Then how was the thief on the cross saved?
He repented and believed Jesus.
The point I was making is that "accept Jesus" is common rhetoric presented within the context of Original Sin and Penal Substitution. When one uses that kind of language one is affirming the common notion to those who hear it.
We do not live in a vacuum. There pulpits, seminaries, radio, television is full of people proclaiming "accept Jesus" and their context is Original Sin and Penal Substitution. They believe in an "abstract salvation" disconnected from purity of heart whereby justification is premised on a forensic legal exchange wrought through Jesus dying as a "substitute" whereby He absorbed the wrath of God and thus "paid the debt owed" making it not due anymore. Anyone who "trusts in that" is assured they are saved.
That message is death. I would avoid using the rhetoric of that message and actually stick to what the Bible actually states.
Titus 3:5 says, "he saved us, not because of righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy. He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit,"
Yes that is right.
Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when
the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
The washing of regeneration is not possible without a repentance proven by deeds. There has to be "godly sorrow that works a repentance unto salvation."
"Accepting Jesus" is not how the Bible preaches the Gospel. "Accepting Jesus" is a modern theological rhetoric premised on what I have stated above and when most people hear it they will hear it in the context of Original Sin and Penal Substitution.
Even if one also teaches a "cessation from sin" it will be undone by the cognitive dissonance wrought via the "paid the price in full" doctrine. Deception is wrought in the mind and we can be deceived into communication which upholds the deception very easily. Language is but a means by which we can communicate mental thoughts with each other. If the language can be redefined the intended message can be lost in the translation (or words used) so to speak.
I hope you can understand what I am trying to say. Please think about it carefully.
So the Tax Collector was not justified or saved in the Parable of the Tax Collector and the Phariee?
The context of the parable of the Tax Collector and the Pharisee was in regards to the Tax Collector repenting. He recognised his sin and begged for mercy. That parable does not contradict anything I have written.
The sin/repent/sin/repent/sin/repent cycle is a clear sign that one never truly repented. What if a husband kept engaging in adultery and yet kept confessing it and begging for forgiveness? Would that husband be truly repentant? No. The adultery would have to cease once and for all.
The Bible speaks of "worldly sorrow" and "godly sorrow." One works death and one works a repentance unto salvation. Godly sorrow produces this...
2Co 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
2Co 7:11 For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort,
what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
Would the tax collecter have been granted mercy if he persisted in his sin? Of course not (Pro 28:13, Isa 55:7).
Yes, a true believer will stop sinning. I agree. But a person is not condemned if they are confessing a sin that they are struggling with so as to overcome it.
That is an erroneous position to hold.
You are claiming that we can sin and not surely die if we are merely confessing that sin as we struggle. The Bible does not teach that.
Where is "escaping the corruption that is in the world through lust" in that sentiment?
2Pe 1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
2Pe 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature,
having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
Sin is wrought through...
Jas 1:14 But every man is tempted, when
he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
Jas 1:15 Then
when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
That is the corruption that we have escaped from if we are truly born again. Where is that in what you are saying?
You are stating the opposite of that in claiming that one who has not escaped that corruption is not condemned so long as they confess the fact as they continue their struggle.
Do you realise the connotations of such a position?
Let's use the example of a child molester. Plug that into your example...
Yes, a true believer [who is a child molester] will stop sinning. I agree. But a person is not condemned if they are confessing a sin [like child molestation] that they are struggling with so as to overcome it.
Is that what you really believe?
When does the sin stop then? A week? A year? A decade?
You have just stated that an individual can sin without being condemned so long as they continue to confess the sin each time. Where is any notion of heart purity or a redemption from all iniquity in that? It is void of such things.
Tit 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
Can you see the problem here?
No true believer who confesses their sin is seeking to cover their sin but they are seeking to resolve it and overcome it.
I hear this kind of statement all the time, yet it is a total contradiction.
Why are they confessing their sin then if they are not seeking to have it covered?
The issue of sin is meant to be resolved via the repentance experience, not later on down the road.
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Rom 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
We ought to have been freed from sin. This notion that believers "still struggle" with sin is not Biblical. Again I ask where is the "having escaped the corruption in the world through lust" ? Where is that?
Pornography addicts, rapists, serial murderers, thieves, blasphemers, idolators all struggling with their sin whilst not under condemnation? Come on be real.
The Bible says that there is no condemnation for those who are IN Christ Jesus and who WALK after the Spirit.
Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
How can someone claim that...
a person is not condemned if they are confessing a sin that they are struggling with so as to overcome it.
The Bible does not say that there is no condemnation for one who is confesses a sin they are struggling with. The Bible says there is no condemnation for those who are IN Christ Jesus who WALK after the Spirit.
It boggles my mind how on the one hand you say that we have to stop sinning and yet on the other hand say that there is no condemnation on those who have not. That is contradictory.
The blood is for the cleansing of sin when one confesses and forsakes sin.
Yes it is and it works in this manner...
Heb 10:19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
Heb 10:20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;
Heb 10:21 And having an high priest over the house of God;
Heb 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
The blood is not something to be used over and over again. Jesus died ONCE so that we may be cleansed ONCE.
2Pe 1:9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was
purged from his old sins.
The Bible says...
Heb 10:26 For
if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
Heb 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted
the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
The blood is what enjoins us into a covenant with God...
Heb 9:20 Saying,
This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.
You are claiming that a sacrifice remains for ongoing sin so long as that sin is confessed and thus demonstrate a complete ignorance of why Jesus actually died and of how the blood actually cleanses us.
There is no sacrifice for ongoing willful sin because the the sacrifice of Jesus is meant to cleanse us one time and leave us pure. There is meant to have been a real transformation of the human heart where ALL THINGS are made new. We actually escape the corruption that is in the world through lust, we don't "struggle with sin." We are tempted of course but we are to take the way of escape each time and this is what enduring to the end means.
People who are in the sin/repent/sin/repent/sin/repent cycle are not saved. They have not been saved FROM sin. They are deceived if they think they have been. Those who think they are saved in such a state have bought hook, line and sinker into a false gospel message and thus remain "workers of iniquity." They have not been redeemed from all iniquity and made pure. It is a tragedy.
Side Note:
Quck question: Do you believe the Law of Moses is still binding for the believer today?
Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
...
Rom 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
