Did God die on the cross.

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Did God die on the cross

  • yes

    Votes: 12 42.9%
  • no

    Votes: 14 50.0%
  • I am not sure.

    Votes: 2 7.1%

  • Total voters
    28
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Sep 2, 2009
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"He that overcometh, I will give to him to sit down with me in my throne, as I also overcame, and sat down with my Father in his throne." Rev 3:21

By the way, did any of you notice that there are TWO thrones mentioned here? One for Jesus and one for God?

God was in heaven, he did not die on the cross. Jesus did, you know, the lamb that was slain......
 
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Definition_Christ

Guest
"He that overcometh, I will give to him to sit down with me in my throne, as I also overcame, and sat down with my Father in his throne." Rev 3:21

By the way, did any of you notice that there are TWO thrones mentioned here? One for Jesus and one for God?

God was in heaven, he did not die on the cross. Jesus did, you know, the lamb that was slain......
Yeah, just make sure we gotta respect Watchmen on his thread.. But let me just say this.. I agree that there is a Father and there is a Son and they are both God... But in respect for Watchmen I'll stop talking about this now.
 
Apr 23, 2009
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Let me ask you this Jesus says.....
Matthew 10
19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak.
20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

Mark 13:11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

Luke 21:15 For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.


Here Jesus says in on verse the Spirit of the Father will speak, in another verse it says the Holy Spirit will speak, in the third it says Jesus Himself will give us the words to speak. So which one is actually going to do it? or are they all one and the same?
 
Apr 23, 2009
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Yeah, just make sure we gotta respect Watchmen on his thread.. But let me just say this.. I agree that there is a Father and there is a Son and they are both God... But in respect for Watchmen I'll stop talking about this now.
Thank you D_C. In my belief the Father is God and the Son is a man but Jesus was both Father and Son, God and man.
 
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Definition_Christ

Guest
I think we can all agree that God raised Jesus from the dead right? Okay either we all agree Jesus is God or we are calling Jesus a liar.. Why do I say that? Well check out this verse.
John 2:19 Jesus answered and said to them, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”

Jesus was referring to His body as a temple.. You know just like how Paul says....
1 Corinthians 3:16 Do you not know that you are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?

So Jesus said I WILL RAISE IT UP IN THREE DAYS... So Jesus said HE will raise it up... We all know God raised Jesus from the dead.. So either you agree Jesus is God or you are calling Jesus a liar in regards to John 2:19.
 
Sep 2, 2009
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I answered your question. No reason to start another tread on the same topic.

I want to say this before I say Good Night. You slam others because they do not think or believe like you do. You bash others who know More than you do. I see that you can't stand it when someone comes along that does not think like you do. Welcome to the real world of 6 billion people.

I responded to this tread to show the ones like myself who read this that we have the right to stand up and proclaim Jesus as the SON of God, and recognize that he is not God and it is ok to believe so. Your beliefs my friend, do not make you right.

I for one have never said and never will say or confess that Jesus is part of a Trinity and God. The Trinity belief is Satan's calling card as he will use it to proclaim himself to be God by doing away with the father-son relationship when he sits on the throne. Millions, actually billions will believe and follow him believing him to be God. Just as you believe Jesus to be God, you will believe Satan to be God.

I have spoken, Good Night.
 
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Definition_Christ

Guest
Yeah well.. Okay I will be like Thomas and cry out to Jesus .. My Lord and my God!!! And I will continue to worship Him... And you can agree with the pharisees and say Jesus is not God.
 
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Sep 2, 2009
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Matthew 10
19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak.
20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

Mark 13:11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

Luke 21:15 For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.



You posted that while I was typing. That is so typical of some ignorant person who thinks (pretends) they are being persecuted. Try to be more original next time.

good night all.
 
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1Covenant

Guest
This is where you are wrong, I was trinitarian for 32 of my 35 years of life, and remain in a trinitarian church. I know exactly what they teach, and God dying on the cross is not one of those things.
Look...going to church is not the same as doing a dilligent study of something, the same as going to church doesn't make you a Christian. I'm talking historical biblical orthodoxy here.

There are a lot of churches out there that take the approach of "lets major on the majors." Therefore after everyone who knew the depth of the Word and Its doctrines passes away, congregations are left believing something but having no idea of the depth of what they believe or why they should really believe it. This is how you can have someone claim to be a trinitarian and really have no concept of what that means other than the major point "three-in-one." This may be true at your church and if so I predict that your church in another generations time will no longer have any idea why they shouldn't be oneness and maybe they are there now.

There are men in history who committed their whole lives to searching out one or two particular truths of God's Word. They have created well studied treatises on these matters. It is wise to go and read those works. After all, that is all we are doing on this website is the lazy form of what they did. We talk back and forth, use our favorite scriptures, and we claim all the while that we are listening to one another and having our biblical understanding enlightened. Well, if that is not bad to do then go pick up one of those old works and read.

Peace
 
Apr 23, 2009
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Look...going to church is not the same as doing a dilligent study of something, the same as going to church doesn't make you a Christian. I'm talking historical biblical orthodoxy here.
You are right going to church doesn;t make you a christian, I went to church all my Childhood life and wasn;t saved until I was 29. You are also right about indepth study that is why I stayed trinitarian for so long, but after 2 to 3 years of dilligent study I realize trinitatrians were wrong. I really do not care what orthodoxy teaches, I believe only what God has said in His word. If orthodoxy agrees with scripture I agree with them, but when orthodoxy does not agree with scripture then I must disagree with them and agree with God.
 
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Apr 23, 2009
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You posted that while I was typing. That is so typical of some ignorant person who thinks (pretends) they are being persecuted. Try to be more original next time.

good night all.
You're the ignorant one AnRev. D_C is very intelligent and obviously well versed in scripture. You shouldn't even be in this forum as you deny the deity of Christ
 
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Jan 31, 2009
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Can cannot and did not die. Jesus Christ Died for my sins.

Hey watchmen what do you do with these verses cut them out, throw them away, or accept that Jesus was God and thus this means that yes God did die on the Cross for sinners.

Re 1:8I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.Re 1:9I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.Re 1:10I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,Re 1:11Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.Re 1:12And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks;Re 1:13And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle.Re 1:14His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire;Re 1:15And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters.Re 1:16And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength.Re 1:17And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:Re 1:18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.
when did the All Mighty, Jehova God our Lord, Die for He said He was Dead But am alive for evermore. now let me answer you before you make your statement on these verses . If this is Jesus just claiming to be God, but He was not . then we all christians are following not a great prophet , not a great teacher of The Word of God, but rather we are following a Blasphemer. However If He was God as He said and God did die on the Cross, when Jesus died then we serve God , we are following the teachings of God himself.
 
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Slepsog4

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The church of GOD which HE purchased with HIS own blood. (Acts 20:28)
 
Sep 2, 2009
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I could be like those who have slammed me and say to them the same that they have said to me: Repent of your ways and your sin for you do not know who Jesus is. Jesus is the SON OF GOD, he is not God, if you do not believe that then you will not receive eternal life.

Jesus knows what I mean when I say that but you do not. True, he spoke the words, I did not, for if you deny that he is the son of God you will die just as he said. He is not God.

To answer the question: Did God die on the cross? Let’s first look to see if God was present at the cross.

The scorners said: “He trusteth on God; let him deliver him now, if he desireth him: for he said, I am the Son of God.” Mat 27:43 “And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” Mat 27:46 “And Jesus cried again with a loud voice, and yielded up his spirit. Mat 27:50

Well, according to the book of Matthew, God was not present at the cross.

“And when the sixth hour was come, there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour. And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” Mr 15:33-34 “And Jesus uttered a loud voice, and gave up the ghost.” Mr 15:37

Nope, according to the book of Mark God wasn’t there either.

“And Jesus, crying with a loud voice, said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said this, he gave up the ghost. And when the centurion saw what was done, he glorified God, saying, Certainly this was a righteous man.” Luke 23:46-47

“The Jews answered him, We have a law, and by that law he ought to die, because he made himself the Son of God.” John 19:7 “When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up his spirit.” John 19:30

So it appears that God was not present in any of the Gospels when Jesus was crucified. In fact it clearly says that Jesus cried out to God asking him why he had forsaken him. Why then didn’t God show up for his crucifixion if it was God who was on the cross?

So Jesus was killed because he claimed to be the “son of God” as stated in the gospels. God was in heaven, Jesus was here, God killed Jesus by taking his spirit when Jesus said “into thy hands I commend my spirit.” You see, Jesus is the lamb of God, not the lamb of Satan. Therefore it is God who was to take the life of Jesus, not Satan.

Jesus answered and said to them, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”

Jesus did raise up the temple after three days, but it was God who brought him back to life. By returning from being dead (“from Jesus Christ, [who is] the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead,” Rev 1:5), Jesus was able to show the world that he was alive and set forth an unending life from that day forward and for those who believe in him.

Let’s see if there are more than one sons of God.

“The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of God came unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them: the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown.” Gen 6:4

“Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan also came among them.” Job 1:6

“Again it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan came also among them to present himself before Jehovah.” Job 2:1

“When the morning stars sang together, And all the sons of God shouted for joy?” Job 38:7

So now we know that God has many sons unless you want to call the bible full of lies. Then we can call all of it lies, right? We also know that Jesus is the only “begotten” one God sent here to earth.

There cannot be a Triune God if God has many other sons besides Jesus. If you believe in the bible, tell me where are these others son? Who are they? Were they present when Jesus died on the cross? Tell me smart ones, where are these others sons of God the bible you preach from mentions?

“For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you.” Mat 7:2 I tell you now, if you do not repent of your sins you will surely die.

You are self condemned: “But whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to sin, it would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck, and he were drowned in the depth of the sea.” Mat 18:6

“You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me. Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me? He who is of God hears God's words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.” John 8:44-47

I for one have grown tired of hearing that God died on the cross. You folks wonder why people don’t listen to you, it’s because there are some very sharp people out there that know more than you.

God did not die on the cross, he is far too powerful, stronger, greater and no man has ever seen him. Even Jesus said when he was here that “God is spirit,” yet you cannot understand even that. If you say that Jesus is God, then you are saying that you have seen God or at least saying that the apostles have seen God and all the others in the day. Then you call the bible a lie again because it says that no man has seen God except for Jesus.

Jesus was in heaven on his own throne when God sent him into the world. Then Jesus returned to be with God after he was resurrected from the “dead.”

[FONT=&quot]Because you do not believe that Jesus is the Son of God you are self condemned. To think that you call yourselves Christians.[/FONT]
 
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Slepsog4

Guest
AnRev,

I really tire of people saying more than is stated by Jesus on the cross. Jesus was quoting the opening line of Psalm 22. That Messianic Psalm contains many details of the passion event.

Try reading the whole Psalm. Check out these verses:

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]22 I will declare your name to my brothers; in the congregation I will praise you. 23 You who fear the Lord, praise him! All you descendants of Jacob, honor him! Revere him, all you descendants of Israel! 24 For he has not despised or disdained the suffering of the afflicted one; he has not hidden his face from him but has listened to his cry for help.[/FONT]
No one on this forum has denied that Jesus is the Son of God. What you miss is the implication of that statement. If he is the Son of God then He has the same nature or essence. He is the same class of being. He is deity, divine, God. There are numerous texts that prove this, but you deny them.

Jesus warned that those who do not believe that I am He will die in their sins.
 
1

1Covenant

Guest
You are right going to church doesn;t make you a christian, I went to church all my Childhood life and wasn;t saved until I was 29. You are also right about indepth study that is why I stayed trinitarian for so long, but after 2 to 3 years of dilligent study I realize trinitatrians were wrong. I really do not care what orthodoxy teaches, I believe only what God has said in His word. If orthodoxy agrees with scripture I agree with them, but when orthodoxy does not agree with scripture then I must disagree with them and agree with God.
When you say you studied are you saying that you felt like you knew trinitarian theology and you study oneness and then became oneness?
 
Jan 8, 2009
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but after 2 to 3 years of dilligent study I realize trinitatrians were wrong
In contrast I know many who have studied the word for decades and never ever once saw that the Trinitarian view was wrong. I don't know how anyone can claim that everyone else , the greater majority, is wrong when they've only been studying 2-3 years. Even IF they are wrong, at the very least, it shows that the bible doesn't clearly teach Oneness, as is supposed by its proponents. The majority is not always right but if the majority who study the Word for themselves all reach a Trinitarian (or similar) conclusion I think that says heaps. I think it's fair to say that a plain and simple interpretation of scripture will lead to Trinitarian-like conclusions, we all can read English and comprehend what it says.
 
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Apr 23, 2009
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When you say you studied are you saying that you felt like you knew trinitarian theology and you study oneness and then became oneness?
Nope I mean I studied the scriptures over and over again, and God revealed to me the truth of Oneness. I had never heard of the Oneness doctrine or knew what they taught until after Gods revealed this truth to me.
 
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In contrast I know many who have studied the word for decades and never ever once saw that the Trinitarian view was wrong. I don't know how anyone can claim that everyone else , the greater majority, is wrong when they've only been studying 2-3 years. Even IF they are wrong, at the very least, it shows that the bible doesn't clearly teach Oneness, as is supposed by its proponents. The majority is not always right but if the majority who study the Word for themselves all reach a Trinitarian (or similar) conclusion I think that says heaps. I think it's fair to say that a plain and simple interpretation of scripture will lead to Trinitarian-like conclusions, we all can read English and comprehend what it says.
I do not agree. If some one studied scripture without any benefit of learned doctrine, I do not believe they would come up with the Trinity belief.
 
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