Calvinist Kitchen...stirring the pot

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EleventhHour

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Grandpa said:
Regeneration does precede the fruit of the spirit, faith. It has to. You can't produce fruit without being regenerated.

How in the wide world of sports could that possibly be un-biblical?
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That would be incorrect according to the plain words of scripture...

John 1:12 does not say this....................... “But as many as have been regenerated, to them gave He the power to believe on His Name, even to those who have become the children of God.”

Notice also that John 20:31 says, “believing ye might have life.” It does NOT say, “having life ye might believe.”

In your view what must a sinner do to be regenerated? Oh right, nothing.

I guess this doctrine of total inability excludes the possibilities of ‘hearing the word."

A "fav" author of Calvinism dogma actually taught that babies can be regenerated and then later come to faith. :rolleyes::unsure:
 
NOV25

NOV25

Well-known member
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Nov 23, 2019
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Grandpa said:
Because you have to try before you realize you can't do it.
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Perhaps It’s impossible for those who haven’t been granted Godly repentance to understand what the word even means.

For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
 
Blue_Of_Lake

Blue_Of_Lake

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Jun 12, 2020
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lenna said:
or you could renew your mind by the word and the Holy Spirit could really prove what the good and perfect will of God is

what is the good and perfect will of God?
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or we could do both.


but that is a good question also.
 
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EleventhHour

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#2,304
NOV25 said:
Perhaps It’s impossible for those who haven’t been granted Godly repentance to understand what the word even means.

For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
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Well, if God has decided against granting it one has NO choice so why even bring it up, except to gloat of your exceptional status?
 
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eternally-gratefull

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Grandpa said:
Where did the belief (faith) come from to begin with?

Why is one of the fruit of the spirit Faith?


Was it given to you by God as a gift? Or was it something that you manufactured inside yourself and created by your own self?


More than likely it was a culmination of all the evidence you see around you. At least it was that way for me...
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It came from God

He 1st did the work the cross

Then he drew me

In the process of drawing me

He convicted me

He showed Me my sin and the cost (penalty)

He showed Me his love and his mercy

And through all these things unseen he showed Me the hope which could only come in him

In non of this did my power have any part in my salvation brother
 
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lenna

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Blue_Of_Lake said:
or we could do both.


but that is a good question also.
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if you do not know the word, you are open to being deceived. I am sure you are not saying that, but I would say be open to the leading of the Holy Spirit, but KNOW the word first

how does that sit?
 
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eternally-gratefull

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#2,307
I am saddened by what I have seen the last 20 or so pages. Where is the love of God
 
Blue_Of_Lake

Blue_Of_Lake

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lenna said:
if you do not know the word, you are open to being deceived. I am sure you are not saying that, but I would say be open to the leading of the Holy Spirit, but KNOW the word first

how does that sit?
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some things can be taken literally and be helpful, other things can only be understood by the Spirit. so unless we are open to the Spirit's leading, we might not understand all things correctly.
 
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lenna

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Blue_Of_Lake said:
some things can be taken literally and be helpful, other things can only be understood by the Spirit. so unless we are open to the Spirit's leading, we might not understand all things correctly.
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I am very conservative in how I 'receive' so I don't think we quite agree on the use of the word 'open' in the sense you mean it if I understand you correctly.

I take Jesus warnings about deception to be one of the most important things He says to us.

We are not to turn off our minds, we are to renew our minds by the Bible and then we are able to prove what is God's will. We do not have to chase around looking for the will of God. God's will does not change and if a person has the bedrock of the word upon which to stand, they will not be easily swayed or fooled.

That is what I think, believe and try to live by.
 
preacher4truth

preacher4truth

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Dec 28, 2016
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NOV25 said:
Perhaps It’s impossible for those who haven’t been granted Godly repentance to understand what the word even means.

For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
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True. 1 Corinthians 2:14.
 
Blue_Of_Lake

Blue_Of_Lake

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SoulWeaver

SoulWeaver

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NOV25 said:
This is part of the free will’ers problem, they truly believe man is autonomous: self governing or without outside governance, acting without ANY outside influence or limitation. This is an unbiblical, pagan view of the will of man. One only needs to read the Bible to see the will of man is fallen after Adam and Eve, like a disease that plagues all mankind. His will, his reason and his logic, his heart mind and soul, is evil continuously in need of cleansing. Cleansing offered only by God the Spirit who comes to whom he wills, when he wills and why he wills, for his own glory that no man may boast.
Sorry free will’ers, you’re not autonomous, you’re not gods who resurrect yourselves from the dead, who remove your own hearts of stone and replace it with a heart of flesh, who summon God the Spirit and command Him to dwell within...
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What makes you think that people who believe in existence of free will deny God's supremacy or claim they can will themselves into salvation on their own? Arminianism vs Calvinism is a false dichotomy, so please quit presenting it. Both doctrines like to stick to only certain verses they favor, and then deny other Scriptures that don't line up. That's not a good teaching if Scriptures strive against one another.
It is high time to admit that BOTH free will and God's will are indicated in the Scripture, one not contradicting the other.
 
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EleventhHour

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SoulWeaver said:
It is high time to admit that BOTH free will and God's will are indicated in the Scripture, one not contradicting the other.
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When a dogma is built on the "bondage of the will" that will be very hard to do.

But I absolutely agree with your post. A false dichotomy if there ever was one.
 
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