How To Be Un-Saved
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E
It says they were NEVER saved in the first place.
An antichrist who left the church was never of us
[SUP]19 [/SUP]They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us. [SUP]20 [/SUP]But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you know all things.[SUP][d][/SUP] [SUP]21 [/SUP]I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. [SUP]23 [/SUP]Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either;
who is an anti Christ? He who Denys Jesus is the Christ.
An antichrist who left the church was never of us
[SUP]19 [/SUP]They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us. [SUP]20 [/SUP]But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you know all things.[SUP][d][/SUP] [SUP]21 [/SUP]I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. [SUP]23 [/SUP]Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either;
who is an anti Christ? He who Denys Jesus is the Christ.
Sure I can. Point 2 is a lie. See that wasn't hard.
YOU would have to dispose of VAST chunks of Scripture to believe the lie. Here are a tiny portion of them.
Keep your lives free from the love of money and be CONTENT with what you have, because God has said, “Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you.” This one is a bonus because it also eviscerates your economic beliefs.
Now, Is that a Lie? Is He going to leave and forsake us? He says NEVER!
27John 10:4, 14My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. 29John 14:28My Father, (John 17:2, 6, 12, 24)who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.30John 17:11, 21–24I and My Father are one.”
So we have the picture of God holding us with One Hand and Jesus with the Other clasped around us. What am I gonna do, bite Their fingers to make Them let me jump out?
And don't forget, the whole time, we are SEALED with the Holy Spirit:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were SEALED with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who[b] is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.
I don't know about you, but I'm certain I can't break the Lord's Seal!
Just like I told Chester yesterday, I was in your camp, so I have hope the Holy Spirit will reveal this truth to you and you can be free!
YOU would have to dispose of VAST chunks of Scripture to believe the lie. Here are a tiny portion of them.
Keep your lives free from the love of money and be CONTENT with what you have, because God has said, “Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you.” This one is a bonus because it also eviscerates your economic beliefs.
Now, Is that a Lie? Is He going to leave and forsake us? He says NEVER!
27John 10:4, 14My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. 29John 14:28My Father, (John 17:2, 6, 12, 24)who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.30John 17:11, 21–24I and My Father are one.”
So we have the picture of God holding us with One Hand and Jesus with the Other clasped around us. What am I gonna do, bite Their fingers to make Them let me jump out?
And don't forget, the whole time, we are SEALED with the Holy Spirit:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were SEALED with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who[b] is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.
I don't know about you, but I'm certain I can't break the Lord's Seal!
Just like I told Chester yesterday, I was in your camp, so I have hope the Holy Spirit will reveal this truth to you and you can be free!
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R
If you mean falling away, yes, it is off to hell with them. Whether they ever really believed to begin with, or stopped believing, doesn't matter. People who do not believe and are 'living like this' (Galatians 5:21) when Jesus returns will not enter into the kingdom. I know you are taught by your church that even unbelievers will enter into the kingdom when Jesus comes back (as long as they used to believe somewhere in the past), but the scriptures are clear that the person living in unbelief is not born again.
That's a good reason why the death in 1 Corinthians 5 is not physical death. Physical death does nothing to make it "so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus"-1 Corinthians 5:5.
Paul is very clear that this person has to die to his flesh so he can be saved. But you are changing the plain words to say he must die to lose reward.
We know there are those disobedient Christians who die physically because of sin. But Paul plainly says the matter of the sinner in 1 Corinthians 5 is about salvation (vs.5), not punishment and loss of reward.
We know he's not already saved (used to be, or not, doesn't matter) because Paul he has to die to the flesh "so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus"-1 Corinthians 5:5. You can't be living in the flesh when Jesus comes back and be saved. Won't happen. And it doesn't matter if you used to not live in the flesh, but now do because you no longer believe. Either way, you aren't going to be saved when Jesus comes back.
What I do not do is live in the deeds of the flesh. Do you? Apparently you do since you refuse to make the distinction between the unsaved sinning person and the saved sinning person. The unsaved person lives in the flesh. The saved person lives for God and is no longer in bondage to the flesh. Which one are you? I know you will not answer the question because even though you don't make the distinction you can't bring yourself to say you still live in sin.
Ask John:
"If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."-1 John 1:9
It's like you don't even read the Bible.
The sin of willful rejection of Christ.
There is no sacrifice given for that offense. Doesn't matter if you were ever saved, or not. Christ's blood does not cover the sin of choosing to live in a rejection of his blood.
Don't have the sin of living in a rejection of Christ's blood and you have nothing to worry about. Go back to your old life in unbelief, that is where Christ's blood will not cover you.
That's where the blood of Christ comes in. Is this really that hard for you to understand?
It's only when I depart from the blood in a willful return to the world in unbelief that I am condemned to the lake of fire. As long as I don't do that I am living in obedience to the commands of God. Don't forget that part of his commands are to seek forgiveness when you sin. You are being obedient when you seek the forgiveness of God for the time you do not keep a command of God. Obedience is not sinless perfection. It's simply living for God and seeking his forgiveness and cleansing when you fail. The only thing that can condemn you as being disobedient is a return to unbelief. In which case NONE of your sin is covered.
You did not realize part of obeying his commands is to seek forgiveness when you fail.
The only sin he can't cover is not believing in the blood that covers your sin.
Yeah, forget about living holy FOR GOD.
Good grief, listen to yourself, man.
You seem to not even realize you directly contradict plain scriptures when you and others say this. I'm amazed at how you people can claim something directly contradictory to what the Bible plainly says. It's an interesting phenomenon. But that is how spiritual blindness is.
And if they stay that way they will not be saved when Jesus comes back.
Dying to self is the sign of the believer, not the unbeliever.
Jesus said the fruit of the righteous LASTS. It's not a fly-by-night, buck in the Salvation Army kettle, once a year thing. It's a matter of lifestyle. A change of nature.
And then there's the matter of what you brought up before-the things unbelievers simply CAN'T do. But you just blew that off.
Nope. False religion is noted for his murderous attitude toward it's enemies.
Like I say, it's like you don't even read the Bible:
"They encouraged them to continue in the faith, reminding them that we must suffer many hardships to enter the Kingdom of God."-Acts 14:22
"For what credit is there if, when you sin and are harshly treated, you endure it with patience? But if when you do what is right and suffer for it you patiently endure it, this finds favor with God.
21For you have been called for this purpose, since Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example for you to follow in His steps"-1 Peter 2:20-21
If YOU are not suffering for Christ you will not enter the kingdom of God. This means doing right even when it costs you. A simple example would be choosing to be patient with someone in traffic, or in the grocery line even doing that (doing right) will cause you to be late for an appointment or late for work. See how that works? Probably not, but it's out there for those who have ears to hear.
That's a good reason why the death in 1 Corinthians 5 is not physical death. Physical death does nothing to make it "so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus"-1 Corinthians 5:5.
Paul is very clear that this person has to die to his flesh so he can be saved. But you are changing the plain words to say he must die to lose reward.
We know there are those disobedient Christians who die physically because of sin. But Paul plainly says the matter of the sinner in 1 Corinthians 5 is about salvation (vs.5), not punishment and loss of reward.
We know he's not already saved (used to be, or not, doesn't matter) because Paul he has to die to the flesh "so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus"-1 Corinthians 5:5. You can't be living in the flesh when Jesus comes back and be saved. Won't happen. And it doesn't matter if you used to not live in the flesh, but now do because you no longer believe. Either way, you aren't going to be saved when Jesus comes back.
What I do not do is live in the deeds of the flesh. Do you? Apparently you do since you refuse to make the distinction between the unsaved sinning person and the saved sinning person. The unsaved person lives in the flesh. The saved person lives for God and is no longer in bondage to the flesh. Which one are you? I know you will not answer the question because even though you don't make the distinction you can't bring yourself to say you still live in sin.
Ask John:
"If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."-1 John 1:9
It's like you don't even read the Bible.
The sin of willful rejection of Christ.
There is no sacrifice given for that offense. Doesn't matter if you were ever saved, or not. Christ's blood does not cover the sin of choosing to live in a rejection of his blood.
Don't have the sin of living in a rejection of Christ's blood and you have nothing to worry about. Go back to your old life in unbelief, that is where Christ's blood will not cover you.
That's where the blood of Christ comes in. Is this really that hard for you to understand?
It's only when I depart from the blood in a willful return to the world in unbelief that I am condemned to the lake of fire. As long as I don't do that I am living in obedience to the commands of God. Don't forget that part of his commands are to seek forgiveness when you sin. You are being obedient when you seek the forgiveness of God for the time you do not keep a command of God. Obedience is not sinless perfection. It's simply living for God and seeking his forgiveness and cleansing when you fail. The only thing that can condemn you as being disobedient is a return to unbelief. In which case NONE of your sin is covered.
You did not realize part of obeying his commands is to seek forgiveness when you fail.
The only sin he can't cover is not believing in the blood that covers your sin.
Yeah, forget about living holy FOR GOD.
Good grief, listen to yourself, man.
You seem to not even realize you directly contradict plain scriptures when you and others say this. I'm amazed at how you people can claim something directly contradictory to what the Bible plainly says. It's an interesting phenomenon. But that is how spiritual blindness is.
And if they stay that way they will not be saved when Jesus comes back.
Dying to self is the sign of the believer, not the unbeliever.
Jesus said the fruit of the righteous LASTS. It's not a fly-by-night, buck in the Salvation Army kettle, once a year thing. It's a matter of lifestyle. A change of nature.
And then there's the matter of what you brought up before-the things unbelievers simply CAN'T do. But you just blew that off.
Nope. False religion is noted for his murderous attitude toward it's enemies.
Like I say, it's like you don't even read the Bible:
"They encouraged them to continue in the faith, reminding them that we must suffer many hardships to enter the Kingdom of God."-Acts 14:22
"For what credit is there if, when you sin and are harshly treated, you endure it with patience? But if when you do what is right and suffer for it you patiently endure it, this finds favor with God.
21For you have been called for this purpose, since Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example for you to follow in His steps"-1 Peter 2:20-21
If YOU are not suffering for Christ you will not enter the kingdom of God. This means doing right even when it costs you. A simple example would be choosing to be patient with someone in traffic, or in the grocery line even doing that (doing right) will cause you to be late for an appointment or late for work. See how that works? Probably not, but it's out there for those who have ears to hear.
Romans 8:28-30: "And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified"
Guarantee of completion, that He who has begun a good work in us will complete it (Philippians 1:6)
I also like that bit "we know" too (we have assurance)
Guarantee of completion, that He who has begun a good work in us will complete it (Philippians 1:6)
I also like that bit "we know" too (we have assurance)
A lot of people do pick and choose which scriptures to adhere to and which ones to ignore.....but if you're not Spiritually discerned....you can get confused really quick because it seems a lot of scriptures contradict themselves, but NOT if you are endwelled with the Holy Spirit. If you're saved, you can't be unsaved, and if you're not saved, then you cannot understand what the scriptures are saying.
"But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." 1 Corinthians 2:14
E
I hope it does. And I ghope you find joy in whatever you get.
Me. I am already ribch
I have been blessed with EVERY spiritual blessing in Christ jesus
I have been given the right to become his child based on my faith
I have been redeemed by his blood
I have been justified freely by his sacrifice
I have been perfected forever. And am in the process of being sanctified
I have been given eternal life
I have been assured my father will never leave me, and if I stray, he will leave the flock to come get me, ane when he comes, i will follow
I have been given the pledge of the spirit as a guarantee
I have been made alive in Christ
I have been baptised into his body, his church and the cross
My savior is in heaven now making a mansion where I will live for eternity
I have the hope that surpasses all understanding
I have been given rest, a rest which can nto come from anyone but God
I have been told I will never die, I will live forever, and given Gods assurance, he will raise me from the dead.
I have had everything that is against me, contrary to me, and would condem me nailed to the cross
I have come to a point where even the greatest suffering is abe to become just a momentary light affliction
I have been united with the father the son and the spirit
I have been given a father who is not a spirit of fear. But an Abba Father
I have been told God has many gifts awating for me in heaven.
I have been told I will have reward in heaven
I have been given so much, nothign on this earth even compairs and I have only begum to list the riches I have and will continue to have in christ
You want to be rich, Go ahead and try to earn your riches. Me, I have everything a person needs, and been blessed beyond comprehension. And you know what is even better? God said NO ONE, and he means NO ONE can take that away from me.
Me. I am already ribch
I have been blessed with EVERY spiritual blessing in Christ jesus
I have been given the right to become his child based on my faith
I have been redeemed by his blood
I have been justified freely by his sacrifice
I have been perfected forever. And am in the process of being sanctified
I have been given eternal life
I have been assured my father will never leave me, and if I stray, he will leave the flock to come get me, ane when he comes, i will follow
I have been given the pledge of the spirit as a guarantee
I have been made alive in Christ
I have been baptised into his body, his church and the cross
My savior is in heaven now making a mansion where I will live for eternity
I have the hope that surpasses all understanding
I have been given rest, a rest which can nto come from anyone but God
I have been told I will never die, I will live forever, and given Gods assurance, he will raise me from the dead.
I have had everything that is against me, contrary to me, and would condem me nailed to the cross
I have come to a point where even the greatest suffering is abe to become just a momentary light affliction
I have been united with the father the son and the spirit
I have been given a father who is not a spirit of fear. But an Abba Father
I have been told God has many gifts awating for me in heaven.
I have been told I will have reward in heaven
I have been given so much, nothign on this earth even compairs and I have only begum to list the riches I have and will continue to have in christ
You want to be rich, Go ahead and try to earn your riches. Me, I have everything a person needs, and been blessed beyond comprehension. And you know what is even better? God said NO ONE, and he means NO ONE can take that away from me.
J
oooo I know!
you can go back in a time machine to become your old self oh wait that self wouldn't be "actually" you, blast even modern stuff can't make an old creation that becomes new an old creation again,now didn't Jesus say something on this...
not placing the old with the new or the new with the old like garments that it can tear a garment worse,any of this ringing a bell?
you can go back in a time machine to become your old self oh wait that self wouldn't be "actually" you, blast even modern stuff can't make an old creation that becomes new an old creation again,now didn't Jesus say something on this...
not placing the old with the new or the new with the old like garments that it can tear a garment worse,any of this ringing a bell?
R
Keep reading, Katy. You stopped short of the very next verse that warns these believers against also not continuing in the truth:
"24As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father."-1 John 2:24
You say yourself that he is writing to true believers who know the truth. And he tells these true believers to continue (abide) in what they heard, in contrast to those who did not (vs.19). And that if they do that they will continue (abide) in the Son and the Father. Yet it is argued that John is saying it isn't even possible for these true believers to not continue in the truth. That belief is not consistent with his warning to not also fall away like those in vs. 19 did.
So don't leave out vs. 24 to try to make the preceding verses mean only fake believers don't continue in what they heard. John says if these true believers don't deny Christ they will continue in the Son and the Father, unlike those who did deny Christ and do not abide in Christ as a result.
"24As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father."-1 John 2:24
You say yourself that he is writing to true believers who know the truth. And he tells these true believers to continue (abide) in what they heard, in contrast to those who did not (vs.19). And that if they do that they will continue (abide) in the Son and the Father. Yet it is argued that John is saying it isn't even possible for these true believers to not continue in the truth. That belief is not consistent with his warning to not also fall away like those in vs. 19 did.
So don't leave out vs. 24 to try to make the preceding verses mean only fake believers don't continue in what they heard. John says if these true believers don't deny Christ they will continue in the Son and the Father, unlike those who did deny Christ and do not abide in Christ as a result.
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R
Romans 8:28-30: "And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified"
Guarantee of completion, that He who has begun a good work in us will complete it (Philippians 1:6)
I also like that bit "we know" too (we have assurance)
Guarantee of completion, that He who has begun a good work in us will complete it (Philippians 1:6)
I also like that bit "we know" too (we have assurance)
R
So don't be an anti-christ........don't deny Christ, keep believing:
"the one who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has given concerning His Son."-1 John 5:10
"Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son."-1 John 2:22
"If we deny Him, He also will deny us;"-2 Timothy 2:12
So don't be an anti-christ, like those who are not in the truth in 1 John 2:19. Instead, continue in the truth you have because if you do you will continue in the Son and the Father.
"they went out, so that it would be shown that they all are not of us."-1 John 2:19
"24As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father."-1 John 2:24
"the one who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has given concerning His Son."-1 John 5:10
"Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son."-1 John 2:22
"If we deny Him, He also will deny us;"-2 Timothy 2:12
So don't be an anti-christ, like those who are not in the truth in 1 John 2:19. Instead, continue in the truth you have because if you do you will continue in the Son and the Father.
"they went out, so that it would be shown that they all are not of us."-1 John 2:19
"24As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father."-1 John 2:24