Galatian Conundrums

[tourist]

well yes

but of course, just as with Christians, there are various sects and groups

it is ironic that the mose blatant so called law followers are mostly Gentiles who seem to think that acting like an OT Jew will make them more holy or whatever

yes they believe Jesus is the Messiah

it occurs to me that we have Judaizers right up to this day and I am not speaking of circumcision

I mean those who want to ADD to salvation for bonus points or something or worse, they will tell you that Jesus blood is not enough and you must also be baptized or you are not saved or follow this law or that law or you are not saved or some other means to diminish the actual plan of God for our salvation

Paul learned the hard way that the grace of God is sufficient. I fully concur with your estimation.

 

[RickStudies]

Acts 2 really answers to peters understanding of the gospel of grace.(dbr)
6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.

7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?

8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?

9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia,

10 Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes,

11 Cretes and Arabians,


.......14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:


38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

Now this is roughly 50 days after Jesus ascention. (ahem,way before paul had ended his insane killing spree)

SO,WHAT WERE YOU SAYING ABOUT ONLY PAUL HAD THE REVELATION????

You haven`t a clue what you are talking about. Peter is preaching the kingdom that is coming. The rise of Israel, fulfillment of all of God`s promises to them. Gentiles not invited.

 

[Dino246]

You haven`t a clue what you are talking about. Peter is preaching the kingdom that is coming. The rise of Israel, fulfillment of all of God`s promises to them. Gentiles not invited.

Have you read Acts 10 and 11 lately?

 

[7seasrekeyed]

see that's the thing.

To miss it,that Jesus was after mankind is to walk up to a barn with a shotgun and pull both triggers and miss from 2 ft away.


In rev it says of those in the wrath of God under extreme torture "and still they would not repent"
To see that ,a mercy and grace so deep,and not be impressed is beyond me.
God is relentless in his pursuit of man.Not Jews or gentiles but MEN,WOMEN AND CHILDREN.

how can some things be so obvious and yet so missed

barns are pretty big

 

[RickStudies]

Have you read Acts 10 and 11 lately?

Have you? Acts 10 is about 10 years after Acts 2.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Wrong smiley.

That's a keeper. It's a man that's an airhead. Such a refreshing change from the usual female implications.

haha

I think that one went past a few people..

 

[7seasrekeyed]

sounds like you have a problem with John 4 that you need to address the Author about *shrug*

 

[Guojing]

scratching my head wondering how I have missed Jews saving people

Genesis 12:3, KJV: "And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed."

says absolutely nothing ^^^^^about Jews saving Samaritans or any other race

what it actually does say, is that God, not the Jews, is going to bless those who bless Abraham and curse those who curse him, Further, ALL the families of the earth will be bless through Abraham (at that time Abram).

the blessing of all the families is evident through salvation through Christ

Abrahamm's righteousness was by his faith and our righteousness is also by faith through Christ

there is only one gospel as the NT clearly indicates

this fragmenting of the Bible is nothing but confusion and teaching of demons IMO

like scripture states, DOCTRINES OF DEMONS.

If you don't considered salvation as a blessing, then you are splitting hair. I would regard salvation as the ultimate blessing a non Jew can get. Rahab and Ruth certainly benefited from getting that, thru the Jews.

As for your other point, the word gospel simply means good news.

The good news that was preached to Abraham was not the death burial and resurrection of Jesus, as Genesis 12 clearly stated.

When Jesus came to Earth to preach first to the lost sheep of Abraham, his message was "Repent and believe in me as the promised King, and there will be a kingdom on Earth."

 

[Guojing]

so what did He mean by go into all the world and preach THE (not half a dozen) gospel....

you know, I get irritated when I read such utter nonsense from people who appear to believe they have something of merit to add concerning scripture but instead create confusion for those who are possibly just learning or the gullible

for example, what Jesus said to his disciples...clearly clearly He did not mean for all time. it was the specific period during which He was on earth before His death and resurrection

otherwise, He would not ever have said GO INTO ALL THE WORLD

do you suppose the Creator did not know the actual size or population of the world?

actually, no, no one should accept your particular brand of misunderstanding

you should not be handling scripture and telling others to accept what you say

I am not telling others to accept what I am saying. I already stated that believing in this distinction is not necessary to be a Christian. You are fine if you don't accept it.

One point I would like to raise where the Bible translates the Greek into this term "all nations". May I suggest that the meaning is not exactly the same when we understood it in English.

Let me give you an example from Luke 2:1 KJV

And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that all the world should be taxed.

Young's version goes

And it came to pass in those days, there went forth a decree from Caesar Augustus, that all the world be enrolled

I am presenting a view that when we read "all the nations" in the Matthew version of the GC, it may not mean exactly what we think it means in the English. It could point towards "all the known Jews in the Roman Empire".

Of course, you could be correct, I am not denying that possibility. I am saying there could be another possible explanation, that every Jew at that time have a different idea from you about what preaching to "all nations" really meant.

 

[Guojing]

Why are you going back before peter repented?
He had a few crisis of faith,but it was he ,before Paul,that got the revelation of salvation to the gentiles.
Heck if you want to go back to some arbitrary point of disenfranchisement,we need not leave Paul out.
Paul was so screwed up he had believers tortured and killed.
So add Paul to your list of disillusioned men of God.

I am saying that JESUS preached his own DBR and others BEFORE PAUL understood it.

...not that any really understood it while the incarnate son of God walked his earthly ministry....But Jesus did. And so to say he preached outside his own understanding is silly.

Like I said, its alright if you don't want to accept this, it is not essential to do so to be a Christian. We already had this long debate before in the past here and I certainly have no interest to go thru the same points with you. God Bless.

https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...mission-irrelevant-for-the-church-now.182210/

 

[Dino246]

Have you?

Why would I ask if you had read a relevant passage of Scripture if I didn't know what it says?

 

[Absolutely]

Like I said, its alright if you don't want to accept this, it is not essential to do so to be a Christian. We already had this long debate before in the past here and I certainly have no interest to go thru the same points with you. God Bless.

https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...mission-irrelevant-for-the-church-now.182210/

I am showing you you are wrong.
Of course i wont accept it.

 

[RickStudies]

Why would I ask if you had read a relevant passage of Scripture if I didn't know what it says?

You don`t appear to.

 

[Guojing]

Have you? Acts 10 is about 10 years after Acts 2.

Interesting point you have there. Personally, I think by the time Acts 10 arrived, Peter was sensing in his heart that the Jewish nation was not going to ever accept Jesus as their Messiah, with the first martyr Stephen. Thus, the Great Commission that required them to start from Jerusalem was not going to ever be fulfilled by the 12.

And during the time of Acts 10 and 11, when he saw that God began to grant Gentiles salvation without them having to be circumcised like the Jews, he realized the time was indeed up for Israel. Hence he was able to defend Paul's ministry to the Gentiles by the time Acts 15 came along.

 

[Dino246]

You don`t appear to.

Okay, be like that. It only reflects on you.

 

[RickStudies]

Okay, be like that. It only reflects on you.

Like you or any of these others have any room to talk

 

[RickStudies]

Interesting point you have there. Personally, I think by the time Acts 10 arrived, Peter was sensing in his heart that the Jewish nation was not going to ever accept Jesus as their Messiah, with the first martyr Stephen. Thus, the Great Commission that required them to start from Jerusalem was not going to ever be fulfilled by the 12.

And during the time of Acts 10 and 11, when he saw that God began to grant Gentiles salvation without them having to be circumcised like the Jews, he realized the time was indeed up for Israel. Hence he was able to defend Paul's ministry to the Gentiles by the time Acts 15 came along.

The persecution in ACTS 8 is the event that closed the door for Israel.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Thus, the Great Commission that required them to start from Jerusalem was not going to ever be fulfilled by the 12.

That is incorrect, and the book of Acts shows the reverse. Jerusalem, Judea, and Samaria were covered by the apostles and their companions. Paul covered the Roman empire, and other apostles went to the uttermost parts of the earth.

 

[Guojing]

That is incorrect, and the book of Acts shows the reverse. Jerusalem, Judea, and Samaria were covered by the apostles and their companions. Paul covered the Roman empire, and other apostles went to the uttermost parts of the earth.

Luke 24:47

Paul was not raised by God to continue the Great Commission. But I know you will disagree with that, so let's us agree to disagree.

 

[Absolutely]

acts 15
And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.

2 When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question.

5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.

7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;

9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.


So we see paul and peter at the same meeting with Peter doing the teaching and instructing of the Gospel to the gentiles.

Debunking thoroughly the idea that peter had no revelation concerning the gospel to the gentiles.