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Hello again, Pilgrimshope,
It is important to understand that the phrase "who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron" is shared by three.
* By the church = "And to the one who overcomes and continues in My work until the end, I will give authority over the nations. He will rule them with an iron scepter and shatter them like pottery —just as I have received authority from My Father. And I will give him the morning star.
* The Male Child = And she gave birth to a son, a male child, who will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.
* The Lord = "The armies of heaven, dressed in fine linen, white and pure, follow Him on white horses. And from His mouth proceeds a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations, and He will rule them with an iron scepter.
First of all, Jesus does not fit the criteria of being the Male Child. Jesus was crucified, buried, resurrected and later ascended up to the right hand of God. In opposition, the Male Child is 'snatched up' to God and His throne and this before the dragon can devour/kill him. The word 'harpazo' translated as 'caught up' is the same word used when the church is caught up, and when Paul said that he was caught up to the third heaven and when Philip was 'snatched away' from the eunuch, etc. The word means 'force suddenly exercised, caught up. seize by force; snatch up, suddenly and decisively.' This did not happen to Jesus. Where Jesus was crucified, the Male Child is snatched up to God's throne unharmed before the dragon/Satan can kill him.
In Revelation 1:19, the Lord told john to write:
What you have seen = Everything written from Revelation 1:1 thru 1:19
What is now = Represented by the letters to the seven churches, which represents the entire church period
What will take place later = Everything that takes place after the "what is now," i.e. after the church period.
Currently, we are still living in the "what is now," portion of what John was told to write, i.e. the church period. Once the Lord gathers the church, that will end the "What is now" and the "what must take place later" will begin. That said, everything from chapter 4 onwards are future events, including the information regarding the woman, her giving birth to a male child and the war in heaven.
In addition, everything in Revelation 12:1-6 is symbolic:
The woman clothed with the sun, etc. = Not a literal woman, but symbolically represents Israel (see Joseph's dream in Genesis 37:9-10)
She was pregnant = Not a literal woman and therefore not literally pregnant
Male Child = Not a literal male child
Seven headed dragon = not a literal dragon
The Male Child is a collective name representing the 144,000 out of the twelve tribes of Israel, who are sealed in chapter 7. In Rev.14 of them it is said, "These are those who did not defile themselves with women" which would make the 144,000 all males, ergo, the Male Child.
The woman who gives birth to the Male Child, is the unbelieving nation of Israel. Where the Male child will be 144,000 who will recognize Jesus as their Messiah. Therefore, the figurative meaning of the woman giving birth, is referring to those 144,000 believing Israelite's coming out of the unbelieving nation of Israel. They will be serving the Lord during the first 3 1/2 years of that seven year period and they being the Male Child, will be 'snatched up' to God's throne in the middle of the seven years. I will go out on a limb here to say that this is also when their bodies will be transformed immortal and glorified like the living church, since Paul said that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.
The teaching that Jesus is the Male Child, is basically a knee-jerk reaction based on the woman representing Israel. However, since everything in Rev.12:1-6 is symbolic, it is not grammatically proper to insert the literal birth of Jesus into the context.
The Woman clothed with the sun, etc. = The unbelieving nation of Israel
The Male Child = The 144,000 believing Israelite's whom the woman figuratively gives birth to
The Dragon and the stars = Figuratively representing Satan and his angels
It is the church in their immortal and glorified bodies, the Male child/144,000, who will rule with Christ during the millennial kingdom with an iron on scepter. The great tribulation saints who are resurrected after the Lord returns to the earth to end the age, will also rule with Christ during the thousand years- (Rev.20:4-6)
All of that said, Revelation 12 regarding the woman and the male child that she gives figurative birth to, as well as the war in heaven, are all future events which will take place in the middle of that seven year period. When Satan is cast out of heaven and restricted to the earth, he will know that his time is short because he will know that he only has 3 1/2 years from the time that he is cast out to the time that the Lord returns to the earth to end the age, where at which time he will be thrown into and restricted in the Abyss during the one thousand year reign of Christ - (Rev.20:1-3)
In the OD Christ said one generation would "see all these things". That includes the second coming. In Rev we are told great trib is 42 months so putting the two together, when AoD appears, there is 42 months until the second coming.
Mat 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
Mat 24:16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
Mat 24:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
Mat 24:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
Mat 24:19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
Mat 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
Mat 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
Mat 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
Mat 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
Mat 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
Mat 24:25 Behold, I have told you before.
Mat 24:26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
Mat 24:27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
Mat 24:28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
The Coming of the Son of Man
Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Mat 24:32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
Mat 24:33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
Mat 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
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S
Continued from above . . .
Rev. 9:1
And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.
[2] And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.
[3] And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
You know,
the way the world is currently we do not even need the Anti-christ to be here to destroy us. We are doing that just fine.
WE murdered over 61 million babies, we support self-killing, we support and abuse children with transgender, and homosexuality. We Profane the Lord God and Mock and scoff HIS Holy name. We lack self-control and are a perverted generation.
the way the world is currently we do not even need the Anti-christ to be here to destroy us. We are doing that just fine.
WE murdered over 61 million babies, we support self-killing, we support and abuse children with transgender, and homosexuality. We Profane the Lord God and Mock and scoff HIS Holy name. We lack self-control and are a perverted generation.
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“It is important to understand that the phrase "who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron" “
yes dear brother I’ve been trying hard to let you know how to understand that and the rest of revelation this is who was to rule from Gods throne with a rod of iron
“Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion.
I will declare the decree: the Lord hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee. Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.
Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel.
Be wise now therefore, O ye kings: be instructed, ye judges of the earth. Serve the Lord with fear, and rejoice with trembling. Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.”
Psalm 2:6-12 KJV
same guy here the “man child “ promised to be born in Israel
“Hereafter shall the Son of man sit on the right hand of the power of God.”
Luke 22:69
same guy here
“So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.”
Mark 16:19 KJV
and if you follow him up through scripture same guy here
“This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses. Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear. Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.”
Acts 2:32-33, 36 KJV
same guy here
“And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.”
Revelation 5:6 KJV
Even if we look backwards same “ man child “ here
“I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.
And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.”
Daniel 7:13-14 KJV
There only ever one “man child “ going to be caught up to Gods throne and rule with an unbreakable rod ( his word) that’s Jesus and he was seated in heaven long ago and his inbreakable word of iron will save and also break those who refuse to hear and accept it
the rod of iron is Christs everlasting word , same with the double edged sword coming out of his mouth
yes dear brother I’ve been trying hard to let you know how to understand that and the rest of revelation this is who was to rule from Gods throne with a rod of iron
“Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion.
I will declare the decree: the Lord hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee. Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.
Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel.
Be wise now therefore, O ye kings: be instructed, ye judges of the earth. Serve the Lord with fear, and rejoice with trembling. Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.”
Psalm 2:6-12 KJV
same guy here the “man child “ promised to be born in Israel
“Hereafter shall the Son of man sit on the right hand of the power of God.”
Luke 22:69
same guy here
“So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.”
Mark 16:19 KJV
and if you follow him up through scripture same guy here
“This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses. Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear. Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.”
Acts 2:32-33, 36 KJV
same guy here
“And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.”
Revelation 5:6 KJV
Even if we look backwards same “ man child “ here
“I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.
And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.”
Daniel 7:13-14 KJV
There only ever one “man child “ going to be caught up to Gods throne and rule with an unbreakable rod ( his word) that’s Jesus and he was seated in heaven long ago and his inbreakable word of iron will save and also break those who refuse to hear and accept it
the rod of iron is Christs everlasting word , same with the double edged sword coming out of his mouth
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Per the Bible. When the Antichrist makes itself known.
What is going to happen according to end times prophecy?
Christ will remove all born-again believers from the earth in an event known as the rapture (1 Thessalonians 4:13-18; 1 Corinthians 15:51-54). At the judgment seat of Christ, these believers will be rewarded for good works and faithful service during their time on earth or will lose rewards, but not eternal life, for lack of service and obedience (1 Corinthians 3:11-15; 2 Corinthians 5:10).
The Antichrist (the beast) will come into power and will sign a covenant with Israel for seven years (Daniel 9:27). This seven-year period of time is known as the “tribulation.” During the tribulation, there will be terrible wars, famines, plagues, and natural disasters. God will be pouring out His wrath against sin, evil, and wickedness. The tribulation will include the appearance of the four horsemen of the Apocalypse, and the seven seal, trumpet, and bowl judgments.
About halfway through the seven years, the Antichrist will break the peace covenant with Israel and make war against it. The Antichrist will commit “the abomination of desolation” and set up an image of himself to be worshiped in the Jerusalem temple (Daniel 9:27; 2 Thessalonians 2:3-10), which will have been rebuilt. The second half of the tribulation is known as “the great tribulation” (Revelation 7:14) and “the time of Jacob’s trouble” (Jeremiah 30:7).
At the end of the seven-year tribulation, the Antichrist will launch a final attack on Jerusalem, culminating in the battle of Armageddon. Jesus Christ will return, destroy the Antichrist and his armies, and cast them into the lake of fire (Revelation 19:11-21). Christ will then bind Satan in the Abyss for 1,000 years and He will rule His earthly kingdom for this thousand-year period (Revelation 20:1-6).
At the end of the thousand years, Satan will be released, defeated again, and then cast into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:7-10) for eternity. Christ then judges all unbelievers (Revelation 20:10-15) at the great white throne judgment, casting them all into the lake of fire. Christ will then usher in a new heaven and new earth and the New Jerusalem—the eternal dwelling place of believers. There will be no more sin, sorrow, or death (Revelation 21–22). Source
Christ will remove all born-again believers from the earth in an event known as the rapture (1 Thessalonians 4:13-18; 1 Corinthians 15:51-54). At the judgment seat of Christ, these believers will be rewarded for good works and faithful service during their time on earth or will lose rewards, but not eternal life, for lack of service and obedience (1 Corinthians 3:11-15; 2 Corinthians 5:10).
The Antichrist (the beast) will come into power and will sign a covenant with Israel for seven years (Daniel 9:27). This seven-year period of time is known as the “tribulation.” During the tribulation, there will be terrible wars, famines, plagues, and natural disasters. God will be pouring out His wrath against sin, evil, and wickedness. The tribulation will include the appearance of the four horsemen of the Apocalypse, and the seven seal, trumpet, and bowl judgments.
About halfway through the seven years, the Antichrist will break the peace covenant with Israel and make war against it. The Antichrist will commit “the abomination of desolation” and set up an image of himself to be worshiped in the Jerusalem temple (Daniel 9:27; 2 Thessalonians 2:3-10), which will have been rebuilt. The second half of the tribulation is known as “the great tribulation” (Revelation 7:14) and “the time of Jacob’s trouble” (Jeremiah 30:7).
At the end of the seven-year tribulation, the Antichrist will launch a final attack on Jerusalem, culminating in the battle of Armageddon. Jesus Christ will return, destroy the Antichrist and his armies, and cast them into the lake of fire (Revelation 19:11-21). Christ will then bind Satan in the Abyss for 1,000 years and He will rule His earthly kingdom for this thousand-year period (Revelation 20:1-6).
At the end of the thousand years, Satan will be released, defeated again, and then cast into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:7-10) for eternity. Christ then judges all unbelievers (Revelation 20:10-15) at the great white throne judgment, casting them all into the lake of fire. Christ will then usher in a new heaven and new earth and the New Jerusalem—the eternal dwelling place of believers. There will be no more sin, sorrow, or death (Revelation 21–22). Source
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That is correct! There was not. Nor does Bible prophecy indicate that there should/would be.
There is a 'clue' in your parenthetical phrase - do you see it?
Please read this post:
https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...-be-in-the-future.200137/page-29#post-4603180
There is a 'clue' in your parenthetical phrase - do you see it?
Please read this post:
https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...-be-in-the-future.200137/page-29#post-4603180
Agreed.
Jesus said "Therefore when ye shall see the abomination [SINGULAR] of desolation [SINGULAR] spoken of by Daniel the prophet...,"
...He was referring specifically to the one in Dan12:11 "abomination [SINGULAR] of desolation [SINGULAR] SET UP [H5414 - wə·lā·ṯêṯ / nathan]..." ... and then supplies some day-amounts (which "fits" in relation to the other day-amounts / timing referred to in the same chpt, vv.6-7,1... speaking specifically of the SECOND HALF of the future "7 yr period"--just as does Dan7:25 [vv.20-25,27 CONTEXT, parallel to Rev13:5-7,1!!])
(whereas chpt 9 only references it in a less specific way, where both vv.26b and 27 use the term "abominationS [PLURAL]")
Jesus said "Therefore when ye shall see the abomination [SINGULAR] of desolation [SINGULAR] spoken of by Daniel the prophet...,"
...He was referring specifically to the one in Dan12:11 "abomination [SINGULAR] of desolation [SINGULAR] SET UP [H5414 - wə·lā·ṯêṯ / nathan]..." ... and then supplies some day-amounts (which "fits" in relation to the other day-amounts / timing referred to in the same chpt, vv.6-7,1... speaking specifically of the SECOND HALF of the future "7 yr period"--just as does Dan7:25 [vv.20-25,27 CONTEXT, parallel to Rev13:5-7,1!!])
(whereas chpt 9 only references it in a less specific way, where both vv.26b and 27 use the term "abominationS [PLURAL]")
E
Your right, the only one which occured presently happened in by the greece prince artexerxes when he slaughtered a pic in the holy place. and this caused the maccabean revolt.
Jesus spoke of a future event. And he spoke of it around 200 years after this event, meaning it can not be that even he spoke of
He said WHEN YOU SEE IT.
They could not see it occur almost too years after it happened.
ANd they did not see it occure in their lifetimes. So he is speaking to a people. who are alive at the time that event takes place
Jesus spoke of a future event. And he spoke of it around 200 years after this event, meaning it can not be that even he spoke of
He said WHEN YOU SEE IT.
They could not see it occur almost too years after it happened.
ANd they did not see it occure in their lifetimes. So he is speaking to a people. who are alive at the time that event takes place