Is Dr. Dino (Kent Hovind) a total joke?
- Thread starter JackH
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Please pay close pay attention and I will patiently explain it to you.
Did you in your post #759 provide a link for the Kolbe Center for the Study of Creation?
(Hint: Yes, you did.)
Did you in your post #761 refer to said organization as a genius?
(Hint: Yes, you did.)
Is the Kolbe Center for the Study of Creation a Catholic YEC organization?
(Hint: Yes, it is.)
Hey, did you hear about the new dinosaur Hellboy?
If not, you can read about it in the article "Meet 'Hellboy' the dinosaur with exotic horns and frill" from Reuters here:
Meet 'Hellboy,' the dinosaur with exotic horns and frill | Reuters
Please note that the article begins with:
Scientists had a heck of a time getting the remarkable fossil of a dinosaur they dubbed "Hellboy" out of the hard limestone along a Canadian river bank where it was entombed for 68 million years, but the diabolic task proved gratifying.
Entombed for 68 million years old you say Reuters?
Reuters is a reliable news source.
Or do you prefer Fox News?
Why don't any of these credible news sources ever say that the dinosaur was entombed for around 4,500 years?
You know, due to the great global flood?
There is a research paper on Hellboy in the reputable peer-reviewed scientific journal Current Biology. I'm reading it right now. If you can't find it, I can give you the link. If you can't understand it, I can explain it to you. Like I did your very own source, the Kolbe Center for the Study of Creation.
Did you in your post #759 provide a link for the Kolbe Center for the Study of Creation?
(Hint: Yes, you did.)
Did you in your post #761 refer to said organization as a genius?
(Hint: Yes, you did.)
Is the Kolbe Center for the Study of Creation a Catholic YEC organization?
(Hint: Yes, it is.)
Hey, did you hear about the new dinosaur Hellboy?
If not, you can read about it in the article "Meet 'Hellboy' the dinosaur with exotic horns and frill" from Reuters here:
Meet 'Hellboy,' the dinosaur with exotic horns and frill | Reuters
Please note that the article begins with:
Scientists had a heck of a time getting the remarkable fossil of a dinosaur they dubbed "Hellboy" out of the hard limestone along a Canadian river bank where it was entombed for 68 million years, but the diabolic task proved gratifying.
Entombed for 68 million years old you say Reuters?
Reuters is a reliable news source.
Or do you prefer Fox News?
Why don't any of these credible news sources ever say that the dinosaur was entombed for around 4,500 years?
You know, due to the great global flood?
There is a research paper on Hellboy in the reputable peer-reviewed scientific journal Current Biology. I'm reading it right now. If you can't find it, I can give you the link. If you can't understand it, I can explain it to you. Like I did your very own source, the Kolbe Center for the Study of Creation.
Here is the research paper I spoke of from the reputable peer-reviewed scientific journal Current Biology pertaining to Hellboy, the new dinosaur. The research paper is entitled "A New Horned Dinosaur Reveals Convergent Evolution in Cranial Ornamentation in Ceratopsidae." This link is for the Summary but you can click on Full Text and review all of it:
http://www.cell.com/current-biology/abstract/S0960-9822(15)00492-3
Now, what I would like to know is why you can't find any research by YECs on a young earth, dinosaurs coexisting with humans, and a global flood in reputable peer-reviewed scientific journals like this.
Of course, it could be a New World Order conspiracy and all the 4,500-year-old dinosaur fossils are hidden from view and under armed guard in the basement of the Smithsonian Institution.
http://www.cell.com/current-biology/abstract/S0960-9822(15)00492-3
Now, what I would like to know is why you can't find any research by YECs on a young earth, dinosaurs coexisting with humans, and a global flood in reputable peer-reviewed scientific journals like this.
Of course, it could be a New World Order conspiracy and all the 4,500-year-old dinosaur fossils are hidden from view and under armed guard in the basement of the Smithsonian Institution.
R
the day age scenario just doesn't work...
here is the sequence of creation according to genesis 1...
light...day and night...
either the earth's atmosphere or outer space or both depending on your interpretation...
dry land and plant life...
sun and moon and stars...most likely this also includes planets which were viewed as 'wandering stars'
aquatic animals and flying animals...
all land animals including 'creeping things' such as insects...
humans...
in contrast the conventional geologic sequence looks like this...
older stars than the sun...
sun and earth and moon in that order...with dry land on earth preceding the formation of oceans...and the moon being produced by a giant impact...
earth's atmosphere produced by volcanic outgassing...
oceans produced by either water from volcanic outgassing or from comets or both...
microscopic and then algal plant life in the ocean...
animal life in the oceans...
plant life and insect life on the land...
vertebrate animal life on the land...
flying insects on the land...
reptiles on the land and in the ocean...
mammals on the land...
birds on the land...
mammals in the ocean...
humans...
there are many obvious contradictions between the two sequences...here are just a few...
in genesis 1 all land animals are created -after- all of the aquatic animals and flying animals...in the geologic sequence many land animals preceded many aquatic animals...and non flying land animals preceded flying land animals...
in genesis 1 the birds clearly came -before- the land animals...in the geologic sequence the birds were some of the last land animals to appear...
in genesis 1 there were land plants -before- any life appeared in the oceans...in the geologic sequence the land plants appeared millions of years after life appeared in the oceans...
in genesis 1 the sun and moon and all the stars were made -after- the plants...in the conventional geologic sequence the sun and moon and stars were formed at different times but generally -billions- of years before the appearance of land plants...
now some old earth creationists argue that the sun and moon and stars were made before the fourth day of creation week...and only became -visible- on the fourth day... but then they are -again- doing violence to the geologic data which nowhere indicates that the sun and moon and stars were invisible from earth until after the appearance of land plants...in other words that the sun was invisible from the earth's surface until at least the silurian period...there is simply -zero- evidence for this...
here is the sequence of creation according to genesis 1...
light...day and night...
either the earth's atmosphere or outer space or both depending on your interpretation...
dry land and plant life...
sun and moon and stars...most likely this also includes planets which were viewed as 'wandering stars'
aquatic animals and flying animals...
all land animals including 'creeping things' such as insects...
humans...
in contrast the conventional geologic sequence looks like this...
older stars than the sun...
sun and earth and moon in that order...with dry land on earth preceding the formation of oceans...and the moon being produced by a giant impact...
earth's atmosphere produced by volcanic outgassing...
oceans produced by either water from volcanic outgassing or from comets or both...
microscopic and then algal plant life in the ocean...
animal life in the oceans...
plant life and insect life on the land...
vertebrate animal life on the land...
flying insects on the land...
reptiles on the land and in the ocean...
mammals on the land...
birds on the land...
mammals in the ocean...
humans...
there are many obvious contradictions between the two sequences...here are just a few...
in genesis 1 all land animals are created -after- all of the aquatic animals and flying animals...in the geologic sequence many land animals preceded many aquatic animals...and non flying land animals preceded flying land animals...
in genesis 1 the birds clearly came -before- the land animals...in the geologic sequence the birds were some of the last land animals to appear...
in genesis 1 there were land plants -before- any life appeared in the oceans...in the geologic sequence the land plants appeared millions of years after life appeared in the oceans...
in genesis 1 the sun and moon and all the stars were made -after- the plants...in the conventional geologic sequence the sun and moon and stars were formed at different times but generally -billions- of years before the appearance of land plants...
now some old earth creationists argue that the sun and moon and stars were made before the fourth day of creation week...and only became -visible- on the fourth day... but then they are -again- doing violence to the geologic data which nowhere indicates that the sun and moon and stars were invisible from earth until after the appearance of land plants...in other words that the sun was invisible from the earth's surface until at least the silurian period...there is simply -zero- evidence for this...
R
you are comparing apples and oranges now...
modern christians...other than cultists...would -never- claim that -everything- they say is a word or revelation from God...they freely acknowledge that most of the time they are speaking humanly and can make mistakes...
but jesus said that he -only- spoke what the father had told him...this would mean no errors...
modern christians...other than cultists...would -never- claim that -everything- they say is a word or revelation from God...they freely acknowledge that most of the time they are speaking humanly and can make mistakes...
but jesus said that he -only- spoke what the father had told him...this would mean no errors...
R
here are two links about the discovery of soft tissue in dinosaur bones...
Molecular analysis supports controversial claim for dinosaur cells : Nature News & Comment
T. Rex Soft Tissue Found Preserved
the first link includes a link to mary schweitzer's paper...though they make you pay to read anything more than the abstract...
there has actually been something of a gold rush of unfossilized soft tissue discoveries lately...there was even a paper in the journal of paleontology last year claiming discovery of unfossilized tissue in ediacaran marine worms!
the creation research society has also been finding unfossilized tissue in a triceratops horn at their van andel creation research center...they published their findings in the acta histochemica journal...
Molecular analysis supports controversial claim for dinosaur cells : Nature News & Comment
T. Rex Soft Tissue Found Preserved
the first link includes a link to mary schweitzer's paper...though they make you pay to read anything more than the abstract...
there has actually been something of a gold rush of unfossilized soft tissue discoveries lately...there was even a paper in the journal of paleontology last year claiming discovery of unfossilized tissue in ediacaran marine worms!
the creation research society has also been finding unfossilized tissue in a triceratops horn at their van andel creation research center...they published their findings in the acta histochemica journal...
R
most modern flood geology models have the 'fountains of the great deep' as a major source of flood water that rapidly covered large parts of the earth like giant tsunamis...not just a gradual flooding of the earth by forty consecutive days of rain...
also most of the modern flood geology models have large amounts of sediment being eroded from the dry land as it floods and then carried along by those giant tsunami like movements of water...sediments and precipitates continually settled out of the water and rapidly buried anything that sank to the bottom...
orthocone nautiloids are shaped like a long cone...streamlined for swimming through the water... when streamlined objects end up in a current of fluid they tend to be most stable when pointing into the current...and given enough time they will naturally move into that orientation... the fact that the nautiloid fossils tended to be pointing in the same direction even across hundreds of miles suggests a current spanning hundreds of miles...this is the equivalent of the gulf stream moving over the american southwest...
a current that large and powerful would be expected to push practically every nautiloid caught in it into the same position in practically no time...but many of the nautiloids were found pointing straight down... that means that they were buried under sediment so quickly that there was not even time for the currents to push them into the 'preferred' orientation...
so the nautiloid fossils in the grand canyon imply both a massive movement of water over that region of the earth as well as very rapid dumping of sediment wherever the current was flowing...that is exactly the kind of thing flood geologists predict in their models...
also most of the modern flood geology models have large amounts of sediment being eroded from the dry land as it floods and then carried along by those giant tsunami like movements of water...sediments and precipitates continually settled out of the water and rapidly buried anything that sank to the bottom...
orthocone nautiloids are shaped like a long cone...streamlined for swimming through the water... when streamlined objects end up in a current of fluid they tend to be most stable when pointing into the current...and given enough time they will naturally move into that orientation... the fact that the nautiloid fossils tended to be pointing in the same direction even across hundreds of miles suggests a current spanning hundreds of miles...this is the equivalent of the gulf stream moving over the american southwest...
a current that large and powerful would be expected to push practically every nautiloid caught in it into the same position in practically no time...but many of the nautiloids were found pointing straight down... that means that they were buried under sediment so quickly that there was not even time for the currents to push them into the 'preferred' orientation...
so the nautiloid fossils in the grand canyon imply both a massive movement of water over that region of the earth as well as very rapid dumping of sediment wherever the current was flowing...that is exactly the kind of thing flood geologists predict in their models...
Not really. Jesus being man, He was essentially the same as you and I... He consistently referred to the Father as greater than Him (as God is greater than us, too). "My God and your God" kinda sounds like He saw Himself in the same camp as them/us in respects to the Father, and that was AFTER He was risen.
He became man so that He could perfect and fulfill the Law as we could not do... so, how does He do that without being as we are? If He fulfilled the Law while having particular divine advantages, like having unlimited knowledge, and/or perfect perception of God's voice, then what does that say about His conquering the Law? He "cheated" so to speak, when you say He did not empty Himself and become as man - and no one has ever confined every word they ever said being something they heard from God.
And you never answered - if He was perfect in knowledge, wisdom, etc, why did He need to pray?
Could that mean "only" as in that is all He is talking about in that particular sermon/conservation? I say "I only mean this" all the time, to stress my source or idea in a particular context, that doesn't mean that everything I ever say is confined to that topic or source. We all tend to forget that cliches, figures of speech, and such was used then as well.
How do you draw "knowing everything" from talking to the Father, esp humbled as a human like the rest of us? Wasn't the point (or a key point) of Him becoming man was to relate to humanity? Wouldn't that also include being limited in knowledge, like a human?
If you want to say no, that Jesus knew everything (we started this in reference to Him knowing without error that Genesis is literal history - God tell Him that too?), because if He didn't then you wouldn't be able to trust His teachings, that's fine... but then He is not human in the sense of growing and "perfecting obedience" (hmm, that phrase is in Scripture somewhere
).
So, how does only speaking what the Father says work? Does God hand Him a script every night to memorize for the next day? How, in your mind, does His communication with God differ from ours? If you want to be stickler for detail, and ignore the context of His speaking of Genesis to condemn frivolous divorce (which left many women homeless and forced into prostitution to live... and then judged by the same people who forced them into that situation), then so can I. Again, it seems silly to reference that as "support" for a literal Genesis, because that wasn't even His point or application.
He became man so that He could perfect and fulfill the Law as we could not do... so, how does He do that without being as we are? If He fulfilled the Law while having particular divine advantages, like having unlimited knowledge, and/or perfect perception of God's voice, then what does that say about His conquering the Law? He "cheated" so to speak, when you say He did not empty Himself and become as man - and no one has ever confined every word they ever said being something they heard from God.
And you never answered - if He was perfect in knowledge, wisdom, etc, why did He need to pray?
Could that mean "only" as in that is all He is talking about in that particular sermon/conservation? I say "I only mean this" all the time, to stress my source or idea in a particular context, that doesn't mean that everything I ever say is confined to that topic or source. We all tend to forget that cliches, figures of speech, and such was used then as well.
How do you draw "knowing everything" from talking to the Father, esp humbled as a human like the rest of us? Wasn't the point (or a key point) of Him becoming man was to relate to humanity? Wouldn't that also include being limited in knowledge, like a human?
If you want to say no, that Jesus knew everything (we started this in reference to Him knowing without error that Genesis is literal history - God tell Him that too?), because if He didn't then you wouldn't be able to trust His teachings, that's fine... but then He is not human in the sense of growing and "perfecting obedience" (hmm, that phrase is in Scripture somewhere
). So, how does only speaking what the Father says work? Does God hand Him a script every night to memorize for the next day? How, in your mind, does His communication with God differ from ours? If you want to be stickler for detail, and ignore the context of His speaking of Genesis to condemn frivolous divorce (which left many women homeless and forced into prostitution to live... and then judged by the same people who forced them into that situation), then so can I. Again, it seems silly to reference that as "support" for a literal Genesis, because that wasn't even His point or application.
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R
well young earth creationists have many motivations...'proving the bible' is not always the motivation...
for many young earth creationists the goal is more scientific...mainly to set the scientific record straight...and this is a goal held by many scientific dissenters...not just young earth creationists...
for other young earth creationists the motivation is more negative...namely they are concerned that if people are led to believe that the bible is -not- a reliable source of literal history then people will reject the spiritual teachings too...in support of their belief that this is a real risk they cite the verse where jesus suggests that the people who don't believe him about earthly things would not believe him about heavenly things either...
for many young earth creationists the goal is more scientific...mainly to set the scientific record straight...and this is a goal held by many scientific dissenters...not just young earth creationists...
for other young earth creationists the motivation is more negative...namely they are concerned that if people are led to believe that the bible is -not- a reliable source of literal history then people will reject the spiritual teachings too...in support of their belief that this is a real risk they cite the verse where jesus suggests that the people who don't believe him about earthly things would not believe him about heavenly things either...
R
i remember seeing a picture of a secular museum where a model of a modern bird was displayed as one of the fossils that was found buried with the dinosaurs that were on display...
it was in an article in one of my magazines...i might go through my magazines and see if i can find more information to post about it...
it was in an article in one of my magazines...i might go through my magazines and see if i can find more information to post about it...
Dr. Dino sure does call out all the evolution nonsense. From Chapter 4 of his book Unmasking the False Religion of Evolution:
"The Smithsonian Institute has 33,000 sets of human remains in their basement ... Many of them were taken while the people were still alive. They were so desperate to find missing links, so desperate to prove their theory that they murdered people to prove it. It was the philosophy of evolution that drove them."
No doubt you know about what his son Little Dino (Eric) said about the Duggar controversy.
Pathetic.
"The Smithsonian Institute has 33,000 sets of human remains in their basement ... Many of them were taken while the people were still alive. They were so desperate to find missing links, so desperate to prove their theory that they murdered people to prove it. It was the philosophy of evolution that drove them."
No doubt you know about what his son Little Dino (Eric) said about the Duggar controversy.
Pathetic.
You might want to start with a middle school science book or an article from Wikipedia like this:
Age of the Earth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Wikipedia is a good source in the sense that it summarizes and gives you places to go for more information.
The place not to go is pseudoscience promoted by Ken Ham and other YEC cultists.
That is not science.
Every federal court decision in recent memory pertaining to this issue has determined that fact.
Age of the Earth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Wikipedia is a good source in the sense that it summarizes and gives you places to go for more information.
The place not to go is pseudoscience promoted by Ken Ham and other YEC cultists.
That is not science.
Every federal court decision in recent memory pertaining to this issue has determined that fact.
E
I could care less what Dr Hovind said, I have seen the proof. and even if Dr Hovind never said a word, it would still be true.
Funny how you ignore dinos in scripture. why is this? Did you know they are finding speces of animals they thought were extinct for millions of years today? Again, have you studied much, or are you so against one man, all you want to do is rant and rave?
Funny how you ignore dinos in scripture. why is this? Did you know they are finding speces of animals they thought were extinct for millions of years today? Again, have you studied much, or are you so against one man, all you want to do is rant and rave?