Sermon on the mount - life or legalistic junk

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
1,430
0
#81
Originally Posted by Stephen63


~~~Notice to the reader: some things aren't as they appear.~~~

The kid gloves are off, & the true colors come to the forefront.
Yeah, this is what she's really like.:)



Yep it me and Peter talk, he appreciate it.

You don't. That's why me and you, don't talk much.
Just ignore that type of behavior. It has a purpose and it is to cause strife and division. I do the same thing and ignore this type of foul behavior.

Romans 16:17 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP]
Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
 
Mar 23, 2017
474
3
0
#82
~~~Notice to the reader: some things aren't as they appear.~~~

The kid gloves are off, & the true colors come to the forefront.
Yeah, this is what she's really like.:)
The Reader has noticed the lady appears.... weary. The Reader can empathize about what it is like being torn between two friends. The Reader hopes rather the lady will be refreshed by the love of Jesus Christ.

Matthew 5:43-47

[SUP]43 [/SUP]Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
[SUP]44 [/SUP]But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
[SUP]45 [/SUP]That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
[SUP]46 [/SUP]For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
[SUP]47 [/SUP]And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#83
That is actually pretty sweet Chokmahiel, thanks.

Still not sure what to think of you, but it's nice to have another person posting scriptures.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
16,682
3,545
113
#84
If the sermon on the mount is to the church, the body of Christ...how do I know which parts to take literally and which parts to spiritualize?
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#85
Didn't want him to feel ignored G777. I don't comment on most of his post because I don't really feel like he listens or cares so it feels like a waste of time.

Peter has gotten a lot better at expressing his beliefs and I find that encouraging. Its pretty awesome to see God at work.

His interpretations/summary of others beliefs needs work, but there is hope.
 
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#86

Peter believes that we need to do righteous things or we are not saved. That is a perversion of the gospel of the grace of Christ. Peter believes that we become righteous by what we do but maybe he has recently come to believe in Christ as our righteousness only.

I have him on ignore because of his behavior so basically I ignore him until I see repentance to at the very least say what people are really saying without being deceitful in saying something else they are saying.

Unfortunately he comes up with his own "thoughts" on what is being said - no matter how many times you say the complete opposite. He then proceeds to attack and talk about this "belief" as if it is real. People can't have any type of a discussion when this is occurring and it is a complete waste of time and does nothing but cause strife and division.
Peter believes that we need to do righteous things :-
I believe we need a heart to walk righteously or we are not saved.
How well we do on this road is down to our relationship with Jesus and our fellow brothers
and sisters in the Lord.

Peter believes that we become righteous by what we do:-
We become righteous by believing in Christ and the cross that washes us clean, pure and holy,
because of our repentance, confession and faith in Him.

Now our transformation from sinner to saint is our walk of discipleship
and sanctification.

Now after over a year of me repeatedly saying the same things, I wonder how
someone can state something I have never said.

So how is it that such a gross miss-representation is made after such a long
amount of interaction? Because in the end the argument is being lost by there
party. It cannot be won because the Lords word is so plain, the more one discusses
it the clearer it becomes.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#87
If the sermon on the mount is to the church, the body of Christ...how do I know which parts to take literally and which parts to spiritualize?
Define literal?

Is metaphor literal or figurative?

How does one "spiritualize" scripture.

The sermon on the mount is both literal and spiritual just like the parables have both a literal and spiritual meaning.
 

Jimbone

Senior Member
Aug 22, 2014
2,730
836
113
44
#88
I agree that grace doesn't leave us in the same place we were found and it is a daily walk in the Lord - trusting in Him to bring about what He has done in our lives.

I agree with you that the hating of God's ways are a sign of an anti-Christ belief system. The hating of God's ways is trying to establish our own righteousness by what we do or don't do.

I vehemently attack the notion that we can be righteous by what we do or don't do. I agree with the truth that we will bear fruits of righteousness as Christ lives in and through us.

Peter believes that we need to do righteous things or we are not saved. That is a perversion of the gospel of the grace of Christ. Peter believes that we become righteous by what we do but maybe he has recently come to believe in Christ as our righteousness only.

I have him on ignore because of his behavior so basically I ignore him until I see repentance to at the very least say what people are really saying without being deceitful in saying something else they are saying.

Unfortunately he comes up with his own "thoughts" on what is being said - no matter how many times you say the complete opposite. He then proceeds to attack and talk about this "belief" as if it is real. People can't have any type of a discussion when this is occurring and it is a complete waste of time and does nothing but cause strife and division.

I pray for him all the time before the Father - that the Lord bless him and reveal Christ to him - we all need Christ to be revealed to us.
See this is the biggest point of contention from my point of view, you say "Peter believes that we need to do righteous things or we are not saved".
Well do you not believe that once you are saved that we will do righteous things? I know very well you do, and I know very well that you also know that God gets that glory because it is only by His Spirit inside of us that we are even capable of good. If God is truly working in us it HAS to produce righteousness, how can it not?

Are you saying that the creator of EVERYTHING can remake you, the atonement of our sins paid for by the sacrifice of the "King of Kings" Jesus Christ, this has provided the ONLY way of reconciliation with our almighty creator, and you can be reborn understanding this, and still live in sin unchanged? I don't. In my experience it DOES do what Peter says it does, and AFTER salvation, BECAUSE of it. If you are saved it WILL produce fruit. I feel you agree with most these points, yet just don't agree with his blunt style of saying it?
 
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#89
Peter believes that we need to do righteous things :-
I believe we need a heart to walk righteously or we are not saved.
How well we do on this road is down to our relationship with Jesus and our fellow brothers
and sisters in the Lord.

Peter believes that we become righteous by what we do:-
We become righteous by believing in Christ and the cross that washes us clean, pure and holy,
because of our repentance, confession and faith in Him.

Now our transformation from sinner to saint is our walk of discipleship
and sanctification.

Now after over a year of me repeatedly saying the same things, I wonder how
someone can state something I have never said.

So how is it that such a gross miss-representation is made after such a long
amount of interaction? Because in the end the argument is being lost by there
party. It cannot be won because the Lords word is so plain, the more one discusses
it the clearer it becomes.
Let me play devils advocate on my statements:-

Peter believes that we become righteous by what we do:-
Because we repent, confess and trust God, Christ and the cross, our sins are forgiven.
Now this is an action on our part, which means we are made righteous.
So in one way of looking at it this statement could be deemed as true, though for many
the doing in terms of repentance, confession and faith is not a doing, it is a response.

Peter believes that we need to do righteous things :-
As followers of Christ our heart is full of love, overflowing to others.
We were destined to do good works, this is our calling.
So we will do righteous things, it is who we are.

So this illustrates how small statements can both be untrue or true depending
on how you read them or want to read them.
 
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#90
He has you mixed up with Stephen or Skinski?

Gang colors, you appear to be wearing them, just FYI.

I have read enough of your post to know you don't believe that, but reexamine your "friends" some of them do believe it and you haven't said a word.

Plus the whole "lose your salvation" issue we haven't really resolved makes it an easy assumption to make if folks don't know the difference.

"Their party" are losing?

I believe everyone is losing in this gang war.
Ariel - Yep, there is bad stuff on all sides. And to be honest things have progressed.
Certain names of the past were not good, and counter productive.

And a lot of positions have mellowed. And I have learnt a lot. So on balance I say,
amen.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
16,682
3,545
113
#91
Define literal?

Is metaphor literal or figurative?

How does one "spiritualize" scripture.

The sermon on the mount is both literal and spiritual just like the parables have both a literal and spiritual meaning.
Literal in that, this is what Jesus said and He meant it or this is what Jesus said but we shouldn't take it literal as an actual thing to apply to my life but this is a principle.
 
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#92
If the sermon on the mount is to the church, the body of Christ...how do I know which parts to take literally and which parts to spiritualize?
The point about the sermon on the mount is it takes a lifetime to fully appreciate.
It is the work of the Holy Spirit and the body to bring aspects to light and through
obedience to actually experience change.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#93
Ariel - Yep, there is bad stuff on all sides. And to be honest things have progressed.
Certain names of the past were not good, and counter productive.

And a lot of positions have mellowed. And I have learnt a lot. So on balance I say,
amen.
Lol I saw your last post and deleted the one you responded too (in case folks wonder where it went)

It's good. I find watching how God works through you to be encouraging, brother.

I am sharp, but I hope you realize it's because I love you and want you to understand how your words can sometimes be misread.

I expect you to do the same if I get embroiled in a misunderstanding with another brother or sister.

Have a blessed day. See you around.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
16,682
3,545
113
#94
The point about the sermon on the mount is it takes a lifetime to fully appreciate.
It is the work of the Holy Spirit and the body to bring aspects to light and through
obedience to actually experience change.
So don't take what Jesus is saying literally and apply it to your life?
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#95
Literal in that, this is what Jesus said and He meant it or this is what Jesus said but we shouldn't take it literal as an actual thing to apply to my life but this is a principle.
I take it as literal teachings we should apply to our lives.

We should go the extra mile, forgive those who hurt us, pray for God's will be done on Earth as it is in Heaven, not murder people in our hearts, not worry about tomorrow, etc.

Which part of the sermon of the mount would not be applicable to living godly lives for God's glory through the power of the Holy Spirit?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
16,682
3,545
113
#96
I take it as literal teachings we should apply to our lives.

We should go the extra mile, forgive those who hurt us, pray for God's will be done on Earth as it is in Heaven, not murder people in our hearts, not worry about tomorrow, etc.

Which part of the sermon of the mount would not be applicable to living godly lives for God's glory through the power of the Holy Spirit?
If one looks at another out of lust, they should pluck their eye out...
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#98
If one looks at another out of lust, they should pluck their eye out...
Metaphoric language..see you are switching the meaning of literal now, before you said if you should apply it to your life.

Now you mean literal versus figurative language.

We could discuss the spiritual meaning of the sermon of the mount.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

preacher4truth

Senior Member
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,718
113
Metaphoric language..see you are switching the meaning of literal now, before you said if you should apply it to your life.

Now you mean literal versus figurative language.
This is due to possessing an inconsistent hermeneutic. The passage must submit to his theology, not the other way around. But anyhow, good luck! ;)