Hebrews 10:26-31
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So-called "lordship salvation" doctrine is nothing other than the Gospel that was preached through the centuries which MacArthur expressed in his polarizing work "The Gospel According to Jesus". Any person who is well read on the expositing and preaching of the Gospel by godly men in church history will be aware of this fact. For the record Chuck Swindoll came out with the FGT side of the issue with "The Grace Awakening." This work helped to facilitate the problems we see today in a weakened "gospel."
As free will decisionalism came into play (in the last 150 years?) it distorted the Gospel and people were and are shocked to hear it preached Biblically as MacArthur presented it.
The Gospel has been dumbed down and truncated into a "Decide your way into heaven, no evidence of conversion necessary, live how you want, you're going to heaven" lie. People then freak out at any hint of sanctification, godliness, the necessity of holiness (descriptive) real transformation, evidence of conversion &c and prematurely call it "a works gospel!!!!"
As free will decisionalism came into play (in the last 150 years?) it distorted the Gospel and people were and are shocked to hear it preached Biblically as MacArthur presented it.
The Gospel has been dumbed down and truncated into a "Decide your way into heaven, no evidence of conversion necessary, live how you want, you're going to heaven" lie. People then freak out at any hint of sanctification, godliness, the necessity of holiness (descriptive) real transformation, evidence of conversion &c and prematurely call it "a works gospel!!!!"
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Which one are Zane Hodges and Bob Wilkin? And Bob Wilkin clearly spoke against Joseph Prince:
https://faithalone.org/grace-in-focus-articles/is-joseph-prince-free-grace/
https://faithalone.org/grace-in-focus-articles/is-joseph-prince-free-grace/
Sorry, but you are on the wrong side. MacArthur did not preach the Gospel according to Christ. And Hodges did not teach a "decide your way into heaven, no evidence of conversion necessary, live how you want, you're going to heaven" Gospel. he indeed taught about chastisement, that disobedient children will face a painful loss of eternal rewards and that all people who are not only truly saved, but also have full assurance, will not live in carnality.
MacArthur cannot be true if he says we are saved by grace but need works to proof it.
Romans 11:6 King James Version (KJV)
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
Which types of works is the Apostle Paul talking about?
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: ergon
Phonetic Spelling: (er'-gon)
Short Definition: work, labor, action, deed
Definition: work, task, employment; a deed, action; that which is wrought or made, a work.
2041 érgon (from ergō, "to work, accomplish") – a work or worker who accomplishes something. 2041 /érgon ("work") is a deed (action) that carries out (completes) an inner desire (intension, purpose).
MacArthur cannot be true if he says we are saved by grace but need works to proof it.
Romans 11:6 King James Version (KJV)
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
Which types of works is the Apostle Paul talking about?
ergon: work
Original Word: ἔργον, ου, τόPart of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: ergon
Phonetic Spelling: (er'-gon)
Short Definition: work, labor, action, deed
Definition: work, task, employment; a deed, action; that which is wrought or made, a work.
2041 érgon (from ergō, "to work, accomplish") – a work or worker who accomplishes something. 2041 /érgon ("work") is a deed (action) that carries out (completes) an inner desire (intension, purpose).
R
And it goes without saying that demons do not have even a shallow retention of the word of God in their hearts. The first type of soil is the only soil that can be compared to that of demons.
Obviously, 'no root' does not mean no root at all (like the 1st type of soil) but rather no deep or firm root. Jesus said the word sprang up quickly from the rocky soil, so we know he doesn't literally mean NO root at all. It did grow in them, so it has to have some root. If it didn't have any root at all they'd be the 1st type of soil.
Yes. They demonstrate the condition of their hearts by how easily the word of Christ was uprooted from them, not that they never believed to begin with.
Obviously, 'no root' does not mean no root at all (like the 1st type of soil) but rather no deep or firm root. Jesus said the word sprang up quickly from the rocky soil, so we know he doesn't literally mean NO root at all. It did grow in them, so it has to have some root. If it didn't have any root at all they'd be the 1st type of soil.
Yes. They demonstrate the condition of their hearts by how easily the word of Christ was uprooted from them, not that they never believed to begin with.
And it goes without saying that demons do not have even a shallow retention of the word of God in their hearts. The first type of soil is the only soil that can be compared to that of demons.
Demons are not people. Jesus did not die for them. James spoke to "brethren" to encourage them.
Obviously, 'no root' does not mean no root at all (like the 1st type of soil) but rather no deep or firm root. Jesus said the word sprang up quickly from the rocky soil, so we know he doesn't literally mean NO root at all. It did grow in them, so it has to have some root. If it didn't have any root at all they'd be the 1st type of soil.
Yes. They demonstrate the condition of their hearts by how easily the word of Christ was uprooted from them, not that they never believed to begin with.[/QUOTE]
Demons are not people. Jesus did not die for them. James spoke to "brethren" to encourage them.
Obviously, 'no root' does not mean no root at all (like the 1st type of soil) but rather no deep or firm root. Jesus said the word sprang up quickly from the rocky soil, so we know he doesn't literally mean NO root at all. It did grow in them, so it has to have some root. If it didn't have any root at all they'd be the 1st type of soil.
Yes. They demonstrate the condition of their hearts by how easily the word of Christ was uprooted from them, not that they never believed to begin with.[/QUOTE]
You're incorrect and don't know the history of the true Gospel being preached. Sorry to be frank but it's the truth of the matter here. I'm not on the wrong side brother, and at the same time MacArthur preached the same Gospel Christ preached.
For the record I've read several of his books, and have listened to his preaching for some 30+ years.
Wrong again. He did in fact teach those things, anyone who knows his doctrine knows this to be true! His false dichotomy hinged on "inherit" the kingdom, that is, the lawless one still goes to heaven. This is a grave error of his. Hodges even went as far as to teach a believer can be a child of the devil and still have eternal life, based off of his faulty teaching on John 8.
Then you also hold to a truncated gospel that rejects evidence of conversion. By the way, James taught the same thing you're against up above.
But of course! You post this as if I don't believe this, you're conflating things here, and assuming too much.
All that proves is salvation isn't earned by works, it doesn't teach that evidence of conversion = a works gospel, or that evidence isn't necessary, or that works do not accompany salvation which is what MacArthur is teaching. In other words you're using the text wrongly here - it doesn't say what you're trying to make it say.
Since you are using the above as a polemic and as evidence against what MacArthur teaches, with all respect it show's you to be mistaken as to what he does teach. Furthermore you really show you do not have a grasp or thorough understanding of the Gospel when using it in this fashion!
But, I digress, you're doing this in a bit of inexperience and are fighting a straw man. You're making the classic mistake many make and as soon as works are mentioned you start quoting texts (wrongly) to fight against works. MacArthur doesn't teach works save, I don't teach works save, but Scripture teaches they are evidence and descriptive of one truly converted.
For the record I've read several of his books, and have listened to his preaching for some 30+ years.
Wrong again. He did in fact teach those things, anyone who knows his doctrine knows this to be true! His false dichotomy hinged on "inherit" the kingdom, that is, the lawless one still goes to heaven. This is a grave error of his. Hodges even went as far as to teach a believer can be a child of the devil and still have eternal life, based off of his faulty teaching on John 8.
Then you also hold to a truncated gospel that rejects evidence of conversion. By the way, James taught the same thing you're against up above.
But of course! You post this as if I don't believe this, you're conflating things here, and assuming too much.
All that proves is salvation isn't earned by works, it doesn't teach that evidence of conversion = a works gospel, or that evidence isn't necessary, or that works do not accompany salvation which is what MacArthur is teaching. In other words you're using the text wrongly here - it doesn't say what you're trying to make it say.
Since you are using the above as a polemic and as evidence against what MacArthur teaches, with all respect it show's you to be mistaken as to what he does teach. Furthermore you really show you do not have a grasp or thorough understanding of the Gospel when using it in this fashion!
But, I digress, you're doing this in a bit of inexperience and are fighting a straw man. You're making the classic mistake many make and as soon as works are mentioned you start quoting texts (wrongly) to fight against works. MacArthur doesn't teach works save, I don't teach works save, but Scripture teaches they are evidence and descriptive of one truly converted.
There should be evidence, but repentance is not turning from sins.
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: metanoeó
Phonetic Spelling: (met-an-o-eh'-o)
Short Definition: I repent, change my mind
Definition: I repent, change my mind, change the inner man (particularly with reference to acceptance of the will of God), repent.
3340 metanoéō (from 3326 /metá, "changed after being with" and 3539 /noiéō, "think") – properly, "think differently after," "after a change of mind"; to repent(literally, "think differently afterwards").
"Hodges even went as far as to teach a believer can be a child of the devil and still have eternal life, based off of his faulty teaching on John 8. "
It may shock you, but it IS possible. See the adulterous man I was talking about earlier.
metanoeó: to change one's mind or purpose
Original Word: μετανοέωPart of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: metanoeó
Phonetic Spelling: (met-an-o-eh'-o)
Short Definition: I repent, change my mind
Definition: I repent, change my mind, change the inner man (particularly with reference to acceptance of the will of God), repent.
3340 metanoéō (from 3326 /metá, "changed after being with" and 3539 /noiéō, "think") – properly, "think differently after," "after a change of mind"; to repent(literally, "think differently afterwards").
"Hodges even went as far as to teach a believer can be a child of the devil and still have eternal life, based off of his faulty teaching on John 8. "
It may shock you, but it IS possible. See the adulterous man I was talking about earlier.
I didn't say that macArthur teaches works save, I said that MacArthur teaches that you cannot have salvation without any works at all. You are refering to james Chapter 2, right? 
[h=1]James 2 King James Version (KJV)[/h][FONT="]2 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.[/FONT]
If it says "brethren", then it MUST be saved people.
[h=1]James 2 King James Version (KJV)[/h][FONT="]2 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.[/FONT]
If it says "brethren", then it MUST be saved people.
I'm just setting the record straight because that is how others will interpret it. Then again I think you're being a bit disingenuous , that is, in the long run you really believe that is the logical end of his teaching.
That said, you still have a disagreement with the Gospel, probably several due to some easy-believism teachings. Or something. THAT is the problem.
And he's correct.
You appear to have a problem with that. Some serious study would help you greatly, and it isn't going to help straighten your errant teaching out in the next few minutes, or hours, or days. I'm saying serious study and a long maturation process.
Of course it says brothers....lolzzzzz
Goodness sake man...you're showing an abject inability to follow along and misconstrue what others are saying. If you were comprehending what was said then you'd know that is exactly the way I was using the text!
You really need to slow down and read what I stated and accept the fact you are totally truncating the Gospel message due to some ignorance of it.
We're going nowhere, you're not going to listen to a word others say, nor will you ever concede to the fact you need to study up on the Gospel long term and end making rookie mistakes and knee jerk dogmas based on bad traditions.
Going to bow out, go ahead and get your last word in.
That said, you still have a disagreement with the Gospel, probably several due to some easy-believism teachings. Or something. THAT is the problem.
And he's correct.
You appear to have a problem with that. Some serious study would help you greatly, and it isn't going to help straighten your errant teaching out in the next few minutes, or hours, or days. I'm saying serious study and a long maturation process.
You are refering to james Chapter 2, right?
James 2 King James Version (KJV)
2 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.
If it says "brethren", then it MUST be saved people.
James 2 King James Version (KJV)
2 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.
If it says "brethren", then it MUST be saved people.
Goodness sake man...you're showing an abject inability to follow along and misconstrue what others are saying. If you were comprehending what was said then you'd know that is exactly the way I was using the text!
You really need to slow down and read what I stated and accept the fact you are totally truncating the Gospel message due to some ignorance of it.
We're going nowhere, you're not going to listen to a word others say, nor will you ever concede to the fact you need to study up on the Gospel long term and end making rookie mistakes and knee jerk dogmas based on bad traditions.
Going to bow out, go ahead and get your last word in.
U
"Easy believism" is using reductionist thinking as a method to attack the simple Gospel of Christ Jesus which is a gift to all who personally believe in Jesus and what He has accomplished through His death and resurrection.
Repentance in the Lordship salvation doctrine is turning from sin, the call to repentance in the scripture is a call to changes one mind from trying to save themselves via good works or the law to Jesus who is Savior to all who personally believe in what He has accomplished for them.
The lordship salvation doctrine adds works (turn from sin) to conversion and also promotes that works must be evident (at all times) to demonstrate conversion.
Repentance in the Lordship salvation doctrine is turning from sin, the call to repentance in the scripture is a call to changes one mind from trying to save themselves via good works or the law to Jesus who is Savior to all who personally believe in what He has accomplished for them.
The lordship salvation doctrine adds works (turn from sin) to conversion and also promotes that works must be evident (at all times) to demonstrate conversion.