Sabbath: The Lord's Day

LawofLove · Aug 22, 2012

2Ti_4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

Act 28:23 And when they had appointed him a day, there came many to him into his lodging; to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus, both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets, from morning till evening.
Act 28:24 And some believed the things which were spoken, and some believed not.
Act 28:25 And when they agreed not among themselves, they departed, after that Paul had spoken one word, Well spake the Holy Ghost by Esaias the prophet unto our fathers,
Act 28:26 Saying, Go unto this people, and say, Hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and not perceive:
Act 28:27 For the heart of this people is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes have they closed; lest they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Laodicea · Aug 22, 2012

Isaiah 30:8-10
(8) Now go, write it before them in a table, and note it in a book, that it may be for the time to come (The latter Day) for ever and ever:
(9) That this is a rebellious people, lying children, children that will not hear the law of the LORD:
(10) Which say to the seers, See not; and to the prophets, Prophesy not unto us right things, speak unto us smooth things, prophesy deceits:

angelofmercy · Aug 22, 2012

ozell said:

Jeremiah 10:1-2
10

Hear ye the word which the LORD speaketh unto you, O house of Israel:

2 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.

Abishai · Aug 22, 2012

I am not here to change anybody's mind as everyone is predetermined that what he/she is already following is right, however even I want to shout with the rest in the crowd, so if anybody wants to hear me, he/she can:

Which day is God's sabbath day? Because God rested, He blessed the day and sanctified it and made it for man. And the Lord God wants His people to enter into His rest (not man's). If Saturday is God's rest day then does He start working from Sunday again through out until Saturday reappears? However, the scripture says :
John 5:16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.

John 5:17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.

John 5:18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.

So this is still related to Sabbath and that means God is still working on Sabbath. But, the Bible also says that He rested from all His works on the Sabbath day and THEREFORE he blessed and sanctified it. Now make up your mind; is He still working on the Sabbath day or He is resting or has rested on the Sabbath.

Hebrews 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

So what is Paul telling us by saying that we have to 'labour' to enter into that rest? Do we need to labour to keep the sabbath? I wot not. Again in this chapter what is Paul talking about? What does he mean by 'rest'? In this chapter of Hebrews: The Lord says 'they shall not enter into my rest' after so long time of His creation and His commandment of the Sabbath day. Does it mean that to those whom the Lord sware saying that 'they shall not enter into my rest', did not keep the Sabbath at all? If they had kept the Sabbath then they had already entered into His rest. If they had not kept the Sabbath, they had not entered into His rest anyways (so there was no point in the Lord swaring that they shall not enter into His rest).

The Bible never mentions of the seventh day of His creation saying 'the evening and the morning were the seventh day' like it does for the rest of six days. That means the seventh day never seemed to have come to an end in the garden of Eden. Is it the same day when we will be back in the Garden where we have the Tree of Life, where we will have our Adam (Jesus Christ) to walk with, where there is no night; for the Lord Himself shall be the light and there is no need of the sun? The Lord shall wipe away all our tears and we are never going to work again. Every man will cease from His work as the Lord Himself has ceased from His. Is it not that everlasting rest we are looking for rather? Is that rest not the true Sabbath? Is not the OT Sabbath the shadow of the thing that is to come?

Be Blessed!

JaumeJ · Aug 22, 2012

Abishai said:

I am not here to change anybody's mind as everyone is predetermined that what he/she is already following is right, however even I want to shout with the rest in the crowd, so if anybody wants to hear me, he/she can:

Which day is God's sabbath day? Because God rested, He blessed the day and sanctified it and made it for man. And the Lord God wants His people to enter into His rest (not man's). If Saturday is God's rest day then does He start working from Sunday again through out until Saturday reappears? However, the scripture says :
John 5:16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.

John 5:17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.

John 5:18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.

So this is still related to Sabbath and that means God is still working on Sabbath. But, the Bible also says that He rested from all His works on the Sabbath day and THEREFORE he blessed and sanctified it. Now make up your mind; is He still working on the Sabbath day or He is resting or has rested on the Sabbath.

Hebrews 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

So what is Paul telling us by saying that we have to 'labour' to enter into that rest? Do we need to labour to keep the sabbath? I wot not. Again in this chapter what is Paul talking about? What does he mean by 'rest'? In this chapter of Hebrews: The Lord says 'they shall not enter into my rest' after so long time of His creation and His commandment of the Sabbath day. Does it mean that to those whom the Lord sware saying that 'they shall not enter into my rest', did not keep the Sabbath at all? If they had kept the Sabbath then they had already entered into His rest. If they had not kept the Sabbath, they had not entered into His rest anyways (so there was no point in the Lord swaring that they shall not enter into His rest).

The Bible never mentions of the seventh day of His creation saying 'the evening and the morning were the seventh day' like it does for the rest of six days. That means the seventh day never seemed to have come to an end in the garden of Eden. Is it the same when we will be back again in the Garden where we have the Tree of Life, where there is no night for the Lord Himself shall be the light and there is no need of the sun? The Lord shall wipe away all our tears and we are never going to work again. Every man will cease from His work as the Lord Himself has ceased from His. Is it not that everlasting rest we are looking for rather? Is that rest not the true Sabbath? Is not the OT Sabbath the shadow of the thing that is to come?

Be Blessed!

The Word of Yahweh states He rested on the Seventh Day and He hallowed it, after already establishing the rest of the week. Where does anyone derive the seventh day is not over? If He rested the seventh day, there was no works to relate as were the working six. Also, remember what Yeshua, the Master said, and this is a teaching,
Joh 5:17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work

It is not good to change the Word of Yahweh, nor the meaning of His Word. Believe Yahweh, not traditions of man nor his postulating.

Abishai · Aug 22, 2012

JaumeJ said:

Exactly: My question is no one derives that the seventh day is not over, yet you find people start working on the eighth day. How does anyone decide when the seventh day has ended for that matter to restart working for the next week?

So what work was Jesus relating to when He said that My Father worketh hitherto, and I work? Which apparently means that He worked and still works on that day, right?

I am not trying to change the meaning of the word of God but I am putting my questions forward here.

JaumeJ · Aug 22, 2012

Abishai said:

Yahweh is the Author of order and not confusion, and He has given us the week. There is never, under any circumstances an eighth day mentioned, nor is there any doubt as to which days are working days and what day is hallowed. The words from the Word are orderly and accurate, if anyone cannot get it straight, I am afraid that person is not understanding simple sentences.

Please do not steer off the subject in question with questions about peripheral understanding, the work cited of Yeshua. If you wish to change the subject of the post, a new post from you would be in order.

LawofLove · Aug 22, 2012

Abishai said:

Hello Abishai,

Thank you for you post.

My prayer is that I can convey my of studying John chapter 5

I would like to back up to verse 8 and find a little more context to the verses that you have shown.
Joh 5:8 Jesus saith unto him, Rise, take up thy bed, and walk.
Joh 5:9 And immediately the man was made whole, and took up his bed, and walked: and on the same day was the sabbath.
Joh 5:10 The Jews therefore said unto him that was cured, It is the sabbath day: it is not lawful for thee to carry thy bed.
Joh 5:11 He answered them, He that made me whole, the same said unto me, Take up thy bed, and walk. Joh 5:12 Then asked they him, What man is that which said unto thee, Take up thy bed, and walk?
Joh 5:13 And he that was healed wist not who it was: for Jesus had conveyed himself away, a multitude being in that place.

Notice the Jews said he broke the law when he carried his bed but the man did not break the law of God here. He violated only the traditions of the Pharisees, which had grown up around the law.

Joh 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.
Joh 5:15 The man departed, and told the Jews that it was Jesus, which had made him whole.
Joh 5:16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.
Joh 5:17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.
Joh 5:18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.

The reason that verse 18 says “because he not ony broken the Sabbath” was because in the Pharisees mind he had broken the Sabbath but as we can tell from verse 10 this is not true because if Jesus ever broke a law then he would have been a sinner like you and me but that cannot be so Jesus has never sinned because if he had sinned then we could not be saved by him plus the Pharisees are not reliable witnesses.

Heb 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

If we go back to the Old Testament and read in Psa 95:7 For he is our God; and we are the people of his pasture, and the sheep of his hand. To day if ye will hear his voice, Psa 95:8 Harden not your heart, as in the provocation, and as in the day of temptation in the wilderness: Psa 95:9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my work.Psa 95:10 Forty years long was I grieved with this generation, and said, It is a people that do err in their heart, and they have not known my ways: Psa 95:11 Unto whom I sware in my wrath that they should not enter into my rest.

We find he is not talking about the Sabbath rest here he is talking about the rest we get when we let God in to our hearts.
Heb 4:11 uses the word “labour” this word means a few things “zealous” so literally “let us make every effort “or “Diligent” compare heb 4:11 with heb 11:6; 2peter 1:10-11
They did not have faith in God. We know that faith comes by hearing the word (rom10:17) so the very next verse after the one you posted verse 12 is talking about the word and the heart. The contexts of all these verses are talking about stopping our own works of trying to be right with god and “rest” and look to Jesus He 4:14-16.

AgapeSpiritEyes · Aug 22, 2012

Spiritual work is done by the holy spirit from both the Father and the Son either through us or by us concerning spiritual power in personal relationship with God ( about salvation) while excessive physical work activity is what God asked those of the old covanent to refrain from to focus on all things about our God, now in the Liberty of the Salvation of the Lord Jesus we can choose Saturday Sunday or any day it is not offfensive to Him because perfect Savior Jesus is perfectly working in us and through us to communicate His Salvation to those he sends to us or He send us to.

xino · Aug 22, 2012

He preached to the dead.
Obviously some people die in vain therefore they can't be judged nor go to heaven or hell.
Jesus preached to them

1 Pet 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
1 Pet 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
what did he preach? I dunno, probably to say he is coming and they should hang on to their faith. (my opinion).

Jesus is the God of the Living and the Dead!

3 days and 3 nights? when does night start? I read somewhere that states Preparation day starts at 6pm but I wouldn't hold on to that site's info.
This is why some people don't get the bible because they use it out of context. (like yourself)

Jesus answered them, "Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days."
Friday | Saturday | Sunday
how many days is this? Jesus died on Friday and rose up on Sunday. Fridays counts as DAY 1, SATURDAY DAY 2, SUNDAY DAY 3
Yes Mary went to Jesus grave early in the morning on the first working day. Early in the morning, what time? WE DON'T KNOW. early mornings starts from 1am!
But tell me your interpretation of "spending a night in"
Because why Jesus said 3 nights is that, he would be in darkness. The grave is covered by a rock therefore it is pitch black. Or he could be talking about the hades he went to preach to the dead.

"lets have a girl's night in" OR "lets have a boys night out". Why is it called NIGHTS IN/OUT? Because it is DARK outside. It HAS NOTHING to do with time!
1am is called Early hours and next day, therefore it IS DARK. That is why we say "nights in/out". It has nothing to do with time.
In human interpretation or how people use the word -nights in/out- in today is to spend the night together but they forgot 6pm is evening, to 12am is when the day finished and night ended. 12am or 1am is when the next day starts as early hours.

night out definition | English definition dictionary | Reverso Collins <---- check this site out

If Jesus spent night on Fri, Sat and Sun, wouldn't that mean he was raised on the 4th day which is Monday? Are you God? no
Because if he spent nights in the grave it would mean in your understanding=
Friday 6pm to 12am [] Saturday 6pm to 12am [] Sunday 6pm to 12am
then rises up early hours of the working days.
I am sorry, you are contradicting yourself NOT the bible. Stop using the bible out of context.

What Jesus meant about Jonas was he will spend 3 days on earth. He died on Friday and rose on Sunday. His timing started the moment he died.
If you think Jesus did spend 3 nights Fri-Sat-Sun and rose on Monday then YOU ARE CALLING JESUS and the BIBLE a liar!

you are the same user saying we should baptise in the name of Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
if the name of the Father is Jehovah
if the name of the Son is Jesus Christ
what is the name of the Holy Spirit
Jesus Christ is Father, Son and Holy Spirit, he is one. and they are one.

cenallen · Aug 22, 2012

Laodicea said:

why did you add Latter Day?
do you think that means NOW?
SDA deny Pentecost as well...claiming a latter rain outpouring on their 'remnant church'

do you not know WHEN it became as testament to their unfaithfulness forever?
see Matthew 23

so, are you an israelite?
were your forefathers at Sinai?
do you need a reminder of your deliverance from literal Egypt?

why is the Hebrew word for the weekly Sabbath found in the ten commandments not found in Genesis?
no one before Moses was ever told to keep the Sabbath.
why is that?

the sabbath commandment says "throughout your generations".
this phrase is always and only ever in relation to the israelites. it is a ceremonial ordinance, a SIGN.
it ultimately became a testimony AGAINST them.

they broke that entire Covenant.
did you know that?

I. דּוֺר, דֹּר noun masculineDeuteronomy 32:5 period, Generation, dwelling (compare below)

verb above; also Late Hebrew דּוֺר, Aramaic (included Biblical Aramaic) דָּר, , age, Generation; Arabic gyrus, orbis, periodus; Sabean דר, one time, once, דרם דרם each once in a year DHM in MV) — absolute דּוֺר Genesis 7:1 68t.; דֹּר Exodus 3:15; 36t.; construct דּוֺר Deuteronomy 32:20 7t., דֹּר Exodus 3:15; suffix דּוֺרִי Isaiah 38:12, דּוֺרוֺ Isaiah 53:8; plural דּוֺרִים Psalm 72:5 2t., דֹּרוֺת absolute Job 42:16; Isaiah 41:4; construct Judges 3:2; דּוֺרוֺת construct Isaiah 51:9, דֹּרֹת Genesis 9:12; suffix דֹּרֹתָיו Genesis 6:9; Leviticus 25:30, דּוֺרוֺתֵינוּ Joshua 22:27, דֹּרֹתֵינוּ Joshua 22:28, דּרֹתֵיכֶם Genesis 17:12 27t., דֹּרֹתָם Genesis 17:7 10t.; —

1 period, age, Generation, mostly poetic:

a. of duration in the past, former age(s) דּוֺרוֺת עוֺלָמִים Isaiah 51:9 ("" קדם ימ&#1497

; שְׁנוֺת דֹּר וָדֹר Deuteronomy 32:7 (song; "" ימות עול&#1501

; בְּדֹר וָדֹר Psalm 90:1 (compare Psalm 90:2); מוֺסְדֵי דּוֺרוָֿדוֺר Isaiah 58:12 ("" חרבות עול&#1501

; שֹׁמֲמוֺת דּוֺר וָדוֺר Isaiah 61:4 ("" id.)

b. usually of duration to come, future age(s), לְדֹר דֹּר Exodus 3:15 (E; "" לעול&#1501

compare Proverbs 27:24 Kt (Qr לְדוֺר וָדוֺר; "" id.); מִדֹּר דֹּר Exodus 17:16 (E), = מִדּוֺר לָדוֺר Isaiah 34:10; לְדֹר וָדֹר Psalm 10:6; Psalm 33:11 ("" לעול&#1501

Psalm 49:12; Psalm 79:13; Psalm 85:6; Psalm 102:13; Psalm 119:90; Psalm 135:13; Psalm 146:10; Joel 4:20 (all "" id.); Psalm 89:2 ("" עול&#1501

Psalm 89:5 ("" עדעֿול&#1501

Psalm 106:31 ("" id.) Isaiah 34:17 ("" id.); Psalm 77:9 ("" לנצ&#1495

; עַדדֹּֿר וָדֹר Psalm 100:5 ("" לעול&#1501

Isaiah 13:20 ("" לנצ&#1495

Jeremiah 50:39 ("" id.); בְּכָלדֹּֿר וָדֹר Jeremiah 45:18 ("" לעולם וע&#1491

compare Esther 9:28; שְׁנוֺתָיו כְּמוֺ דֹר וָדֹר Psalm 61:7 compare שְׁנֵי דּוֺר וָדוֺר Joel 2:2 ("" העול&#1501

; as modifying phrase מְשׂוֺשׂ דּוֺר וָדוֺר Isaiah 60:15 ("" נאון עול&#1501

; further דּוֺר דּוֺרִים Psalm 72:5; יְשׁוּעָתִי לְדוֺר דּוֺרִים Isaiah 51:8 ("" לעול&#1501

.

c. apparently including both past and future בְּדוֺר דּוֺרִים שְׁנוֺתֶיךָ Psalm 102:25; בְּכָל דּוֺר וָדֹר Psalm 145:13; לְדוֺר וָדוֺר Lamentations 5:19.

2 of men living at a particular time (period, age), generation, as transitory דּוֺר הֹלֵךְ וְדוֺר בָּא Ecclesiastes 1:4: specifically

a. in the present, and (or) the past Genesis 7:1 (J) Exodus 1:6 (P) Numbers 32:13 (JE) Deuteronomy 1:35; Deuteronomy 2:14; Judges 2:10 (twice in verse); Isaiah 53:8 (compare Che critical note) Jeremiah 2:31; also Psalm 95:10; Job 8:8; Isaiah 41:4.

b. Judges 3:2 (present & future); compare plural דֹּרֹתָיו Genesis 6:9 (i.e. his own Generation and those immediately contiguous, before and after).

c. especially of a future Generation Genesis 15:16 (JE), with numeral, compare Deuteronomy 23:3; Deuteronomy 23:4; Deuteronomy 23:9; also Deuteronomy 29:21; Psalm 48:14; Psalm 71:18; Psalm 78:4; Psalm 78:6; Psalm 102:19; Psalm 109:13; Joel 1:3 compare Psalm 22:31; Psalm 22:32 (Checritical note); of a succession of Generations דּוֺר לְדוֺר יְשַׂבַּח מַעֲשֶׂיךָ Psalm 145:4; בְּכָלדּֿוֺר וָדוֺר Esther 9:28; usually plural לְדֹרֹת עוֺלָם Genesis 9:12 (P); with number לְאֶלֶף דּוֺר Psalm 105:8 ("" עול&#1501

= 1 Chronicles 16:15 ("" לעול&#1501

; Deuteronomy 7:9; see further, of posterity, אַרְבָּעָה דֹּרוֺת Job 42:16; usually plural with suffix Genesis 17:7,9,12; Exodus 12:14,17,42; Exodus 16:32,33; Exodus 27:21; Exodus 29:42; Exodus 30:8,10,21,31; Exodus 31:13,16; Exodus 40:15; Leviticus 3:17; Leviticus 6:11; Leviticus 7:36; Leviticus 10:9 (all P); Leviticus 17:7; Leviticus 21:17; Leviticus 22:3; Leviticus 23:14,21,31,41,43; Leviticus 24:3; Leviticus 25:30 (all H); Numbers 9:10; Numbers 10:8; Numbers 15:14,15,21,23,38; Numbers 18:23; Numbers 35:29; Joshua 22:27,28 (all P).

3 generation characterized by quality or condition, class of men: דּוֺר עִקֵּשׁ crooked Generation Deuteronomy 32:5 (song) compare Deuteronomy 32:20; Psalm 78:8 (twice in verse); Jeremiah 7:29; of different classes of wicked, Proverbs 30:11,12,13,14 compare Psalm 12:8; of the righteous, as a class Psalm 14:5; Psalm 24:6; Psalm 73:15 (בָּנֶיךָ דּוֺ&#1512

Psalm 112:2 (compare Psalm 22:31 ᵑ0, but < Che joins לדור to Psalm 22:32 compare above below 2c); so also דּוֺר אֲבוֺתָיו i.e. the dead Psalm 49:20 (so most; yet see below below 4).

4 dwelling-place, habitation Isaiah 38:12 compare דּוּר verb, so Saad Ki Ges De Che RVm (Ew life "" חַיַּ&#1497

; so also Psalm 49:20 De Witt, compare CheOP 479.

דָּר noun [masculine] generation (Biblical Hebrew דּוֺ&#1512

; — absolute in phrase עִםדָּֿר וְדָו Daniel 3:33; Daniel 4:31 (is) with Generation and Generation, i.e. endures Generation after Generation.

not ONE single New Covenant reference.

but Jesus pronounces all the Covenant CURSES on that final generation of the Old Covenant apostates.

Matthew 23
1 Then Jesus spake to the multitudes, and to his disciples, 2 saying, 'On the seat of Moses sat down the scribes and the Pharisees; 3 all, then, as much as they may say to you to observe, observe and do, but according to their works do not, for they say, and do not; 4 for they bind together burdens heavy and grievous to be borne, and lay upon the shoulders of men, but with their finger they will not move them. 5 'And all their works they do to be seen by men, and they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the fringes of their garments, 6 they love also the chief couches in the supper, and the chief seats in the synagogues, 7 and the salutations in the market-places, and to be called by men, Rabbi, Rabbi. 8 'And ye -- ye may not be called Rabbi, for one is your director -- the Christ, and all ye are brethren; 9 and ye may not call any your father on the earth, for one is your Father, who is in the heavens, 10 nor may ye be called directors, for one is your director -- the Christ. 11 And the greater of you shall be your ministrant, 12 and whoever shall exalt himself shall be humbled, and whoever shall humble himself shall be exalted.

13 'Woe to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye shut up the reign of the heavens before men, for ye do not go in, nor those going in do ye suffer to enter. 14 'Woe to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye eat up the houses of the widows, and for a pretence make long prayers, because of this ye shall receive more abundant judgment.

15 'Woe to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye go round the sea and the dry land to make one proselyte, and whenever it may happen -- ye make him a son of gehenna twofold more than yourselves.

16 'Woe to you, blind guides, who are saying, Whoever may swear by the sanctuary, it is nothing, but whoever may swear by the gold of the sanctuary -- is debtor! 17 Fools and blind! for which is greater, the gold, or the sanctuary that is sanctifying the gold? 18 'And, whoever may swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whoever may swear by the gift that is upon it -- is debtor! 19 Fools and blind! for which is greater, the gift, or the altar that is sanctifying the gift? 20 'He therefore who did swear by the altar, doth swear by it, and by all things on it; 21 and he who did swear by the sanctuary, doth swear by it, and by Him who is dwelling in it; 22 and he who did swear by the heaven, doth swear by the throne of God, and by Him who is sitting upon it.

23 Woe to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye give tithe of the mint, and the dill, and the cumin, and did neglect the weightier things of the Law -- the judgment, and the kindness, and the faith; these it behoved you to do, and those not to neglect. 24 'Blind guides! who are straining out the gnat, and the camel are swallowing.

25 'Woe to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye make clean the outside of the cup and the plate, and within they are full of rapine and incontinence. 26 'Blind Pharisee! cleanse first the inside of the cup and the plate, that the outside of them also may become clean.

27 'Woe to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye are like to whitewashed sepulchres, which outwardly indeed do appear beautiful, and within are full of bones of dead men, and of all uncleanness; 28 so also ye outwardly indeed do appear to men righteous, and within ye are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.

29 'Woe to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the sepulchres of the prophets, and adorn the tombs of the righteous, 30 and say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. 31 So that ye testify to yourselves, that ye are sons of them who did murder the prophets; 32 and ye -- ye fill up the measure of your fathers. 33 'Serpents! brood of vipers! how may ye escape from the judgment of the gehenna?

34 'Because of this, lo, I send to you prophets, and wise men, and scribes, and of them ye will kill and crucify, and of them ye will scourge in your synagogues, and will pursue from city to city; 35 that on you may come all the righteous blood being poured out on the earth from the blood of Abel the righteous, unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the sanctuary and the altar: 36 verily I say to you, all these things shall come upon this generation.

37 'Jerusalem, Jerusalem, that art killing the prophets, and stoning those sent unto thee, how often did I will to gather thy children together, as a hen doth gather her own chickens under the wings, and ye did not will. 38 Lo, left desolate to you is your house; 39 for I say to you, ye may not see me henceforth, till ye may say, Blessed is he who is coming in the name of the Lord.'

Galatians 3 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

cenallen · Aug 22, 2012

Laodicea said:

Genesis 17 This is my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you and thy seed after thee; Every man child among you shall be circumcised.

do SDA circumcise?

how many covenants are there Laodicea?

Laodicea · Aug 22, 2012

cenallen said:

First if you read 'time to come' it also means 'The latter Day' . Second where do you get the idea that SDA deny Pentecost?
Joel 2:23
(23) Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in the LORD your God: for he hath given you the former rain moderately, and he will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first month.

At Pentecost they received the former rain, before the harvest there will be a latter rain. If Pentecost did not happen then there can be no latter rain.

Laodicea · Aug 22, 2012

cenallen said:

For more info on the covenant go to this thread.
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/37502-covenant.html#post635652

Abishai · Aug 23, 2012

JaumeJ said:

I never said that He is the author of confusion. If you have not understood my question brother JaumeJ, I would like to repeat. While the reason of keeping the sabbath is that the Lord rested on the seventh day but the Lord did not start working again on the eighth day (or the first day of the week), or did He? The Bible in the book of Genesis does not say that the evening and the morning were the seventh day. Don't you think that there is a reason behind it?
Do you think that we have only the decalogue for us? As for your accusation of me steering off the subject, my brother, I am sure I am not. May the good Lord bless you for your kind and good words.

Abishai · Aug 23, 2012

LawofLove said:

Welcome Lawoflove. May the Lord bless you!

The man who was cured took up the bed and walked but the Lord Jesus was accused of that because the author of Life and Law had commanded the man to do so. I never said that the Lord sinned but His understanding and interpretation of the law & the commandments was totally different from what the Jews understood it. If both Jesus and the Jews understood and interpreted the same way then there wouldn't have been any contradiction between them but we see that that was not the case.

Heb 4:1-11 does talk about the rest, which is of the seventh day, which is the sabbath day.
Esp:
Hebrews 4:4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

What would you do if you want to be diligent or zealous? We know that faith without works is dead. If I say that I am diligent without proving it by works, then my words are nothing. In the same way I think, love without labour is dead and so is hope without patience. If we do not prove ourselves in deed then these fruit of the Spirit are nothing on their own; for we are known by our fruits. Jesus did not just sit in heaven with His qualities but proved what He is, though it was not necessary. He showed in His deeds how to love, to forgive, to have faith in God, to have patience and so on. That is how we have to work out our salvation in fear and trembling and also that is how we labour to enter into His rest. faith and work go hand and hand. One cannot do without another.

May the Lord bless you and keep you.

LawofLove · Aug 24, 2012

Abishai said:

Thank you for you reply

My meaning about Jesus was just conveying that he was showing us how to keep the Sabbath. That Gods laws teach us that its not bad to help someone on the Sabbath.

The thing is with Heb 4:4 Is that he was not teaching them to keep the Sabbath he was speaking to the Jews so he was only using the Sabbath to compare but his argument was not teaching the Sabbath its self. They already knew the Sabbath. So he was teaching about spiritual rest.

Verse 9 states the conclusion, already alluded to in v. 6. drawn from the line of argument begun in v. 3 to prove the assertions of vs. 1, 3. This line of argument may be set forth
1. As originally made to ancient Israel God’s promised “rest” included: (a) permanent settlement in the land of Canaan, (b) a transformation of character that would make the nation a fit representative of the principles of God’s kingdom, and (c) the role of being God’s chosen instrument for the salvation of the world (see Vol. IV, pp. 26–30; see on ch. 3:11).
2. The generation to whom the promise of “rest” was originally made failed to enter the land of Canaan because of unbelief (see on ch. 3:19).
3. Joshua did led the next generation into the land that had been promised (see on ch. 3:11), but because they were spiritually stiff-necked he could not lead them into the spiritual “rest” God intended them to find there (see on ch. 4:7, 8).
4. The same promise had been repeated in the days of David (v. 7). This was evidence that Israel had not, at that time, entered into the spiritual “rest,” and also that their failure to do so in the days of Moses and Joshua had not invalidated the original promise.
5. The ultimate accomplishment of God’s purposes is certain, despite the failure of successive generations (see on vs. 3, 4).
6. The writer’s earnest plea to God’s people of apostolic times to “enter into that rest” (vs. 11, 16) is further evidence that the invitation remained valid and that God’s people, as a group, had not truly entered into that “rest” even in apostolic times.
7. Accordingly, the promise of, and invitation to enter into, God’s spiritual “rest” remains valid (vs. 6, 9), and Christians should “labour therefore to enter into that rest” (v. 11).
It should be noted that the “rest” that remained in Christian times was the spiritual “rest” originally promised to literal Israel (see on v. 3). Obviously, what remains must have been there to begin with.

Just by the word you can not learn if this is talking about the Sabbath day only by context can you see this
1. Because Joshua could not lead Israel into spiritual “rest” (katapausis, v. 8), a sabbatismos (v. 9) remains for Christians. Consistency seems to require that what remains be the same as what was there to begin with. Because Joshua did not lead literal Israel into spiritual “rest” would be no reason for the Christian to observe the Sabbath.
2. From vs. 1, 6 it is clear that what remains for the people of God in New Testament times is a katapausis; in v. 9 it is said that a sabbatismos remains. To declare that what remains for “the people of God” is the weekly Sabbath, is to declare that what Joshua failed to lead Israel into was the weekly Sabbath.

Spiritual_Plague · Aug 24, 2012

I do not live under the old covenant, since there is a new covenant in Christ, which I follow. For those of you who want to argue that God is commanding that the seventh day be observed as a day of "rest", can you please show me the New Covenant scriptures that define how New Covenant believers are supposed to "observe" this day? I've seen no instruction in the New Covenant writings on how I am supposed to "rest" on the seventh day and what commands to follow for it.

Please provide a list of how we observe this day and list the New Testament scripture references for New Covenant believers.

Laodicea · Aug 24, 2012

Spiritual_Plague said:

So what do you think is the new covenant?
Exodus 34:28
(28) And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.
Jeremiah 31:31-33
(31) Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
(32) Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
(33) But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

The Law is written upon the heart and lived out in our life

Spiritual_Plague · Aug 24, 2012

Laodicea said:

I'm going to wait for a bit and see if someone answers my questions. I will address your question in a new thread soon. I'll let you know when I post it once I've got some time to write it out. It may take a couple of weeks.

For now, I just want to wait and see if someone will be addressing the questions I posed.

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