Is keeping the Commandments and Laws of God Needed for Eternal Life?

[JaumeJ]

I wonder why yuor outraged. It is basic to the Gospel of grace that the Christian will only ever have one rightousness in God's eyes for the wholev of their Christian lives, faith in the son of God who loved them and gave himself for them, actuall that is key. Now, as you should be aware Paul makes clear that anyone who believes they can have a righteousness o their own according to law keeping is ignoring the cross of Christ and setting aside the grace of God. I am sorry if you are incomfortable with that, but it is very plainly written. And I would have hoped, bearing that in mind you would have endorsed my words, so the author of this thread would bnot continue to ignore the grace of God.

Why do you put emotions on me, such as OUTRAGED? To place that emotion is indicative of your wanting that outcome. Sorry. I am at peace.

However, it is a grave infraction on the Body of Yeshua, Christ, to teach people not study all of the Word. Again, the Word is Yeshua, Jesus.

If there are segments of the Word you do not understand, you should not use your ignorance against those who do understand.

Again, the kernel of the post is that all believers study ALL of the Word, yet you are perverting my post to say I am saying we are under the law. Read it again, and if you continue thinking I am saying such, then, I am afraid you are either incapable of understanding language, or you are not in the Way, Jesus, Yeshua.

Do not look for specks in your brothers' eye.

 

[newcovenantchristian]

Why do you put emotions on me, such as OUTRAGED? To place that emotion is indicative of your wanting that outcome. Sorry. I am at peace.

However, it is a grave infraction on the Body of Yeshua, Christ, to teach people not study all of the Word. Again, the Word is Yeshua, Jesus.

If there are segments of the Word you do not understand, you should not use your ignorance against those who do understand.

Again, the kernel of the post is that all believers study ALL of the Word, yet you are perverting my post to say we are under the law. Read it again, and if you continue thinking I am saying such, then, I am afraid you are either incapable of understanding language or you are not in the Way, Jesus, Yeshua.

Do not look for specks in your brothers' eye.

Well I'm glad you forgive my ignorance, and I forgive your haughtiness. It seems you are unwilling to point out to the author of this thread he cannot have a righteousness of his own according to law keeping, which may go a long way to explaining the tone and arrogance of your words to me

 

[JaumeJ]

Why do you put emotions on me, such as OUTRAGED? To place that emotion is indicative of your wanting that outcome. Sorry. I am at peace.

However, it is a grave infraction on the Body of Yeshua, Christ, to teach people not study all of the Word. Again, the Word is Yeshua, Jesus.

If there are segments of the Word you do not understand, you should not use your ignorance against those who do understand.

Again, the kernel of the post is that all believers study ALL of the Word, yet you are perverting my post to say I am saying we are under the law. Read it again, and if you continue thinking I am saying such, then, I am afraid you are either incapable of understanding language, or you are not in the Way, Jesus, Yeshua.

Do not look for specks in your brothers' eye.

Well I'm glad you forgive my ignorance, and I forgive your haughtiness. It seems you are unwilling to point out to the author of this thread he cannot have a righteousness of his own according to law keeping, which may go a long way to explaining the tone and arrogance of your words to me

Yet you avoid understanding my post while leveling more accusations. Again, the kernel of the post states it is adviseable to study all of the Word.

Your being evasive and not addressing this shows your level of understanding and fellowship in Yeshua, Jesus. After all, you claim to have read my post, and came back telling me I do not understand the grace of Yeshua, Jesus. I cannot think of anything with an more hurtful intent to a disciple of Yeshua, and no, love does not allow for such scathing accusations in the name of Yeshua, Jesus, so do not attempt perverting this statement into some kind of hate remark.

 

[newcovenantchristian]

Yet you avoid understanding my post while leveling more accusations. Again, the kernel of the post states it is adviseable to study all of the Word.

Your being evasive and not addressing this shows your level of understanding and fellowship in Yeshua, Jesus. After all, you claim to have read my post, and came back telling me I do not understand the grace of Yeshua, Jesus. I cannot think of anything with an more hurtful intent to a disciple of Yeshua, and no, love does not allow for such scathing accusations in the name of Yeshua, Jesus, so do not attempt perverting this statement into some kind of hate remark.

Can I ask? If you have such great understanding, why are you on the internet? Why are you not pastoring a church?
You see, the hardest place of all to get people to change their minds about God/the bible is on websites like these, it is like trying to storm the highest of citadels. Much better to go and tell those who would be more open to the message, and would believe it far easier. Because for a couple of reasons nearly everyone here would be extremely reluctant to change their minds. One is fear, they take comfort, solace in their beliefs, to actually think of changing them is unthinkable. Then as I told you, many come here to teach others, believing they have much knowledge of the word, as you keep trying to impress me that you have
So I would say, if you have great truth, take it to those who are far more likely to accept it, outside of cyberspace.

 

[ozell]

Hopefully some have read the Posts "What Law is This Paul Speaks of". And more importantly you have read the (2) posts after, "Answer to the OP Which law is this Paul speaks of Parts 1 & 2", which answers the question of the first post, "What Law is This Paul Speaks of?"

If you have read them, you now understand that Paul speaks of (2) sets of laws throughout his writings. After reading the post hopefully all that read understand that Paul uses the phrases 'works and deeds of the law' NOT to mean that ALL of God's laws have been nailed to His cross. As a matter of fact, Paul teaches all that he preaches to to KEEP God's laws, as he did himself to the best of his abilities.

Now on to a topic that most will not agree with but is a doctrine that is supported by scripture.

My question to the forum, as is indicated by the title; "Is keeping the Commandments and Laws of God Needed for Eternal Life?"

Now this is a very simple question, that if thought about logically, has an answer that is just as simple.

So again I ask...."Is keeping the Commandments and Laws of God Needed for Eternal Life?

Just as with my other posts....let's toss this topic around for awhile...pray and ask God for wisdom and understanding....and let's study and present God's word as proof and not emotions, to come up with a sound biblical doctrine. And let's remember to use ALL of Gods word....

2 Tim.3
[16] All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

That means we cannot toss some scriptures if it seems to contradict others; all MUST be used and work together.

"Is keeping the Commandments and Laws of God Needed for Eternal Life?"


.

yes
Jesus said it is

 

[JaumeJ]

Yet you avoid understanding my post while leveling more accusations. Again, the kernel of the post states it is adviseable to study all of the Word.

Your being evasive and not addressing this shows your level of understanding and fellowship in Yeshua, Jesus. After all, you claim to have read my post, and came back telling me I do not understand the grace of Yeshua, Jesus. I cannot think of anything with an more hurtful intent to a disciple of Yeshua, and no, love does not allow for such scathing accusations in the name of Yeshua, Jesus, so do not attempt perverting this statement into some kind of hate remark.

Can I ask? If you have such great understanding, why are you on the internet? Why are you not pastoring a church?
You see, the hardest place of all to get people to change their minds about God/the bible is on websites like these, it is like trying to storm the highest of citadels. Much better to go and tell those who would be more open to the message, and would believe it far easier. Because for a couple of reasons nearly everyone here would be extremely reluctant to change their minds. One is fear, they take comfort, solace in their beliefs, to actually think of changing them is unthinkable. Then as I told you, many come here to teach others, believing they have much knowledge of the word, as you keep trying to impress me that you have
So I would say, if you have great truth, take it to those who are far more likely to accept it, outside of cyberspace.

Have you been here under another name? It seems you cannot keep on the subject, even when you have changed the subject, you come back changing to some other subject. Are you aware you do this? It is the closest thing to trolling I can figure. Now, as per my work in this age, you know nothing of it or of me. Please go back to my post where you answered telling me I did not know Yeshua, Jesus, and speak to it. Otherwise, do not come back as if you are replying to anything, because so far you have changed the subject in each of your feigned replies.

 

[newcovenantchristian]

Have you been here under another name? It seems you cannot keep on the subject, even when you have changed the subject, you come back changing to some other subject. Are you aware you do this? It is the closest thing to trolling I can figure. Now, as per my work in this age, you know nothing of it or of me. Please go back to my post where you answered telling me I did not know Yeshua, Jesus, and speak to it. Otherwise, do not come back as if you are replying to anything, because so far you have changed the subject in each of your feigned replies.

You've lost me, can't find where Im s'posed to have said you didn't know Jesus. People do know him you know without fuly understanding grace, for he loves them and is merciful to us all

 

[JaumeJ]

Have you been here under another name? It seems you cannot keep on the subject, even when you have changed the subject, you come back changing to some other subject. Are you aware you do this? It is the closest thing to trolling I can figure. Now, as per my work in this age, you know nothing of it or of me. Please go back to my post where you answered telling me I did not know Yeshua, Jesus, and speak to it. Otherwise, do not come back as if you are replying to anything, because so far you have changed the subject in each of your feigned replies.

You've lost me, can't find where Im s'posed to have said you didn't know Jesus. People do know him you know without fuly understanding grace, for he loves them and is merciful to us all

You typed "To write what you have shows you do not understand the new covenant, the law is written on your heart and mind, but, I also know you will not accept that, so I will await your rebuke"

This is saying I do not understand grace, and Yeshua, Jesus, is grace, His sacrifice on the cross is the gift of salvation to all who accept it.

You said this to my post that was stressing the importance of reading and studying all of the Word, because Jesus, Yeshua, IS the Word.

Apparently, you are reigning without the King present, in judging me such. I choose to await Yeshua's return, and the reward He brings with Him.

It is taught by Yeshua to judge for ourselves what is right, but judgment to condemnation is not to be practiced.

Now, why did you type that reply when the point of my post is that people study ALL of the Word. If you change the subject again, I am afraid I am finished with trying because it is evident you do not believe studying all of the Word is important, and you think anyone who does is not familiar with Grace.

 

[RickShafer]

To the all the 'law perfects me' crowd out there - Keep ye ALL of it!
If your going to make types and shadows real, then be a whole keeper of them.
Don't pick and choose.
Keep ye all of the LAW, and so fulfill His commandments.

B.T.W. - The two commandments Jesus said on which all of the law rests, if you keep those, you won't be breaking the other eight
of the big ten.
And the Holy Spirit of Grace is the only way we are able to Love the Lord our God with all our heart, mind, soul, and strength;
and to love our neighbor as ourself.

 

[newcovenantchristian]

To the all the 'law perfects me' crowd out there - Keep ye ALL of it!
If your going to make types and shadows real, then be a whole keeper of them.
Don't pick and choose.
Keep ye all of the LAW, and so fulfill His commandments.

B.T.W. - The two commandments Jesus said on which all of the law rests, if you keep those, you won't be breaking the other eight
of the big ten.
And the Holy Spirit of Grace is the only way we are able to Love the Lord our God with all our heart, mind, soul, and strength;
and to love our neighbor as ourself.

Having had much time to reflect on this I have learnt the following
The people who demand all of the law/commands are kept, are themselves selective as to which ones they actually strive/make effort themselves to obey
Many(I say many) who keep stressing the law, find it difficult to embrace the Chistian only has one righteousness, faith in Christ the whole of their Christian life
And many(I only say many) rarely if ever mention the Holy Spirit, who sanctifies the believer, and empowers the believer to live the Chistian life as they look to Christ and trust him

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Having had much time to reflect on this I have learnt the following
The people who demand all of the law/commands are kept, are themselves selective as to which ones they actually strive/make effort themselves to obey
Many(I say many) who keep stressing the law, find it difficult to embrace the Chistian only has one righteousness, faith in Christ the whole of their Christian life
And many(I only say many) rarely if ever mention the Holy Spirit, who sanctifies the believer, and empowers the believer to live the Chistian life as they look to Christ and trust him

they do not understand you obey them all, or you are guilty of them all. This is why we can never stand up to the law. We all have parts we struggle with, the two Christ said all the law is based on we fail miserable (love Lord, and our neighbor) so why people think they can be holy and right is beyond me

 

[Eccl12and13]

I'm not putting all this up for you, I know you'll never accept it, but I don't want others to be misled by your wrong exegesis/interpretations
So Paul had to die to the law of burnt offerings so he could live for God??????????????????
You won't find many who will agree with you(i 'ope)

Newcovenantchristian;

I have attempted to answer all of your questions that you have presented..even those you said that I was avoiding. I have asked a few simple questions with no reply from you.

You speak of not wanting to mislead those reading...well...do those reading a favor, if you could and please, let them know your position on the following questions.....


Do you believe a change is needed in ones life if they decide to follow the true and living God?

And if so.....what change is it that YOU believe is needed?


To those reading...what are your thoughts about the above questions? Before I left yesterday this post was at 1088 read. Today it's over 1200....so I know there are those that are reading that are also interested in the topic.

So tell me what do you think? Does a person who wishes to follow the true and living God have to have a change in their life? And if a change is needed....just what type of change is it that is needed?

I know...as well as I'm sure most who are reading, know the answer to the above.

Let's read what thus say the word of God;

Matt.5
[19] Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Why do I teach men about the commandments of God? Because teaching men to keep God's laws and commandments is TOO a law? Not doing it when I know to do so would be a sin.

So please.....Speak up!

.

 

[newcovenantchristian]

they do not understand you obey them all, or you are guilty of them all. This is why we can never stand up to the law. We all have parts we struggle with, the two Christ said all the law is based on we fail miserable (love Lord, and our neighbor) so why people think they can be holy and right is beyond me

It is ingrained into us that we get what we deserve, we have to earn what we have, and if we fail to do the right thing we get punished or pay the consequences. That is natural logic and understanding to the human mind, and many take that into their Christianity, and the only way it can be broken, and believe me I know, is by the Holy Spirit, for unless he starts leading us, it is hopeless for us to understand and see the grace which is ours. We cannot earn our way to Heaven, we cannot deserve our way to Heaven, and we can never be good enough to get there, but in tjhe purity of grace that knowledge is the key to much victory in our lives.
But there are many Christians who in their heart want recognition for their Christianity and for where thy perceive they are at, it is not there's to have, and they will have no peace or lasting happiness while they think along those lines
God Bless EG and thank you for your witness to the truth of the Amazing Grace that is ours who are undeserving sinners and always will be

 

[Eccl12and13]

We cannot earn our way to Heaven, we cannot deserve our way to Heaven, and we can never be good enough to get there, but in tjhe purity of grace that knowledge is the key to much victory in our lives.

Do you believe a change is needed in ones life if they decide to follow the true and living God?

And if so.....what change is it that you believe is needed?



.

 

[newcovenantchristian]

Do you believe a change is needed in ones life if they decide to follow the true and living God?

Absolutely
And if so.....what change is it that you believe is needed?



.

The old needs to be washed away and the new come in. I go to church one night, I give my heart to the Lord and become saved, at that point I'm forgiven, and stand righteous in God's sight, because I trust his son died for my sin, and that is the only reason I stand righteous before God at that time. And I guess you may even agree with that, I've had no time to do anything or be obediant I am utterly accepted because of what Jesus did for me on the cross.
But what will the minister tell me to do when I leave his service to go on with God? If I'm fortunate I speak to one who fully encompasses grace. Becuase now I'm a Christian I really in my heart want to live as God wants me to live, and God has done this for me, by putting his laws he would have me keep on my heart and mind
Don't know if you've heard of Spurgeon, but he said the new Christian goes to move forward with Christ and he likened it to coming to a very high mountain, and most Christians tried to climb that mountain to get to the other side, but it was too steep, no matter how many times they tried they could never reach the top, they gave up and came back down, and after time they got more and more discouraged an disheartened by their faliure. And he likened that mountain to the way of law. But at the very foot of the mountain there was a narow gorge, so narrow that most missed seeing it as they kept struggling to climb the mountain, but it was the way of Jesus and led to the other side.
You see, if you are sincere, and lets face it, I don't know your heart, and you don't know mine, but if we are both sincere we both want to please God, so the question is how is this best achieved, how do we achieve it
When I was ten I becaume a Christian and set out to live a good enough life for God, oh how hard I tried, but I failed miserably, the harder I tried the more I failed as I kept trying to climb that mountain, and in the end I gave up dispirited. Years later I found the gorge at the bottom of the mountain and now I'm saved.
Now I'm gonna be frank with you, utterly frank. I do not understand how you can be happy in a sincere Chistianity believing your righteousness is your own personal goodness(which you must believe from what you've written) according to law. Because when I tried that I was utterly miserable and wracked with guilt, and I find it hard to believe your that much of a different human being than me at essence. So there is much I don't know and much I cannot comprehend and I cannot comprehend that if you love God with all your heart you can have any peace seeking a righteousnss of obediance to the law/persional goodness

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Do you believe a change is needed in ones life if they decide to follow the true and living God?

And if so.....what change is it that you believe is needed?



.

A change is NOT NEEDED, A change WILL HAPPEN. A huge difference. Those who are truely born of God WILL change,

 

[Eccl12and13]

You see, if you are sincere, and lets face it, I don't know your heart, and you don't know mine, but if we are both sincere we both want to please God, so the question is how is this best achieved, how do we achieve it....

Let's not guess....let's read how God tells us we are to please Him;

1 Thes.4
[1] Furthermore then we beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by the Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more.
[2] For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus.

I cannot comprehend and I cannot comprehend that if you love God with all your heart you can have any peace seeking a righteousnss of obediance to the law/persional goodness

It is because of the fact that God has told us what is required to show our love to Him. Again....let's go to His word for wisdom and understanding.......

1 John 2
[3] And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
[4] He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
[5] But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

1 John 3
[22] And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.
[23] And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
[24] And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

1 John 3
[2] By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
[3] For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

My peace comes from knowing I am doing my best at doing His will. His will is that I obey Him. I show that obedience by keeping His laws and commandments.



.

 

[Eccl12and13]

A change is NOT NEEDED, A change WILL HAPPEN. A huge difference. Those who are truely born of God WILL change,

OK....let's go with that. And just what is the change that will happen?



.

 

[newcovenantchristian]

You see, if you are sincere, and lets face it, I don't know your heart, and you don't know mine, but if we are both sincere we both want to please God, so the question is how is this best achieved, how do we achieve it....




I cannot comprehend and I cannot comprehend that if you love God with all your heart you can have any peace seeking a righteousnss of obediance to the law/persional goodness

Yeah, but your're forgetting something

Through Jesus and for his namesake we received grace and apostleship to call people from among the Gentiles(that's me) to the obediance that comes from faith
Rom 1:5

How come you never mention this? All you seem to want to talk about is looking to the literal law, striving to obey it and that's our righteousness. Why do you never mention obediance is by faith? I find that strange

 

[loveme1]

1Judge not, that ye be not judged. 2For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. 3And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? 4Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? 5Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.
6Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

7Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: 8For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. 9Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? 10Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? 11If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?

12Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.

13Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? 17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. 18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. 20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: 25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. 26And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: 27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.

28And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine: 29For he taught them as one having authority, and not as the scribes.