Interesting insight (John 3v36) OSAS take note
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(Joh 3:18) He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
(Joh 3:18) He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that does not comply with this belief is condemned already, because he does not comply with this belief in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
(Joh 3:18) He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that refuses this believe and isn't obedient to this belief is condemned already, because he refuses this believe and isn't obedient to the belief in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
(Joh 3:18) He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that does not comply with this belief is condemned already, because he does not comply with this belief in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
(Joh 3:18) He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that refuses this believe and isn't obedient to this belief is condemned already, because he refuses this believe and isn't obedient to the belief in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Umm, you OP equates obedience to salvation when the fact that obedience is a result of salvation and you are wrong about what is OSAS that leads you to a wrong premise. Ephesians 2:8-10 means next to salvation is the working out of it. Build your faith and you need to grow in the knowledge of Christ.
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2 Corinthians 7 v9 Now I rejoice, not that you were made sorry, but that your sorrow led to repentance. For you were made sorry in a godly manner, that you might suffer loss from us in nothing. 10 For godly sorrow produces repentance leading to salvation, not to be regretted; but the sorrow of the world produces death.
As you will notice, this repentance leading to salvation is not initial repentance in turning to Christ, as the context is addressing the wayward Corinthian church. It is repentance from sin.
As you will notice, this repentance leading to salvation is not initial repentance in turning to Christ, as the context is addressing the wayward Corinthian church. It is repentance from sin.
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I am not the best when it comes to words.. forgive me.
From what I read it seems were not all on the same page. Well if you do not believe OSAS then what exactly does that mean to you. I am reading allot of "obey/obedience". Christ said to the 12 after they had been with Him day and night for about 3 years "if you love me keep my words".. or for some "obey my commandments" "if you love me you will keep my commandments".
Lets back up shall we. So if I am reading this right some fully understand what Christ was saying "if you love you will keep my commandments" You did notice there is no "or else" after that right? You do know you can believe in Jesus and not know Him or love Him right? I was saved in a Baptist Church when I was like 9. I remember it .. going up front fall on my knees crying and I still have the little book "the four spiritual laws" thats over 50 years old now. I didn't KNOW Jesus nor loved Him.. I believed john 3;16 so I was saved. Anyway so back up a few verses.. If you believe in Jesus as some say they do then you will do the works He did and greater works. Lets keep going and He will do what ever you ask in His name so the Father will be glorified in the son. Maybe we missed it.. He said it again.. if you ask me anything in my name I will do it. Then He says He will ask the Father and He will give you another helper and will abide with you for ever. Wow.. didn't Jesus also say in Luke if you ask the Father for the holy Spirit He will give it to you.. hmm
This talk about OSAS or you can lose your salvation as I see it is foolish, silly doctrines of man. There is no "once your are saved you will never lose your salvation" verse in the bibie. There is no verse for "after your saved if you don't obey do works you can lose your salvation/ if you keep sinning you can lose your salvation". What happens is OSAS will post this and that verse and there it is proof! The others side will do the same. Just post this and that verse and again.. POOF... there it is proof. Both are self/flesh talking that then takes the word of God to prove a personal belief as I see it.
I pray someone sees what I am trying to get you to see. You see one verse.. your missing so much being said or written. We love Jesus so much huh? So as we type do we care about those weak in the faith or new believers?
The Father and Jesus and the Holy Spirit are so real. This salvation born from above is from HIM! A gift where He stays with you .. that what HE started HE will finish. IT ALL FLOWS!
From what I read it seems were not all on the same page. Well if you do not believe OSAS then what exactly does that mean to you. I am reading allot of "obey/obedience". Christ said to the 12 after they had been with Him day and night for about 3 years "if you love me keep my words".. or for some "obey my commandments" "if you love me you will keep my commandments".
Lets back up shall we. So if I am reading this right some fully understand what Christ was saying "if you love you will keep my commandments" You did notice there is no "or else" after that right? You do know you can believe in Jesus and not know Him or love Him right? I was saved in a Baptist Church when I was like 9. I remember it .. going up front fall on my knees crying and I still have the little book "the four spiritual laws" thats over 50 years old now. I didn't KNOW Jesus nor loved Him.. I believed john 3;16 so I was saved. Anyway so back up a few verses.. If you believe in Jesus as some say they do then you will do the works He did and greater works. Lets keep going and He will do what ever you ask in His name so the Father will be glorified in the son. Maybe we missed it.. He said it again.. if you ask me anything in my name I will do it. Then He says He will ask the Father and He will give you another helper and will abide with you for ever. Wow.. didn't Jesus also say in Luke if you ask the Father for the holy Spirit He will give it to you.. hmm
This talk about OSAS or you can lose your salvation as I see it is foolish, silly doctrines of man. There is no "once your are saved you will never lose your salvation" verse in the bibie. There is no verse for "after your saved if you don't obey do works you can lose your salvation/ if you keep sinning you can lose your salvation". What happens is OSAS will post this and that verse and there it is proof! The others side will do the same. Just post this and that verse and again.. POOF... there it is proof. Both are self/flesh talking that then takes the word of God to prove a personal belief as I see it.
I pray someone sees what I am trying to get you to see. You see one verse.. your missing so much being said or written. We love Jesus so much huh? So as we type do we care about those weak in the faith or new believers?
The Father and Jesus and the Holy Spirit are so real. This salvation born from above is from HIM! A gift where He stays with you .. that what HE started HE will finish. IT ALL FLOWS!
Who works in us to change it?
Every time in respect to a new creation God must do the first work of calling (irresistible grace) a person to repent (comfort or ease oneself ). Its perfectly clear God not seen must do the first work of repenting. Then after a person is turned having heard the voice from within, then in turn they can repent towards God not seen. .
Two turnings. Satan the author of self righteousness would make it one a work we can perform without him .. First he turn us and then in turn we can confess and bear the shame of of sin . If no one to give a person power to turn .Nothing changes nothing .
Jeremiah 31:18-20 King James Version (KJV) I have surely heard Ephraim bemoaning himself thus; Thou hast chastised me, and I was chastised, as a bullock unaccustomed to the yoke: turn thou me, and I shall be turned; (1) for thou art the Lord my God. Surely after that I was turned, I repented; (2) and after that I was instructed, I smote upon my thigh: I was ashamed, yea, even confounded, because I did bear the reproach of my youth.
Agreed the translations you mention have it correct. Obedience is clearly linked to salvation. We are saved to eternal life only if we continue to adhere to (Obey) all of God’s requirements.
OSAS I believe is unscriptural. Consider the following illustration: Imagine being rescued from a burning tower and the relief we would feel as we are safely taken from the building. The rescuer says: ‘ You are Safe now’. Yes we are saved from certain death. But what would happen if we decided to go back into the building for some foolish reason?
Our life would again be in danger.
Through disobedience to Christ we take ourselves out from under God’s saving grace. (Return to the burning building) The following scriptures John 15:2,6 and Hebrews 6:4-6 show the consequences of making such a foolish choice.
OSAS I believe is unscriptural. Consider the following illustration: Imagine being rescued from a burning tower and the relief we would feel as we are safely taken from the building. The rescuer says: ‘ You are Safe now’. Yes we are saved from certain death. But what would happen if we decided to go back into the building for some foolish reason?
Our life would again be in danger.
Through disobedience to Christ we take ourselves out from under God’s saving grace. (Return to the burning building) The following scriptures John 15:2,6 and Hebrews 6:4-6 show the consequences of making such a foolish choice.
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Imagine being rescued from a burning tower and the relief we would feel as we are safely taken from the building. The rescuer says: ‘ You are Safe now’. and a week later you find yourself in another burning building . And when calling 911 the operator says you were rescued from a burning building last week one is all that is allowed.
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.Hebrew6; 4-6
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.Hebrew6; 4-6
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I've heard many works-salvationists use Hebrews 5:9 to try and support salvation by works, including Roman Catholics, Mormons and SDA's.
In regards to Hebrews 5:9, who obeys Him? The saved or the lost?
Only believers have obeyed Him by choosing to believe the gospel (Romans 1:16) in order to become saved and only believers obey Him
"after they have been saved through faith" by practicing righteousness and not sin (1 John 3:9,10). *In either sense, only believers obey Him.
Unbelievers have not obeyed Him by refusing to believe the gospel (Romans 10:16) and without faith its impossible to please God (Hebrews 11:6) so unbelievers do not obey Him no matter how much "so called" obedience that they attempt to conjure up through the flesh in a vain effort to receive salvation by works (Matthew 7:21-23). *In either sense, unbelievers do not obey Him.
In regards to Hebrews 5:9, who obeys Him? The saved or the lost?
Only believers have obeyed Him by choosing to believe the gospel (Romans 1:16) in order to become saved and only believers obey Him
"after they have been saved through faith" by practicing righteousness and not sin (1 John 3:9,10). *In either sense, only believers obey Him.
Unbelievers have not obeyed Him by refusing to believe the gospel (Romans 10:16) and without faith its impossible to please God (Hebrews 11:6) so unbelievers do not obey Him no matter how much "so called" obedience that they attempt to conjure up through the flesh in a vain effort to receive salvation by works (Matthew 7:21-23). *In either sense, unbelievers do not obey Him.
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E
Amen,
apart from faith there is no obedience, the jews obeyed the law and strove to be law keepers. Yet as Jesus said, they were disobedient, and I. The end, their unbelief was their downfall.
its no different today, people who do not truly believe (have faith) do all these religious deeds and try to live obedient lives, yet in the end, their works of righteousness (obedience) can not save them, because they reject Gods mercy (titus 3)
its one thing to believe Jesus, it a far other thing to entrust your eternity to him,
as you said, without faith it’s impossible to believe him, even demons believe...many in that day will recall all their great works of obedience and even supposed miracles they have done, Jesus will simply in sadness say depart from me for I never knew you
apart from faith there is no obedience, the jews obeyed the law and strove to be law keepers. Yet as Jesus said, they were disobedient, and I. The end, their unbelief was their downfall.
its no different today, people who do not truly believe (have faith) do all these religious deeds and try to live obedient lives, yet in the end, their works of righteousness (obedience) can not save them, because they reject Gods mercy (titus 3)
its one thing to believe Jesus, it a far other thing to entrust your eternity to him,
as you said, without faith it’s impossible to believe him, even demons believe...many in that day will recall all their great works of obedience and even supposed miracles they have done, Jesus will simply in sadness say depart from me for I never knew you
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