Is keeping the Commandments and Laws of God Needed for Eternal Life?

Eccl12and13 · Oct 15, 2012

Do you do your best at NOT breaking God's laws? If you find yourself having an evil thought do you pray that it is removed?

Do you try NOT to look at a woman in the wrong way?

Do you try to do as Paul tells us.....

1 Cor.15
[34] Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

Now which commandments is Paul speaking of when he tells us not to sin? Let's read some of them below..

Rom.1
[29] Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
[30] Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
[31] Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
[32] Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

WOW! ALL of the above are sins! ALL of the above is the transgression of God's laws!

2 Cor.6
[14] Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

So if being UNRIGHTEOUS is breaking God's laws...then guess what it takes to stay righteous?

Do you try to stay righteous in the eyes of the Lord?

Because if you are trying to stay righteous...then you are trying your best NOT to break His laws!

Are you striving to stay righteous?

.

Brother_Don · Oct 16, 2012

much power in living the commandments, and satan knows this, so in my observations i feel satan is trying to get man to believe they don't matter. This is a lie of satan, as he knows the super natural powers of the commandments. The proof is in the pudding, can't knock it till you try it.

Sonofjesuschrist · Oct 16, 2012

Brother_Don said:

I love does Words, When we start thinking the commandments dont matter, is like saying what god thinks dont matter.
Peace and love Brethren.

hermanodaniel · Oct 16, 2012

Eccl12and13 said:

The 10 commandments were added to what laws? God's 10 commandments have been around from day 1.

Gen. 4
[6] And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
[7] If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

Notice what God said ‘lieth at the door’ for Cain….SIN! And sin is to break Gods law. And did Cain sin?

[8] And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him.
Now do we have any record telling us this law was written down? No! But yet Cain still knew it was wrong. How? God told him so. That is how everybody knew what was wrong and what was right. If it wasn’t written down it HAD to be passed by word of mouth. God spoke to His children and they, in turn, told the rest of mankind.

So we have MURDER BEFORE MOSES! Exod. 20 [13]Thou shalt not kill. Let’s read more.

Gen. 12
[13] Say, I pray thee, thou art my sister: that it may be well with me for thy sake; and my soul shall live because of thee.
[17] And the LORD plagued Pharaoh and his house with great plagues because of Sarai Abram's wife.
[18] And Pharaoh called Abram, and said, What is this that thou hast done unto me? why didst thou not tell me that she was thy wife?
[19] Why saidst thou, She is my sister? so I might have taken her to me to wife: now therefore behold thy wife, take her, and go thy way.

Now how did the Pharaoh know this was wrong? Was it written or did somebody tell him? Either way, the fact remains that he KNEW!

So we have ADULTERY BEFORE MOSES! Exod. 20 [14] Thou shalt not commit adultery.

Gen. 30
[31] And he said, What shall I give thee? And Jacob said, Thou shalt not give me any thing: if thou wilt do this thing for me, I will again feed and keep thy flock:
[32] I will pass through all thy flock to day, removing from thence all the speckled and spotted cattle, and all the brown cattle among the sheep, and the spotted and speckled among the goats: and of such shall be my hire.
[33] So shall my righteousness answer for me in time to come, when it shall come for my hire before thy face: every one that is not speckled and spotted among the goats, and brown among the sheep, that shall be counted stolen with me.

So we have STEALING BEFORE MOSES! Exod. 20 [15] Thou shalt not steal.

Josh. 24 [2] And Joshua said unto all the people, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Your fathers dwelt on the other side of the flood in old time, even Terah, the father of Abraham, and the father of Nachor: and they served other gods.
Notice when they served ‘other gods’. It was on the ‘other side of the flood’!

So we have IDOLATRY BEFORE MOSES! Exod. 20 [3] Thou shalt have no other gods ` before me.

Exod.16
[23] And he said unto them, This is that which the LORD hath said, To morrow is the rest of the holy sabbath unto the LORD: bake that which ye will bake to day, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning.
[25] And Moses said, Eat that to day; for to day is a sabbath unto the LORD: to day ye shall not find it in the field.
[26] Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day, which is the sabbath, in it there shall be none.
[29] See, for that the LORD hath given you the sabbath, therefore he giveth you on the sixth day the bread of two days; abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.

So we have God's Sabbath being observed BEFORE they were written in stone.

Gen.13
[13] But the men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the LORD exceedingly.
Gen.18
[20] And the LORD said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous;
Gen.19
[5] And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.
[7] And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly.
[8] Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof.

So we have the sin of Sodomy BEFORE Moses.

ALL of God's laws were in effect BEFORE He gave them to Moses on a stone. All except for the set of laws that He ADDED!

God had to ADD a set of laws to keep mankind in hope and to prevent Him from destroying His creation; man. God ADDED this set of laws because man continued to break the laws that were already in place.

Again.....do you know the set of Laws that were ADDED?

.

AGAIN YOU ARE TAKING THIS PASSAGE OUT OF CONTEXT GOD ADDED THE 10 COMMANDMENTS AFTER THE PROMISE THERE IS NOT ANOTHER LAW THAT WAS ADDED HERE

hermanodaniel · Oct 16, 2012

Eccl12and13 said:

Putting on Christ is trying to your best to stay righteous? Romans 13:14
Mortifying the members is trying your best? Colossians 3:5
NO IT'S NOT TRYING YOUR BEST IT'S DYING TO YOUR FLESH which means anything that points to your contribution is dead. When I pray and pour out my heart before God it's an act of the spirit not my flesh. When I am in the spirit as a result of mortifying my flesh I NO LONGER LIVE CHRIST LIVES IN ME. This is part of the mystery of the Gospel it's not that we are becoming better Christians BUT rather that Christ is living in us. We are actually IN Christ when we abide and walk after the spirit. Romans 6 speaks that we are dead and are spirit is now united with Christ Romans 6:5 EVERY ACT OF OBEDIENCE IS CHRIST MANIFESTING HIMSELF THROUGH US ! IT'S NOT US BUT CHRIST IN US THE HOPE OF GLORY Colossians 1:27

WE DON'T CONTRIBUTE ANYTHING BUT CARRY OUR CROSS. We are one in Christ but Christ always received the glory and credit.

hermanodaniel · Oct 16, 2012

Have you notice that Jeremiah 23:6 says THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS (YHWH TSIDKENU)! There is no such thing as "learn to help your self that God may help you" since this means some of the glory pertains to you when God shares His Glory with NO ONE. Now there is obedience by faith but when one obeys it was Christ IN them! This is the difference of being in the spirit which always seeks to glorify Christ and in the flesh where we look for our contribution to be recognized. No can please God after the flesh and no one ever will this is why we must die to trying to obey the Letter of the Law that Christ may manifest in us since we are one with HIM. When HE manifests it's because we have counted ourselves dead to the flesh but alive in HIM.

hermanodaniel · Oct 16, 2012

Galatians 6:12-16

12 As many as desire to make a fair shew in the FLESH, they constrain you to be circumcised; only lest they should suffer persecution for the cross of Christ.

13 For NEITHER they themselves who are circumcised keep the law; but desire to have you circumcised, that they may GLORY IN YOUR FLESH.

14 BUT GOD FORBID THAT I SHOULD GLORY, SAVE IN THE CROSS OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST, BY WHOM THE WORLD IS CRUCIFIED UNTO ME, AND I UNTO THE WORLD.

15 FOR IN CHRIST JESUS neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, BUT A NEW CREATURE.

16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

hermanodaniel · Oct 16, 2012

2 big heretical signs a believer needs to watch for

1. Does the doctrine being presented or taught diminish Christ's Deity, His Finish Work on the cross or adds to His Work?

2. Does the doctrine repeat the BIG LIE IN THE GARDEN OF EDEN?

Answer to number 1. The Deity Of Christ meaning that the very Word of God coming in the Flesh is not fully acknowledged or understood is ANTI-CHRIST (1 John 4) Jesus was God in the flesh thus He living in us as the Scriptures confirms is sufficient to save us and transform us that we may be one with HIM. Anything that opposes the Living Word or Written Word as a whole is ANTI-CHRIST

Answer to number 2. The big lie uttered in the Garden of Eden is the lie that states if you eat you will know good from evil and be like GOD. That very lie is echoed again as we see those who suggest or enforce that we can keep the 10 commandments in the flesh. Since Jesus being God in the flesh was perfect and able to obey fully (hence because HE IS GOD) any notion that points to our obedience in the flesh is saying indirectly without even noticing (however the enemy knows this since he was the one who uttered the lie in the first place) I can obey and become like God.

Sonofjesuschrist · Oct 16, 2012

Brethren, Just trying to help out of love NOT pride.
There are different Laws.
The laws of moses does were abolished in the cross.

The laws of our God Jesus christ- will never pass away.

Dietary Laws were put in place for our own good. not all animals are clean to eat.
also taking care of Ur body is a good thing.
everybody loves pork but it is a unclean animal to eat.
why not eat dogs or cats. see bro some things are for ur own good.
go to asia the eat cats and dogs. but they are unclean animals. dietary laws are good.
Just saying. I know you are a great christian and you love the Lord Amen!
Love and peace Brethren

loveme1 · Oct 18, 2012

hermanodaniel said:

It is through Faith in Yahshua the Messiah that we are saved.

You say people are teaching we can Keep the commandments in the flesh...

Certainly not so, for i know it is was my flesh that failed at Keeping the commandments of Yahvah God.

It is my New Spirit that strives to obey him knowing that it is pleasing to him, and that he said himself those that love him Keep his commandments.

It is the the Holy Spirit invested in a person that strives to obey.

My flesh is how i'm tempted to disobey...

Yahshua the Messiah was without food and water when satan came to tempt him, it is then the flesh being at its weakest that the Spirit must overcome the flesh. Yahshua the Messiah perfectly overcame satan.

When i fast i witness the conflict of my flesh and my Spirit.

The old me could not of fasted, i was weak in my flesh..

It is no longer "self" but the New Spirit given that can say "No"...

My Spirit needs strength to remain alight and i seek it daily.

Renew the oil for your Light each and every day..

I know by whom i'm strengthened, i know by whom i'm saved.

You said this:

The Garden of Eden was Yahvah God giving a commandment and the serpent tempting them to break it.

It is written that the saints are those that Keep the Commandments of Yahvah God and have Faith in Yahshua the Messiah.

What you are posing is against what is written.

If someone comes to you and says Keep the Commandments of Yahvah God for eternal life then you are right to rebuke them.

The only sin offering acceptable to Yahvah God is Faith in Yahshua the Messiah.

It is the Holy Spirit given by this Faith that one can worship in Spirit and Truth and strive to Keep the Commandments of Yahvah God by the guidance and comfort of the Holy Spirit within them.

webchatter · Oct 18, 2012

No! It is the only answer as to keeping the law & commandments being necessary for salvation. Again the thief on the cross is a perfect example. He died the same day he was saved. If it was necessary for him to obey all the commandments to recieve salvation, then God would have kept him alive longer, as we all have the same opportunity to be saved. On the other hand, I do believe that God helps us, dwells power in us to help us obey these laws & commands of the old & new testaments, because we cannot do it on our own.

loveme1 · Oct 18, 2012

The man on the cross Feared Yahvah God, he showed remorse in accepting he was receiving what he deserved, He knew Yahshua the Messiah was innocent and suffering.

He asked the Lord to remember him.

It witnesses that through Faith we are saved.

It is said that it is a very painful way to die, and this man's Spirit was speaking against the pain of his flesh.

He had Faith in Yahshua the Messiah not to save his flesh but to save his Soul.

The other man did not seek forgiveness but a way to get out of his punishment.

It bares witness to us all that Yahshua the Messiah is not a get out of "hell" free card, but a way in which we can be forgiven for what we have done wrong and be reconciled with Yahvah God.

First we must admit we have sinned and deserve to be punished, we ask Yahshua the Messiah to come and forgive us knowing that he suffered for us, and lead us in the Path of Righteousness home to Yahvah God.

All this comes through Faith and all Glory to Yahvah God and Yahshua the Messiah.

What then?

Is not all that Love and Gratitude within not seeking to obey his Commandments not for but because of Salvation?

JaumeJ · Oct 18, 2012

From a related thread.........
Our blessed savior, Yeshua, came to give us the good news that we are all free of the curse of the law, death.

The power of sin is in the law. When our precious savior died for us each on the cross, He vanquished the sting of death forever for all who believe Him. Death's power is the punishment for sin, for the wages of sin is death. All of this is from the Word.

The curse of the Law is the punishment dictated for any infraction. We all now enjoy grace and mercy because of the Blood of the Lamb of Yahweh, Yeshua! There is no punishment for any who accept Yeshua as Lord and Savior.

His teaching is simple, the curse of the law is destroyed, that being punishment for breaking it however the law and the prophets are completed in Him. There is no longer a curse and the law is good.

Yeshua teaches anyone teaching against the least of these laws will be least in His Kingdom.

All the above is taught by Yeshua, none of it is simply some notion that popped into the heads of those who understand, it is teaching from the Master.

People have taken the term New Covenant to call the Old Testament a lie, and the Old Testament, that being the Law and the Prophets teach of the New Covenant, it is one Book.

hermanodaniel · Oct 18, 2012

Here's a repost of what I posted on a different thread just now addressing the same thing:

The obligation to the do's and don'ts in the flesh and not the actual law (the Law of Moses ) that mandates them was nailed to the cross this is what I am referring to as well as the Scriptures. In other words, it wasn't the Law itself but the regulations that applied to the physical since it applied to the flesh. The reason sin still exists is that we constantly battle everyday with our flesh in counting it dead. Thus why Jesus said carry the cross and follow me and why Paul said he dies daily. But confidence in the flesh is what me must avoid at all cost as Philippians 3:3 states because no one will glory in the flesh before God and no one can please God after the flesh and no will ever will. So we actually die to trying to obey after the flesh that Christ may manifest in us and we obey after the spirit which can be witnessed outwardly however this obedience derives from being in the spirit cutting off the body of sins. When we cut off the body of sins we are constantly acknowledging our sins we commit daily in the flesh and being truthful to God resulting in our flesh being slayed before the presence of God in prayer and worship. The Letter of the Law does this daily to our flesh but thank be to God that it can no longer apply death to our spirit which is now united in Christ! Halleluyah

Please understand that the truth in abiding in the spirit and walking in it does not disregard the Law of Moses. We are dead to the flesh which is provoked by the Law of Moses and when we are counted dead we are in the spirit and when we are in the spirit we are now in the deeper meaning of what the Law of Moses really means because it's true make up is spirit not stone tablets which refers to physical ordinances. This is why there's a deeper meaning behind the Sabbath rest which according to the letter is bound by time but according to the spirit is eternal we have now in Christ enter into the heavenly places and this is rest and it's glory surpasses that which was of glory in the letter (the physical and literal observances) This is what 2 Corinthians 3 is talking about and if you noticed how chapter 4 starts off by renouncing all dishonesty and deceit and mishandling the Word because all this was attributed to men being in their flesh. Read: 2 Corinthians 4:1-2 Therefore seeing we have this ministry, as we have received mercy, we faint not; But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

When we renounce all of the above it's a result of being dead to the letter of the law which provoked the flesh in acting out it's very nature and what's left is a spirit that is united in Christ resulting in Christ manifesting in us and bearing fruit to the glory of God!

hermanodaniel · Oct 18, 2012

Now since we are dead in the flesh the Law of Moses that applies to it is no longer applied but IT's NOT that we are not without Law we are now in the Law of Christ which is the call to love others as Christ loved them which was to the death and we do just that by dying to our flesh. It is a battle to mortify our flesh daily and love others the way Christ did. Example: If we get insulted really bad to the point of being embarrassed our flesh wants to lash out and it even starts producing thoughts that later we will most assuredly regret if we entertained them enough and act them out but if we die to the feeling of being humiliated and acknowledge that we need Christ in that moment we can overcome and be quiet not say a word back and even pray for that individual's salvation! When that is accomplished guess who did it? CHRIST IN YOU! We are united with Christ and are now one with Him thus He will always get the glory in fact the spiritual man seeks to only glorify HIM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

JaumeJ · Oct 18, 2012

hermanodaniel said:

It is the curse of the law which would result in death had it not been nailed to the cross with Yeshua, Jesus.

The law, itself is always good. Yeshua, Jesus, fulfilled the law and the prophets by giving us mercy in place of punishment for infractions.

The law itself is good, as He teaches not one jot or tiddle will change.

Anyone teaching against the least of these laws will be least in the Kingdom.

It is obvious the majority of the laws are simply not applicable today, laws of the Temple, Sacrifice, and living in Israel, however all of the laws of conduct are just as valid today as they will be until the end of this age .

Laws teaching us to return our enemy's belongings should one encounter them are valid. All commandments are valid, or would anyone here teach that honoring our parents is invalid, or not to steal has been repealed. Is it alright to covet now? I think not. The laws are good; they are not bad, and they are not obsolete, or would one say our Savior was lying when He told us they would never change.

It is the curse of the law nailed to the cross, not the law. We no longer suffer the consequences of sin when we fail, and we do fail.

The fact is, people claiming to believe all of the Word is breathed by Yahweh, God, ignore the Five Books of Moses and the wisdom contained in them. Moses and the prophets wrote about Jesus, Yeshua, and to ignore any portion of the Word deliberately is not studying the Word to find oneself approved.

It is a very unsavory practice to teach against the laws and the commandments, learn of them all, and you will know they are good.

Sonofjesuschrist · Oct 18, 2012

webchatter said:

Brethren, You said it, we cant not do it on our own.
Thats why you have to be born again in the spirit. The holy spirit will help you stay away from breaking the laws. But if you are a carnal christian going to party's, talking about its all in grace and you could do anything, no submission, on living the word of god.
Then ur not a true christian. I realize the only people who rebel against the law are people who love there life for self. Jesus said if you love the world you hate god.
They want the best life now, and then Heaven, the perfect fairy tail.
They want heaven they just dont want god to be there.
Brethren the only way to go to heaven is to truly love god and his laws.
cause heaven is all about god. worshiping god and being loyal. what happen to satan he did not want to obey his laws, and got cast out of heaven, what happen to adam and eve, Brethren there are laws.
no matter how you see it.
Peace and Love Brethren.

hermanodaniel · Oct 18, 2012

JaumeJ said:

It is the curse of the law which would result in death had it not been nailed to the cross with Yeshua, Jesus.

The law, itself is always good. Yeshua, Jesus, fulfilled the law and the prophets by giving us mercy in place of punishment for infractions.

The law itself is good, as He teaches not one jot or tiddle will change.

Anyone teaching against the least of these laws will be least in the Kingdom.

It is obvious the majority of the laws are simply not applicable today, laws of the Temple, Sacrifice, and living in Israel, however all of the laws of conduct are just as valid today as they will be until the end of this age and perhaps beyond.

Laws teaching us to return our enemy's belongings should one encounter them are valid. All commandments are valid, or would anyone here teach that honoring our parents is invalid, or not to steal has been repealed. Is it alright to covet now? I think not. The laws are good; they are not bad, and they are not obsolete, or would one say our Savior was lying when He told us they would never change.

It is the curse of the law nailed to the cross, not the law. We no longer suffer the consequences of sin when we fail, and we do fail.

The fact is, people claiming to believe all of the Word is breathed by Yahweh, God, ignore the Five Books of Moses and the wisdom contained in them. Moses and the prophets wrote about Jesus, Yeshua, and to ignore any portion of the Word deliberately is not studying the Word to find oneself approved.

It is a very unsavory practice to teach against the laws and the commandments, learn of them all, and you will know they are good.

If you really understood what I had posted you will see that I am by no means going against anything in the Law but rather upholding it and giving God the glory. I have renounced dishonesty and deceit I don't corrupt the Word of God but manifest the truth having my conscience clear before God! In love for the Spirit, I say carefully examine and rightly divide the Word.

JaumeJ · Oct 18, 2012

Perhaps I do not understand what you have posted. I do understand what the Lord teaches us in the Good News He died to present to all who believe Him.

The laws are not a set of do's and do not's they are a guide to moral behavior, that is outside of those laws impossible to even address regarding the Temple, sacrifice, living in an all Jewish Israel (for lack of a better term.) Also the dietary laws are not necessary to follow because our Lord teaches nothing by entering the body defiles it.

This is not picking and choosing which laws to still follow, for the ones eliminated are eliminated by circumstances or by the Lord, Himself.

The remaining laws are a guide to good conduct. They are all good, and they are all valid. The difference is punishment is now replaced by mercy.

The law was not nailed to the cross, the curse of the law was nailed to the cross completing the law for all of us by the Lord, Yeshua. It is not a dark saying to be revealed. Yeshua, teaches all by His example.

No one is contentious here, it is the teaching of the Word.

hermanodaniel · Oct 18, 2012

By the way I am not against anyone who wants to continue observing the Sabbath, dietary laws and feasts because everything that you do for the Lord in faith is accepted as Colossians 3 and Romans 14 states HOWEVER the problem is when people try to enforce these observances on all believers (Jews and Gentiles alike) as a means of being obedient to the Lord and thus being saved if we observe them when that is confidence in the flesh. That is not the Gospel (Acts 15) "For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh." Philippians 3:3

Is keeping the Commandments and Laws of God Needed for Eternal Life?

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