here goes Luke.....
[youtube] John Hiatt - Have A Little Faith In Me - YouTube [/youtube]
did it work?
[youtube] John Hiatt - Have A Little Faith In Me - YouTube [/youtube]
did it work?
Come Let Us Reason Together
- Thread starter Skinski7
- Start date
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i do believe the DISGRACEFUL LUCIFERIAN - (not) NEW "I-WANT-TO-BE-SAVED-BUT-I-WILLINGLY-CLING-TO-A-CULT-HERESY--IT'S-NOT-WHAT-JESUS,-DID-IT'S-WHAT-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-DO-DELUSIAN is the biggest black eye (i speak as a madman) SATANIC BLASPHEMY Against the Most Holy Most High that ever was.
eh....what's new?
Isaiah 14
you who laid the nations low!
13 You said in your heart,
‘I will ascend to heaven;
above the stars of God
I will set my throne on high;
I will sit on the mount of assembly
in the far reaches of the north;b
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;
I will make myself like the Most High.’
15 But you are brought down to Sheol,
to the far reaches of the pit.
16 Those who see you will stare at you
and ponder over you:
‘Is this the man who made the earth tremble,
who shook kingdoms,
17 who made the world like a desert
and overthrew its cities,
who did not let his prisoners go home?’
eh....what's new?
Isaiah 14
you who laid the nations low!
13 You said in your heart,
‘I will ascend to heaven;
above the stars of God
I will set my throne on high;
I will sit on the mount of assembly
in the far reaches of the north;b
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;
I will make myself like the Most High.’
15 But you are brought down to Sheol,
to the far reaches of the pit.
16 Those who see you will stare at you
and ponder over you:
‘Is this the man who made the earth tremble,
who shook kingdoms,
17 who made the world like a desert
and overthrew its cities,
who did not let his prisoners go home?’
So "WE must first die with Christ" before "the power of God can save us" ?? How do "we" do just that ? It's not about us or what "we" must do Skinski. Never was and never will be. Do you understand what I'm saying ? I dare ya to watch this beautiful clip without a tear swelling in your eye 
O Holy Night - Josh Groban - YouTube
O Holy Night - Josh Groban - YouTube
FALL ON YOUR KNEES
ALL HAIL
JESUS
I dare ya to watch this beautiful clip without a tear swelling in your eye
O Holy Night - Josh Groban - YouTube
O Holy Night - Josh Groban - YouTube
For to Us a Child Is Born
2 cThe people who walked in darkness
have seen a great light;
those who dwelt in a land of deep darkness,
on them has light shined.
3 You have multiplied the nation;
you have increased its joy;
they rejoice before you
as with joy at the harvest,
as they are glad when they divide the spoil.
4 For the yoke of his burden,
and the staff for his shoulder,
the rod of his oppressor,
you have broken as on the day of Midian.
5 For every boot of the tramping warrior in battle tumult
and every garment rolled in blood
will be burned as fuel for the fire.
6 For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given;
and the government shall be upond his shoulder,
and his name shall be callede
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7 Of the increase of his government and of peace
there will be no end,
on the throne of David and over his kingdom,
to establish it and to uphold it
with justice and with righteousness
from this time forth and forevermore.
The zeal of the LORD of hosts will do this.
Acts 5:331-32
31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.
Ezekiel 36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
No one gets the Holy Spirit by merit. It is Gods work.
There are things to do to come to Christ. Coming to Christ is doing. But the cleaning is done by Him not by us. The purifying of the Heart is done by Him not by us.
You can re-iterate the law to someone but that doesn't mean they can keep it through their own strength. God gave the Law through Moses but they weren't able to keep it. It was given to them because of transgression. Same with those passages in James.
All of these things are the leading of the Lord.
P
The LORD, the Psalmist’s Shepherd.
A Psalm of David.
1The LORD is my shepherd,
I shall not want.
2He makes me lie down in green pastures;
He leads me beside quiet waters.
3He restores my soul;
He guides me in the paths of righteousness
For His name’s sake.
4Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,
I fear no evil, for You are with me;
Your rod and Your staff, they comfort me.
5You prepare a table before me in the presence of my enemies;
You have anointed my head with oil;
My cup overflows.
6Surely goodness and lovingkindness will follow me all the days of my life,
And I will dwell in the house of the LORD forever.
♥
A Psalm of David.
1The LORD is my shepherd,
I shall not want.
2He makes me lie down in green pastures;
He leads me beside quiet waters.
3He restores my soul;
He guides me in the paths of righteousness
For His name’s sake.
4Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,
I fear no evil, for You are with me;
Your rod and Your staff, they comfort me.
5You prepare a table before me in the presence of my enemies;
You have anointed my head with oil;
My cup overflows.
6Surely goodness and lovingkindness will follow me all the days of my life,
And I will dwell in the house of the LORD forever.
♥
oh! now i get it
i'm so glad you've hammered me with the LAW for 5 million posts. the power of SIN is THE LAW.
1 Corinthians 15:56
For sin is the sting that results in death, and the law gives sin its power
i finally managed to see the Gospel in one of them.
do i take this to mean you have been born from above?
if you'll just answer that single question, maybe we can get somewhere.
i know you don't want to, because the moment you do, if the answer is yes, you know your whole house of cards comes down.
if you answer no, you're in a lot of trouble.
~
what's this?
"whereby you are in fellowship with Him again."
before The Lord quickens a man, he is not in fellowship with Him. AT ALL.
he is dead in trespasses and sins, following after the prince of the power of air, hating God and loving his sin.
so why did you ADD again?
oh! it's because you're taking passages that first and virtually exclusively applied to Israel, and applying them to YOU.
of course YOU are. because this is always about YOU.
how sinless and obedient YOU are.
NEVER is it about The King of Israel, The Suffering Servant, the Perfect Man, the Son of God - THE I AM.
never is it about Him. it can't be - because what He did really has nothing to do with you. His work is not applied to you at all.
He was just an example.
it's all about YOU.
i'm so glad you've hammered me with the LAW for 5 million posts. the power of SIN is THE LAW.
1 Corinthians 15:56
For sin is the sting that results in death, and the law gives sin its power
i finally managed to see the Gospel in one of them.
do i take this to mean you have been born from above?
if you'll just answer that single question, maybe we can get somewhere.
i know you don't want to, because the moment you do, if the answer is yes, you know your whole house of cards comes down.
if you answer no, you're in a lot of trouble.
~
what's this?
"whereby you are in fellowship with Him again."
before The Lord quickens a man, he is not in fellowship with Him. AT ALL.
he is dead in trespasses and sins, following after the prince of the power of air, hating God and loving his sin.
so why did you ADD again?
oh! it's because you're taking passages that first and virtually exclusively applied to Israel, and applying them to YOU.
of course YOU are. because this is always about YOU.
how sinless and obedient YOU are.
NEVER is it about The King of Israel, The Suffering Servant, the Perfect Man, the Son of God - THE I AM.
never is it about Him. it can't be - because what He did really has nothing to do with you. His work is not applied to you at all.
He was just an example.
it's all about YOU.
Last edited:
I believe this is where you are having trouble clarifying your position, and why you have contenders.
They would agree with both the emboldened portion of your quote, but they are disagreeing with your other sayings that is suggesting that a sinner has the ability to turn from his sins before he can be saved. The sinner is in his sins and knows why He needs the Saviour. The sinner can't ask Jesus to save Him if he has the ability to turn from his sins in the first place just so he can be saved by Jesus Christ. I say sinners are free to come to Him as the Saviour because He will save them from their sins.
This is the contention that I am having with you anyway when you are putting the cart before the horse. No sinner can see it in their flesh or willpower to turn from their sins which is why we preach the hope in Christ Jesus that they will repent by believing in Him to save them from their sins.
They would agree with both the emboldened portion of your quote, but they are disagreeing with your other sayings that is suggesting that a sinner has the ability to turn from his sins before he can be saved. The sinner is in his sins and knows why He needs the Saviour. The sinner can't ask Jesus to save Him if he has the ability to turn from his sins in the first place just so he can be saved by Jesus Christ. I say sinners are free to come to Him as the Saviour because He will save them from their sins.
This is the contention that I am having with you anyway when you are putting the cart before the horse. No sinner can see it in their flesh or willpower to turn from their sins which is why we preach the hope in Christ Jesus that they will repent by believing in Him to save them from their sins.
For he has died for our sins, not only ours, but the sins of the whole world.
He who says he is without sin is decieved and the truth is not in him.
For you have called to be free, but do not use this freedom to indulge the flesh.
'Nor do I condemn you'. (Jesus is emowered as the judger of men, therefore, the woman was forgiven by him who has the power to forgive sins).
Humanity are saved from eternal death. But all sin shall be revisited. 'All will stand before God's judgement seat'.
Even yours.
He who says he is without sin is decieved and the truth is not in him.
For you have called to be free, but do not use this freedom to indulge the flesh.
'Nor do I condemn you'. (Jesus is emowered as the judger of men, therefore, the woman was forgiven by him who has the power to forgive sins).
Humanity are saved from eternal death. But all sin shall be revisited. 'All will stand before God's judgement seat'.
Even yours.
I find the responses in this thread very interesting.
There is one person that has been asking over and over as to whether I am born again. They claim that if I answer this question that everything I have written will collapse like a house of cards.
I have already stated clearly that I am not the person I was, that I have escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. I have stated that God raised me up from death to life. That is being born again.
Your question is not an honest question. You completely ignore the tenet of what I have written and attempt to find something with which to fault.
If you read my responses you would know that I am born from above. I have stated so but because you were digging for fault it went right past you.
Your claim that "it is all about Him" does not negate your own conduct before God.
It simply amazes me that when someone contends for the faith and connects "deeds" to "salvation" the message is viciously attacked., All manner of accusation is put forth, even so far as to call the individual a Luciferian.
My posts have gone into great detail about the need for the old man to die in repentance. I do not think a single response in this entire thread addressed this. I may be wrong but if my memory is correct I do not think a single critic has acknowledged the death of the old man, the grain of wheat dying, that a death must occur before the new birth.
It appears that people prefer a Gospel message where ongoing sin is permissible, where it does not have to stop. Thus any teaching which concludes that willful sin must stop must be of the devil in their mind.
Zone, here is what you have said recently...
Honestly Zone, you needn't waste your time asking me questions because your mind is already closed to my answers. You twist what I write into something I did not write in your mind, thus it would be just as profitable for you to write my responses for me, for basically that is what you already do.
Here is a passage I have often alluded to which specifically relates to CONDUCT and the passage clearly teaches that CONDUCT MATTERS in regards to escaping the wrath of God. If you want to twist such an idea into "all about you" then so be it.
Here Paul is calling for those in the Church at Ephesus to walk in purity and does not want them being deceived in thinking that they can walk in the lusts of their flesh and not fall under the wrath of God. Paul is clearly refuting the idea that you can sin and not surely die.
Eph 4:17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
Eph 4:18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:
Eph 4:19 Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.
Eph 4:20 But ye have not so learned Christ;
Eph 4:21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
Eph 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
Eph 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
Eph 4:25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
Eph 4:26 Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:
Eph 4:27 Neither give place to the devil.
Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
Eph 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.
Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Eph 4:31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
Eph 4:32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.
Eph 5:1 Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children;
Eph 5:2 And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour.
Eph 5:3 But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;
Eph 5:4 Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.
Eph 5:5 For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
Eph 5:6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
Eph 5:7 Be not ye therefore partakers with them.
Here is a quote from Polycarp who was a disciple of John the apostle and he was also the Bishop of Smyrna.
The early church clearly taught a conditional salvation message.
What YOU DO matters. Yes God does a work THROUGH YOU but you have to yield to God. God is indeed the FIRST CAUSE but that does not mean you are a robot like the reformers taught.
God has given all men the ability to choose to do right or to choose to do wrong.
Choose life and live says the Lord.
There is one person that has been asking over and over as to whether I am born again. They claim that if I answer this question that everything I have written will collapse like a house of cards.
I have already stated clearly that I am not the person I was, that I have escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. I have stated that God raised me up from death to life. That is being born again.
Your question is not an honest question. You completely ignore the tenet of what I have written and attempt to find something with which to fault.
If you read my responses you would know that I am born from above. I have stated so but because you were digging for fault it went right past you.
Your claim that "it is all about Him" does not negate your own conduct before God.
It simply amazes me that when someone contends for the faith and connects "deeds" to "salvation" the message is viciously attacked., All manner of accusation is put forth, even so far as to call the individual a Luciferian.
My posts have gone into great detail about the need for the old man to die in repentance. I do not think a single response in this entire thread addressed this. I may be wrong but if my memory is correct I do not think a single critic has acknowledged the death of the old man, the grain of wheat dying, that a death must occur before the new birth.
It appears that people prefer a Gospel message where ongoing sin is permissible, where it does not have to stop. Thus any teaching which concludes that willful sin must stop must be of the devil in their mind.
Zone, here is what you have said recently...
oh! now i get it
i'm so glad you've hammered me with the LAW for 5 million posts. the power of SIN is THE LAW.
1 Corinthians 15:56
For sin is the sting that results in death, and the law gives sin its power
i finally managed to see the Gospel in one of them.
do i take this to mean you have been born from above?
if you'll just answer that single question, maybe we can get somewhere.
i know you don't want to, because the moment you do, if the answer is yes, you know your whole house of cards comes down. [I am really not sure where you get the idea that I prefer to not answer your questions because I some how fear the collapse of my house of cards. In another thread I clearly explained my objection to the doctrine of Penal Substitution and I think they are very reasonable objections. Yet you would just offer a curt response and name call. Therefore there is no real purpose to have an exchange with you except perhaps to shine a light to others.
if you answer no, you're in a lot of trouble.
~
what's this?
"whereby you are in fellowship with Him again." [The Prodigal Son returned to the Father. Little babies are not cut off from God. Willful transgression is what separates someone from God, not birth and a baby cannot commit transgression because they do not have the reasoning capacity to willfully suppress the light in them and go their own way.
Do you honestly believe that a little baby is wicked, evil and condemned? That a small child is depraved, wicked and morally depraved, whom Jesus said...
Mar 10:14 But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
Mar 10:15 Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.
God has made man upright but they seek out many inventions.
Ecc 7:29 Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.
Jesus clearly taught that the condemnation was in the rejection of the light. God has given all people the light of conscience, condemnation is wrought when that light is willfully suppressed to do evil.
You are not born dead and condemned and the Prodigal Son was not born in the pig pen. He left the father and spent his inheritance on wayward living and ended up in a mess.
before The Lord quickens a man, he is not in fellowship with Him. AT ALL.
he is dead in trespasses and sins, following after the prince of the power of air, hating God and loving his sin. [You are not born dead in trespasses and sins, that is a doctrine which was introduced into Christian orthodoxy by Augustine of Hippo. Do your research and look it up. You can ignore history if you want to and cling the false teaching of Original Sin, that is up to you.
so why did you ADD again?
oh! it's because you're taking passages that first and virtually exclusively applied to Israel, and applying them to YOU.
of course YOU are. because this is always about YOU.
how sinless and obedient YOU are. [You really despise a conditional salvation don't you? Yes your conduct matters and if in your mind that makes you THINK that "it is all about you" then so be it. That is a stronghold in your mind which it appears you are unwilling to examine.
NEVER is it about The King of Israel, The Suffering Servant, the Perfect Man, the Son of God - THE I AM.
never is it about Him. it can't be - because what He did really has nothing to do with you. His work is not applied to you at all.
He was just an example. [Here you really reveal your heart in the way you completely misrepresent what write. I have written many times that the only means to be reconciled to the Father is through the blood of Jesus Christ for He was the propotiatory offering which God accepts whereby our past transgression is purged. Yet you will claim "what He did really has nothing to do with you at all. His work is not applied to you at all." What a blatant LIE about my writings.
Jesus was not JUST an example. I have never one time claimed He was JUST an example. He was most certainly an example though for He said...
Joh 13:15 For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you.
it's all about YOU. You refuse to specifically address my writings and just lambast with rhetoric and make LYING accusations. The road to life is in the Spirit of life in Jesus Christ (Rom 8:2). That Spirit of life in Jesus Christ is the walk where we abide in Him, we are yielding to the Spirit of God, we are His sheep. We walk after the Spirit and no longer walk in the lusts of the flesh. Yet you IGNORE EVERYTHING I write on that and attack my writing with lying rhetoric.
Jesus Christ did not endure all things to cloak ongoing rebellion. Jesus Christ endured all things that we might LIVE IN HIM and thus worship God in spirit and in truth.
i'm so glad you've hammered me with the LAW for 5 million posts. the power of SIN is THE LAW.
1 Corinthians 15:56
For sin is the sting that results in death, and the law gives sin its power
i finally managed to see the Gospel in one of them.
do i take this to mean you have been born from above?
if you'll just answer that single question, maybe we can get somewhere.
i know you don't want to, because the moment you do, if the answer is yes, you know your whole house of cards comes down. [I am really not sure where you get the idea that I prefer to not answer your questions because I some how fear the collapse of my house of cards. In another thread I clearly explained my objection to the doctrine of Penal Substitution and I think they are very reasonable objections. Yet you would just offer a curt response and name call. Therefore there is no real purpose to have an exchange with you except perhaps to shine a light to others.
if you answer no, you're in a lot of trouble.
~
what's this?
"whereby you are in fellowship with Him again." [The Prodigal Son returned to the Father. Little babies are not cut off from God. Willful transgression is what separates someone from God, not birth and a baby cannot commit transgression because they do not have the reasoning capacity to willfully suppress the light in them and go their own way.
Do you honestly believe that a little baby is wicked, evil and condemned? That a small child is depraved, wicked and morally depraved, whom Jesus said...
Mar 10:14 But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
Mar 10:15 Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.
God has made man upright but they seek out many inventions.
Ecc 7:29 Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.
Jesus clearly taught that the condemnation was in the rejection of the light. God has given all people the light of conscience, condemnation is wrought when that light is willfully suppressed to do evil.
You are not born dead and condemned and the Prodigal Son was not born in the pig pen. He left the father and spent his inheritance on wayward living and ended up in a mess.
before The Lord quickens a man, he is not in fellowship with Him. AT ALL.
he is dead in trespasses and sins, following after the prince of the power of air, hating God and loving his sin. [You are not born dead in trespasses and sins, that is a doctrine which was introduced into Christian orthodoxy by Augustine of Hippo. Do your research and look it up. You can ignore history if you want to and cling the false teaching of Original Sin, that is up to you.
so why did you ADD again?
oh! it's because you're taking passages that first and virtually exclusively applied to Israel, and applying them to YOU.
of course YOU are. because this is always about YOU.
how sinless and obedient YOU are. [You really despise a conditional salvation don't you? Yes your conduct matters and if in your mind that makes you THINK that "it is all about you" then so be it. That is a stronghold in your mind which it appears you are unwilling to examine.
NEVER is it about The King of Israel, The Suffering Servant, the Perfect Man, the Son of God - THE I AM.
never is it about Him. it can't be - because what He did really has nothing to do with you. His work is not applied to you at all.
He was just an example. [Here you really reveal your heart in the way you completely misrepresent what write. I have written many times that the only means to be reconciled to the Father is through the blood of Jesus Christ for He was the propotiatory offering which God accepts whereby our past transgression is purged. Yet you will claim "what He did really has nothing to do with you at all. His work is not applied to you at all." What a blatant LIE about my writings.
Jesus was not JUST an example. I have never one time claimed He was JUST an example. He was most certainly an example though for He said...
Joh 13:15 For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you.
it's all about YOU. You refuse to specifically address my writings and just lambast with rhetoric and make LYING accusations. The road to life is in the Spirit of life in Jesus Christ (Rom 8:2). That Spirit of life in Jesus Christ is the walk where we abide in Him, we are yielding to the Spirit of God, we are His sheep. We walk after the Spirit and no longer walk in the lusts of the flesh. Yet you IGNORE EVERYTHING I write on that and attack my writing with lying rhetoric.
Jesus Christ did not endure all things to cloak ongoing rebellion. Jesus Christ endured all things that we might LIVE IN HIM and thus worship God in spirit and in truth.
Honestly Zone, you needn't waste your time asking me questions because your mind is already closed to my answers. You twist what I write into something I did not write in your mind, thus it would be just as profitable for you to write my responses for me, for basically that is what you already do.
Here is a passage I have often alluded to which specifically relates to CONDUCT and the passage clearly teaches that CONDUCT MATTERS in regards to escaping the wrath of God. If you want to twist such an idea into "all about you" then so be it.
Here Paul is calling for those in the Church at Ephesus to walk in purity and does not want them being deceived in thinking that they can walk in the lusts of their flesh and not fall under the wrath of God. Paul is clearly refuting the idea that you can sin and not surely die.
Eph 4:17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
Eph 4:18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:
Eph 4:19 Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.
Eph 4:20 But ye have not so learned Christ;
Eph 4:21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
Eph 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
Eph 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
Eph 4:25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
Eph 4:26 Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:
Eph 4:27 Neither give place to the devil.
Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
Eph 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.
Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Eph 4:31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:
Eph 4:32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.
Eph 5:1 Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children;
Eph 5:2 And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour.
Eph 5:3 But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;
Eph 5:4 Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.
Eph 5:5 For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
Eph 5:6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
Eph 5:7 Be not ye therefore partakers with them.
Here is a quote from Polycarp who was a disciple of John the apostle and he was also the Bishop of Smyrna.
The early church clearly taught a conditional salvation message.
What YOU DO matters. Yes God does a work THROUGH YOU but you have to yield to God. God is indeed the FIRST CAUSE but that does not mean you are a robot like the reformers taught.
God has given all men the ability to choose to do right or to choose to do wrong.
Choose life and live says the Lord.
Nineveh turned from their sins. Were they saved BEFORE hand?
Jon 3:5 So the people of Nineveh believed God, and proclaimed a fast, and put on sackcloth, from the greatest of them even to the least of them.
Jon 3:6 For word came unto the king of Nineveh, and he arose from his throne, and he laid his robe from him, and covered him with sackcloth, and sat in ashes.
Jon 3:7 And he caused it to be proclaimed and published through Nineveh by the decree of the king and his nobles, saying, Let neither man nor beast, herd nor flock, taste any thing: let them not feed, nor drink water:
Jon 3:8 But let man and beast be covered with sackcloth, and cry mightily unto God: yea, let them turn every one from his evil way, and from the violence that is in their hands.
Jon 3:9 Who can tell if God will turn and repent, and turn away from his fierce anger, that we perish not?
Jon 3:10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.
God told Cain to rule over sin and Cain chose not to. Do you really believe that Cain had no power to forsake his wickedness?
Gen 4:5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.
Gen 4:6 And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
Gen 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
Are you not teaching the Gospel in reverse? You get saved first and then you repent and forsake your sin? Jesus clearly connected a change of conduct to repentance in the parable of the Prodigal Son and His allusion to the repentance of Nineveh?
How do you get around those scriptures?
Jon 3:5 So the people of Nineveh believed God, and proclaimed a fast, and put on sackcloth, from the greatest of them even to the least of them.
Jon 3:6 For word came unto the king of Nineveh, and he arose from his throne, and he laid his robe from him, and covered him with sackcloth, and sat in ashes.
Jon 3:7 And he caused it to be proclaimed and published through Nineveh by the decree of the king and his nobles, saying, Let neither man nor beast, herd nor flock, taste any thing: let them not feed, nor drink water:
Jon 3:8 But let man and beast be covered with sackcloth, and cry mightily unto God: yea, let them turn every one from his evil way, and from the violence that is in their hands.
Jon 3:9 Who can tell if God will turn and repent, and turn away from his fierce anger, that we perish not?
Jon 3:10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.
God told Cain to rule over sin and Cain chose not to. Do you really believe that Cain had no power to forsake his wickedness?
Gen 4:5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.
Gen 4:6 And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
Gen 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
Are you not teaching the Gospel in reverse? You get saved first and then you repent and forsake your sin? Jesus clearly connected a change of conduct to repentance in the parable of the Prodigal Son and His allusion to the repentance of Nineveh?
How do you get around those scriptures?
God cleanses the heart. We are to cleanse our conduct by submitting to His will. God empowers us to walk in purity by quickening our spirit as well as our flesh.
God does not make you repent, He leads you to repent. The choice is up to you otherwise you are a robot like the Reformers taught. God grants the OPPORTUNITY to repent. Repentance is not some sort of "thing" which God comes and gives to you. God initiates repentance through His influence on a heart in order to bring conviction but He most certainly does not MAKE the person repent in the sense that there was no choice on the part of the repentant person.
Also a murderer does not come to God in broken repentance with any intention of going out to kill again. If he goes out and kills again then it proves that his repentance was not real. It is no different with any willful known sin. The rebellion must cease in repentance or it never will. One cannot receive the implanted word and reject it at the same time. Receiving and rejecting are mutually exclusive terms.
The modern Gospel is taught in such a way that it cloaks ongoing rebellion. The pastors freely admit it. They have one receiving Jesus in their rejection of Jesus. It is pure hogwash.
Go to practically any funeral and hear the pastor preach the dead person into heaven no matter how they lived. These people are hirelings who tickle the ears of the lost with a salvation message which makes an allowance for the rebellion to continue.
Grandpa, can the rebellion continue?
Grandpa, does the rebellion have to stop?
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Still at it?
So it's like you are STILL opposing that part of your quote about Jesus freeing us from sin, but yet you make a go at it here that Nineveh is proof that Jesus does not need to free us from our sins?
Let's look at what God is calling Nineveh to repent from : evil & violence: and the work of repentance as seen has to be no violence, and thus doing away with hatred. That does not mean Nineveh was not without sin. It does not mean that the people of Nineveh do not need the Saviour that is coming.
The rod has been known to discipline a child. A warning of destruction can inspire a people to repent, but in no way can they be without sin nor free themselves from sin by simply repenting. Specific sins, yes. One can find the spirit is willing, but even Jesus stated that the flesh si weak therefore what is impossible with man, is possible with God.
So what happened in Nineveh does not change the spots nor does it mean that man has the ability to turn from sin altogether, but a specific sin, as in the case of Cain, especially when the temptation is at the door.
James 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. 16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.
Where did Jesus alluded in the parable of the prodigal son to Nineveh?
Why don't you ask Jesus for help in making a simple post in conveying the truth here, because you are opposing yourself.
NA & AA can turn from sin religiously, but is it permenant? No. Does this mean they can turn from all sin and deliver themselves from sin without Jesus Christ? Again no. So clarity is needed on your part, because I have heard of Jesus saving sinners from alcoholism without AA.
So it's like you are STILL opposing that part of your quote about Jesus freeing us from sin, but yet you make a go at it here that Nineveh is proof that Jesus does not need to free us from our sins?
Let's look at what God is calling Nineveh to repent from : evil & violence: and the work of repentance as seen has to be no violence, and thus doing away with hatred. That does not mean Nineveh was not without sin. It does not mean that the people of Nineveh do not need the Saviour that is coming.
The rod has been known to discipline a child. A warning of destruction can inspire a people to repent, but in no way can they be without sin nor free themselves from sin by simply repenting. Specific sins, yes. One can find the spirit is willing, but even Jesus stated that the flesh si weak therefore what is impossible with man, is possible with God.
So what happened in Nineveh does not change the spots nor does it mean that man has the ability to turn from sin altogether, but a specific sin, as in the case of Cain, especially when the temptation is at the door.
James 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. 16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.
Where did Jesus alluded in the parable of the prodigal son to Nineveh?
Why don't you ask Jesus for help in making a simple post in conveying the truth here, because you are opposing yourself.
NA & AA can turn from sin religiously, but is it permenant? No. Does this mean they can turn from all sin and deliver themselves from sin without Jesus Christ? Again no. So clarity is needed on your part, because I have heard of Jesus saving sinners from alcoholism without AA.
The rebellion stops. But not because we willed it to stop.
It stops when He changes us. When He translates us from the kingdom of Darkness to the kingdom of Light.
This all happens when a person is honest before the Lord and cries out for His Help. This is what cleansing your own hands and purifying your own heart should bring you to. The Knowledge that you aren't perfect before God and that you need a Saviour.
Matthew 11:28-31
28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
Those verses are key. The Heavy Load is us in our sorrow and shame at having sin before Him and breaking His Law.
His Light Burden is the Holy Spirit which causes us to walk in His Statutes and abide in Him. We can rest from our works (of iniquity) and walk in the light as He is in the Light.
He takes our sorrow and shame and gives us Joy. His Peace and Love are written on our hearts and by abiding in Him, by the Holy Spirit, we are able to fulfill the Law. We keep the Law by faith and not by works.
Repentance is great but if it is relying only on the will of the repenter it is only dirty rags. If it brings the person repenting before the Lord and causes him to cry out, in real repentance, and ask the Lord God for His Help, this is what brings Salvation. This is the leading of the Lord, The Good Shepherd.
Our only Help is in the Lord. If we acknowledge our weakness, being honest before Him, He is powerful to save...
It stops when He changes us. When He translates us from the kingdom of Darkness to the kingdom of Light.
This all happens when a person is honest before the Lord and cries out for His Help. This is what cleansing your own hands and purifying your own heart should bring you to. The Knowledge that you aren't perfect before God and that you need a Saviour.
Matthew 11:28-31
28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
Those verses are key. The Heavy Load is us in our sorrow and shame at having sin before Him and breaking His Law.
His Light Burden is the Holy Spirit which causes us to walk in His Statutes and abide in Him. We can rest from our works (of iniquity) and walk in the light as He is in the Light.
He takes our sorrow and shame and gives us Joy. His Peace and Love are written on our hearts and by abiding in Him, by the Holy Spirit, we are able to fulfill the Law. We keep the Law by faith and not by works.
Repentance is great but if it is relying only on the will of the repenter it is only dirty rags. If it brings the person repenting before the Lord and causes him to cry out, in real repentance, and ask the Lord God for His Help, this is what brings Salvation. This is the leading of the Lord, The Good Shepherd.
Our only Help is in the Lord. If we acknowledge our weakness, being honest before Him, He is powerful to save...
Thanks for trying, brother.
So it's like you are STILL opposing that part of your quote about Jesus freeing us from sin, but yet you make a go at it here that Nineveh is proof that Jesus does not need to free us from our sins? The method by which Jesus frees us from our sin is through US DYING WITH HIM and then GOD RAISING US UP WITH HIM. There are TWO ASPECTS. One aspect is a DEATH and the other aspect is a RESURRECTION. You cannot throw the FIRST ASPECT out the window and preach a Gospel which only includes the second. Jesus plainly taught the FIRST ASPECT and so did Paul. Yet you IGNORE IT and don't even make reference to it at all in your responses to me. It is as if I never wrote about it in your mind. Why is that?
You're reaching beyond the scope of what any sinner is hearing & doing when they come to Christ.
Why don't you tell me how you came to Jesus Christ? What exactly did you hear when you first believed in Him? Reflect on that and be sure of your response on what you heard when you cae to Him.
1 Peter 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
Ephesians 1:12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. 13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, 14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory. 15 Wherefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus, and love unto all the saints,
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
So it's like you are STILL opposing that part of your quote about Jesus freeing us from sin, but yet you make a go at it here that Nineveh is proof that Jesus does not need to free us from our sins? The method by which Jesus frees us from our sin is through US DYING WITH HIM and then GOD RAISING US UP WITH HIM. There are TWO ASPECTS. One aspect is a DEATH and the other aspect is a RESURRECTION. You cannot throw the FIRST ASPECT out the window and preach a Gospel which only includes the second. Jesus plainly taught the FIRST ASPECT and so did Paul. Yet you IGNORE IT and don't even make reference to it at all in your responses to me. It is as if I never wrote about it in your mind. Why is that?
You're reaching beyond the scope of what any sinner is hearing & doing when they come to Christ.
Why don't you tell me how you came to Jesus Christ? What exactly did you hear when you first believed in Him? Reflect on that and be sure of your response on what you heard when you cae to Him.
1 Peter 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
Ephesians 1:12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. 13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, 14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory. 15 Wherefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus, and love unto all the saints,
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
I have spoken to many Pastors who have CLEARLY ADMITTED to me that a pornography addict and a child molester CAN STILL BE ENGAGED in those sins and yet be SAVED at the very same time. Clear as day they admit that and thus they also believe it is the same with all wicked conduct. Why don't people have a problem with that?
I mean seriously, how can anyone defend a Pastor who plainly admits that he believes that a child molester can STILL BE MOLESTING CHILDREN and enter the kingdom in that state because salvation is not of works? It boggles my mind.
If that is not a reflection of how watered down and perverted the Gospel is in people's minds then I really do not know what is.