both from occurring.

Here is what I do when I sin.

I love to kneel quickly and tell my Father how I trust in Him. How what I did was wrong.

Sometimes I use the word sin and sometimes I don't. I think that is irrelevant. I run to my Father and tell Him how that His Son is my Lord and is my life and my righteousness - that Jesus' Blood has secured my redemption and forgiveness of sins.

I confess what God says about me. I tell Him I love Him and trust in Him.

I have not asked for forgiveness in order to be forgiven or to be cleansed for quite some time now because I believe in what Christ has already done for me on the cross and resurrection....but I always talk with my Lord about what I do or don't do.

You know - He always loves on me and tells me He loves me and that He is my life and strength. Sometimes I have felt a warm liquid like feeling of pure love fall on me and I just sit there in His presence and weep. I can't move a muscle. He is so mighty in power yet His love and total acceptance is the most overwhelming aspect of His presence.


To me - all sin is relational. All sin is a failure to see the life of Christ in me. I am ignorant of His life in me. To me - most outward sin is just a "fruit" of the real sin.

For example - If I steal something - that is a sin but the real sin behind that is the failure to recognize my Father will take care of me. I am operating in the flesh. I want to take things into my own hand and "do" things.

The other part is when you see how horrid it really is when we mess up....sin....transgress.... whatever term you want to use.

..what I see is my unbelief in the goodness and love of my Father and Lord Jesus for me. That is the horrid part because I know that is not Their character nor is it really my true nature now and what He has made me in Christ.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The more you talk the more you prove how blind you really are.....you really make me want to bring back the cake taker statement...I directly referenced what the bible states about lust and you tie it to salvation...get a life man and do not address me anymore if you cannot be honest concerning what I said!!

seems I have heard these words before decked at same user.