"Torah Observers" don't follow the clean meat laws
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excellent
so we see that a later prophet, Isaiah, gives us wise words on how to understand Torah, which then modifies how we practice Torah.
'Just as all Torah teaches Messiah and Messiah taught Torah.' also Paul, as a representative of Christ taught Torah.
so Paul gives us teachings about Torah which modify the way we practice it.
I believe this is a global modifier that modifies how we practice every commandment, actually every word, in Torah.
GALATIANS 5:14 For all of Torah is fulfilled in one word: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
so we see that a later prophet, Isaiah, gives us wise words on how to understand Torah, which then modifies how we practice Torah.
'Just as all Torah teaches Messiah and Messiah taught Torah.' also Paul, as a representative of Christ taught Torah.
so Paul gives us teachings about Torah which modify the way we practice it.
I believe this is a global modifier that modifies how we practice every commandment, actually every word, in Torah.
GALATIANS 5:14 For all of Torah is fulfilled in one word: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
Are you saying that the law that we are told frees us, the commandments based on love as the ten commandments are, that these are the burden instead? What scripture says is the burden is the traditions rabbis added to the law.
You also seem to say that the faith that purifies hearts has nothing to do with faith in God's word, giving His law to everyone.
You also seem to say that the faith that purifies hearts has nothing to do with faith in God's word, giving His law to everyone.
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S
I agree with Paul in Galatians, and also in Colossians when he said:
For this reason, since the day we heard about you, we have not stopped praying for you. We continually ask God to fill you with the knowledge of his will through all the wisdom and understanding that the Spirit gives, so that you may live a life worthy of the Lord and please him in every way: bearing fruit in every good work, growing in the knowledge of God, being strengthened with all power according to his glorious might so that you may have great endurance and patience, and giving joyful thanks to the Father, who has qualified you to share in the inheritance of his holy people in the kingdom of light. For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. -- Col. 1:9-14 (NIV)
HRM theology, properly understood, fully recognizes that we can do nothing on our own and everything must start with God. We believe that the Spirit empowers us to overcome sin in the flesh and live according to God's will. The difference is we believe that God has been continuously revealing that will throughout history, including through Moses, and that Messiah walked perfectly in that will. Dan said that Messiah lived by the Spirit -- and I ask in response to that: As a result, how did He live? Partial answer as it relates to the topic of this thread: He didn't let any unclean meats pass through His mouth, that's for sure. And God had to say of Him: "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased." -- Matt. 3:17b (NIV).
For this reason, since the day we heard about you, we have not stopped praying for you. We continually ask God to fill you with the knowledge of his will through all the wisdom and understanding that the Spirit gives, so that you may live a life worthy of the Lord and please him in every way: bearing fruit in every good work, growing in the knowledge of God, being strengthened with all power according to his glorious might so that you may have great endurance and patience, and giving joyful thanks to the Father, who has qualified you to share in the inheritance of his holy people in the kingdom of light. For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. -- Col. 1:9-14 (NIV)
HRM theology, properly understood, fully recognizes that we can do nothing on our own and everything must start with God. We believe that the Spirit empowers us to overcome sin in the flesh and live according to God's will. The difference is we believe that God has been continuously revealing that will throughout history, including through Moses, and that Messiah walked perfectly in that will. Dan said that Messiah lived by the Spirit -- and I ask in response to that: As a result, how did He live? Partial answer as it relates to the topic of this thread: He didn't let any unclean meats pass through His mouth, that's for sure. And God had to say of Him: "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased." -- Matt. 3:17b (NIV).
I have posted this over 10x times now but I will do it one more time - then, I'm done as this is a complete waste of time and very unprofitable as Paul says in Titus 3:9.
The true Christian life is lived by grace through faith only - nothing to do with the law of Moses. As we have received Christ - we are to walk in Him and all that He has done.
Colossians 2:6-7 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] Therefore as you have received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk in Him,
[SUP]7 [/SUP] having been firmly rooted and now being built up in Him and established in your faith, just as you were instructed, and overflowing with gratitude.
Real Christians have died on the cross with Christ and rose again at His resurrection to serve God in newness of life and not in the oldness of the letter.
If anyone comes with the message that "You must now follow the law of Moses as in observing the Sabbath or feasts days - if you do not - then you are dis-obeying God and sinning."....
..if you hear this - run from it because it is an anti-Christ belief system just like the Judaizers that came in to the Galatians and tried to get them to follow the law of Moses only their route was by circumcision.
Some do it by eating certain foods only which is a sign of the those falling away from the faith ( 1 Tim. 4:1-5 )
Paul said that he did not stand for the Judaizers message for one hour so that the truth would remain with them. Gal. 2:5
Galatians 2:5 (NASB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.
I do not look at all Hebrew Roots adherents as all the same. As I have said before - there are many that are of authentic Jewish descent and they like their traditions but they do not say that others need to observe the Sabbath or feasts as in the law of Moses or you are dis-obeying God and sinning.
They observe these things to see Christ as the fulfillment of them - not as something they "need" to do now or they are sinning.
This group has excellent teachings on how Christ has fulfilled the Law and show Christ in every part of the Old Testament. Jesus said that all the scriptures speak about Him.
This group of believers are a major blessing to us in the body of Christ and are not Judaizers such as Paul encountered and that are also in the extreme sects of Hebrew Roots that say believers in Christ must "observe the Sabbath and the feasts like in the law of Moses - or they are dis-obeying God and sinning".
Those - run away from as fast as you can! - but do not put all Hebrew Roots people in the same boat as the extreme sects because they are not the same.
There is an extreme sect of Roots that are really gentiles but for some strange reason try to change themselves into being Jewish - they change the names of people to make them sound more Jewish.
Here is a link that describes Judaizers in the body of Christ that try to get people to follow the law of Moses instead of Christ.
http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...ont-follow-clean-meat-laws-5.html#post2904747
The true Christian life is lived by grace through faith only - nothing to do with the law of Moses. As we have received Christ - we are to walk in Him and all that He has done.
Colossians 2:6-7 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] Therefore as you have received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk in Him,
[SUP]7 [/SUP] having been firmly rooted and now being built up in Him and established in your faith, just as you were instructed, and overflowing with gratitude.
Real Christians have died on the cross with Christ and rose again at His resurrection to serve God in newness of life and not in the oldness of the letter.
If anyone comes with the message that "You must now follow the law of Moses as in observing the Sabbath or feasts days - if you do not - then you are dis-obeying God and sinning."....
..if you hear this - run from it because it is an anti-Christ belief system just like the Judaizers that came in to the Galatians and tried to get them to follow the law of Moses only their route was by circumcision.
Some do it by eating certain foods only which is a sign of the those falling away from the faith ( 1 Tim. 4:1-5 )
Paul said that he did not stand for the Judaizers message for one hour so that the truth would remain with them. Gal. 2:5
Galatians 2:5 (NASB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.
I do not look at all Hebrew Roots adherents as all the same. As I have said before - there are many that are of authentic Jewish descent and they like their traditions but they do not say that others need to observe the Sabbath or feasts as in the law of Moses or you are dis-obeying God and sinning.
They observe these things to see Christ as the fulfillment of them - not as something they "need" to do now or they are sinning.
This group has excellent teachings on how Christ has fulfilled the Law and show Christ in every part of the Old Testament. Jesus said that all the scriptures speak about Him.
This group of believers are a major blessing to us in the body of Christ and are not Judaizers such as Paul encountered and that are also in the extreme sects of Hebrew Roots that say believers in Christ must "observe the Sabbath and the feasts like in the law of Moses - or they are dis-obeying God and sinning".
Those - run away from as fast as you can! - but do not put all Hebrew Roots people in the same boat as the extreme sects because they are not the same.
There is an extreme sect of Roots that are really gentiles but for some strange reason try to change themselves into being Jewish - they change the names of people to make them sound more Jewish.
Here is a link that describes Judaizers in the body of Christ that try to get people to follow the law of Moses instead of Christ.
http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...ont-follow-clean-meat-laws-5.html#post2904747
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Can you spot the lie in the about statement?
"I'm done" G7 is never done and spends hour upon hour pushing the same position, which
does not acknowledge Paul stood up for the law 100%, while saying we fulfilled it through love
and Christ, and not by looking at the letter for justification.
It is like being a parasite that feeds of christian theology while destroying it.
It is heresy of Antinonianism, by denying a moral law reference points, and saying that sin is
obvious evil, not some super hyper legalist view, so being lost into compromise over the conviction
guilt and condemnation drive people away from Christ rather than towards him and righteousness.
The truth is our Lord is unbelievably loving but in a pure, holy, righteous way. It is impossible
to draw close to Him without being in this place oneself. And that is the tension of our existance.
But he promises us, and I experience it, feeling isolated and cast out, and then forgiven and
embraced, washed clean and purified. But which is me, and which is reality?
The Lord calls me in these different emotional expressions, to turn to Him and seek His face.
He is the source, who brings all into focus, the giver of life, and His Spirit into eternity will always
be our need and our daily communion. But maybe in praise you never make it to this place.
Brothers and sisters, surely this is our tension, the Spirit alive within us to do His will.
Who am I to say what others have or have not, I can just say, what a King.
"I'm done" G7 is never done and spends hour upon hour pushing the same position, which
does not acknowledge Paul stood up for the law 100%, while saying we fulfilled it through love
and Christ, and not by looking at the letter for justification.
It is like being a parasite that feeds of christian theology while destroying it.
It is heresy of Antinonianism, by denying a moral law reference points, and saying that sin is
obvious evil, not some super hyper legalist view, so being lost into compromise over the conviction
guilt and condemnation drive people away from Christ rather than towards him and righteousness.
The truth is our Lord is unbelievably loving but in a pure, holy, righteous way. It is impossible
to draw close to Him without being in this place oneself. And that is the tension of our existance.
But he promises us, and I experience it, feeling isolated and cast out, and then forgiven and
embraced, washed clean and purified. But which is me, and which is reality?
The Lord calls me in these different emotional expressions, to turn to Him and seek His face.
He is the source, who brings all into focus, the giver of life, and His Spirit into eternity will always
be our need and our daily communion. But maybe in praise you never make it to this place.
Brothers and sisters, surely this is our tension, the Spirit alive within us to do His will.
Who am I to say what others have or have not, I can just say, what a King.
In order to keep the malice and slander down to a minimum about being antinomian - here is what I "really" say about "laws".
I too have posted this many times in the past but the same lies are being perpetuated as usual and so I don't interact with this type of a person anymore. Romans 16:17 comes into play here as well as 1 Cor 15:33 and then Heb. 12:15.
We do have laws in the New Covenant. They are exciting laws that bring life and wholeness to us all - because these are all Christ Himself in us.
There is no greater revelation than to know Him and the Father and to plumb the depths of their love and grace towards us which Paul says in Eph. 2:7 - the Father will be doing for all the ages to come to us.
Ephesians 2:7 (NASB)
[SUP]7 [/SUP]so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.
Jesus fulfilled the law. The law was a mere shadow of the real thing which was Jesus.
Read the law to see Jesus in it and to know that Jesus did that for us and His life in us now leads us in all things. Those who are led by the Spirit of God are the sons of God.
We now live by:
1) The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus. ( Romans 8:2 )
2) The law of love ( Romans 13:10 James 2:8 )
3) The law of faith ( Romans 3:27 and the law of Moses is NOT of faith - Gal. 3:12 )
4) The law of liberty ( James 1:25 )
5) The law of Christ - which is Christ Himself in us. ( Gal. 6:2 )
We can trust the Holy Spirit in us to lead us in all affairs of life. We don't go back to the law of Moses that were a shadow of the real thing which is Christ in us.. Jesus is more then enough.
Yes...we glory in the laws that we have in the New Covenant because they are all Christ Himself living in and through us. ( Gal.2:20 and Col. 3:3 )
Galatians 5:22-23 (NASB)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,
[SUP]23 [/SUP] gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.
I too have posted this many times in the past but the same lies are being perpetuated as usual and so I don't interact with this type of a person anymore. Romans 16:17 comes into play here as well as 1 Cor 15:33 and then Heb. 12:15.
We do have laws in the New Covenant. They are exciting laws that bring life and wholeness to us all - because these are all Christ Himself in us.
There is no greater revelation than to know Him and the Father and to plumb the depths of their love and grace towards us which Paul says in Eph. 2:7 - the Father will be doing for all the ages to come to us.
Ephesians 2:7 (NASB)
[SUP]7 [/SUP]so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.
Jesus fulfilled the law. The law was a mere shadow of the real thing which was Jesus.
Read the law to see Jesus in it and to know that Jesus did that for us and His life in us now leads us in all things. Those who are led by the Spirit of God are the sons of God.
We now live by:
1) The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus. ( Romans 8:2 )
2) The law of love ( Romans 13:10 James 2:8 )
3) The law of faith ( Romans 3:27 and the law of Moses is NOT of faith - Gal. 3:12 )
4) The law of liberty ( James 1:25 )
5) The law of Christ - which is Christ Himself in us. ( Gal. 6:2 )
We can trust the Holy Spirit in us to lead us in all affairs of life. We don't go back to the law of Moses that were a shadow of the real thing which is Christ in us.. Jesus is more then enough.
Yes...we glory in the laws that we have in the New Covenant because they are all Christ Himself living in and through us. ( Gal.2:20 and Col. 3:3 )
Galatians 5:22-23 (NASB)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,
[SUP]23 [/SUP] gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.
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Judaizers
It is odd a person like G7 talking about insults and offence would use a term intended to
offend and cause antagonism.
Paul was preaching to a Jewish community out of which he had come.
He was the most legalistic of them all, and with a passion did not want people to fall back
into this legalism. One big issue was circumcision, yet he circumcised Timothy.
He did not believe in justification through ceremony yet was in Jerusalem for the rituals of
purification.
Though we are a gentile faith we are still rooted in Israel.
G7 problem is he sees evil in conviction of sin, condemnation and being shown as being
unworthy. The most extreme would go so far as to say this condemnation is of satan.
Their faith would condemn Nineveh for repenting at the preaching of Jonah.
Equally they condemn repentant believers knowing before the Lord they have much to learn
and to follow Jesus is a narrow way.
To G7 I am not a follower of Christ. My problem with his approach is he desires to divide over
the wrong issues. and so ends up as a heretic, seeming to be a sheep but is actually a wolf.
As a wolf he has no problem calling people names without justification, and creating antagonism
where there is none. This is no man of grace or peace.
Funnily his words and lack of respect to his sympathisers is mild compared to their hatred and
antagonism they feel in their hearts. I have read too many rants and real anger over nothing
to realise hurt and bitterness clouds all their words from their past. It gets so bad that they
project this on to me, when I just stand amazed at their blindness to the emotions within them.
In all sincerity, I just love Jesus and give Him all the honour. I know how unworthy I am though
he calls me holy, pure and clean. How could the Holy Spirit dwell in me unless this reality was
true. How is so many listen to the enemy who says you are not clean, or made into His holy
people? If in your thoughts you wish to condemn me, remember that is you judging a brother.
We are the people of Christ, washed pure and Holy through the cross of Christ. Learn to dwell
at the foot of the cross and work through who you are. Let Christ tell you how He feels about
your approach and stop being so defensive. Open your hearts, and walk in openness.
It is odd a person like G7 talking about insults and offence would use a term intended to
offend and cause antagonism.
Paul was preaching to a Jewish community out of which he had come.
He was the most legalistic of them all, and with a passion did not want people to fall back
into this legalism. One big issue was circumcision, yet he circumcised Timothy.
He did not believe in justification through ceremony yet was in Jerusalem for the rituals of
purification.
Though we are a gentile faith we are still rooted in Israel.
G7 problem is he sees evil in conviction of sin, condemnation and being shown as being
unworthy. The most extreme would go so far as to say this condemnation is of satan.
Their faith would condemn Nineveh for repenting at the preaching of Jonah.
Equally they condemn repentant believers knowing before the Lord they have much to learn
and to follow Jesus is a narrow way.
To G7 I am not a follower of Christ. My problem with his approach is he desires to divide over
the wrong issues. and so ends up as a heretic, seeming to be a sheep but is actually a wolf.
As a wolf he has no problem calling people names without justification, and creating antagonism
where there is none. This is no man of grace or peace.
Funnily his words and lack of respect to his sympathisers is mild compared to their hatred and
antagonism they feel in their hearts. I have read too many rants and real anger over nothing
to realise hurt and bitterness clouds all their words from their past. It gets so bad that they
project this on to me, when I just stand amazed at their blindness to the emotions within them.
In all sincerity, I just love Jesus and give Him all the honour. I know how unworthy I am though
he calls me holy, pure and clean. How could the Holy Spirit dwell in me unless this reality was
true. How is so many listen to the enemy who says you are not clean, or made into His holy
people? If in your thoughts you wish to condemn me, remember that is you judging a brother.
We are the people of Christ, washed pure and Holy through the cross of Christ. Learn to dwell
at the foot of the cross and work through who you are. Let Christ tell you how He feels about
your approach and stop being so defensive. Open your hearts, and walk in openness.
G7 still has the way of operating like a legalist.
John used to lean on Jesus at meal times. To a legalist it is all about concepts and not
pure love and holiness. They have to create reams of justification and condemnation.
Emotional language of simplicity and truth is far from them. The power of the move of the
Holy Spirit in the 70's was touching peoples hearts with love and acceptance within the context
of faith. It blew their minds, but over the years their emotional history often bled away the
freedom that this also brought.
Now if G7 was really walking with Christ we would be brothers, but he obviously is not.
Judge by this simple fruit. I will praise with anyone who brings glory to Christ.
John used to lean on Jesus at meal times. To a legalist it is all about concepts and not
pure love and holiness. They have to create reams of justification and condemnation.
Emotional language of simplicity and truth is far from them. The power of the move of the
Holy Spirit in the 70's was touching peoples hearts with love and acceptance within the context
of faith. It blew their minds, but over the years their emotional history often bled away the
freedom that this also brought.
Now if G7 was really walking with Christ we would be brothers, but he obviously is not.
Judge by this simple fruit. I will praise with anyone who brings glory to Christ.
Question: "Who were the Judaizers?"
Answer: There have always been those who balk at the idea of God’s salvation being offered freely to those who believe. They reason that such a grand gift as forgiveness from such a holy God must require some kind of payment from us. We thank God for His grace, but we understand that He expects us to somehow earn that grace—in other words, there must be something that we can do to pay off the debt we owe to God.
In the early church, those who taught a combination of God’s grace and human effort were called “Judaizers.” The word Judaizer comes from a Greek verb meaning “to live according to Jewish customs.” The word appears in Galatians 2:14 where Paul describes how he confronted Peter for forcing Gentile Christians to “Judaize.”
A Judaizer taught that, in order for a Christian to truly be right with God, he must conform to the Mosaic Law. Circumcision, especially, was promoted as necessary for salvation. Gentiles had to become Jewish proselytes first, and then they could come to Christ.
The doctrine of the Judaizers was a mixture of grace (through Christ) and works (through the keeping of the Law). This false doctrine was dealt with in Acts 15 and strongly condemned in the book of Galatians.
At the Jerusalem Council in Acts 15, a group of Judaizers opposed Paul and Barnabas. Some men who belonged to the party of the Pharisees insisted that Gentiles could not be saved unless they were first circumcised and obeyed the Law of Moses.
Paul made the case that, in Christ, there was no longer any distinction between Jew and Gentile, for God had purified the hearts of the Gentiles by faith (Acts 15:8–9). He said it plainly in Galatians 2:16: “A man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified.”
To add anything to the work that Christ did for salvation is to negate God’s grace. We are saved by grace alone, through faith alone, not by returning to the Law. “I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing” (Galatians 2:21).
There are many groups today with beliefs/practices very similar to the Judaizers of the New Testament. The two most prominent would be the Hebrew Roots Movement and the Roman Catholic Church. The teachings of the Hebrew Roots Movement are virtually identical to those of the Judaizers whom Paul rebuked in Galatians. A primary focus of the Hebrew Roots Movement is to put followers of Christ back under the bondage of the Old Testament Law.
The Roman Catholic Church teaches a doctrine similar to that of the Judaizers of the New Testament in this way: its doctrine is a mixture of law and grace. At the Council of Trent in the 16th century, the Catholic Church explicitly denied the idea of salvation by faith alone.
Catholics have always held that certain sacraments are necessary for salvation. The issues for the 1st-century Judaizers were circumcision and Sabbath-keeping. The issues for modern-day Catholics are baptism, confession, etc. The works considered necessary may have changed, but both Judaizers and Catholics attempt to merit God’s grace through the performance of ritualistic acts.
First Timothy 4:3 says that, in later times, false teachers will “forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.” This sounds suspiciously close to some of the teachings of Roman Catholicism, which requires priests to be celibate (“forbidding to marry”) and proclaims some food to be off-limits during Lent (“abstaining from certain foods”).
The Judaizers upheld the Mosaic Law as necessary for salvation; Catholics uphold man-made tradition as necessary; both view Christ’s death as being insufficient without the active and continued cooperation of the one being saved.
The Bible is clear that the attempt to add human works to God’s grace overlooks the very meaning of grace, which is “undeserved blessing.” As Paul says, “If by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace” (Romans 11:6). Praise the Lord, “Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery” (Galatians 5:1).
https://gotquestions.org/Judaizers.html
Answer: There have always been those who balk at the idea of God’s salvation being offered freely to those who believe. They reason that such a grand gift as forgiveness from such a holy God must require some kind of payment from us. We thank God for His grace, but we understand that He expects us to somehow earn that grace—in other words, there must be something that we can do to pay off the debt we owe to God.
In the early church, those who taught a combination of God’s grace and human effort were called “Judaizers.” The word Judaizer comes from a Greek verb meaning “to live according to Jewish customs.” The word appears in Galatians 2:14 where Paul describes how he confronted Peter for forcing Gentile Christians to “Judaize.”
A Judaizer taught that, in order for a Christian to truly be right with God, he must conform to the Mosaic Law. Circumcision, especially, was promoted as necessary for salvation. Gentiles had to become Jewish proselytes first, and then they could come to Christ.
The doctrine of the Judaizers was a mixture of grace (through Christ) and works (through the keeping of the Law). This false doctrine was dealt with in Acts 15 and strongly condemned in the book of Galatians.
At the Jerusalem Council in Acts 15, a group of Judaizers opposed Paul and Barnabas. Some men who belonged to the party of the Pharisees insisted that Gentiles could not be saved unless they were first circumcised and obeyed the Law of Moses.
Paul made the case that, in Christ, there was no longer any distinction between Jew and Gentile, for God had purified the hearts of the Gentiles by faith (Acts 15:8–9). He said it plainly in Galatians 2:16: “A man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified.”
To add anything to the work that Christ did for salvation is to negate God’s grace. We are saved by grace alone, through faith alone, not by returning to the Law. “I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing” (Galatians 2:21).
There are many groups today with beliefs/practices very similar to the Judaizers of the New Testament. The two most prominent would be the Hebrew Roots Movement and the Roman Catholic Church. The teachings of the Hebrew Roots Movement are virtually identical to those of the Judaizers whom Paul rebuked in Galatians. A primary focus of the Hebrew Roots Movement is to put followers of Christ back under the bondage of the Old Testament Law.
The Roman Catholic Church teaches a doctrine similar to that of the Judaizers of the New Testament in this way: its doctrine is a mixture of law and grace. At the Council of Trent in the 16th century, the Catholic Church explicitly denied the idea of salvation by faith alone.
Catholics have always held that certain sacraments are necessary for salvation. The issues for the 1st-century Judaizers were circumcision and Sabbath-keeping. The issues for modern-day Catholics are baptism, confession, etc. The works considered necessary may have changed, but both Judaizers and Catholics attempt to merit God’s grace through the performance of ritualistic acts.
First Timothy 4:3 says that, in later times, false teachers will “forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.” This sounds suspiciously close to some of the teachings of Roman Catholicism, which requires priests to be celibate (“forbidding to marry”) and proclaims some food to be off-limits during Lent (“abstaining from certain foods”).
The Judaizers upheld the Mosaic Law as necessary for salvation; Catholics uphold man-made tradition as necessary; both view Christ’s death as being insufficient without the active and continued cooperation of the one being saved.
The Bible is clear that the attempt to add human works to God’s grace overlooks the very meaning of grace, which is “undeserved blessing.” As Paul says, “If by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace” (Romans 11:6). Praise the Lord, “Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery” (Galatians 5:1).
https://gotquestions.org/Judaizers.html
Hatred of false faith
Are we called to purge the church of false faith? No.
But this spirit is preached far and wide. Only the enemy would say such things.
Jesus said the opposite. Do not pull up the weeds it will damage the good seeds.
But if you have hurt against people in the past, forgive them from the heart.
Only when you are clean and pure will you see what you need to do.
Where then did the weeds come from?’
“‘An enemy did this,’ he replied.
“The servants asked him, ‘Do you want us to go and pull them up?’
“‘No,’ he answered, ‘because while you are pulling the weeds, you may uproot the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.
Matt 13:27-30
Now people will say the enemy would say this, because he wants to stop us
purifying the church.
Now the truth is we are called to be lights walking after Christ, in our actions, deeds, and
words and that is it.
What is damaging is preaching innocent brothers and sisters are evil, which is generating
great bitterness and hurt, which is the work of the evil one. Some irony here.
Are we called to purge the church of false faith? No.
But this spirit is preached far and wide. Only the enemy would say such things.
Jesus said the opposite. Do not pull up the weeds it will damage the good seeds.
But if you have hurt against people in the past, forgive them from the heart.
Only when you are clean and pure will you see what you need to do.
Where then did the weeds come from?’
“‘An enemy did this,’ he replied.
“The servants asked him, ‘Do you want us to go and pull them up?’
“‘No,’ he answered, ‘because while you are pulling the weeds, you may uproot the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.
Matt 13:27-30
Now people will say the enemy would say this, because he wants to stop us
purifying the church.
Now the truth is we are called to be lights walking after Christ, in our actions, deeds, and
words and that is it.
What is damaging is preaching innocent brothers and sisters are evil, which is generating
great bitterness and hurt, which is the work of the evil one. Some irony here.
Above is a simple lie. A Judaizer is someone who insists you are a jew to be a christian.
The addition G7 group preach is an extreme version of grace, which is without reference to
the moral law. In their eyes everyone who does not take their whole view is a judaizer which
is simply absurd.
But G7 is becoming more open about his failure in this regard, because he is loosing the argument
because being a wolf in sheeps clothing only works if you have not been spotted.
The whole premise of this diatribe is pointless if he fails at the first step. But dumb if you want to
claim the higher ground, lol.
Judaizers - Baker's Evangelical Dictionary of Biblical Theology Online
And looking at what some are giving into in this view of morality, lots of positions are being
shifted towards Antinomianism which puts no obligations or guilt or sense of a need to change.
This debate has gone on throughout church history, but it is one believer at a time does the
truth sing through.
The addition G7 group preach is an extreme version of grace, which is without reference to
the moral law. In their eyes everyone who does not take their whole view is a judaizer which
is simply absurd.
But G7 is becoming more open about his failure in this regard, because he is loosing the argument
because being a wolf in sheeps clothing only works if you have not been spotted.
The whole premise of this diatribe is pointless if he fails at the first step. But dumb if you want to
claim the higher ground, lol.
Judaizers - Baker's Evangelical Dictionary of Biblical Theology Online
And looking at what some are giving into in this view of morality, lots of positions are being
shifted towards Antinomianism which puts no obligations or guilt or sense of a need to change.
This debate has gone on throughout church history, but it is one believer at a time does the
truth sing through.
A Judaizer is someone who follows a law of the fathers as oral traditions of men. They make the faith of God without effect.
Judaizers are those who do despite to the grace of God. It should teach them to say no to them walking by sight after their religious experiences (mere shadows) rather than the faith of Christ ,which come by hearing God.
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; Tit 2:11
They deny the reformation has come.
They have their faith in respect to their religious experiences as a work they perform . Can’t serve two master its either grace or works .There is no limbo or purgatory in between.
2Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight
Judaizers are easy to detect just look to ones that are putting their hope in performing fleshly ceremonial laws as mere shadows.
There is no higher ground than walking by the faith of Christ, as He works in us to both will and do His good purpose.
If Christ has begun the good work of salvation in us he will finish not might or perhaps all the way to the end.He does not speak out of both sides of His mouth. If he says it He performs it. He performs all that at is appointed to us.It is He who can make our hearts soft enough to take in the seed of His word as the good ground (foundation)
Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
He is our confidence.
We are to put no confidence in carnal ordinances, imposed on the Jews until the time of reformation
The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation. Heb 9:8
Has the reformation occurred? yes or no?
Judaizers are those who do despite to the grace of God. It should teach them to say no to them walking by sight after their religious experiences (mere shadows) rather than the faith of Christ ,which come by hearing God.
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; Tit 2:11
They deny the reformation has come.
They have their faith in respect to their religious experiences as a work they perform . Can’t serve two master its either grace or works .There is no limbo or purgatory in between.
2Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight
Judaizers are easy to detect just look to ones that are putting their hope in performing fleshly ceremonial laws as mere shadows.
There is no higher ground than walking by the faith of Christ, as He works in us to both will and do His good purpose.
If Christ has begun the good work of salvation in us he will finish not might or perhaps all the way to the end.He does not speak out of both sides of His mouth. If he says it He performs it. He performs all that at is appointed to us.It is He who can make our hearts soft enough to take in the seed of His word as the good ground (foundation)
Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
He is our confidence.
We are to put no confidence in carnal ordinances, imposed on the Jews until the time of reformation
The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation. Heb 9:8
Has the reformation occurred? yes or no?
2 Corinthians 3:7-9
[FONT="]7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:[/FONT]
[FONT="]8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?[/FONT]
[FONT="]9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
If it brings death and condemnation then it must be a burden, right? A yoke that people can't bear? Something that would be good to be freed from, absolved of?[/FONT]
[FONT="]7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:[/FONT]
[FONT="]8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?[/FONT]
[FONT="]9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
If it brings death and condemnation then it must be a burden, right? A yoke that people can't bear? Something that would be good to be freed from, absolved of?[/FONT]
' Dan said that Messiah lived by the Spirit -- and I ask in response to that: As a result, how did He live?'
according to Torah, of course, and including all the words of wisdom that later prophets and apostles about how we carry that out.
Jesus probably didn't eat unclean meats, but if he did, it wouldn't have defiled him. He probably would've said, 'food is made for man, not man for food. The son of man is lord of the animal.'
that's the reasoning he used to show that he could work on the Sabbath.
I believe that's the way of walking that pleases God.
according to Torah, of course, and including all the words of wisdom that later prophets and apostles about how we carry that out.
Jesus probably didn't eat unclean meats, but if he did, it wouldn't have defiled him. He probably would've said, 'food is made for man, not man for food. The son of man is lord of the animal.'
that's the reasoning he used to show that he could work on the Sabbath.
I believe that's the way of walking that pleases God.
To carnally work at the law would be to do what the hebrews did. Rest on saturdays. Eat "clean" meats.
Basically attempting to do by your own understanding and work what is the spiritual work of God. Giving us Rest. Sanctifying us. etc...
John 3:25-27
[FONT="]25 Then there arose a question between some of John's disciples and the Jews about purifying.[/FONT]
[FONT="]26 And they came unto John, and said unto him, Rabbi, he that was with thee beyond Jordan, to whom thou barest witness, behold, the same baptizeth, and all men come to him.[/FONT]
[FONT="]27 John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.
Ephesians 2:8-9
[/FONT]
[FONT="]8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:[/FONT]
[FONT="]9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Galatians 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
Romans 8:1-4
[/FONT]
1 [FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.[/FONT]
[FONT="]2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.[/FONT]
[FONT="]3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:[/FONT]
[FONT="]4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.[/FONT]
Basically attempting to do by your own understanding and work what is the spiritual work of God. Giving us Rest. Sanctifying us. etc...
John 3:25-27
[FONT="]25 Then there arose a question between some of John's disciples and the Jews about purifying.[/FONT]
[FONT="]26 And they came unto John, and said unto him, Rabbi, he that was with thee beyond Jordan, to whom thou barest witness, behold, the same baptizeth, and all men come to him.[/FONT]
[FONT="]27 John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.
Ephesians 2:8-9
[/FONT]
[FONT="]8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:[/FONT]
[FONT="]9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Galatians 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
Romans 8:1-4
[/FONT]
1 [FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.[/FONT]
[FONT="]2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.[/FONT]
[FONT="]3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:[/FONT]
[FONT="]4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.[/FONT]