Contradiction of WORDS

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#361
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#361
peacefulbeliever said:
The point is SeaBass - only believers are in the group or don't cha know? So an individual outside the group would be an unbeliever and not place in the body to begin with!
Click to expand...
Point is only the GROUP Christian is sealed. No individual outside the group can be sealed.

And one must work to meet the conditions to be in the group and be sealed. No scripture says one is sealed unconditionally. One quits meeting the conditions will fall from the sealed group.
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#363
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#363
posthuman said:
what if you cannot come to get the car?
-- i will bring it to you --
(we did not ascend to heaven to seek Him, but He sent the Son to seek us)

what if you cannot drive?
-- i will teach you how to drive --
(the Lord has put His spirit in us, which will lead us into all truth)

what about taxes? insurance?
-- i have also paid these --
(by one sacrifice he has perfected all who are being made holy)

who will pay for petrol?
-- i will provide you with fuel --
(His strength is perfected in our weakness - it is by His power, not ours that we are motivated and able)
Click to expand...
I am the gift giver. I set the conditions.

Want the free car, then do the work and come to me and get it.

Does the work in coming to me earn the free car? If so, how?

After you do the work in coming and getting the free car, how does you paying for insurance gas, etc mean you earned the free car?
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#364
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#364
Elin said:
Pretty much like you don't eat if you aren't in the presence of food.
Click to expand...
This fails to answer the question. Jesus said come to Him and He will give you rest.

If one does not do the work in coming to CHrist, will Christ give him rest anyway? Are those that do the work to come to CHrist trying to earn the rest?
 
E

Elin

Banned
#365
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
0
#365
SeaBass said:
This fails to answer the question. Jesus said come to Him and He will give you rest.

If one does not do the work in coming to CHrist, will Christ give him rest anyway? Are those that do the work to come to CHrist trying to earn the rest?
Click to expand...
No one comes unless the Father enables them.

The coming is of God, not of man.

Man simply responds to the moving of his heart.

It is no more work than responding to the moving of one's heart to love.

It's so sad that you know so little of the power of God that you must supplement it with your own power.

You didn't read this and this, did you?
 
Last edited:
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#366
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#366
posthuman said:
and head straight for their own works. (Romans 1:24, Galatians 3:3)
Click to expand...
They leave Christ and quit loving Christ when they quit doing what Christ says, quit obeyng His commands, Jn 14:15; Lk 6:46.

Not possible to be a follower of Christ by doing no works. No such thing as 'do nothing disciples" of Christ.
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#369
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#369
elf3 said:
Ok then wasn't good how about now?
Click to expand...
There is no contradictions where you claim there are.

The fact is free gifts can come with conditions and meeting those conditions do not earn the gift.

Again, in Jn 6:27, one on hand Jesus said to LABOUR for the meat that endures unto everlasting life. On the other hand Jesus says He GIVES everlasting life, it's free. Why would He say to labour for something He freely gives? Because He has put conditions on His free gift.
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#370
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#370
Elin said:
In the definition of the word "free."


He chooses willful blindness to that self-evident fact.
Click to expand...

It's amazing at what lengths people will go and effort they make to refuse to understand a simple concept that free gifts can have conditions.............all just to protect man made teachings.
 
E

Elin

Banned
#371
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
0
#371
SeaBass said:
I am the gift giver. I set the conditions.
Click to expand...
You aren't God.

He has no conditions for the gift of salvation through the gift of faith (Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:27)
and the gift of repentance (2Tim 2:25; Ac 11:18; 5:31).

You know nothing of God's power in moving the heart (enabling) to come, and seek to add your own power to it.
 
E

Elin

Banned
#373
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
0
#373
SeaBass said:
Point is only the GROUP Christian is sealed. No individual outside the group can be sealed.
Click to expand...
Where does Scripture state the group is sealed rather than the individual?
 
G

gb9

Senior Member
#374
Jan 18, 2011
11,908
6,403
113
#374
SeaBass said:
It's amazing at what lengths people will go and effort they make to refuse to understand a simple concept that free gifts can have conditions.............all just to protect man made teachings.
Click to expand...
it's amazing to me what lengths you works people go through to prove that grace has to be EARNED. that is the real man-made teaching.
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#375
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#375
peacefulbeliever said:
Through faith . . . . That WHOSOEVER believeth in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that WHOSOEVER believes in him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:15,16

For by grace are you saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD. Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. We are GOD'S workmanship [masterpiece] - that which was created in us through Christ Jesus enables us to do good works . . . faith = salvation salvation = obedience unto good works

But as many as received him (Jesus), to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name. Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
Click to expand...
The point I made was the bible does not teach that faith only saves.

The bible teaches MANY things save including repentance confession, baptism, grace, blood of Christ etc.

So a NT faith that saves INCLUDES all these things. Faith only is VOID of all these thing therefore cannot save.

Are you going to deny that repentance saves? Deny confession saves? Deny baptism saves?
 
E

Elin

Banned
#376
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
0
#376
SeaBass said:
They leave Christ and quit loving Christ when they quit doing what Christ says, quit obeyng His commands, Jn 14:15; Lk 6:46.
Click to expand...
Those who leave Christ never truly loved Christ in the first place (1Jn 2:19).

True faith does not apostasize, only counterfeit faith apostasizes
because it has no root of rebirth (Lk 8:13).
 
Last edited:
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#377
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#377
posthuman said:
but i don't have any place to park it?
-- i will build a garage for you --
(He is preparing a place for us in His Father's house, right now!)

are there any complaints i'm missing??
Click to expand...
You not having a parking place does not mean the car is not free.

If you do not want the free car, you do not have to get it. Just do nothing and you will not get it.

But if you want the car do the work in coming to me and get it.

Likewise, if one does not want salvation then just do nothing and he will not get it. If one wants it, obey Christ, Heb 5:9.
 
E

Elin

Banned
#378
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
0
#378
SeaBass said:
It's amazing at what lengths people will go and
effort they make to refuse to understand a simple concept that free gifts can have conditions.............all just to protect man made teachings.
Click to expand...
Methinks redefining the meaning of the word "free," is the pot calling the kettle black.
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#379
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#379
Elin said:
You could also use some instruction in analogies.

Nowhere do we find stated in Scripture the exact words "God is truthful," just as

nowhere do we find stated in Scripture the exact words "if I have a free gift to give
I cannot put conditions upon receiving that free gift,"

and finding neither of these exact words does not mean either that
God is not truthful, nor that
free gifts can have conditions.

And then there's that minor detail of language and the definition of the word "free,"
whose definition you perversely seek to rewrite.
Click to expand...
Again, I do not see what point you are trying to make.


It seems you are trying to deny that Naaman having to go and dip is a condition God put upon his free healing.
 
SeaBass

SeaBass

Banned
#380
Mar 12, 2014
6,433
29
0
#380
Elin said:
No, it has to state "God is truthful only," or it does not mean that, just as

it has to state, "if I have a free gift to give I cannot put conditions on the gree gift"

or it does not mean that a free gift is without conditions.
Click to expand...
Again, are you trying to say since the bible does not explicitly state "dipping is a condition" then that allows you think that dipping was not a condition?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.