Master of Divinity Student

[Albert]

I didnt come to argue but to talk sense about how this subject matter is hurtful to believers faith.
God Bless you

 

[Dino246]

I didnt come to argue but to talk sense about how this subject matter is hurtful to believers faith.
God Bless you

Ignoring Scripture that refutes your position is not “talking sense” at all.

 

[Albert]

actually...im being obedient to Jesus and not adding to what would cause derision. I spoke truth to you. Accept it or not. I did my job and im moving on. But it does no good to argue. I blessed you to keep the fellowship of peace and that is way more important then being right or wrong in all discussions. Truth be told, I have a personal relationship with Jesus and he teaches me.

Titus 3:9

But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless.
​

 

[Albert]

Galatians 5:22-23

New International Version



22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. Their needs to be Holy Spirit Lead and Inspired discussions. When discussions tempt others to turn to their own ways of winning an argument or being right above all, well then That is not the fruit of the Holy Spirit, is it. Its just the flesh showing off and I dont want to sin or tempt or others to sin either. Its best to leave when things start to turn away from Gods plan. Men in their own ways trying to explain scripture is an ugly sight. Not one I want to stick around for.

so... truly .. God Bless you... Peace and Grace of our Lord Jesus Christ too you all

 

[Albert]

Galatians 5:22-23

New International Version



22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. Their needs to be Holy Spirit Lead and Inspired discussions. When discussions tempt others to turn to their own ways of winning an argument or being right above all, well then That is not the fruit of the Holy Spirit, is it. Its just the flesh showing off and I dont want to sin or tempt or others to sin either. Its best to leave when things start to turn away from Gods plan. Men in their own ways trying to explain scripture is an ugly sight. Not one I want to stick around for.

so... truly .. God Bless you... Peace and Grace of our Lord Jesus Christ too you all

 

[GWH]

The point I was making is according to the One verse I put was to make everyone understand that the subject matter is improperly asked and thus being used to create doubts in the readers. To Question your very salvation is something we are commanded not to do... Thats doubting! The very question suggest to the reader to question Gods faithfullness and Promises. It is an unfruitful question. satan asks questions to causes doubts...

genesis 3:1
New International Version
Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the
LORD God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?”

May I point out that the original sin was not questioning God?
Instead of asking God why this snake contradicted His command,
A&E chose to believe the lie.
Doubt is unavoidable, because it is the opposite side of the coin of faith;
but we are wise to doubt our doubts.

 

[Lamar]

Hey! What happen to answering "all" question?

Still waiting on Post# 134.

 

[GWH]

actually...im being obedient to Jesus and not adding to what would cause derision. I spoke truth to you. Accept it or not. I did my job and im moving on. But it does no good to argue. I blessed you to keep the fellowship of peace and that is way more important then being right or wrong in all discussions. Truth be told, I have a personal relationship with Jesus and he teaches me.

Titus 3:9

But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless.
​

I completely agree with your desire to obey Paul's instruction not to argue,
and it is indeed a fine line sometimes between where discussion becomes quarreling.
However, may I encourage you to have the courage of your convictions and be willing
to obey Peter's command to explain them so you will not move on before you should.

I think you might find our website worth investigating, because I say the same thing
about agreement/unity regarding the Gospel is more important than being right about
secondary doctrines in Lesson 2 at <truthseekersfellowship.com>

Please feel free to comment or discuss it on a thread I sponsor, such as Apologetics (Lesson 1),
The Kerygma (Lesson 2), Hermeneutics, etc.

 

[Albert]

I appreciate your comments , understanding, and invitation.

 

[GWH]

Hey! What happen to answering "all" question?

Still waiting on Post# 134.

The Lord is teaching you patience.

 

[NeutralZone]

Neutral,
While I do believe in that verse, I believe it will take place when Jesus comes back and returns at his second coming. It will be then that the Spiritual gifts will cease.

Well, you should know that while my professors often press us even in on what we believe, they often use arguments of the differing views to push back. My professors believe the gifts are for today and are continuationists.

You can believe whatever you wish. Scripture at 1 Corinthians 13:8 says otherwise.

While on earth, Jesus gave his apostles the power to perform miracles, which included healing the sick and even raising the dead. For instance, Peter raised the deceased Tabitha (Dorcas) at Acts 9:36-42. Similarly, Peter raised Euʹty·chus from the dead at Acts 20:7-12

Luke 9:1
"Then he [Jesus] called the Twelve together and gave them power and authority over all the demons and to cure diseases.

Luke 9:2
And he sent them out to preach the Kingdom of God and to heal,"


No one since the 1st century C.E. (when the last of Jesus' apostles died) has had authority over the demons, has had the ability to almost instantaneously cure diseases, much less raise people from the dead. But you expect me to believe that speaking in tongues, which was included among the aforementioned miraculous abilities, somehow survived into our century while the other miraculous abilities did not.

By the way, when someone is "speaking in tongues" at a Pentacostal gather, what language, might I ask, are they speaking?

 

[NeutralZone]

I am guessing you see the N.T. as the, 'perfect arriving', hence, no gifts or ministries.

Romans 13:9-10
For we know in part and we prophesy in part; but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away.

Please don't assume when, "the perfect comes", that is referring to the scripture.

Simply because you generate a contradiction in the minds of those reading your post.

If the text (1 Corinthians) is perfect.

Then the instruction by Paul to the Corinthian church in 1 Corinthians is redundant.

Why would Paul tell the Corinthian church.

14 Pursue love, yet desire earnestly spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.

When they are holding the perfect in their hands?

See my response to Taylorj2 at Post 271.
https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...-divinity-student.219828/page-14#post-5550815


Thereafter, you and Taylorj2 can explain to those reading this thread why all of the other miraculous abilities given to Jesus's First Century C.E. apostles (raising people from the dead, instantly curing diseases, having power over the demons, accurately prophesying, etc.) ceased after the last 1st Century apostle died and why only the supposed miraculous ability to speak in tongues survived into the 21st century.

Oh, and by the way, be sure and find out from Taylorj2 what language is being spoken during these "speaking in tongues" events at Pentacostal churches. Last time I heard, nobody had a clue what was being babbled at those events. Even the person doing the babbling didn't know what they were saying.

Inquiring minds want to know.

 

[Taylorj2]

You can believe whatever you wish. Scripture at 1 Corinthians 13:8 says otherwise.

While on earth, Jesus gave his apostles the power to perform miracles, which included healing the sick and even raising the dead. For instance, Peter raised the deceased Tabitha (Dorcas) at Acts 9:36-42. Similarly, Peter raised Euʹty·chus from the dead at Acts 20:7-12

Luke 9:1
"Then he [Jesus] called the Twelve together and gave them power and authority over all the demons and to cure diseases.

Luke 9:2
And he sent them out to preach the Kingdom of God and to heal,"


No one since the 1st century C.E. (when the last of Jesus' apostles died) has had authority over the demons, has had the ability to almost instantaneously cure diseases, much less raise people from the dead. But you expect me to believe that speaking in tongues, which was included among the aforementioned miraculous abilities, somehow survived into our century while the other miraculous abilities did not.

By the way, when someone is "speaking in tongues" at a Pentacostal gather, what language, might I ask, are they speaking?

Is that so? Why then in Church history are their reports of miracles, demons being cast out, dead raising? Also, you do realize that the first century would not have been the completion of that which is perfect? (If you suppose the Bible), it was still being selected. Also, why would Paul impart spiritual gifts in a Church other than the apostles (Romans 1:11)? I am fascinated by your response, and I DO hope you have answers.

 

[Taylorj2]

Hey! What happen to answering "all" question?

Still waiting on Post# 134.

I will get to them as I can. Forgive me for falling short, but I can't answer ALL questions with hundreds of questions, but I will answer as many as I can.

 

[Taylorj2]

A PERSON CAN NEVER EVER LOSE THEIR SALAVTION. for it is written


Ephesians 1:13-14

New International Version



13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.

Salavtion is The HOLY SPIRIT given to us by GOD! Jesus promises Him to us forever!
Now, can people sin against their salvation. Yes, as unadvisable as it is but the Holy Spirit never leaves a true born again believer! so the very topic is misleading! A man still reaps what he sows and His actions good or bad will be judged by God and in the end a man will never lose their salvation (The Holy Spirit) BUT can come under Gods wrath if he tests God by sinning while saved. When Gods final judgement comes its more like, "What did you do with what I gave you"? This subject is a very unadvisable subject to talk about because it does not edify the reader and implicates lies instead of clear and concise truth based on the whole word of God.

Hebrews 6 says otherwise. The early Church also did not agree with once saved always saved.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Is that so? Why then in Church history are their reports of miracles, demons being cast out, dead raising? Also, you do realize that the first century would not have been the completion of that which is perfect? (If you suppose the Bible), it was still being selected. Also, why would Paul impart spiritual gifts in a Church other than the apostles (Romans 1:11)? I am fascinated by your response, and I DO hope you have answers.

Yeah, don't listen to them. God can't work through them to heal, cast demons out and other gifts! You believe and have the ability as the Holy Spirit sees fit. In my own experience I've healed, cast out demons, etc. It doesn't happen for me everyday - only sporadically when the Holy Spirit sees a true need to be met!

 

[Dino246]

actually...im being obedient to Jesus and not adding to what would cause derision. I spoke truth to you. Accept it or not. I did my job and im moving on. But it does no good to argue. I blessed you to keep the fellowship of peace and that is way more important then being right or wrong in all discussions. Truth be told, I have a personal relationship with Jesus and he teaches me.

Titus 3:9

But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless.
​

I'm disappointed that you consider the presentation of plain Scripture to be "foolish... unprofitable, and useless".

Oh well. You're free to do as you see fit.

 

[Albert]

Taylorj2

Where in the bible specifically where it says a beleiver will lose the Holy Spirit? im not talking about being enlightened an then faliing as it is written in hebrews. You all say your Holy Spirit filled as I am also. Now let me ask you this. Will the Holy Spirit ever leave you? Well i know the bible says he will be with us forever. He is the Gift of Salavation I speak of. Now can A person turn away from that salvation back to sin... yes. But the Holy Spirit never leaves us thus we dont lose the gift of Salavation but God is still judge of his people for their deeds , good or bad...

 

[Albert]

Dino246, why are you provoking me and tempting me to sin? Have you not read the dangers of causing someone whos the Lord into sin. Don't test me again lest you arouse the Lord Jesus Christ anger, who is my husband. You will quickly find out that I am of Christ's house and all words spoken against his annointed have consequences online or otherwise

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Dino246, why are you provoking me and tempting me to sin? Have you not read the dangers of causing someone whos the Lord into sin. Don't test me again lest you arouse the Lord Jesus Christ anger, who is my husband. You will quickly find out that I am of Christ's house and all words spoken against his annointed have consequences online or otherwise

How is he trying to provoke and tempt you to sin??? What threat are you exactly going to carry out against him if he does???