I want to understand the Catholic faith so....

[Goodness11]

Again as I said it's more than loving people, look at Jesus look at all the things he did for ppl how he taught how he showed mercy how he prayed how far he was willing to go for us do you know what fueled his actions? Love. Love at least God's love is a supernatural steroid for a believer and without such a love without knowing such a love you will never truly know God nor truly see as he does.

When I became saved I asked God what does it mean to be a Christian how can I become strong in him and he gave me the best advice I ever received, seek love above all else and everything else will fall into place

Something just doesn't sit right. Like a three and a half legged chair. Yes love is important; but we must be wise to realize Jesus was not always purely loving to others, but sometimes stern. Jesus was so angered at the market in the temple He flipped the tables. He handed Judas the piece of bread to display betrayal. Jesus didn't pursue every single person but those He could alter their hearts like Zaccheus in the tree. Jesus left this Earth crucified; not everyone loved Him!! Being Christian does not build you a huge social fan base!!

Maybe when the Holy Spirit spoke to you directly 'seek love above all else and everything else will fall into place.' was a message you needed to hear for you at that time. I heard the message 'The Time is Now.' the other day which is meaningful to me; but utterly useless to others. God is helping mold you individually because we are all different and unique. So please don't get confused!

I enjoy that you're trying to get all psychological God's spiritual love; but your opinion is not of God. Truly. I know you'll probably still argue with what I have said; but I'll pray one day your eyes will be fully opened!!

This is my last visit to this post because I personally think the devil has played enough in here and made enough conflict.

Many blessings!!! XooXoo

 

[Yeraza_Bats]

Im not telling Blain that he should hate the catholics Im only telling him to be careful and who he chooses to follow, and to base what he hears on the word of God, and not on something that sounds nice.

 

[atwhatcost]

Doctrine did seem to matter...back then...when they ruled with an iron maiden. Now, when they are trying to win converts...the smiley face will do.

Oh, IDK. I was a Catholic in the 60's. I don't remember a time when it wasn't a matter of simply become Catholic through classes, confession, and the communion. It's enough, according to the priests, for Italian mafia, for those who practice voodoo, and it's enough for a whole bunch of other weird practices of those who call themselves Catholic.

 

[atwhatcost]

Again as I said it's more than loving people, look at Jesus look at all the things he did for ppl how he taught how he showed mercy how he prayed how far he was willing to go for us do you know what fueled his actions? Love. Love at least God's love is a supernatural steroid for a believer and without such a love without knowing such a love you will never truly know God nor truly see as he does.

When I became saved I asked God what does it mean to be a Christian how can I become strong in him and he gave me the best advice I ever received, seek love above all else and everything else will fall into place

The Bible says to seek God above all else. That's where the love comes from. I'm concerned you're hearing God. How are you learning about him?

 

[jaybird88]

Something just doesn't sit right. Like a three and a half legged chair. Yes love is important; but we must be wise to realize Jesus was not always purely loving to others, but sometimes stern. Jesus was so angered at the market in the temple He flipped the tables. He handed Judas the piece of bread to display betrayal. Jesus didn't pursue every single person but those He could alter their hearts like Zaccheus in the tree. Jesus left this Earth crucified; not everyone loved Him!! Being Christian does not build you a huge social fan base!!

Maybe when the Holy Spirit spoke to you directly 'seek love above all else and everything else will fall into place.' was a message you needed to hear for you at that time. I heard the message 'The Time is Now.' the other day which is meaningful to me; but utterly useless to others. God is helping mold you individually because we are all different and unique. So please don't get confused!

I enjoy that you're trying to get all psychological God's spiritual love; but your opinion is not of God. Truly. I know you'll probably still argue with what I have said; but I'll pray one day your eyes will be fully opened!!

This is my last visit to this post because I personally think the devil has played enough in here and made enough conflict.

Many blessings!!! XooXoo

Blain is not saying love and love alone and not another single teaching matters other than love. he is saying that if you understand love, the love that Jesus is talking about, everything else will fall into place.
compare to what Jesus said:
when asked how to enjoy the kingdom, He replied love your Father and love your fellow man. when asked the 2 most important commandments, love your Father and love your fellow man and all other commandments hinge on those first two.
I dont think Jesus was trying to give us a bunch of psychological metaphors here.

does it still look like the 3 legged chair? i dont think Blain is the one confused.

 

[crossnote]

No because as I said the love I speak of is not the kind of love we humans know love to be it's alien to us not of this world.
The Love of God is more than just loving others as I said it changes you it envelopes your entire being. Love is a verb an action and God's love is exactly what this verb means

luther as a monk, wracked his brains in agony knowing he couldn't LOVE enough in order to be accepted by God. He tortured himself trying to please a Holy God. It wasn't until the truth dawned on him that "the righteous shall live by faith" (doesn't say love) was he set free from his works salvation.

 

[crossnote]

you make it sound as if Blain is referring to some free love hippi from the 60s. the "friendly" person he is basing this on was Jesus. Jesus referred people to this 2 different times. also this is the answer Jesus gave when asked directly "how to enjoy the kingdom of heaven." and yet today so many ignore it.



Jesus said everything hinges on those 1st two commandments. He never said accept those commandments and nothing else. IMO if you can fully understand how to live by those 2, then all the rest will fall into place.

And I'm glad Jesus kept those two in my stead so that now His Life is at work in me.

 

[jaybird88]

luther as a monk, wracked his brains in agony knowing he couldn't LOVE enough in order to be accepted by God. He tortured himself trying to please a Holy God. It wasn't until the truth dawned on him that "the righteous shall live by faith" (doesn't say love) was he set free from his works salvation.

faith alone? and nothing else?

i like what you said about Luther, he was a great man. no one said it was easy. so did Luther give up on love?

 

[Angela53510]

Blain is not saying love and love alone and not another single teaching matters other than love. he is saying that if you understand love, the love that Jesus is talking about, everything else will fall into place.
compare to what Jesus said:
when asked how to enjoy the kingdom, He replied love your Father and love your fellow man. when asked the 2 most important commandments, love your Father and love your fellow man and all other commandments hinge on those first two.
I dont think Jesus was trying to give us a bunch of psychological metaphors here.

does it still look like the 3 legged chair? i dont think Blain is the one confused.

I'm just wondering who gave you the authority to interpret for Blain? You really have no grounds to say, "Blain is not saying" or " Blain is saying."

Blain is quite capable of answering these posts himself, and is doing so.

Please stick to your own opinions in future. If I wonder in future what Blain is saying, I will ask him, not you!

 

[crossnote]

faith alone? and nothing else?

i like what you said about Luther, he was a great man. no one said it was easy. so did Luther give up on love?

The question was, "How can a sinful man stand before a Holy God?" in that case OUR love was not enough.
It took faith in a loving God who would live and die for us. He robes (declares righteous) in His righteousness, those who place their faith in His Son.

 

[atwhatcost]

you're quote about ”end times and not being saved”, simply does not apply to me as I don't hold that a person's eschatology determines their salvation.

Now you are using my post of Trent's article XII which anathematizes us because of our view of justification, to criticize me...are you really that desperate for an example?
I'll fully admit that I come on strong with convictions and am somewhat polemic. Attack? Remember Eph 6 and those instruments of warfare?
Are you playing Holy Spirit again Lynn? LOL.
Yes, sorry I don't participate in every ecumenical lovefest here...that I save for Misc Forum.

Whoa, whoa whoa! I fully agree with you on your post with the mixed up, freaky doctrine they have, so how do you see me criticizing you on that?

Let me run down the list of "loving" things people have said about Catholics on this psot only:
-- They are getting special supernatural plagues particularly for them.
-- They are spiritual adulterers.
-- They're heretics.
-- They call Mary the Mother of Humanity and the queen of heaven.
-- They call someone other than God Father.
-- The pope tells them to despite Jesus's explicit instructions.
-- They're what's in a garbage can.
-- The deification of Mary is a fact.
-- They judge us!
-- They don't feed starving parishioners.
-- They call us names and haters.
-- They're a cult.
-- They've murdered millions and millions.
-- They never use the Bible to support these little accusations.
-- Take the boulder off your shoulder and you don't make it to heaven by people being nice to you. take the boulder off your shoulder for a moment, toss it aside and start over. As a CHRISTIAN, you do not make it to heaven by demanding people be 'nice' to you. You make it to heaven by being nice to your enemies, blessing them that curse and persecute you, etc. God is NOT going to take you aside and ask "DID you get on the internet recently and make sure those people knew how you were treated? There, there, my child...let your Father rap his arms around you and comfort you...I will take care of those chatroom members who did not associate with you, once and for all!". There are no pity parties given here. (People stuck up for tourist, but treated the Catholics they don't know like this anyway.)
-- doctrine and scripture is perverted.
-- The RC is the Antichrist.
-- There is fiction in your head. (Followed quickly by Good-bye and God bless.)
-- you never quote the Bible, and don't seem to hold it in high regard. (Said to someone who has quoted and seems to have regard for it.)
-- Respectfully:
I asked you if it agrees with what the bible says? Just give me a succinct answer! Is that possible with you or do you always need to answer in your self-aggrandizing, bloviated manner in which you respond to everyone! Im quite tired of your vain babblings. You impress noone but yourself.
Just answer the question!! YES OR NO!
-- I thought you were leaving? (Said more than once, and always followed by a blessing once they were sure he really left.)
-- Your ignorance is not just sad, its blasphemous. You, fordman, worship the Catholic church. You're doomed, and there ain't nothing Mary, the pope or your works can do about it. Did, dot, dash, adios, blasphemer. Make no mistake, you've been warned.
-- did Jesus use a Rosemary? Nope. Did Jesus go to a confessional? Nope. He prayed to God directly finding a quiet place to pray. Did Jesus follow around a 'pope' like figure? Nope. He told everyone to be disciples:
-- don't be conceded and pompous' because you are in our home, ChristianChat. Not the other way around.

First, some of this is just crap. Some of it is true, but the manner it is said is wrong. Second, it's all to target and none of it is love (or respect.) Third, and most important, how long would you put up with people tearing your beliefs this hard and actually listen to them? The Catholics were targeted by a moc. No one was out to bring them to the truth. Want to save someone? Be nice. Be understanding. Don't taunt.

And you said:
-- My guess is that Blain will get sucked in.
Experiential faith is a strong pull along with the mystical element.
-- How about each of those the Roman Catholic Church burned at the stake?
Does the true Church burn people at the stake?
-- So you would like to join those who tortured and burned the saints (if you don't already belong)?
-- have been slippin, slippin into darkness and are becoming a setup for an ecumenical type beast...
-- no that won't do. Countries kill, murder, and do bloody battles: Churches don't...or are at least not supposed to.
-- Ecumenical slop
-- ecumenical mish mash
-- ecumenical lovefest
As I said before, you weren't the worse. But even my Catholic brothers who don't even believe in God or don't think he gets involved with people would have punched you over this junk. There was no love.

So, who's fault is it these people aren't saved? Isn't there a time to truly reach a person? Ford proved he won't here but ZZ and Mary would, if they could hear something past the anger and taunts.

You know this wasn't right. Very much like a mobbing.

 

[crossnote]

Whoa, whoa whoa! I fully agree with you on your post with the mixed up, freaky doctrine they have, so how do you see me criticizing you on that?

Let me run down the list of "loving" things people have said about Catholics on this psot only:
-- They are getting special supernatural plagues particularly for them.
-- They are spiritual adulterers.
-- They're heretics.
-- They call Mary the Mother of Humanity and the queen of heaven.
-- They call someone other than God Father.
-- The pope tells them to despite Jesus's explicit instructions.
-- They're what's in a garbage can.
-- The deification of Mary is a fact.
-- They judge us!
-- They don't feed starving parishioners.
-- They call us names and haters.
-- They're a cult.
-- They've murdered millions and millions.
-- They never use the Bible to support these little accusations.
-- Take the boulder off your shoulder and you don't make it to heaven by people being nice to you. take the boulder off your shoulder for a moment, toss it aside and start over. As a CHRISTIAN, you do not make it to heaven by demanding people be 'nice' to you. You make it to heaven by being nice to your enemies, blessing them that curse and persecute you, etc. God is NOT going to take you aside and ask "DID you get on the internet recently and make sure those people knew how you were treated? There, there, my child...let your Father rap his arms around you and comfort you...I will take care of those chatroom members who did not associate with you, once and for all!". There are no pity parties given here. (People stuck up for tourist, but treated the Catholics they don't know like this anyway.)
-- doctrine and scripture is perverted.
-- The RC is the Antichrist.
-- There is fiction in your head. (Followed quickly by Good-bye and God bless.)
-- you never quote the Bible, and don't seem to hold it in high regard. (Said to someone who has quoted and seems to have regard for it.)
-- Respectfully:
I asked you if it agrees with what the bible says? Just give me a succinct answer! Is that possible with you or do you always need to answer in your self-aggrandizing, bloviated manner in which you respond to everyone! Im quite tired of your vain babblings. You impress noone but yourself.
Just answer the question!! YES OR NO!
-- I thought you were leaving? (Said more than once, and always followed by a blessing once they were sure he really left.)
-- Your ignorance is not just sad, its blasphemous. You, fordman, worship the Catholic church. You're doomed, and there ain't nothing Mary, the pope or your works can do about it. Did, dot, dash, adios, blasphemer. Make no mistake, you've been warned.
-- did Jesus use a Rosemary? Nope. Did Jesus go to a confessional? Nope. He prayed to God directly finding a quiet place to pray. Did Jesus follow around a 'pope' like figure? Nope. He told everyone to be disciples:
-- don't be conceded and pompous' because you are in our home, ChristianChat. Not the other way around.

First, some of this is just crap. Some of it is true, but the manner it is said is wrong. Second, it's all to target and none of it is love (or respect.) Third, and most important, how long would you put up with people tearing your beliefs this hard and actually listen to them? The Catholics were targeted by a moc. No one was out to bring them to the truth. Want to save someone? Be nice. Be understanding. Don't taunt.

And you said:
-- My guess is that Blain will get sucked in.
Experiential faith is a strong pull along with the mystical element.
-- How about each of those the Roman Catholic Church burned at the stake?
Does the true Church burn people at the stake?
-- So you would like to join those who tortured and burned the saints (if you don't already belong)?
-- have been slippin, slippin into darkness and are becoming a setup for an ecumenical type beast...
-- no that won't do. Countries kill, murder, and do bloody battles: Churches don't...or are at least not supposed to.
-- Ecumenical slop
-- ecumenical mish mash
-- ecumenical lovefest
As I said before, you weren't the worse. But even my Catholic brothers who don't even believe in God or don't think he gets involved with people would have punched you over this junk. There was no love.

So, who's fault is it these people aren't saved? Isn't there a time to truly reach a person? Ford proved he won't here but ZZ and Mary would, if they could hear something past the anger and taunts.

You know this wasn't right. Very much like a mobbing.

Umm, you sure have your list and checking it twice,...I have heard that love doesn't keep score as well.
In any case, I try to keep my attacks non personal (if you dig you'll see I fail at that too).
I will attack when I deem (yikes, I'm judging ) poisonous doctrine that sickens souls is being spread, and don't count me to back down. Perhaps some of the true seekers will sense that sincerity and respect it more as a stand for truth (which I hope they are seeking) than if I give friendly nods and winks to be liked even when lies are being propagated.
Paul had a similar attitude with the Judaisers in Galatians.

I just don't see BDF as a social circle as say Miscellaneous or some other forums. The friendlies should be carried on in those.
BDF is different, it is a doctrinal free for all, where serious errors come with a smile masquerading as truth. It is no place for Rodney King, and I wish that those who cry "let's just all get along" in the midst of a heated debate would go where they all can get along. As I said, when it gets personal, then it has crossed the line.

 

[PoetMary]

Umm, you sure have your list and checking it twice,...I have heard that love doesn't keep score as well.
In any case, I try to keep my attacks non personal (if you dig you'll see I fail at that too).
I will attack when I deem (yikes, I'm judging ) poisonous doctrine that sickens souls is being spread, and don't count me to back down. Perhaps some of the true seekers will sense that sincerity and respect it more as a stand for truth (which I hope they are seeking) than if I give friendly nods and winks to be liked even when lies are being propagated.
Paul had a similar attitude with the Judaisers in Galatians.

I just don't see BDF as a social circle as say Miscellaneous or some other forums. The friendlies should be carried on in those.
BDF is different, it is a doctrinal free for all, where serious errors come with a smile masquerading as truth. It is no place for Rodney King, and I wish that those who cry "let's just all get along" in the midst of a heated debate would go where they all can get along. As I said, when it gets personal, then it has crossed the line.

What is the use of having "right" theology if this "rightness" gives the license to treat people without ethics? Paul called this a "resounding gong or clanging cymbal." Does God grade people on some theological curve? Is something earned if a person's theology is spotless? Can someone's theology be spotless if it allows them to dehumanize a creature made in God's image? Why is "right thinking" elevated above "right action?" God values the intellect more highly?

Or, is the drive to theologically adjust everyone (as amply demonstrated in BDF) really an excuse for our own bad behavior? Or, to put it in gospel terms...does the BDF value spotlighting splinters while ignoring the distortion caused by our own logs?

 

[maxwel]

What is the use of having "right" theology if this "rightness" gives the license to treat people without ethics? Paul called this a "resounding gong or clanging cymbal." Does God grade people on some theological curve? Is something earned if a person's theology is spotless? Can someone's theology be spotless if it allows them to dehumanize a creature made in God's image? Why is "right thinking" elevated above "right action?" God values the intellect more highly?

So it's alright for YOU to viciously tear into PROTESTANT doctrine,
but if someone tears into YOUR doctrine...
they are "without ethics."


And... YOU want to play the victim now?

Seriously?

Seriously?


You come here just to argue, and create contention... and now you're the victim?

That's convenient.

 

[PoetMary]

So it's alright for YOU to viciously tear into PROTESTANT doctrine,
but if someone tears into YOUR doctrine...
they are "without ethics."


And... YOU want to play the victim now?

Seriously?

Seriously?


You come here just to argue, and create contention... and now you're the victim?

That's convenient.

Hey Maxwel...I'm not sure where all of this is coming from. I've never torn into protestant doctrine. (I've never claimed that certain doctrines were false). Most of my comments here have been related to PRACTICE as opposed to doctrinal views. I have presented the rationale behind a few aspects of RCC and/or liturgical doctrines...but very few of those.

Also, if you will actually read what I said WITH CARE, you'll notice that I include myself in the phrasing. In my final statements, I use "our" more than once. So your interpretation of this as me indicting others and excusing or victimizing myself is a misread.

Finally, you have little evidence that I "come here just to argue." There have been posts I've made that presented a contrary viewpoint. However, I've also engaged in plenty of posts that have attempted to encourage others, to understand others, to get to know others, and to just have fun.

I would appreciate it if you would attempt to be more objective and less emotive in your "diagnosis" of me. Apart from the fact that you really don't know me well at all, if you just read through the variety of posts I've made you would realize that your statements are not accurate.

 

[maxwel]

Also, if you will actually read what I said WITH CARE, you'll notice that I include myself in the phrasing. In my final statements, I use "our" more than once. So your interpretation of this as me indicting others and excusing or victimizing myself is a misread.

You honestly believe you're the only person on the forum who knows what "rhetoric" means?

You honestly think you can just spout some words, and it magically makes all your other words change or disappear?

Unbelievable.

You should run for office.

No really, you should be a politician.

The plural possessive pronoun "our" is often used in a condescending way to mean "your".

We do this all the time.
Everyone on this forum has heard an adult tell some children,
"Alright, now lets put our mittens on."
And the adult had no mittens.

You know perfectly well "our" is often a condescending way to say "your", and it's contingent on context.

That's the most irritating thing.
You act as if everyone outside of yourself must surely be such an idiot they'll believe any ridiculous thing you say.

If I took you seriously, I'd be insulted.

 

[PoetMary]

You honestly believe you're the only person on the forum who knows what "rhetoric" means?

You honestly think you can just spout some words, and it magically makes all your other words change or disappear?

Unbelievable.

You should run for office.

No really, you should be a politician.

The plural possessive pronoun "our" is often used in a condescending way to mean "your".

We do this all the time.
Everyone on this forum has heard an adult tell some children,
"Alright, now lets put our mittens on."
And the adult had no mittens.

You know perfectly well "our" is often a condescending way to say "your", and it's contingent on context.

That's the most irritating thing.
You act as if everyone outside of yourself must surely be such an idiot they'll believe any ridiculous thing you say.

If I took you seriously, I'd be insulted.

The only problem with this interpretation is it's based on the presumption that I was being politic instead of sincere. I wasn't. I can think of several examples where I have been caught up in the argument for it's own sake and I've hurt people's feelings. There have been multiple times where I've had to go back to people and apologize for my actions. I was thinking of these moments when I was writing my response.

In fact, you and I had an exchange where you were checking-in with me regarding a debate we were having on another board. My understanding is that you were wanting to insure that it wasn't offensive or personal, and suggested dropping the discussion. I let you know that I wasn't taking it personally, that I had no inherent problems with intellectual debate, and then (based on my inference that you wanted it to stop) I stopped my postings about it on the boards. So, even though I didn't have a need to stop the discussion, my perception was you wanted it to stop, and I deferred to you in that.

It seems like you've made a decision regarding me and my motives. I'm not sure why you've made this decision. Really, all I'm asking is for you to consider the possibility that you might have misinterpreted.

*Let me add one more thing. If you're getting a read that I'm being "guarded" or "careful" in my response, you are right about that. If your conclusion is that this guardedness is because I'm being false, that is a misread. This is me doing my very best to carefully express myself without hurting others. So I am using language deliberately in an attempt to be clear without being offense.

 

[JesusLives]

If Blain is anything like me he is doing this to better understand our Catholic brothers and sisters not to change faiths. When I was younger religions were interesting to me and I was friendly with many different faiths not because I wanted to change but to better understand where someone else was coming from and how they believed.

The most important thing in any faith is that Jesus is our Savior and that one understands salvation. It is God's work through the Holy Spirit to help guide each one of us into the truth according to God and not any man made religion....

I believe Blain understands Salvation and has accepted Jesus as his Savior.

 

[JesusLives]

Have not met any nice people here except for one. Maybe if i didnt say I was Catholic, it would have been different. I would name the person who is nice to me, but i don't want them to suffer repercussions from associating with me

Sorry you have had such a bad experience here it seems if you aren't the religion of choice you are bashed....been there done that on the receiving end..... I am not a Catholic but married to one and he's saved by the way as well as you are I would venture a guess. God reads our hearts not men. Sorry we can be so judge mental at times. I will let God decide where we stand with Him as it is not my place other than to love and show kindness.

 

[JesusLives]

tourist..take the boulder off your shoulder for a moment, toss it aside and start over. As a CHRISTIAN, you do not make it to heaven by demanding people be 'nice' to you. You make it to heaven by being nice to your enemies, blessing them that curse and persecute you, etc. God is NOT going to take you aside and ask "DID you get on the internet recently and make sure those people knew how you were treated? There, there, my child...let your Father rap his arms around you and comfort you...I will take care of those chatroom members who did not associate with you, once and for all!". There are no pity parties given here.

Wow.... the only one carrying a boulder here is you.... you seem to aim them nicely too.... Just Wow....