First Thread: ☕🙂👍📖 Should the Bible Be the Text Book?

I recently read somewhere about the use of the King James Bible's use of the pronouns "that and who". It doesn't matter where because I forget the thread. I just think it needs addressed for those who care to use the accurate translation.

The thing that readers should realize is that Grammer and language in general is constantly changing. There are far more rules of Grammer than there were 400 years ago. Many pastors want to bend the past to fit their 21st century perspective sometimes. This is mostly because they spend their time reading commentaries that are promoting and sales of their particular competing translation.

As to the proper use of the pronoun" that" when addressing a person.

Example: John 3:18

"He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

verse 36
"He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him."

I'm not a Grammer teacher, but today we would say, "He who believes..." in these two cases. Is there much confusion as to the use of "that" here?

When I read the Bible, I look for context and usage elsewhere of the same words/ phrases to define the text. That usually clarified any questions. When words are used interchangeably in the English, this is often because the same is true in the Greek.

What you are doing is getting a mail
Order degree. It is worth nothing! You need to go to an online seminary so you can continue to work & learn. I have my MDiv from the Canadian Southern Baptist Seminary & College in Cochrane, AB You may need to start at a college level. I cannot more highly recommend a place where you would become more prepared to serve God. It took me 7 years to finish my MDiv, but, I was so prepared. I was also asked to apply as a theology professor, but I was extremely unwell at the time, my RA meds were failing, and I was not reasonably going to finish my PhD degree on time. I do not regret the time I have spent working on my degrees. I rejoice in what I learned, including how to research & write papers, Greek & Hebrew, so many practical skills.

I guarantee you will Learn 1000 X more at a seminary that is Bible believing, than through a mail order degree mill. I am working on a PhD degree from BHCarroll in Texas, which also offers degrees at various levels. I am working on a PhD in Disability Theology. I might have to quit, because I just learned I am growing blind from Macular Degeneration. I'm still praying! I've been trained as a teacher, taught elementary school for many years, and did a work experience as a chaplain, which I lived, and continued to volunteer at for a year after, till I became more disabled than many of the patients!

Seminary teaches you so much more than you could ever learn yourself. It compresses wisdom & knowledge from many disciplines by many people. It gives you tools to counsel people, to preach, teach and care for God's people. You have access to models who are kind and experienced people, with high levels of degrees in accredited institutions. I loved my seminary, because they didn't teach you want to think, but how to learn to think. They didn't give you a bunch of rules, or doctrines, but made you dig them out of the Bible. They help model mature Christians. All my professors were former International Mission Board Missionaries, through the SBC, although that has changed. These people, including husbands & wives have given their lives to serve Christ and share the gospel. They are truly men & women of God you can learn from and trust. They are affiliated with the Southern Baptist tradition, they do not ordain women. But the seminary was so popular with such a high rating, that women preachers from other denominations came there. We had a woman Anglican priest, a woman pastor from the Chinese Alliance church. And yes, we all took courses like preaching together. I think that was harder on me than the men in the class. I'm in a Baptist denomination now that lets women preach & be ordained, and I do preach, although not since I had COVID in Jan of 2022. I'm finally recovering from that, and other illnesses that have come my way!

You have the time, but maybe not the money. Talk to the registrars. They are looking for people with a heart to serve God in many places. They will help you with finding jobs etc. Even Jesus prepared himself before he began his ministry. I assure you that you will never regret choosing to put yourself under mature, senior Christians who can lead & guide you. Online is a challenge, but its advantages are many, esp doing it in your own time, from wherever your live in Canada. There are Jan & May courses which are intensives, that you have to be on campus for. But it is a good opportunity to meet people & learn from staff & students. Feel free to contact me if you want to know more. Plus, my seminary left it to you to decide and defend your theology., Your ideas come out of the Bible, and what you read and learn. But be prepared to write lots of papers!! I've always loved writing papers! I know Lutheran students could do a directed course with a qualified Lutheran pastor. I don't know why they just didn't go to Saskatchewan, to the Lutheran Seminary there. We had Mennonite pastors, Reformed pastors, and even a charismatic who took courses yearly. That was a real learning experience for many of the seminary students!

I might be getting mail, but I do recognize that just because a college or university issues a diploma, does not in any way indicate that God called or ordained a person.

So Angela, what are the qualifications of a pastor?
I might be getting mail, but I do recognize that just because a college or university issues a diploma, does not in any way indicate that God called or ordained a person.

My former pastor recommended me to a correspondence course from an american bible college, but being on social assistance and paying monthly fees and postage and currency change makes it quite challenging.

There really are no Biblical qualifications for a pastor, which you already know! Anyone can hang out their shingle, start a church with no training, no understanding of the Bible or relationship with Christ!

But seriously, without the skills and information Seminary training gives you, the chances of being successful are slim and none.

You can also have a ragged piece of paper from a diploma mill. In fact, the assistant pastor in my church was like that when we first arrived. He had a BA from a local Bible college. I looked it up, and it basically was a study what you want, and then we'll give you a piece of paper so you can get hired by a church,

This guy was great with teens and children. But he couldn't preach at all. He couldn't even speak English well, which is why he had to go the paper mill route. He also had no initiative, rarely followed through on things, including making time to talk to the senior pastor, who was trying to mentor him as part of his training to stay as Associate Pastor. He couldn't do it! He didn't have the organizational or other skills, and he was let go. Our new associate pastor for kids & teens is dynamic, exciting and a leader. She has a theology degree, undergrad, from King's College in Edmonton, affiliated with the University of Alberta. She is registered with Carey college in Vancouver, affiliated with UBC, and is our denominational school, taking courses towards a master's degree.

I personally knew I needed so much more knowledge & wisdom to be in ministry. I needed role models, courses which taught skills, like preaching, teaching & counseling. And Greek & Hebrew! But you don't have to take a MDiv, there are lots of other degrees, with no languages, which are also useful in leading a church. God has not personally called me to be a pastor. My goal was to write, and specifically about Disability Theology as I am disabled. I run a FB group for my illness, with 3700 people. I use all the leadership and decision making skills I learned in my degree. Do I need a MDiv to run a health FB group? Of course not! But, for writing books, it is better to have solid academic qualifications. My father was a university professor for 33 years. I watched the whole process of him getting his degrees, and becoming an outstanding teaching member of the University of Alberta. He did need his degrees.

I don't need them, but I never would have learned all the invaluable things I picked up in my formal studies. It filled a need in me, but also a calling of God to learn his word, and to study to show myself an approved worker. It also shows accountability. And God does expect us to be accountable. Accreditation also shows accountability, too. If you don't want accountability, then don't bother with a degree, continue with your diploma plans.

The problem with a paper mill diploma is that you will never be able to advance. No institution is going to accept it as accredited. Or, perhaps they are accredited by a lower level body. That would be fine, too! But why shoot for the bottom, instead of the top? My education honours God. It honours his plan for my life. God has opened doors of leadership within the disabled community.

Are you sick that you cannot work? I was on disability, I'm now retired. That helped me pay my costs. I can't physically work. But a good portion of the online students were full time pastors or bivocational. Of course, that is between you & God.

I'd just really like to see you get a quality education to serve God. You have a heart and a calling, do your best, not the minimum. Of course, it may not be right for you. I will never regret the years I have taken to properly study the Bible, and to get to know God better, which I had tried, but could not do on my own!

Are you able to work, even part time? CSBS is mostly online. You need a computer & internet. A lot of the courses are hybrid, so you interact with the other students & teachers. There is a huge library you will have access to. Do you live in the West?

You would not be earning a diploma. You would be earning a degree which is accredited by the top religious education body in North America. ATS Associated Theological Schools. To be accredited you have to prove the seminary is at the top of its field. Things like all the professors have PhDs or DMins. You have to take so many on campus courses. The curriculums have to be inspected to make sure they confirm and are equivalent to the other degree granting institutes, everything from Harvard, Southern Baptist Seminaries to Western Seminary in Portland. Here is a booklet you can read.

https://www.ats.edu/files/galleries/self-study-handbook.pdf

It really is important to go to an accredited seminary. A diploma from a correspond school is worth nothing, I had the choice when I got my MDiv if going to a secular university, as my degree is accepted by all universities in North America. Or, I could go to a Theological School, also accredited to get my PhD in Theology!

Its more than grammer, its doctrine itself, check the same verse in different bibles and you will see some of them are changed to change the meaning of the text, the doctrine or removed all together.

I attended an Evangelical mega church for a good while. There also happened to be folks leading who were from various backgrounds.
I noticed that there were many more opinions on the tools for ministry. They included software, daily devotional books and various guides. Pastors might want consistency and proper doctrine by establishing his own preference. I see a place for various media tools, but with that was a tendency to substitute the devotionals for the raw Word of God. I have a pattern that works for me and that's the Bible daily with insight from the Holy Spirit.
Perhaps there are many opinions on this. Mine is to encourage believers to establish a lifelong routine for daily Bible reading.

The whole Holy Bible is necessary for salvation.

And, after salvation, then "...living By Every Word" Of The Whole Holy Bible! ♫ 😇 ↑

there best item to preach from is the Holy Bible according to God, the KJB. i-pads, computers can word something a bit different, the pastor may not notice the change in meaning & then he's preaching a false doctrine.

Its more than grammer, its doctrine itself, check the same verse in different bibles and you will see some of them are changed to change the meaning of the text, the doctrine or removed all together.

If anyone actually wanted me yes, but most people refuse to hire me because I dont have a valid G license or a car. Its called being punished for being poor. Well right now I am commited to Georgian College for Tourism in the fall.

there best item to preach from is the Holy Bible according to God, the KJB. i-pads, computers can word something a bit different, the pastor may not notice the change in meaning & then he's preaching a false doctrine.

This is a recognized college of study, and you are taking a course which should get you a job, when you graduate. That is a good thing. I was a teacher, I have a teaching certificate, and taught until Rheumatoid Arthritis kicked me to the curb. But, because I had the degree, I was able to get on disability when I became ill, which I stayed on till I retired. Not my first choice, nor even the last - to be on disability and in pain, but God used it to open doors to ministry.

I had thought you were speaking about getting some kind of diploma in being a pastor. That is my misunderstanding. Certainly, you will need a job to live. We stayed in some hotels this winter, visiting my dying mom in Edmonton. Literally, one entire hotel, with a recognizable chain name, was run by Chinese people. Many of the service clerks barely spoke English. To find a native speaking Canadian in a hotel, may be very special in the near future, it seems. So good luck with your training. Or, if your idea is to get a job to support you, while you attend some kind of Bible school, then I stand by my previous posts. At any rate, your future is decided the next few years, and I pray God will guide and lead you. I googled that college, and you are going to have to stand very strong as a Christian. It seems like it is bending over backwards to be the maximum "woke" allowable! I found the same thing in education, back in the 1980s, when I did my teaching certificate. If you are ever wondering why the educational system in Canada is such a mess, it started a long time ago.

As for different Bible saying different things in the same verse, not so much. Sometimes, that comes from different numbering systems. For example, some people include the title as the first verse. The Hebrews did that. Other times, verses are spurious, and left out. Although mostly a footnote makes note of that, or square brackets are used in some version. Other times, there are legitimate differences of interpretations of words. Or, later manuscripts are corrupt, and add many verses and/or words. KJV is a good example of that. Erasmus, a Catholic priest did most of the translating of Greek and the KJV committee used his translations. He used 7 corrupted, 15th century Greek manuscripts. In places, even he could see the Vulgate was wrong, but the Catholic approval committee, said use the accept, corrupted version, or they would not give him the imprimatur, in other words, Catholic church approval. The KJV has been a solid version for hundreds of years, but there are a lot of mistakes in it. If you study the history of manuscripts, you can learn all of these things, I have. But, if someone reads the KJV and it gives meaning, the gospel is still the same. I personally can't read KJV English, never liked Shakespeare, either. I can read 6 languages, but none of them is 16th century early modern English, cause I have never studied it. I've read many, many different translations, and also the original languages. I'll take the original languages over anything translated into any language. But, I prefer a Bible in my heart language, which is modern English.

I was reading the NET, because the footnotes are incredible. But, I am in the early stages of Macular Degeneration, going blind, and I finally switched to a different version with larger print, and better contrast between the dark letters and the white paper. Sad I have to change Bible because I can't see. But I will keep up with my Bible reading, until such day as I am forced to go to audio bible. Sigh!

I know, I was taught the King James issue from the time I got saved.

What you are doing is getting a mail
Order degree. It is worth nothing! You need to go to an online seminary so you can continue to work & learn. I have my MDiv from the Canadian Southern Baptist Seminary & College in Cochrane, AB You may need to start at a college level. I cannot more highly recommend a place where you would become more prepared to serve God. It took me 7 years to finish my MDiv, but, I was so prepared. I was also asked to apply as a theology professor, but I was extremely unwell at the time, my RA meds were failing, and I was not reasonably going to finish my PhD degree on time. I do not regret the time I have spent working on my degrees. I rejoice in what I learned, including how to research & write papers, Greek & Hebrew, so many practical skills.

I guarantee you will Learn 1000 X more at a seminary that is Bible believing, than through a mail order degree mill. I am working on a PhD degree from BHCarroll in Texas, which also offers degrees at various levels. I am working on a PhD in Disability Theology. I might have to quit, because I just learned I am growing blind from Macular Degeneration. I'm still praying! I've been trained as a teacher, taught elementary school for many years, and did a work experience as a chaplain, which I lived, and continued to volunteer at for a year after, till I became more disabled than many of the patients!

Seminary teaches you so much more than you could ever learn yourself. It compresses wisdom & knowledge from many disciplines by many people. It gives you tools to counsel people, to preach, teach and care for God's people. You have access to models who are kind and experienced people, with high levels of degrees in accredited institutions. I loved my seminary, because they didn't teach you want to think, but how to learn to think. They didn't give you a bunch of rules, or doctrines, but made you dig them out of the Bible. They help model mature Christians. All my professors were former International Mission Board Missionaries, through the SBC, although that has changed. These people, including husbands & wives have given their lives to serve Christ and share the gospel. They are truly men & women of God you can learn from and trust. They are affiliated with the Southern Baptist tradition, they do not ordain women. But the seminary was so popular with such a high rating, that women preachers from other denominations came there. We had a woman Anglican priest, a woman pastor from the Chinese Alliance church. And yes, we all took courses like preaching together. I think that was harder on me than the men in the class. I'm in a Baptist denomination now that lets women preach & be ordained, and I do preach, although not since I had COVID in Jan of 2022. I'm finally recovering from that, and other illnesses that have come my way!

You have the time, but maybe not the money. Talk to the registrars. They are looking for people with a heart to serve God in many places. They will help you with finding jobs etc. Even Jesus prepared himself before he began his ministry. I assure you that you will never regret choosing to put yourself under mature, senior Christians who can lead & guide you. Online is a challenge, but its advantages are many, esp doing it in your own time, from wherever your live in Canada. There are Jan & May courses which are intensives, that you have to be on campus for. But it is a good opportunity to meet people & learn from staff & students. Feel free to contact me if you want to know more. Plus, my seminary left it to you to decide and defend your theology., Your ideas come out of the Bible, and what you read and learn. But be prepared to write lots of papers!! I've always loved writing papers! I know Lutheran students could do a directed course with a qualified Lutheran pastor. I don't know why they just didn't go to Saskatchewan, to the Lutheran Seminary there. We had Mennonite pastors, Reformed pastors, and even a charismatic who took courses yearly. That was a real learning experience for many of the seminary students