Contradiction of WORDS

[SeaBass]

The point is SeaBass - only believers are in the group or don't cha know? So an individual outside the group would be an unbeliever and not place in the body to begin with!

Point is only the GROUP Christian is sealed. No individual outside the group can be sealed.

And one must work to meet the conditions to be in the group and be sealed. No scripture says one is sealed unconditionally. One quits meeting the conditions will fall from the sealed group.

 

[SeaBass]

The same place it says: "God's word is true only."

What is your point?

 

[SeaBass]

what if you cannot come to get the car?
-- i will bring it to you --
(we did not ascend to heaven to seek Him, but He sent the Son to seek us)

what if you cannot drive?
-- i will teach you how to drive --
(the Lord has put His spirit in us, which will lead us into all truth)

what about taxes? insurance?
-- i have also paid these --
(by one sacrifice he has perfected all who are being made holy)

who will pay for petrol?
-- i will provide you with fuel --
(His strength is perfected in our weakness - it is by His power, not ours that we are motivated and able)

I am the gift giver. I set the conditions.

Want the free car, then do the work and come to me and get it.

Does the work in coming to me earn the free car? If so, how?

After you do the work in coming and getting the free car, how does you paying for insurance gas, etc mean you earned the free car?

 

[SeaBass]

Pretty much like you don't eat if you aren't in the presence of food.

This fails to answer the question. Jesus said come to Him and He will give you rest.

If one does not do the work in coming to CHrist, will Christ give him rest anyway? Are those that do the work to come to CHrist trying to earn the rest?

 

[Elin]

This fails to answer the question. Jesus said come to Him and He will give you rest.

If one does not do the work in coming to CHrist, will Christ give him rest anyway? Are those that do the work to come to CHrist trying to earn the rest?

No one comes unless the Father enables them.

The coming is of God, not of man.

Man simply responds to the moving of his heart.

It is no more work than responding to the moving of one's heart to love.

It's so sad that you know so little of the power of God that you must supplement it with your own power.

You didn't read this and this, did you?

 

[SeaBass]

and head straight for their own works. (Romans 1:24, Galatians 3:3)

They leave Christ and quit loving Christ when they quit doing what Christ says, quit obeyng His commands, Jn 14:15; Lk 6:46.

Not possible to be a follower of Christ by doing no works. No such thing as 'do nothing disciples" of Christ.

 

[Elin]

The same place it says: "God's word is true only."

What is your point?

Principle previously explained here.

 

[Elin]

The same place it says: "God's word is true only."

What is your point?

Principle previously explained here.

 

[SeaBass]

Ok then wasn't good how about now?

There is no contradictions where you claim there are.

The fact is free gifts can come with conditions and meeting those conditions do not earn the gift.

Again, in Jn 6:27, one on hand Jesus said to LABOUR for the meat that endures unto everlasting life. On the other hand Jesus says He GIVES everlasting life, it's free. Why would He say to labour for something He freely gives? Because He has put conditions on His free gift.

 

[SeaBass]

In the definition of the word "free."


He chooses willful blindness to that self-evident fact.

It's amazing at what lengths people will go and effort they make to refuse to understand a simple concept that free gifts can have conditions.............all just to protect man made teachings.

 

[Elin]

I am the gift giver. I set the conditions.

You aren't God.

He has no conditions for the gift of salvation through the gift of faith (Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:27)
and the gift of repentance (2Tim 2:25; Ac 11:18; 5:31).

You know nothing of God's power in moving the heart (enabling) to come, and seek to add your own power to it.

 

[SeaBass]

EARTH RESIDENTS ADD 9.725% SALES TAX

ACT NOW AND RECEIVE A SECURE HOPE JUST PAY SEPARATE PROCESSING $19.95

Free is nothing, zero. Zero times 9.725 = zero.

 

[Elin]

Point is only the GROUP Christian is sealed. No individual outside the group can be sealed.

Where does Scripture state the group is sealed rather than the individual?

 

[gb9]

It's amazing at what lengths people will go and effort they make to refuse to understand a simple concept that free gifts can have conditions.............all just to protect man made teachings.

it's amazing to me what lengths you works people go through to prove that grace has to be EARNED. that is the real man-made teaching.

 

[SeaBass]

Through faith . . . . That WHOSOEVER believeth in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that WHOSOEVER believes in him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:15,16

For by grace are you saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD. Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. We are GOD'S workmanship [masterpiece] - that which was created in us through Christ Jesus enables us to do good works . . . faith = salvation salvation = obedience unto good works

But as many as received him (Jesus), to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name. Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

The point I made was the bible does not teach that faith only saves.

The bible teaches MANY things save including repentance confession, baptism, grace, blood of Christ etc.

So a NT faith that saves INCLUDES all these things. Faith only is VOID of all these thing therefore cannot save.

Are you going to deny that repentance saves? Deny confession saves? Deny baptism saves?

 

[Elin]

They leave Christ and quit loving Christ when they quit doing what Christ says, quit obeyng His commands, Jn 14:15; Lk 6:46.

Those who leave Christ never truly loved Christ in the first place (1Jn 2:19).

True faith does not apostasize, only counterfeit faith apostasizes
because it has no root of rebirth (Lk 8:13).

 

[SeaBass]

but i don't have any place to park it?
-- i will build a garage for you --
(He is preparing a place for us in His Father's house, right now!)

are there any complaints i'm missing??

You not having a parking place does not mean the car is not free.

If you do not want the free car, you do not have to get it. Just do nothing and you will not get it.

But if you want the car do the work in coming to me and get it.

Likewise, if one does not want salvation then just do nothing and he will not get it. If one wants it, obey Christ, Heb 5:9.

 

[Elin]

It's amazing at what lengths people will go and
effort they make to refuse to understand a simple concept that free gifts can have conditions.............all just to protect man made teachings.

Methinks redefining the meaning of the word "free," is the pot calling the kettle black.

 

[SeaBass]

You could also use some instruction in analogies.

Nowhere do we find stated in Scripture the exact words "God is truthful," just as

nowhere do we find stated in Scripture the exact words "if I have a free gift to give
I cannot put conditions upon receiving that free gift,"

and finding neither of these exact words does not mean either that
God is not truthful, nor that
free gifts can have conditions.

And then there's that minor detail of language and the definition of the word "free,"
whose definition you perversely seek to rewrite.

Again, I do not see what point you are trying to make.


It seems you are trying to deny that Naaman having to go and dip is a condition God put upon his free healing.

 

[SeaBass]

No, it has to state "God is truthful only," or it does not mean that, just as

it has to state, "if I have a free gift to give I cannot put conditions on the gree gift"

or it does not mean that a free gift is without conditions.

Again, are you trying to say since the bible does not explicitly state "dipping is a condition" then that allows you think that dipping was not a condition?