Can someone lose their salvation?

[GreenNnice]

The Spirit is God's guarantee that he will give us the inheritance he promised and that he has purchased us to be his own people. He did this so we would praise and glorify him. - Ephesians 1:14

and who has also put his seal on us and given us his Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee 2 Corinthians 1:22

Yes, sealed. But 1 Cor. 3:15 of person's worked dribbled but he saved, etc, verses , are all NOT talking about one who willfully leaves Christ by way of having tasted the heavenly gift, the sweetness of the Holy Spirit.

There is no repentance at all of their life and there is NO salvation. (Heb. 6:4-6)

The Holy spirit grants us, permits us to partake of Him.

Don't shame that great faith blessing of Him, or, you will not be saved , youvwull apostate unto DEATH !

Question, Is his Spirit actually in us? do we have the friut evidence? are we coming under obedience to Christ? or is this just another thing we confess to make it so?

Yes.

Faith is what i was given to trust Gods word. To trust Him, would be to obey Him.
Grace is what gives me the enablement to do it.

Your trying to make faith the power itself...when grace is the power
Faith is the motivator to believe to trust..to take a chance, if something was promised.
Grace is the divine influence on my heart to do whatever He wants me to do.

GRACE= the act by Christ, His Son's shed blood that eliminated sin and shame

Faith is the power. His given faith must become used, we get empowered through His leading,clue following , abider

----
Note to abidingsquirrel: 'delta' = the person who does the faith.

Christ is the beginner / author of our faith (gives us our measure ) and we USE it as He leads, then, He will complete the goodcwork began in us, and this, too, is yhrough our faith believing in Him , His plans for our life. Simple, eh

 

[Abiding]

I asked isn't our white garment the righteous works we let Christ do through us? or is it the righteous works we allow Him it do in us?

abiding then you responded with this and romans 4:4
White robes have nothing to do with us. You make it sound like we make effectual His perfection
by our deeds. Now your back to:

right her in roman 4

18 Against all hope, Abraham in hope believed and so became the father of many nations, just as it had been said to him, “So shall your offspring be.”[d] 19 Without weakening in his faith, he faced the fact that his body was as good as dead—since he was about a hundred years old—and that Sarah’s womb was also dead. 20 Yet he did not waver through unbelief regarding the promise of God, but was strengthened in his faith and gave glory to God, 21 being fully persuaded that God had power to do what he had promised.

Issac was Gods work, But Abraham had to respond to Gods Promise in faith and not his old body. If we truly have faith we act on it and Gods power makes it happen.

Bible says he puts his Spirit in us and moves us to do his will..

Bible also warns men that resist his Spirit and refuse to be moved by him.

Its not that i dont see you and others point..but there is a line in the sand with the doctrine
of justification...some are going past it and are beating sheep and scaring them and herding
them into the flesh...Yes i know you dont know what im talking about...but that ok.

Yes!! Abraham acted on his faith....not even the strictess calvinist would disagree to faith
with actual works coming FROM that faith by grace. They would see it as a thing God worked in them
both a will and a do put in them for doing His good pleasure.

They would object to works to prove your faith or gain justification by it. If that was the case
we would have to say that when Ishmael was born it woulda just stopped there.

To make it short my righteousness is His, my garments have to be His for His merit only. Not
any of mine. Faith works by grace and love, all gifts, all by the working of the Holyspirit.

We can open a new thread on the rewards we can receive in heaven which Paul worked so hard for
and deal with the big bonfires some like me will have on that day and how my garment will smell
a little smokey. We can talk about wood hay and stubble..and the like. Thats a whole other subject.

 

[weakness]

I don't want to distract .... Rev says the ( if I recall right) garment of white linen is the righteousness of the saints. "Christ who is our righteousness" "put on Christ" I can handle being clothed with the righteousness of Christ. Praise God for his glorious gift that we should be called the sons of God!!

 

[Abiding]

I don't want to distract .... Rev says the ( if I recall right) garment of white linen is the righteousness of the saints. "Christ who is our righteousness" "put on Christ" I can handle being clothed with the righteousness of Christ. Praise God for his glorious gift that we should be called the sons of God!!

Thats the way i see it.

 

[Abiding]

Disclaimer: Do I fear God? I can say that yes i do. Not something that i think of constantly
but what He has shown me is that He isnt going to change His mind on sin. And although I
may never be condemned I know He is still just and holy and i will reap what i sow.
And i know and trust He will chastise me, even scourge me out of a great Love.

I fear driving into a concrete wall. Im not sure i could ever walk away from Him, but i pray
daily for His keeping grace. I know He can destroy my soul. But i have comfort that His grace is sufficient.
Altho i may have disagreed with some theological doctrines...the Christian life is not a passive
life. Far from it. And of coarse we need to be obedient. Or as Peter said you will go blind and
even forget you were purged from your sins.

I love these verses:

Matt 11:28 “Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him.

I can say that the wrath of God is real...and it must be proclaimed..but after hearing the gospel
it was the goodness of God that led me to repentance, and the goodness of God that
motivates me to obedience,and confess my sins, regularly.

 

[GreenNnice]

Disclaimer: Do I fear God? I can say that yes i do. Not something that i think of constantly
but what He has shown me is that He isnt going to change His mind on sin. And although I
may never be condemned I know He is still just and holy and i will reap what i sow.
And i know and trust He will chastise me, even scourge me out of a great Love.

I fear driving into a concrete wall. Im not sure i could ever walk away from Him, but i pray
daily for His keeping grace. I know He can destroy my soul. But i have comfort that His grace is sufficient.
Altho i may have disagreed with some theological doctrines...the Christian life is not a passive
life. Far from it. And of coarse we need to be obedient. Or as Peter said you will go blind and
even forget you were purged from your sins.

I love these verses:

Matt 11:28 “Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him.

I can say that the wrath of God is real...and it must be proclaimed..but after hearing the gospel
it was the goodness of God that led me to repentance, and the goodness of God that
motivates me to obedience,and confess my sins, regularly.

Goodness of God=???

 

[Abiding]

Goodness of God = His lovingkindness and tendermercy

Displayed on the Cross and the gospel of salvation that He proclaimed to me.
And the gift of "eternal life"

 

[GreenNnice]

Goodness of God = His lovingkindness and tendermercy

Displayed on the Cross and the gospel of salvation that He proclaimed to me.
And the gift of "eternal life"

Did the Spirit convict you that your 'world' ways were not getting you anywhere (eternally)?

Abider, sorry, too, if I sound condescending, I totally blame that on mi green brains


Now, to be fair, God's Holy Spirit convicted me in 1997 through a production called Hells Gates and Heavens Flames . Began to change my life. The Lord led me through refining fire, never forget, your 'fire' is different than anyone else's . So, in your life, how did the Refiner 'fire' off your dross so you could see His goodness, that accepting Christ as your personal Savior was how it would be, there could be no other way?

If this is too personal, fine, the Lord leads

 

[Abiding]

Did the Spirit convict you that your 'world' ways were not getting you anywhere (eternally)?

Abider, sorry, too, if I sound condescending, I totally blame that on mi green brains


Now, to be fair, God's Holy Spirit convicted me in 1997 through a production called Hells Gates and Heavens Flames . Began to change my life. The Lord led me through refining fire, never forget, your 'fire' is different than anyone else's . So, in your life, how did the Refiner 'fire' off your dross so you could see His goodness, that accepting Christ as your personal Savior was how it would be, there could be no other way?

If this is too personal, fine, the Lord leads

My conscience convicted me as early as i remember. I had not a one time event happen.
I broke down due to the fact it wouldnt go away, along with feelings i belonged nowhere(although very social), and the darkess i felt, and the lack of peace. I couldnt break away...i tried a few ways
to drown it out. So i found myself yacking at the moon one night...then got a bible...thats my story.
It was all internal. No fanfare....happened almost 40 years ago.

Rich Mullins wrote:
"There's a wideness in God's mercy
I cannot find in my own
And He keeps His fire burning
To melt this heart of stone
Keeps me aching with a yearning
Keeps me glad to have been caught
In the reckless raging fury
That they call the love of God

Now I've seen no band of angels
But I've heard the soldiers' songs
Love hangs over them like a banner
Love within them leads them on
To the battle on the journey
And it's never gonna stop
Ever widening their mercies
And the fury of His love

Oh the love of God
And oh the love of God
The love of God

Joy and sorrow are this ocean
And in their every ebb and flow
Now the Lord a door has opened
That all Hell could never close
Here I'm tested and made worthy
Tossed about but lifted up
In the reckless raging fury
That they call the love of God"

Really the only testimony i have to give is that of the Faithfulness of God.
Im the wondering sheep..Hes the good shepherd.

 

[Ariel82]

Please provide a single passage in the New Testament which describes Christians following the Holy Spirit.
Where is He going?
Where is He now?

??? you're not serious are you??? just in case someone hasn't given it to you yet because I honor any request for scripture:

John 14:26
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.

John 16:7
Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you.

PS. Abiding I love Rich Mullins songs. His was the first one I ever memorized as a baby Christian.

 

[Red33]

Red33 do you understand Gods desire? He is putting everything under obedience to Christ. what do you think that means? do you think Jesus is returning for a whore?

Repent red33 and read the rest of the Lords words.. I'd hate to see you found lacking in his day of wrath.

Just what do you think and believe concerning the promises of God that have been given to and for the believer? Do His promises mean anything to you and do they make up any part of your faith that you have in Yeshua? Are we to trust His promises and judge God to be faithful who has promised or are we to lay aside His exceedingly great and precious promises (2Pt 1:1-5)? I see God's desire and the activity of His love and justice through His many promises which the scriptures testify as ALL being YEA and AMEN and none of them are NAY ...

2Pt 1:1-5
1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:
2 Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,
3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

2Cor 2:18-22
18 But as God is true, our word toward you was not yea and nay.
19 For the Son of God, Jesus Christ, who was preached among you by us, even by me and Silvanus and Timotheus, was not yea and nay, but in him was yea.
20 For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.
21 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God;
22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

How can we have faith in the living God without the good words of His promise that He has never failed to keep (1Kng 8:56)? Because we may sin and fail because of human weakness through the flesh, should we not trust in the promises of God and in the trustworthiness of the One who gave them? Does sin make void the faith that we have through the promises of God and shall it not be as God has said and shall He not do what he has promised (Num 23:19,20)...

19 God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?
20 Behold, I have received commandment to bless: and he hath blessed; and I cannot reverse it.

 

[ReinItIn]

We have not only word explanations of Gods saving work in men. We have visual accounts of the Gospel in action and a proper response.. In Saul/Pauls conversion we see how the Gospel works in men. We see true conviction,true sanctification, true justification, true brokenness, true repentance, true restoration, true reckoning and true reconciliation,true grace. It is still the Lord that pursues us and brings us to our knees.

Acts 9:1-19; retold in Acts 22:6-21 and Acts 26:12-18.

seeing the risen Lord as the one doing the work gave him the eye witness of Apostleship

But, it is the same Lord doing the same work in the same way in us, but invisible and in secret.

He was in one state of mind and action when the Lord finished He had completely changed his mind (which is repentance)..

paul repented more then once, God continued to change him mind about things he believed.

after His sight was restored he was given grace to preach Christ..

the way some of you use the words repentance and grace they are not what I know them to be by bible example of them.

 

[ReinItIn]

the Gospel I know the sacrifice of Christ with his blood covers our sin. we stand nekid before God without shame.

Where sin abounds grace abounds more doesn't mean more covering by his blood. Grace is the power of God provided so WE can turn from SIN and do what is right by God. The fine linen or robes of righteousness are the works God prepared for us, enabled us for. yes for us to dress ourselves we must have grace and use it through faith.

We have no hope for perfection in the flesh. Flesh and blood will not inherit the kingdom of God. Our hope for perfection is in the resurrection. for we will be like him when we see him.

Yet, here and now we rely on Christs power to do what he has commanded. We can't love like Jesus told us to love without his Holy Spirit putting his love in us. We can't forgive like Jesus commanded us to forgive without his Holy Spirit empowering us.. Yet, we must love like he told us and we must Forgive like he told us and that is why his grace must be utilized through faith.

So I totally do not understand a lot of you.

 

[ReinItIn]

actually the words being said are the right Words.. But, the meaning i understand of the Words in the gospel your proclaiming is different so I do not know the gospel as some of you are professing it.

God is Holy, He wants his wife to dress in modesty, and adorn herself with every good attribute of his character. that is the wedding Garment provided by God. We by Grace through faith have been provided with every piece and stitch so my gospel says be ready and believe in Jesus.. don't be found nekid, wretched, poor, blind.

 

[Bookends]

Let me tell yah something, if you feel you can lose your salvation, perhaps you've never been saved to begin with. It is that or you're just confused because Satan loves to come and steal, killl and destroy John 10:10

 

[Red33]

actually the words being said are the right Words.. But, the meaning i understand of the Words in the gospel your proclaiming is different so I do not know the gospel as some of you are professing it.

God is Holy, He wants his wife to dress in modesty, and adorn herself with every good attribute of his character. that is the wedding Garment provided by God. We by Grace through faith have been provided with every piece and stitch so my gospel says be ready and believe in Jesus.. don't be found nekid, wretched, poor, blind.

No one is teaching that it is all right to live in sin and flash the robe of righteousness around as you flirt with the world. What is the matter with you? However, when God cleanses the sinner by faith they are clean and their sin is put away and buried, never to be remembered any more and God imputes to them a gift of His righteousness that can never be taken from them or forfeited by them. It is a finished work and Christ did it on the cross and through His resurrection. This is why it is all grace and if it is not all grace then it is by works and if by works then it is not grace and we have a debt to pay and the debt that Christ paid counts for nothing.

 

[GreenNnice]

??? you're not serious are you??? just in case someone hasn't given it to you yet because I honor any request for scripture:

John 14:26
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.

John 16:7
Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you.

PS. Abiding I love Rich Mullins songs. His was the first one I ever memorized as a baby Christian.

Rich Mullins Loved God more than man. He was not married when he died. He preached a Holy Spirit embedded Salvation. He is, without question, eternally earth-living engraved on my mind....

I was driving down the road, age 27 (you were 14 when you heard this next part about to be said, Anariel), having consumed his music that year, from 'Sing your praise to the Lord,' (wrote Amy Grant's mega hit) to 'Our God Is An Awesome God,' to 'Hold Me, Jesus,' ('You've been my King of glory, be my prince of peace) to the one song about to be said after this radio story that's ....

"My friends, we have great, sad news tonight. Christian singer and songwriter, Rich Mullins, who made 9 albums, had numerous hits,was driving his car on a Illinois backroad when he lost control of his car and crashed and was fatally hurt."

Now, this thread is too powerful now to say much more on this but my favorite song of His has everything to do with the greatest promise God gave us, and, miraculous how God works, but I was this close from starting a new thread, 'What was God's greatest promise to us while He was on earth?'

LOL. The answer is from Anariel, above.....Him. Christ peeps, it's not all this precious talk of grace forevermore , it's Him. It's not that God will be faithful when we're not, wait for us to prodigally come home (from a 'denial of the Holy Spirit' lifestyle that that dad certainly told/imbued on his son's heart) . It's not the best promise that the guy who does dead works will be saved, even as thru fire. It's not that the antichrists going out with followers of Christ but denouncing Christ the moment they had to say the Truth, and, 'were never of us,' John states in 1 John 2:19. It's not, it's NOT , it's NOT the GREATEST, MOST BLESSED PROMISE from Him, for this promise is with power that....

....more than metes the eye. It's promise of the SEAL of eternal life for all the wickedness having been committed. Redeemed ! It's a promise of how one can have right understanding with God , it is the promise of continued one having a 'right standing with God.' Righteousness ! It's one where the believer begins to read the Word in a whole different way of understanding. Enlightenment ! It's one of so great meaning, that putting His promise of power into proper words is easy with Him, not possible without Him. Impossible !

Oh, Christ peeps, the promise by Jesus once He left of giving Himself unto us, to counsel us, to be an advocate for us, to enlighten us to 'Word' knowing, to empower us to produce fruit, ah, YES! , this IS the greatest promise ever given mankind.

The promise of Him, and, now, I use the easy words of Anariel to lighten your day, and, also, tell abidingx that the HOLY SPIRIT, His sweetness taste was experienced 40 years ago, He convictedly crumbled you, showing you Love, His great Love, showing you mercy, His great mercy shewed, and, grace, oh, the precious grace that is NOT a promise but AN ACT by God, starting with His Son's sacrifice wiping out your sins , your death, and, giving you the promise of being with Him forevermore....

Being forevermore with Him in Heaven, green, right? Yeah, yeah. I can live a dead life and still go, yeah, yeah, right, 1 Cor. 3:15, the bible tells me so , right, green. It is as you say. But I want you go through life forevermore with My promise of the Holy Spirit forevermore leading your life on.......

.......earth. Him, you, earth, Christ peeps, oh, My Christ peeps, follow Me all of your days, I have given you a a person for such a greatest purpose as this, sheep of Mine. Be thy Mine, follow His leading, My sons and daughters of Me, of Mine

Click on this link, fellow Christ peeps of His, and, just promise me you will listen until the last bit of words, make this, if the whole doctrine of Christ seems to difficult to fully believe in, your creed, your 'Him.'

Rich Mullins - Step By Step - YouTube

 

[ReinItIn]

I don't believe we can loose it.. I believe Salvation is coming with Christ.. I will not have it till he returns..
I have his promises just like every person on the face of this earth.. His blood was shed for all man. people say those who turn away never had it.. i say none of us have it. Christ is working day and night with out rest to collect a people for the kingdom of God that will be his people and he be their God.

The lame man that could not get himself in to the fountain for healing was unable to walk. Then by grace and faith in Jesus he was able to walk. The only boast he had was that Jesus did it.. he not only walked he carried his bed.

The rich young ruler is an example of men in flesh unable to do what Jesus asked.. he walked away knowing he was unable.. Yet by grace through faith lots of people were able to give all they had.. they were no different then the rich young ruler that couldn't.. But God made them able by grace through faith that Jesus was Gods Son and their wealth was not needed because they have found something of greater value in Christ. So they have no boast.. It is not our work we are able to obey his words it is by grace through faith. Part of those words are humbling ourselves, confessing our sins, making things right when we do something wrong, being honest, being generous, loving our enemies, we can not do these thing except Christ has made us able to believe. He is the Son of God.. We are dead, blind, lame, wretched. We can only boast in the power of God as His grace enables us to do his works.

It seems to me a lot people are getting beliefs from other people and then parroting them and not seeking Christ for understanding and application of his Word in their life.

 

[marianna]

No one is teaching that it is all right to live in sin and flash the robe of righteousness around as you flirt with the world. What is the matter with you? However, when God cleanses the sinner by faith they are clean and their sin is put away and buried, never to be remembered any more and God imputes to them a gift of His righteousness that can never be taken from them or forfeited by them. It is a finished work and Christ did it on the cross and through His resurrection. This is why it is all grace and if it is not all grace then it is by works and if by works then it is not grace and we have a debt to pay and the debt that Christ paid counts for nothing.

Red33 this is what the Bible teaches.
When did the Church forget this?
I don't understand the fingerpointing about sin when every single person is not without sin.
It's quite distressing.

 

[ReinItIn]

Paul said salvation is something we hope for not something we have obtained..